Author Topic: The Bach Cantatas  (Read 218717 times)

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Offline Que

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The Bach Cantatas
« on: April 08, 2007, 12:51:45 AM »
I'm honoured to restart the thread on these materpieces!  :)
The earlier thread on the old forum: Bach's Cantatas


This morning I came across this issue on Mirare. Does anyone know it?




And what about this 2CD reissue on Ricercar?



Q

Offline 71 dB

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Re: The Bach Cantatas
« Reply #1 on: April 08, 2007, 01:20:50 AM »
I collect Suzuki.

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Offline marvinbrown

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Re: The Bach Cantatas
« Reply #2 on: April 08, 2007, 02:01:43 AM »

  A question about Bach's Cantatas:

  Bach wrote over 200 cantatas, I own 14 of them (namely 4,8,27,44,51,59,78,80,140,147,158,173,184 and 189) providing well over 2.5 hours of music. I would like to know if it is worth buying more cantatas or have I gotten the "gist" of them? I guess what I am trying to ask is will I hear new melodies or music if you will or does it get to the point where its just variations on melodies (music) used in other cantatas?


  I would appreciate any feedback


   marvin

Offline Que

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Re: The Bach Cantatas
« Reply #3 on: April 08, 2007, 02:14:02 AM »
  A question about Bach's Cantatas:

  Bach wrote over 200 cantatas, I own 14 of them (namely 4,8,27,44,51,59,78,80,140,147,158,173,184 and 189) providing well over 2.5 hours of music. I would like to know if it is worth buying more cantatas or have I gotten the "gist" of them? I guess what I am trying to ask is will I hear new melodies or music if you will or does it get to the point where its just variations on melodies (music) used in other cantatas?


  I would appreciate any feedback


   marvin

Marvin, I'll give you a straight answer.
YES, it is worthwhile to explore all the other cantatas.. :D

Many people expect repetitiveness in a cycle of 200 works, but that is simply not the case here.
And no way there are just a few masterpieces and the rest "run of the mill" quality, either.
If we are talking about the truly great cantatas: there are dozens of them.

Enjoy!

Q

Offline 71 dB

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Re: The Bach Cantatas
« Reply #4 on: April 08, 2007, 02:15:14 AM »
  A question about Bach's Cantatas:

  Bach wrote over 200 cantatas, I own 14 of them (namely 4,8,27,44,51,59,78,80,140,147,158,173,184 and 189) providing well over 2.5 hours of music. I would like to know if it is worth buying more cantatas or have I gotten the "gist" of them? I guess what I am trying to ask is will I hear new melodies or music if you will or does it get to the point where its just variations on melodies (music) used in other cantatas?


  I would appreciate any feedback


   marvin

Marvin, it's up to how much you love this kind of music. If you say 14 cantatas is enough it's the same like saying 6-7 Haydn Symphonies are enough. If you are not interested in exploring then don't. I'd say many of your cantatas are worse than say 21 and 61. You are also missing secular cantatas.

I love baroque cantatas (perfect form of music imo) and from my point of view you have less than 10 % of these jewels. I have ~70 cantatas and I don't feel I have enough...
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Harry

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Re: The Bach Cantatas
« Reply #5 on: April 08, 2007, 02:46:46 AM »

Offline SonicMan46

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Re: The Bach Cantatas
« Reply #6 on: April 08, 2007, 04:41:30 AM »
  A question about Bach's Cantatas:

  Bach wrote over 200 cantatas, I own 14 of them (namely 4,8,27,44,51,59,78,80,140,147,158,173,184 and 189) providing well over 2.5 hours of music. I would like to know if it is worth buying more cantatas or have I gotten the "gist" of them? I guess what I am trying to ask is will I hear new melodies or music if you will or does it get to the point where its just variations on melodies (music) used in other cantatas?

Marvin - have to agree w/ the others, the more you hear these wonderful works, the more of them you want!  I have only about 30 or so (a beginner!), and have not yet acquired any w/ Suzuki (although there certainly are other excellent options) - in fact I need to make a major effort and explore these works again - you might want to check out this excellent Bach Cantata Website - I've posted it in the old forum (as have others);plus, there may be other sites discussing these compositions?  Good luck, and YES if you've gone up to a dozen, start considering you next 12 -  ;D ;) :D

Offline (: premont :)

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Re: The Bach Cantatas
« Reply #7 on: April 08, 2007, 05:31:19 AM »
It is hard, in the entire musical history, to find a group of works so rich inventive and deep expressive as Bach´s Cantates. I am in debt to this forum and the ZeroGain forum for getting the impulses to investigate these works, and I don´t regret this a minute.

Bach cantate thread here: http://www.zerogain.com/forum/showthread.php?t=18

Tiden læger alle sår,
heldigt nok at tiden går.

Offline knight66

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Re: The Bach Cantatas
« Reply #8 on: April 08, 2007, 06:02:02 AM »
Here is an excellent resource in connection with the cantatas. I have about 70 of them, many duplicated or even in triplicate. They seem inexhaustible. I constantly marvel at Bach's long sinuous melodies and the frequent twinning with different woodwind instruments.

http://www.bach-cantatas.com/

Mike
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I wasted time: and time wasted me.

Offline marvinbrown

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Re: The Bach Cantatas
« Reply #9 on: April 08, 2007, 06:15:33 AM »


  I would like to thank everyone who responded to my query.  I am now convinced that I have not given these works the proper attention they deserve and am missing out on their complete value and will include Bach Canatats in my future purchases....starting with 71db's suggestion of Cantata 21 and 61 among others.  Sorry Que to have highjacked your initial query regarding the Mirare and Ricercar recordings I did not know what I had done until it was too late.  Perhaps someone qualified can respond to Que's initial inquiry? anyone heard these:






  marvin

Offline Que

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Re: The Bach Cantatas
« Reply #10 on: April 08, 2007, 06:23:17 AM »
Sorry Que to have highjacked your initial query regarding the Mirare and Ricercar recordings I did not know what I had done until it was too late. 

  marvin

No matter, marvin! :)
What performances of Bach's cantatas do you have so far, and what do you like?

Q

Offline 71 dB

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Re: The Bach Cantatas
« Reply #11 on: April 08, 2007, 06:39:36 AM »
I would like to thank everyone who responded to my query.  I am now convinced that I have not given these works the proper attention they deserve and am missing out on their complete value and will include Bach Canatats in my future purchases....starting with 71db's suggestion of Cantata 21 and 61 among others. 

No problem! Even when you have explored all the Bach Cantatas there's tons of brilliant cantatas by other baroque composers like Buxtehude and Bruhns. Those cantatas were very influential to Bach and not inferior in any way.
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Harry

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Re: The Bach Cantatas
« Reply #12 on: April 08, 2007, 07:24:22 AM »
No problem! Even when you have explored all the Bach Cantatas there's tons of brilliant cantatas by other baroque composers like Buxtehude and Bruhns. Those cantatas were very influential to Bach and not inferior in any way.

And that is quite correct, take heed Marvin!

Offline SonicMan46

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Re: The Bach Cantatas
« Reply #13 on: April 08, 2007, 07:37:37 AM »
And that is quite correct, take heed Marvin!


And to add GP Telemann who wrote a TON of vocal works - look HERE - I have just a couple of discs, Festive & Christmas Cantatas.

Maybe we need another thread, i.e. 'Cantatas Not by JS Bach' ?   ;) :D

Harry

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Re: The Bach Cantatas
« Reply #14 on: April 08, 2007, 07:43:46 AM »
And to add GP Telemann who wrote a TON of vocal works - look HERE - I have just a couple of discs, Festive & Christmas Cantatas.

Maybe we need another thread, i.e. 'Cantatas Not by JS Bach' ?   ;) :D

That is not a bad idea Dave, I am sure 71db wouldn't mind starting it!

Don

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Re: The Bach Cantatas
« Reply #15 on: April 08, 2007, 08:31:51 AM »
No problem! Even when you have explored all the Bach Cantatas there's tons of brilliant cantatas by other baroque composers like Buxtehude and Bruhns. Those cantatas were very influential to Bach and not inferior in any way.

Buxtehude and Bruhns cantatas are as good as Bach's.  I don't think so.

Offline Dancing Divertimentian

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Re: The Bach Cantatas
« Reply #16 on: April 08, 2007, 08:49:05 AM »
I'm thoroughly won over by Herreweghe's cantata recordings. Wonderful color and highly nuanced.

As far as dark horse recordings, none are more so than Christophe Coin's, yet deserving wider appeal.






« Last Edit: April 02, 2015, 08:43:54 PM by Dancing Divertimentian »
Veit Bach-a baker who found his greatest pleasure in a little cittern which he took with him even into the mill and played while the grinding was going on. In this way he had a chance to have the rhythm drilled into him. And this was the beginning of a musical inclination in his descendants. JS Bach

Offline marvinbrown

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Re: The Bach Cantatas
« Reply #17 on: April 08, 2007, 09:27:55 AM »
No matter, marvin! :)
What performances of Bach's cantatas do you have so far, and what do you like?

Q

  Hello Que, I have the following recordings of the cantatas, my personal favorite is this one:
 

  the soprano aria that opens Cantata 51 is unbelievable, I love how Bach "flirts" with the soprano driving up and up, truely inspring.  I also love Cantata 140 (Wachet auf, I have so many adaptations of this piece of music-Sleepers Awake) and also Cantata147.  this set is a must for every collection.

  I also have this:

 
   Cantata 198 is the highlight here.

  And I have this:
 
   I bought this set beacuse I liked Cantata 44
  and finally I bought Cantata 4 off of itunes and have this recording:


  I love this recording, Cantata no.4 starts off with beautiful Sinfonia followed by a chorus that always gives me goosebumps when I hear it.
« Last Edit: August 09, 2009, 05:30:22 AM by Que »

Offline 71 dB

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Re: The Bach Cantatas
« Reply #18 on: April 08, 2007, 12:15:25 PM »
That is not a bad idea Dave, I am sure 71db wouldn't mind starting it!

I'll see what I can do.  ;D

Buxtehude and Bruhns cantatas are as good as Bach's.  I don't think so.

The best cantatas by Buxtehude and Bruhns are better than the worst by Bach. Even if the music by Buxtehude and Bruhns was inferior to that of Bach it is worth exploring for it's beauty.

And to add GP Telemann who wrote a TON of vocal works - look HERE - I have just a couple of discs, Festive & Christmas Cantatas.

Thanks SonicMan! I find Telemann a bit boring baroque composer but I definitely should check out his cantatas.  :)
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Offline marvinbrown

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Re: The Bach Cantatas
« Reply #19 on: April 08, 2007, 02:03:04 PM »
No problem! Even when you have explored all the Bach Cantatas there's tons of brilliant cantatas by other baroque composers like Buxtehude and Bruhns. Those cantatas were very influential to Bach and not inferior in any way.

   I am ashamed to admit that I have not heard of either Buxtehude nor Bruhns.  Untill those names were mentioned the only composer I know who influenced Bach was Vivaldi.  I know Handel wrote Cantatas (The Italian Cantatas I think they are called) but I do not know if they influenced Bach's cantatas or not?

  marvin