Bach's Greatest Works Part 2a The Cantatas

[DavidW]

Cantatas

• BWV 004, Christ lag in Todesbanden
• BWV 054, Widerstehe doch der Sünde
• BWV 062, Nun komm, der Heiden Heiland
• BWV 082, Ich Habe Genug
• BWV 084, Ich bin vergnügt mit meinem Glücke
• BWV 106, Gottes Zeit ist die allerbeste Zeit
• BWV 125, Mit Fried und Freud ich fahr dahin
• BWV 140, Wachet auf, ruft uns die Stimme
• BWV 150, Nach dir, Herr, verlanget mich
• BWV 169, Gott soll allein mein Herze haben
• BWV 170, Vergnügte Ruh', beliebte Seelenlust
• BWV 198, Laß, Fürstin, laß einen Strahl
• BWV 211, Schweigt stille, plaudert nicht

What is special about the works listed above is that every work had at least one gmg poster that loved them enough to nominate them for a greatest works of list.

I see the cantatas as program music, a label that does not demean them at all.  Romanticism has made us attach a great deal of almost holy weight to the abstract composition, as if it becomes necessary for music to be abstract to stand as great art.

Well do you think that Bach's cantatas can be listened to as abstract music, or is it vital to appreciate the works by knowing the program?

What do you like about these works?  In what ways do they stand out from cantatas from his peers?  In what ways do they not?

What qualities should a great cantata possess?  And in what way do you think that the works listed above do/do not possess those qualities?

Please answer any or none of the questions.  If you feel that I'm asking the wrong questions, please ask your own.

I'm going to stagger the release of the phase 2 threads so as to not exhaust fellow gmg Bachians.

[Marc]

I see the cantatas as program music, a label that does not demean them at all.  Romanticism has made us attach a great deal of almost holy weight to the abstract composition, as if it becomes necessary for music to be abstract to stand as great art.

Hmm, I have to admit that's a thought that would never 'come' to me.
To me, program music is an 'invention' of the 19th century.

About Bach: his music comforts me. And sometimes he takes me to the Nirvana.
Also in the cantatas, f.i. the alto aria of BWV 125.

[DavidW]

Well it already looks I have to defend that program music assertion.  I came across something that tilted me to think of the cantatas that way (but I thought it was common knowledge) in Haynes The End of Early Music, but he was actually quoting Taruskin.

The aria in BWV 13/5 employs parallel sevenths to make the music intentionally unpleasant, unmusical, just horrible on the ear (at least an ear for that time) to accompany the text "Groaning and wailing pitifully will not cure sorrow's sickness."

The point exemplified by that example being that the music is rhetorical, instead of simply being pleasant to listen to, it instead paints a mood for each accompanying part of the text to as a whole convey the passage that was studied for that Sunday.  And the music might not even be entertaining, while a concerto for example would certainly be.

Even though we don't have painting of specific objects/events like Strauss, that's about as close as using music to script a story as you can get for that time, which is why I consider it to be programmatic.

Like 's son it's much easier for me to listen to the music as absolute, because even if I look up the passage for that Sunday I still would have trouble following the text when I listened to it, I would put so much effort into not getting lost I don't think I would put 2 and 2 together anyway to recognize what say trumpets represented in a certain passage, how an affection was developed to match the text.  It's difficult.

But the music shines so bright that I think that it can be appreciated as absolute music even though it's not.

[Mandryka]

BWV 004, Christ lag in Todesbanden
There's an extraordinary moment when Fischer Dieskau sings this with Richter. he has the lines:

Der Würger kann uns nicht mehr schaden.
Halleluja!

And the way he sings nicht and Halleluja – both  repeated several times, is memorable.

The poem -- by Luther I think -- is very good.

BWV 054, Widerstehe doch der Sünde
Deller makes the hairs on the back of my neck bristle in this.

BWV 082, Ich Habe Genug
In Hunt –Lieberson's version the Lullaby is sung with such candour I can hardly bear to hear it. Hotter gives really profound meaning to the line Welt, gute Nacht!

[DavidW]

BWV 082, Ich Habe Genug
In Hunt –Lieberson's version the Lullaby is sung with such candour I can hardly bear to hear it. Hotter gives really profound meaning to the line Welt, gute Nacht!

The opening of this cantata with the mournful oboe just blows me away.  There is such deep sadness and longing.

[Opus106]

The opening of this cantata with the mournful oboe just blows me away.  There is such deep sadness and longing.

Bach uses the oboe wonderfully in many of his vocal and choral works -- at least among those I've seen and heard on YouTube. There's the one early in the Kyrie Eleison of BWV 232.*

I agree with you about the opening of BWV 82a, however. The one I have on CD and familiar with is for soprano [Nancy Argenta/Virgin Classics], with the oboe part transcribed for flute, but the effect you mention still very much remains.




*Or is that a flute, also?

[Guido]

An extraordinary group of performers:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qO_W6TFwmEo