Author Topic: Ludwig van Beethoven (1770-1827)  (Read 223951 times)

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Offline BachQ

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Ludwig van Beethoven (1770-1827)
« on: April 06, 2007, 03:12:18 AM »
"I believe in God, Mozart, and Beethoven"

          ~ Richard Wagner

"There was only Beethoven and Wagner [and] after them, nobody."

          ~ Gustav Mahler




1. What do you think are among Beethoven's greatest achievements?  Most "influential" works?

2. What are your favorite works by Beethoven?  Least favorite?

3. Do you feel that Beethoven's personal challenges (deafness; nephew issues; etc) considerably heightened the emotional content of his music?

4. Any favorite recordings?  Of Symphonies? Piano Sonatas? Concertos?  Chamber?  Overtures?

5. Do you consider Beethoven to be a "classical" (classical era) or "romantic" (romantic era) composer?





Edit:



Beethoven Resources:

The Grove Concise Dictionary of Music

Beethoven Haus Bonn

LVBEETHOVEN.COM

Raptus Association for Music Appreciation site on Beethoven

Beethoven the Immortal

The Beethoven Reference Site

One Stop Beethoven Resource

All About LvB

Beethoven Forum
« Last Edit: January 07, 2008, 04:22:25 AM by Dm »

Offline BachQ

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Re: Beethoven's Bistro
« Reply #1 on: April 06, 2007, 03:32:36 AM »
Currently, my favorite works of Beethoven are these:

1. Missa Solemnis

2. Piano Concertos 4 and 5

3. Piano Sonatas 29-32 + Waldstein/Tempest/Appassionata/Pathetique

4. Symphonies 3/5/6/7/8/9

5. Ghost and Archduke Trios

6. Late String Quartets

7. Diabelli and Eroica Variations

8. Violin Concerto

9. Overtures to Egmont; King Stephen; Lenore #3

10. Violin Sonatas / Cello Sonatas

Offline knight66

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Re: Beethoven's Bistro
« Reply #2 on: April 06, 2007, 03:39:49 AM »
D Minor....I once encountered someone of that name elsewhere, but he knew little about music. D

Good old Beethoven.....

My favorite piece is The Missa Solemnis, it was a late piece, he took three years perfecting it and wrote on the title page. "From the heart, to the heart." He must have been a master musician to compose what he could not hear: by looking at it on the page he must have known how it would sound.
I recently sang it and did wonder at some of the demands he makes on the Basses in the choir where he wants a great deal of volume in notes where basses cannot generally produce a great deal, and this amongst thick textures. I wondered if he had been able to hear, would he have altered the writing? But quite possibly not and what he asks for contributes to the element of physical effort that is so much part of the piece.



A whole new world opens up, I can now repeat what I wrote elsewhere!

Mike
DavidW: Yeah Mike doesn't get angry, he gets even.
I wasted time: and time wasted me.

Offline knight66

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Re: Beethoven's Bistro
« Reply #3 on: April 06, 2007, 03:41:38 AM »
I see we have put the same piece as top, but possibly next I would have to have the first of the middle period string quartets. I have the Quartet Italiano unfurling that staggering melody that opens the first movement.

Mike
DavidW: Yeah Mike doesn't get angry, he gets even.
I wasted time: and time wasted me.

Harry

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Re: Beethoven's Bistro
« Reply #4 on: April 06, 2007, 03:46:33 AM »
My favourite works would be all what the fellow has composed, apart from the vocal works that is!
I am really serious about that, I simply adore all his works, and I am unable to single out one work!
Symphonies by Herbert von Karajan, Quartetto Italiano, and Vegh for the SQ, ans so on.

Offline BachQ

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Re: Beethoven's Bistro
« Reply #5 on: April 06, 2007, 03:47:24 AM »
A whole new world opens up, I can now repeat what I wrote elsewhere!

Exactly!  ;D


Offline BachQ

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Re: Beethoven's Bistro
« Reply #6 on: April 06, 2007, 04:03:00 AM »
My favourite works would be all what the fellow has composed, apart from the vocal works that is!

Harry,  I agree that his lieder are very much off my radar screen . . . . . .

I see we have put the same piece as top,

For me, Missa Solemnis took a long time to reach the top, as it had to wrestle beyond the symphonies, sonatas, and concerti.  8)  Piano Concerto no. 4 in G Major was particularly stubborn as my favorite Beethoven work . . . . . . but even it has succumbed to Missa Solemnis . . . . . . . [insert halo smiley]

All things considered, my favorite recording of Missa is Klemperer/New Philharmonia:






Offline knight66

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Re: Beethoven's Bistro
« Reply #7 on: April 06, 2007, 04:10:48 AM »
At to recordings of the Missa....I am still looking for my holy grail, I hear rumours of a stupendous Szell version that is not generally available. In the meantime, I have the 1st Karajan with Janowitz gracing the top line, Toscanini for sheer adrenalin kicks and amongst the other versions I have, the Levine for the way he digs into the second half of the work and manages that balance of certainty and questioning that Beethoven stitched into the piece.

Mike
DavidW: Yeah Mike doesn't get angry, he gets even.
I wasted time: and time wasted me.

hornteacher

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Re: Beethoven's Bistro
« Reply #8 on: April 06, 2007, 04:21:01 AM »
At to recordings of the Missa....I am still looking for my holy grail.

Mike

Gardiner has a marvellous version with the Monteverdi Choir and English Baroque Soloists.  It's a more recent recording but is excellent.

Offline Maciek

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Re: Beethoven's Bistro
« Reply #9 on: April 06, 2007, 04:24:11 AM »
Hey guys, stop teasing me! >:( I only have one recording (Solti) and don't have the assets right now to get 5-10 others. :'(

hornteacher

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Re: Beethoven's Bistro
« Reply #10 on: April 06, 2007, 04:27:47 AM »
Hi, I'm a newbie, and this is my first thread (first post, actually).  So please, everyone feel free to respond.

1. What do you think are among Beethoven's greatest achievements?  Most "influential" works?

2. What are your favorite works by Beethoven?  Least favorite?

3. Do you feel that Beethoven's personal challenges (deafness; nephew issues; etc) considerably heightened the emotional content of his music?

4. Any favorite recordings?  Of Symphonies? Piano Sonatas? Concertos?  Chamber?  Overtures?

1. Of course the obvious answers (Symphonies, Missa, Piano Sonatas, String Quartets) but one of the things I like about Beethoven is how he wrote so well for the horn.  No question, he influenced the development of the horn's role in the orchestra.  The trio in the Eroica, the outbursts in the 5th, the wild licks in the finale of the 7th, the great 4TH HORN solo in the 9th, and the very underrated Sonata for Horn and Piano Op. 17, which is a bear to play on a modern horn, let alone a natural one.

Beethoven was good to the horns.

Offline knight66

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Re: Beethoven's Bistro
« Reply #11 on: April 06, 2007, 04:35:08 AM »
Gardiner has a marvellous version with the Monteverdi Choir and English Baroque Soloists.  It's a more recent recording but is excellent.

I have it, but feel it underplays the emotional content somewhat...efficient is how I would characterise it.

Quote
Hey guys, stop teasing me!  I only have one recording (Solti) and don't have the assets right now to get 5-10 others.

I don't have an official Solti recording, but I do have an off the air recording of his from a London Prom, I was in the choir, so it seems a special performance to me, but in truth the sound is pretty awful. It was televised and my tape needs to be transferred onto DVD, that gives more of a feel for the sheer energy Solti encouraged and the raw excitement that is part of the piece.

Mike
DavidW: Yeah Mike doesn't get angry, he gets even.
I wasted time: and time wasted me.

Offline Maciek

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Re: Beethoven's Bistro
« Reply #12 on: April 06, 2007, 04:47:11 AM »
Lucia Popp, Yvonne Minton, Mallory Walker, Gwynne Howell, Chicago Symphony Chorus and Orchestra, Sir George Solti. That's what it says. I like it but it's on cassette :-[. I think it's time I bought it on CD... ::)

Offline knight66

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Re: Beethoven's Bistro
« Reply #13 on: April 06, 2007, 04:50:30 AM »
Cassette...there is a word one would not have thought to see on this new site! The female singers are excellent, Howell, sounds fine, but he always just stood there like a sack of potatoes and sang with a blank face. I should think it is better not being able to see him. The bass in the Solti I mentioned was Sotin....presence plus.

Mike
DavidW: Yeah Mike doesn't get angry, he gets even.
I wasted time: and time wasted me.

Symphonien

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Re: Beethoven's Bistro
« Reply #14 on: April 06, 2007, 05:11:41 AM »
I've loved pretty much all Beethoven I've heard so far: the symphonies, piano sonatas, piano concerti and the violin concerto.

I listened to his symphonies so many times when I first got them... Although I don't listen to them as often anymore, I still never grow tired of listening to one of them now and again. The only ones I haven't quite warmed to as much as the others are the 2nd and 4th.

My favourite work would definitely have to be the Emperor Concerto.
« Last Edit: April 06, 2007, 05:14:29 AM by Symphonien »

George

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Re: Beethoven's Bistro
« Reply #15 on: April 06, 2007, 05:24:20 AM »
Beethoven sucks.


 
« Last Edit: April 06, 2007, 05:50:41 AM by George »

Harry

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Re: Beethoven's Bistro
« Reply #16 on: April 06, 2007, 05:31:00 AM »

George

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Re: Beethoven's Bistro
« Reply #17 on: April 06, 2007, 05:33:07 AM »
Really? :o

Seemed like a nice first post at the time...perhaps I should reconsider?  :-\

George

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Re: Beethoven's Bistro
« Reply #18 on: April 06, 2007, 05:46:43 AM »
OK:

1. What do you think are among Beethoven's greatest achievements?  Most "influential" works?

His symphonies probably. Many Romantic composers found it difficult to escape the "shadow of Beethoven." Some, like Brahms for instance, felt this influence rather deeply.

2. What are your favorite works by Beethoven?  Least favorite?

The piano sonatas, symphonies and string quartets. I can't get more specific than that. Least favorite? I really haven't heard anything that I don't like by him.

3. Do you feel that Beethoven's personal challenges (deafness; nephew issues; etc) considerably heightened the emotional content of his music?

Perhaps, I am sure that his upbringing also had this effect as well.

4. Any favorite recordings?  Of Symphonies? Piano Sonatas? Concertos?  Chamber?  Overtures?

Symphonies: Szell, HvK '62, Barenboim

Piano Sonatas: Annie Fischer, Gulda (Amadeo), Gilels, Backhaus, Schnabel, Kovacevich, Kempff (m), Hungerford

Concertos: 1- Richter/Munch, 2-Pollini/Jochum, 3-Annie Fischer/Fricsay, Serkin/Bernstein, 4-Arrau/Haitink, 5-Serkin/Bernstein, Pollini/Boehm

Chamber: SQ- Vegh, Italiano

Overtures: Szell/Cleveland
« Last Edit: April 06, 2007, 11:21:53 AM by George »

Offline Novi

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Re: Beethoven's Bistro
« Reply #19 on: April 06, 2007, 05:53:06 AM »
Beethoven sucks.

Yeah, hear, hear ... and only those who have no idea with spaces in their names like G E O R G E or squiggles before like ~George have 24 or so sonata sets  :P.

Hello D minor, I'm a newbie too :).

My favourites: I vacillate between the late sonatas and the late quartets, particularly opp 111 and 132. Both are equally sublime, but I think maybe solo piano has the edge.

For orchestral, the Eroica has always been a favourite since before serious listening days even. But last year, I heard the Scottish Chamber Orchestra do a phenomenal 7th which knocked Kleiber from his pedestal (and they have girls in the SCO ;)).

 
Durch alle Töne tönet
Im bunten Erdentraum
Ein leiser Ton gezogen
Für den der heimlich lauschet.

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