Author Topic: New Releases  (Read 1206540 times)

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Offline Octave

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Re: New Releases
« Reply #960 on: January 14, 2013, 09:42:35 PM »
One little complaint I have in the Repackaging Boulez Department is the duplication of Boulez/Debussy orchestral recordings within the same year.  (PLAYS DEBUSSY/RAVEL and the larger DEBUSSY EDITION, both DG).  I really like his Debussy, but how nice it would have been to bring in a little more diversity with that bigger box.  I know: blah blah blah, get used to it, etc.  But in the same year!  I'd like to be rewarded just a tiny bit for buying more product.  But I am from the Planet Freakstar, where corporations exist solely to help out their clientele.

That recent Duke Ellington '50s box set from Sony/Columbia also didn't correct a flagrant error in his beautiful, snuffling, snorting, stomping Shakespeare soundtrack SUCH SWEET THUNDER; a small but terrible omission of some wonderful trumpet playing that fans have been bitching about since at least 1999.  It's careless and arrogant, and it's almost certainly not a serious issue of $$$$.  I think these companies deserve their death.
« Last Edit: January 14, 2013, 10:05:47 PM by Octave »
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Offline Opus106

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Re: New Releases
« Reply #961 on: January 14, 2013, 09:47:58 PM »
For a person just getting into classical music, this can be a good thing...

Why is it a good thing to bring out a new series of recordings, most of which are already available, with nothing but cosmetic changes? ??? Didn't you just say a few posts earlier that you'd rather have them not spend money on re-issues?
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Offline Mirror Image

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Re: New Releases
« Reply #962 on: January 14, 2013, 09:55:24 PM »
I think these companies deserve their death.

I wouldn't go that far, I mean in hindsight EMI, Sony, etc. have employed many people. Seeing them go under, for me, means loss of jobs, which in this fragile economy, this would be an unfortunate event. That said, they should start being more wise and considerate with what they release. Releasing the same old thing over and over again will no doubt send them into a black hole, but need to invest in getting more interesting repertoire recorded and getting younger generation conductors on their recording roster. One plus for EMI is them getting Petrenko who's anything but a slouch. He's a good conductor who has a bright future. Also (WARNING ANOTHER RANT :)), I'm sick and tired of seeing this conductor's face or that soloist's face on the front cover of the recording. What happened to good album artwork to draw the listener into the recording? What happened to intelligent, thoughtful liner notes? Sorry Sarah Chang as much as I'd like to see you naked, you shouldn't be on the front cover. :P I mean are they selling sex or the music? Anyway, this subject has been touched on many times before on this forum.
“I love music passionately. And because I love it, I try to free it from barren traditions that stifle it.” - Claude Debussy

Offline Mirror Image

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Re: New Releases
« Reply #963 on: January 14, 2013, 09:58:51 PM »
Why is it a good thing to bring out a new series of recordings, most of which are already available, with nothing but cosmetic changes? ??? Didn't you just say a few posts earlier that you'd rather have them not spend money on re-issues?

Yeah, I did, but I got to thinking that some reissues are good to have, especially if the recording has been long OOP. Now releasing a recording that has already been reissued last year is moronic, that I agree with you about, but reissuing a recording that came out in the 1990 and hasn't been reissued since is a good thing I think just as long as the label keeps it in-print, which will likely not happen, especially knowing how quickly EMI or Decca cuts it from their catalog.
« Last Edit: January 14, 2013, 10:02:42 PM by Mirror Image »
“I love music passionately. And because I love it, I try to free it from barren traditions that stifle it.” - Claude Debussy

Offline Fafner

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Re: New Releases
« Reply #964 on: January 15, 2013, 01:55:50 AM »
Sorry Sarah Chang Yuja Wang as much as I'd like to see you naked, you shouldn't be on the front cover. :P I mean are they selling sex or the music? Anyway, this subject has been touched on many times before on this forum.

Well, these are the times we live in. Classical music sells badly as it is, and lots of people will rather buy an album with a pretty young lady (or dude - my women friends were slobbering over a cover of a Jonas Kaufmann cd, and they do not really like opera at all) on the cover, instead of one with a cover picture of some unrelated countryside or other.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2013, 03:09:36 AM by Fafner »
"Remember Fafner? Remember he built Valhalla? A giant? Well, he's a dragon now. Don't ask me why. Anyway, he's dead."
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jlaurson

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Re: New Releases
« Reply #965 on: January 15, 2013, 02:50:57 AM »
I wouldn't go that far, I mean in hindsight EMI, Sony, etc. have employed many people. Seeing them go under, for me, means loss of jobs, which in this fragile economy, this would be an unfortunate event. That said, they should start being more wise and considerate with what they release. Releasing the same old thing over and over again will no doubt send them into a black hole, but need to invest in getting more interesting repertoire recorded and getting younger generation conductors on their recording roster. One plus for EMI is them getting Petrenko who's anything but a slouch. He's a good conductor who has a bright future. Also (WARNING ANOTHER RANT :)), I'm sick and tired of seeing this conductor's face or that soloist's face on the front cover of the recording. What happened to good album artwork to draw the listener into the recording? What happened to intelligent, thoughtful liner notes? Sorry Sarah Chang as much as I'd like to see you naked, you shouldn't be on the front cover. :P I mean are they selling sex or the music? Anyway, this subject has been touched on many times before on this forum.

They do what they do, to make money... not to "send them[selves] into a black hole". However incompetent it looks from afar, or however we might dislike what their actions mean to us, I think it's safe to assume that they know better than you or I what will prevent bankruptcy.

And you ask what happened to intelligent, thoughtful liner notes? Now I'm getting angry, actually: YOU happened to them. And by you I mean almost everyone in this forum... always vying for new repackaged cheap boxes, always waiting for a release "to be boxed up for cheap", never buying a single disc at full price... or when it's not available in any other way complaining about it and bitching and moaning about having to fork over 18 quid for a properly made audio recording with liner notes and such. These things don't just materialize from thin air, they have to be paid for. But who is willing to pay a decent ('living') wage for liner notes and translations, these days? Do you know how much that costs? Would you pay for it? You personally, I can't tell, obviously. But most people wouldn't. And so the consumer gets what he's willing to pay for. That's why you all get Sony re-re-re-re-packaged box sets, and a few people in the niche get this: http://www.theelectricrecordingco.com/;)

Offline The new erato

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Re: New Releases
« Reply #966 on: January 15, 2013, 03:39:36 AM »
And you ask what happened to intelligent, thoughtful liner notes? Now I'm getting angry, actually: YOU happened to them. And by you I mean almost everyone in this forum... always vying for new repackaged cheap boxes, always waiting for a release "to be boxed up for cheap", never buying a single disc at full price... or when it's not available in any other way complaining about it and bitching and moaning about having to fork over 18 quid for a properly made audio recording with liner notes and such. These things don't just materialize from thin air, they have to be paid for.

Thumbs up for that. I think full price for audio recordings of little known repertoire (for which the notes obviously are most important, and where expected volume probably will be small) are actually rather fair, and buy them all of the time. Box sets to me mainly represents "filling out" the collection, and the combination of low price/no notes are usually fine by me, event though notes on recording sessions, previous releases and so on in many cases ought to be mandatory.

Offline Wanderer

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Re: New Releases
« Reply #967 on: January 15, 2013, 04:37:49 AM »
And you ask what happened to intelligent, thoughtful liner notes? Now I'm getting angry, actually: YOU happened to them. And by you I mean almost everyone in this forum... always vying for new repackaged cheap boxes, always waiting for a release "to be boxed up for cheap", never buying a single disc at full price... or when it's not available in any other way complaining about it and bitching and moaning about having to fork over 18 quid for a properly made audio recording with liner notes and such. These things don't just materialize from thin air, they have to be paid for.

My sentiments exactly.

Offline mc ukrneal

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Re: New Releases
« Reply #968 on: January 15, 2013, 05:12:54 AM »
And you ask what happened to intelligent, thoughtful liner notes? Now I'm getting angry, actually: YOU happened to them. And by you I mean almost everyone in this forum... always vying for new repackaged cheap boxes, always waiting for a release "to be boxed up for cheap", never buying a single disc at full price... or when it's not available in any other way complaining about it and bitching and moaning about having to fork over 18 quid for a properly made audio recording with liner notes and such. These things don't just materialize from thin air, they have to be paid for. But who is willing to pay a decent ('living') wage for liner notes and translations, these days? Do you know how much that costs? Would you pay for it? You personally, I can't tell, obviously. But most people wouldn't. And so the consumer gets what he's willing to pay for. That's why you all get Sony re-re-re-re-packaged box sets, and a few people in the niche get this: http://www.theelectricrecordingco.com/;)
Frankly, this is utter nonsense. But I've had this argument on this forum before and I am not interested in re-hashing it.

What I would add is that most of the liner notes are crap, so they might as well not have them. Only a few companies produce really good ones. Opera Rara produce excellent notes. Hyperion have some good ones. And that's all I can think of. I have some Sony, Naxos, Dutton, EMI and Decca notes next to me of various discs (Tchaikovsky, Vanhal, Haydn, etc) and the information they contain is mostly rubbish. I'd estimate some 10-20% is actually of interest on each, while some have 0%.
Be kind to your fellow posters!!

Online Sergeant Rock

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Re: New Releases
« Reply #969 on: January 15, 2013, 06:19:31 AM »
Bought recently at fullprice, all with good to excellent liner notes (the Wolf-Ferrari box in the luxury class):









My point? Not sure I have one..  :D

Sarge
« Last Edit: January 15, 2013, 06:24:14 AM by Sergeant Rock »
the phone rings and somebody says,
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Mahler, you ought to go see it.
he was as f*cked-up as you are."
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Offline The new erato

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Re: New Releases
« Reply #970 on: January 15, 2013, 06:34:03 AM »
The de Boeck is superbly documented, just as such unknown music needs and deserves.

Offline TheGSMoeller

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Re: New Releases
« Reply #971 on: January 15, 2013, 06:40:28 AM »
And you ask what happened to intelligent, thoughtful liner notes? Now I'm getting angry, actually: YOU happened to them. And by you I mean almost everyone in this forum... always vying for new repackaged cheap boxes, always waiting for a release "to be boxed up for cheap", never buying a single disc at full price... or when it's not available in any other way complaining about it and bitching and moaning about having to fork over 18 quid for a properly made audio recording with liner notes and such. These things don't just materialize from thin air, they have to be paid for. But who is willing to pay a decent ('living') wage for liner notes and translations, these days? Do you know how much that costs? Would you pay for it? You personally, I can't tell, obviously. But most people wouldn't. And so the consumer gets what he's willing to pay for. That's why you all get Sony re-re-re-re-packaged box sets, and a few people in the niche get this: http://www.theelectricrecordingco.com/;)

-1
YOU act as if YOU know everyone here. ;D

Online Sergeant Rock

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Re: New Releases
« Reply #972 on: January 15, 2013, 06:55:59 AM »
The de Boeck is superbly documented, just as such unknown music needs and deserves.

And someday I'm actually going to listen to it  :D

Sarge
the phone rings and somebody says,
"hey, they made a movie about
Mahler, you ought to go see it.
he was as f*cked-up as you are."
                               --Charles Bukowski, "Mahler"

Offline TheGSMoeller

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Re: New Releases
« Reply #973 on: January 15, 2013, 07:01:19 AM »
Sarge, have you listened to the Currentzis discs yet? By far my top DSCH 14 and very close to tops for the Purcell.

Offline springrite

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Re: New Releases
« Reply #974 on: January 15, 2013, 07:02:16 AM »
And someday I'm actually going to listen to it  :D

Sarge
I am already curious enough to put it into my shopping cart.
Do what I must do, and let what must happen happen.

Online Sergeant Rock

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Re: New Releases
« Reply #975 on: January 15, 2013, 07:06:58 AM »
Sarge, have you listened to the Currentzis discs yet? By far my top DSCH 14 and very close to tops for the Purcell.

The Shosty, yeah, and Mrs. Rock has heard the Purcell (and loved it). For me Rostropovich still rules in 14 but Currentzis is close.

Sarge
the phone rings and somebody says,
"hey, they made a movie about
Mahler, you ought to go see it.
he was as f*cked-up as you are."
                               --Charles Bukowski, "Mahler"

Online Sergeant Rock

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Re: New Releases
« Reply #976 on: January 15, 2013, 07:07:43 AM »
I am already curious enough to put it into my shopping cart.

Jens and Erato think highly of it.

Sarge
the phone rings and somebody says,
"hey, they made a movie about
Mahler, you ought to go see it.
he was as f*cked-up as you are."
                               --Charles Bukowski, "Mahler"

jlaurson

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Re: New Releases
« Reply #977 on: January 15, 2013, 08:42:14 AM »
Quote
And you ask what happened to intelligent, thoughtful liner notes? Now I'm getting angry, actually: YOU happened to them. And by you I mean almost everyone in this forum... always vying for new repackaged cheap boxes, always waiting for a release "to be boxed up for cheap", never buying a single disc at full price... or when it's not available in any other way complaining about it and bitching and moaning about having to fork over 18 quid for a properly made audio recording with liner notes and such. These things don't just materialize from thin air, they have to be paid for...

-1
YOU act as if YOU know everyone here. ;D

C'mon. You know better than to feel attacked, especially if you're one of the exceptions. Employ your principle of charity. I'm making a general point that, pace mc ukrneal, has plenty validity and enough for you to know what I mean. I'm not saying I'm not biased (I obviously am, at the receiving end of the constant cheap-skating from record companies who can't afford to pay for this or that, or don't want to, or think that cheapest-is-best), but the point remains. I'm also not against having cheapo-options. More options are beautiful... and the market works. But complaining about the state of affairs and doing nothing about it (and we both know that there's plenty overlap, here... I certainly know there is with myself)... that reminds me of my days at Tower Records, when people came in, sniffed haughtily, complained how there used to be so much more classical music about when they had last been in the store a year ago (my usual response: "You do see the connection...??!?" usually being ignored)... then look at a CD, snidely point out that they can have it for two dollars less across town, and left and probably drove uptown to save two dollars. (BP, Shell, and Lukoil sending their regards, along the way.)
« Last Edit: January 15, 2013, 08:46:15 AM by jlaurson »

Offline Mirror Image

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Re: New Releases
« Reply #978 on: January 15, 2013, 09:03:11 AM »
They do what they do, to make money... not to "send them[selves] into a black hole". However incompetent it looks from afar, or however we might dislike what their actions mean to us, I think it's safe to assume that they know better than you or I what will prevent bankruptcy.

And you ask what happened to intelligent, thoughtful liner notes? Now I'm getting angry, actually: YOU happened to them. And by you I mean almost everyone in this forum... always vying for new repackaged cheap boxes, always waiting for a release "to be boxed up for cheap", never buying a single disc at full price... or when it's not available in any other way complaining about it and bitching and moaning about having to fork over 18 quid for a properly made audio recording with liner notes and such. These things don't just materialize from thin air, they have to be paid for. But who is willing to pay a decent ('living') wage for liner notes and translations, these days? Do you know how much that costs? Would you pay for it? You personally, I can't tell, obviously. But most people wouldn't. And so the consumer gets what he's willing to pay for. That's why you all get Sony re-re-re-re-packaged box sets, and a few people in the niche get this: http://www.theelectricrecordingco.com/;)

I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with wanting to get a good price on a CD and not wanting to pay an arm and leg for it. I've paid for many full priced CDs, but I've also gotten many, many good deals online. I've also paid a chunk of change for OOP recordings on numerous occasions. The liner notes problem is just a general complaint of mine. Like Neal said, these aren't always well-thought anyway.

All of this said, I don't think it's right of you to assume that none of us would pay full price for a CD. I've done it many times, especially if it's a recording I really want.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2013, 09:26:25 AM by Mirror Image »
“I love music passionately. And because I love it, I try to free it from barren traditions that stifle it.” - Claude Debussy

Offline TheGSMoeller

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Re: New Releases
« Reply #979 on: January 15, 2013, 09:19:15 AM »
@jlaurson

I wouldn't take it as a full-on attack unless you said something about my Mama. (plus, written sarcasm is an art-form I sometimes fail in)

It's like the scene from Casablanca...
"I am shocked, shocked to find there is gambling in here."
"Your winnings, sir."