Author Topic: 5 Worst Composers Ever!!  (Read 103593 times)

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Offline Sammy

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Re: 5 Worst Composers Ever!!
« Reply #580 on: May 08, 2013, 06:06:10 PM »
Well OK .. you continue to enjoy his tales from the classroom, as if that has much to do with the real world ..

And just where is the real world?  Cato in a classroom is his real world.  I sure wouldn't want teachers thinking that they're in fantasy land.

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Re: 5 Worst Composers Ever!!
« Reply #581 on: May 08, 2013, 06:06:46 PM »
Sure, if youre a young person who lives in a classroom too essentally .. but otherwise to grown adults who live in the real world to keep referring things back to a classroom like Cato does (its seems often) is well .. 
I haven't been in a classroom in 25 months.

I agree with Karl here:
Thank goodness we have a grownup like you around, James. I find Cato's (infrequent) references to his classroom germane, and interesting. But of course, I could never hope to be your match in maturity.

Offline Octave

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Re: 5 Worst Composers Ever!!
« Reply #582 on: May 08, 2013, 06:11:48 PM »
Thank goodness we have a grownup like you around, James. I find Cato's (infrequent) references to his classroom germane, and interesting. But of course, I could never hope to be your match in maturity.

Plus, I can't ever remember finding any of said references pedantic, they just seem like appeals to experience, not authority.  Cato even thematizes that difference in that last/recent post/ref. of his.  It almost seems like he learns from/with his students!  *gasp*  I envy his students! 

I personally mainly had the bad luck to have vindictive nuns (so to speak) and burn-outs and browbeaten wrecks drowning in tweed, one after the next, all experts in part-whole confusion.  Classics goons and "cultural studies" goons: all the same.  They vector obedience and think it's humility.  Another confusion.  I kept being told I was to take responsibility for my own education, and finally I believed them, against my will.  Lesson learned.   :(    I want to be like the tortured and exiled Machiavelli, who donned his nice evening wear in order to spend time with the ancients [his books] after a long day hanging out with the rough-and-tumble townies.
« Last Edit: May 08, 2013, 06:17:47 PM by Octave »
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Offline Octave

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Re: 5 Worst Composers Ever!!
« Reply #583 on: May 08, 2013, 06:13:21 PM »
People who say "those who can't do, teach" are insane.  They are insane and speak from an armchair.  Aristotle was right, you can "do" by accident; but to teach, you have to understand.  (He says it better than this.)
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Re: 5 Worst Composers Ever!!
« Reply #584 on: May 08, 2013, 06:15:54 PM »
Well OK .. you continue to enjoy his tales from the classroom, as if that has much to do with the real world ..

It seems to me that Cato is one of those rare teachers who does far beyond what is required of him in order to prepare his students for the real world.  Why you would criticize him is beyond me.  The classroom is part of the real world, afterall.

I like to think of Cato as our own Walter White.   :D
« Last Edit: May 08, 2013, 06:19:50 PM by Parsifal »

Offline Octave

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Re: 5 Worst Composers Ever!!
« Reply #585 on: May 08, 2013, 06:19:06 PM »
I like to think of Cato as our own Walter White.   :D

Oh dear....that's Bad.
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Parsifal

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Re: 5 Worst Composers Ever!!
« Reply #586 on: May 08, 2013, 06:21:43 PM »
Oh dear....that's Breaking Bad.

Yes, we don't want to push him over the edge.  They say that the word is mightier than the sword, so it is also probably mightier than fulminate of mercury!

Offline Madiel

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Re: 5 Worst Composers Ever!!
« Reply #587 on: May 09, 2013, 12:49:45 AM »
For example, someone who listens to Mozart because his operas have never been out of the repertoire is a sheep; though when challenged on the value of the composer, it is true that they can point to this as a reason to listen to the operas in question.  "Because he's still there!"  It's not a bad reason for greatness in 2013, just a.....curiously hollow reason.   One starts to wonder if the whole point of talking about (music) history is precisely to repeat it.

I like period instruments and performance, for example, because they are "out" of tune, out of joint with the "tradition of quality" intonation and robust, romantic vigor; not because they offer me something "more" authentic, a window into/onto a lost time (and economic/class system).  I like them because they sound wrong by standards that have been enforced and policed for quite a while (but not a long time). 

Liking things specifically for being out of step is no more laudable than liking things specifically for being in step.  In fact they're the same thing. Both are letting your decisions being dictated by what other people think, not by your personal response.  A genuine response doesn't give a damn whether what you listen to is popular or not, and in fact it's statistically LIKELY that you'll often like things are popular unless you're going out of your way to say "look how wonderfully counter-cultural I am".

Such an attitude is, if anything, even more hollow than the attitude that likes whatever is popular, because at least someone who likes whatever is popular is admitting to being swayed by popular opinion.  Constantly being in opposition to popular opinion is every bit as much being swayed by popular opinion, but while trying to deny it.
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Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Re: 5 Worst Composers Ever!!
« Reply #588 on: May 09, 2013, 01:47:58 AM »
Yea .. he constantly reminds us in almost every discussion on here that he thinks he's the greatest teacher ever .. we get it already.

The problem here is yours entirely, and none of Cato's.

And remind us, who appointed you as the Content Nazi, again? TIA
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Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: 5 Worst Composers Ever!!
« Reply #589 on: May 09, 2013, 01:53:27 AM »
You gotta get out more karl.

This pithy line: such breathtaking maturity!

The apparent irony is, I can readily imagine an underachieving pupil in a classroom parroting exactly that line. But let's dig a little deeper.

In his inexhaustible wisdom, James has brought us full circle; he has revealed that the classroom is as Real Life® as life gets.

You teach us so very much, James.

Never change.
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
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[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline Cato

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Re: 5 Worst Composers Ever!!
« Reply #590 on: May 09, 2013, 02:42:15 AM »
Yea .. he constantly reminds us in almost every discussion on here that he thinks he's the greatest teacher ever .. we get it already.

Wow!  ???

Many thanks to my supporters for the kind comments!

James: here is a solution to the problem. 

Don't read anything I write!   :laugh:

When you see that I have written a comment, ignore it.

As to being the greatest teacher ever, all I will say is that the greatest teacher ever was crucified for His efforts. 

"Meet Miss Ruth Sherwood, from Columbus, Ohio, the Middle of the Universe!"

- Brian Aherne introducing Rosalind Russell in  My Sister Eileen (1942)

Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: 5 Worst Composers Ever!!
« Reply #591 on: May 09, 2013, 02:46:53 AM »
Well, and really, what a funny remark from such a source. You remind us in every post what a God you think Stockhausen is .. we get it already.
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[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
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His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: 5 Worst Composers Ever!!
« Reply #592 on: May 09, 2013, 02:47:32 AM »
Liking things specifically for being out of step is no more laudable than liking things specifically for being in step.  In fact they're the same thing.

QFT
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[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
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His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: 5 Worst Composers Ever!!
« Reply #593 on: May 09, 2013, 03:27:08 AM »
While the recent discussion in this thread has been interesting I must say that this is my favorite post in terms of entertainment value.

This one comes close, though:

Mozart can be harmful to art.

Dude, if you're going to fling absurdities about, you might try to argue the case. The greatest practitioners of Art are the enemies of Art?  Draw us a diagram, there's a good fellow.

Karl's cited "narcissism" can be, often is, the very essence of living art.

You've jumped rails (not to say the shark) entirely. Using What does it do for me? to declare to the world what is and what is not great art, is narcissism. And an entirely different matter to an artist applying whatever filtration process he please in the pursuit of his own work.
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
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Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Parsifal

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Re: 5 Worst Composers Ever!!
« Reply #594 on: May 09, 2013, 03:55:11 AM »
Speaking of the classroom, this thread is starting to remind me of kindergarten.

Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: 5 Worst Composers Ever!!
« Reply #595 on: May 09, 2013, 03:59:22 AM »
Some would say, that but harmonizes with the topic, I suppose.
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
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[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline petrarch

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Re: Re: 5 Worst Composers Ever!!
« Reply #596 on: May 09, 2013, 03:59:46 AM »
The problem here is yours entirely, and none of Cato's.

James likes to talk about people, not ideas. The borderline insulting deflates to harmlessly vacuous if we keep that in mind.
« Last Edit: May 09, 2013, 04:07:00 AM by petrarch »
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Parsifal

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Re: Re: 5 Worst Composers Ever!!
« Reply #597 on: May 09, 2013, 04:21:13 AM »
You've all been punk'd. Continue on ..

Yes, this is how I imagine kindergarten these days.  But maybe it's more along the lines of "hand over that juice box before I pop a cap in your ass."  Let's ask Cato!  :D
« Last Edit: May 09, 2013, 04:32:19 AM by Parsifal »

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Re: 5 Worst Composers Ever!!
« Reply #598 on: May 09, 2013, 04:38:11 AM »
Time to give this topic a little rest. It was never a very good topic to start with, and it has now deteriorated into even worse areas than intended. Let's have a fresh start on a new day.

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