Author Topic: Symphonic/Philarmonic Orchestras ?  (Read 11936 times)

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Offline Bonehelm

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Re: Symphonic/Philarmonic Orchestras ?
« Reply #20 on: June 20, 2007, 05:01:52 PM »
Nope. Just philm scores.   ;)

Good one!  ;)

pjme

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Re: Symphonic/Philarmonic Orchestras ?
« Reply #21 on: June 21, 2007, 12:29:37 PM »
It's an odd thing though - composers write symphonies but no one writes philharmonies. I wonder why?

 ;D ;D ;D

Anyway- some composers wrote pieces with names like : Concerto philharmonico ( 1990-1992 Gotfried von Einem -for the Vienna Phil.)

Preludio filharmonico by  Czech Evžen Zámečník ( 1980) -


« Last Edit: June 22, 2007, 09:15:54 AM by pjme »

Greta

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Re: Symphonic/Philarmonic Orchestras ?
« Reply #22 on: June 24, 2007, 01:10:06 AM »
What are the differences between the BBC Philharmonic, Symphony Orchestra, and Concert Orchestra? The Concert Orchestra works in TV and film more I think. Is the BBC SO considered the premier ensemble?

M forever

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Re: Symphonic/Philarmonic Orchestras ?
« Reply #23 on: June 24, 2007, 04:30:45 AM »
The Concert Orchestra is indeed specialized in "lighter music". The S is in London, the P in Manchester. That's the only real difference. Who cares what is "considered" this or that? They are both good orchestras. There is also a BBC Scottish Sympony and BBC National Orchestra of Wales. Never heard the latter, but I heard the the former, it is quite good, too.

Choo Choo

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Re: Symphonic/Philarmonic Orchestras ?
« Reply #24 on: June 24, 2007, 04:43:46 AM »
The NOW is my favourite of the BBC orchestras, having developed a sinewy, gritty sound under Walter Weller that is/was great e.g. in Bruckner.  Unfortunately it all went a bit soggy under Hickox - but they are still a fine outfit.

Greta

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Re: Symphonic/Philarmonic Orchestras ?
« Reply #25 on: June 24, 2007, 05:20:24 AM »
Quote
The Concert Orchestra is indeed specialized in "lighter music". The S is in London, the P in Manchester. That's the only real difference.

Location, gotcha. I think they're equally fine orchestras myself but always was curious just what the distinction was with the different names. In fact one of my favorite discs I've run across lately is a vivacious live Mahler 6th from the BBC Phil under Mackerras, the playing of both ensembles is top-notch.

Offline knight66

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Re: Symphonic/Philarmonic Orchestras ?
« Reply #26 on: June 24, 2007, 06:42:25 AM »
Historically the London orchestra would get the more prestigous cheif conductors, Boult, Kempe, Boulez etc. But in recent years, they have all managed to attract rather good chiefs. For instance Ilan Volkov from 2003 in Scotland, he is a really exciting conductor.

Here are some samples of him....

http://www.hyperion-records.co.uk/artist_page.asp?name=volkov

Mike
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Offline samtrb

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Re: Symphonic/Philarmonic Orchestras ?
« Reply #27 on: June 27, 2007, 05:07:24 AM »
The symphony orchestra is the "modern" orchestra of the romantic period after Schubert and Berlioz, including nearly all instruments like the trombones, the harp and others on demand (piccolo, bass clarinet). The philarmonic is just another fancy name  ;D

M forever

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Re: Symphonic/Philarmonic Orchestras ?
« Reply #28 on: June 27, 2007, 06:22:25 AM »
BPO certainly has more than that. Just look up their Mahler videos...huge orchestra and chorus.

I know, I know, it is nitpicking ...but : ::)

I count 124 members at the Berlin PO.....( incl. 4 Konzertmeister;,excl. 3 or 4 open posts)....see: http://www.berliner-philharmoniker.de/de/orchester/ :)

You are correct. The BP have 128 permanent members, although rarely all of the positions are filled at the same time. They sometimes take a lot of time to fill them with people who live up to their expectations.
In addition to that, at any time, they have 30 young musicians in the "Orchester-Akademie" which is an institution attached to the orchestra. It offers a kind of postgraduate study program/internship with the orchestra for 2 years, and these young musicians play in the orchestra regularly, too.

The typical size of most bigger concert/radio/opera orchestras in Germany is about that, typically around 110-130 members or so. There are about 40 orchestras of that size, I think. They usually have 5 of each wind instruments (but 8 horns), and about 70-80 string players. That doesn't mean they all play at the same time. They have to have time off now and then.

The biggest orchestra is the Gewandhausorchester which has 192 permanent members. They do full time concert and opera.

The seond biggest is the Staatskapelle Dresden with 162 members. They do full time opera and not a full season of concerts, but they are heavily in demand for concert tours, festival appearances, recordings.

The concept of the "orchestral academy" was introduced by the BP in the early 70s (it was actually Karajan's idea) because they found that many graduates from music schools were very good, but not quite ready yet. So they started that.
It provides young musicians who are already very good, but who need some more experience and routine, with an opportunity to bridge that critical time between studying and working full time, and it allows them to "shape" young musicians and integrate them into the orchestra. Plus, it provides them with a pool of extra musicians they can draw from any time since the academists play with the orchestra regularly, sometimes almost full time when there are open positions.
The academists do not automatically become members after 2 years, they still have to take part in the auditions when positions are open. Some of them stay, some of them get jobs in other good orchestras.
That concept has been picked up by many other orchestras and opera houses, so most of them have similar insitutions now.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2007, 06:26:42 AM by M forever »

Offline MishaK

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Re: Symphonic/Philarmonic Orchestras ?
« Reply #29 on: June 27, 2007, 03:08:21 PM »
The concept of the "orchestral academy" was introduced by the BP in the early 70s (it was actually Karajan's idea) because they found that many graduates from music schools were very good, but not quite ready yet. So they started that.
It provides young musicians who are already very good, but who need some more experience and routine, with an opportunity to bridge that critical time between studying and working full time, and it allows them to "shape" young musicians and integrate them into the orchestra. Plus, it provides them with a pool of extra musicians they can draw from any time since the academists play with the orchestra regularly, sometimes almost full time when there are open positions.
The academists do not automatically become members after 2 years, they still have to take part in the auditions when positions are open. Some of them stay, some of them get jobs in other good orchestras.
That concept has been picked up by many other orchestras and opera houses, so most of them have similar insitutions now.

Actually, that was not really that novel of an idea. E.g., the Civic Orchestra of Chicago, the training orchestra of the CSO, was founded in 1919. Martinon and Reiner were quite involved with it. It languished a bit under Solti, but Barenboim revived it again. See also here. They train and perform with the CSO MD and guest conductors as well as their own conductor, currently Cliff Colnot. Many Civic alumni go on to become CSO members or move on to other major orchestras. I happened to catch one of their concerts a few years ago with Barenboim (as well as some open rehearsals prior to the concert) and they played really extremely well, as good as any top professional orchestra. The finest live Daphnis & Chloe I have heard, with uncanny dynamic contrasts. I am sure there are other orchestral academies as well that predate Karajan's.