Author Topic: 21st century classical music  (Read 142201 times)

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Offline Henk

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Re: 21st century classical music
« Reply #40 on: June 04, 2012, 01:19:26 PM »
People, try Robin de Raaff:



Listened to the Concerto for Orchestra some time ago. Very impressive. This is a great composer. The other two works are also fine. Need to listen to his opera again soon.



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« Last Edit: June 04, 2012, 01:23:28 PM by Henk »
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Offline jimmosk

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Re: 21st century classical music
« Reply #41 on: June 04, 2012, 10:16:08 PM »
I would be remiss in my responsibilities were I not to include...

George Crumb
Unto the Hills (American Songbook III) for soprano, percussion quartet and piano (2001)
Eine Kleine Mitternachtmusik for solo piano (2002)
The River of Life (American Songbook I) for soprano, percussion quartet and piano (2003)
A Journey Beyond Time (American Songbook II) for soprano, percussion quartet and piano (2003)
Otherworldly Resonances for two pianos (2003)
The Winds of Destiny (American Songbook IV) for soprano, percussion quartet and piano (2004)
Voices from a Forgotten World (American Songbook V) for soprano, baritone, percussion quartet and piano (2007)
The Ghosts of Alhambra (Spanish Songbook I) for baritone, guitar and percussion (2008)
Voices from the Morning of the Earth (American Songbook VI) for soprano, baritone, percussion quartet and piano (2008)
Sun and Shadow (Spanish Songbook II) for soprano and amplified piano (2009)
Voices from the Heartland (American Songbook VII) for soprano, baritone, percussion quartet and piano (2010)


« Last Edit: June 04, 2012, 10:23:19 PM by jimmosk »
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Leon

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Re: 21st century classical music
« Reply #42 on: June 05, 2012, 04:46:36 AM »
Hans Abrahamsen

Schnee has been mentioned , but there are some other very interesting works for traditional ensembles: string quartet, wind quintet, piano trio (horn).





 :)

Offline some guy

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Re: 21st century classical music
« Reply #43 on: June 05, 2012, 11:39:22 AM »
James, you bring up classical training in a recent post. I was not thinking about training when I made my list. And I don't think about training when I listen to music. But I've been thinking about training since reading your post. The list I made was made by a person who is a classically trained listener. That is, once I first heard "classical" music, around age 9, I was hooked and have listened to little else since then. So what you've got there is a list of some of the people I listen to as a classically trained listener.

I listen to other things, it's true. I very much like King Crimson, for instance. And Primus. But I wouldn't mention either in a "classical" thread, except like this. Nurse With Wound, yeah. Dr. Nerve, sure. (That's Nick Didkovsky, a "classically" trained violinist.)

Of course, there's also that word in the subject line. It's an increasingly problematic and troublesome word. I spend the bulk of my time listening to, writing about, and talking with practitioners of contemporary music. The word "classical" doesn't come up very often. It's just not a useful term any more among the people I hang out with. I mentioned it once to Michele Bokanowski, and she said, incredulous, "You consider what I'm doing to be 'classical music'?" At the time (2006?) I said "Yes." I would say "No" today.

But that's not because I don't think her music is serious or artistic or valuable. It's all of those things. It's more that over the past six years of attending contemporary music festivals all over the world and talking to the people who create the music and who perform it, I've become increasingly uncomfortable with the label.

It's not the end all and be all of labels, after all. It was first used in 1810, just by the way (not getting into English until the mid twenties), after the era we now call "classical" was pretty much over. That is, Mozart and Haydn and Beethoven and Hummel and Gluck and hundreds of others managed to write tons of music that is now called "classical" without benefit of that defining term. (Just as Vivaldi and Bach and hundreds of people in between managed to write tons of music without ever having the word "baroque" to guide them, or the word "classical," either.)

I guess what counts for inclusion on any list I make is whether I think they're doing "art" or doing "entertainment." And I'm probably wrong.

Online North Star

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Re: 21st century classical music
« Reply #44 on: June 05, 2012, 01:20:33 PM »
James, you bring up classical training in a recent post. I was not thinking about training when I made my list. And I don't think about training when I listen to music. But I've been thinking about training since reading your post. The list I made was made by a person who is a classically trained listener. That is, once I first heard "classical" music, around age 9, I was hooked and have listened to little else since then. So what you've got there is a list of some of the people I listen to as a classically trained listener.

That is not training. Training is studying composition or an instrument at a conservatory, or with a private teacher. Not saying whether it is necessary for understanding music, just saying what training means. Studying music by listening is of course a way of studying the music, which, although invaluable, isn't the same as studying the scores or learning to play the pieces. Not saying that listening is better or worse than reading/playing, just saying that all three are different and help understanding different aspects of the music.


...continue...
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Offline some guy

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Re: 21st century classical music
« Reply #45 on: June 05, 2012, 01:57:14 PM »
North,

I've done all that other stuff, too.

Guy

ibanezmonster

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Re: 21st century classical music
« Reply #46 on: June 05, 2012, 03:52:59 PM »
Can't I find EVERY single thing I could possibly ever want, within the years 1946-1996?
Sometimes you don't know you need something until after you discover it.


Oh, and another thing... WHO are these youngsters who want to be Composers anyhow? I assume most are rich Jewish kids from NYC... yea, I know, that's a horrible attitude to have, but who but the rich kids are even going to have the money to go to  University or whatever?
Well, nowadays, music education isn't needed as much, because of the internet. Anyone can teach themselves how to compose, though of course, the only ones who will be successful will be the ones who are self-critical.

Offline some guy

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Re: 21st century classical music
« Reply #47 on: June 05, 2012, 03:54:12 PM »
In other words, take my ball and go home?

Well, at least I won't have to keep seeing the wrong name, Jim. ;D

Leon

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Re: 21st century classical music
« Reply #48 on: June 05, 2012, 04:05:45 PM »
Funny; the two guys who are appear to be the most interested in 21st century music can't seem to get along ...

 :D

Offline some guy

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Re: 21st century classical music
« Reply #49 on: June 05, 2012, 07:27:22 PM »
It's Wagner and Brahms all over again! ;D

Offline snyprrr

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Re: 21st century classical music
« Reply #50 on: June 05, 2012, 08:41:47 PM »
I want to take 'someguy's point about being more positive. I know that being mad doesn't do anything other than soften up my bowels; I still take issue with the whole 'Composers don't have to do anything else' line, but, I'm trying to be peaceful THIS week, so I have absolutely no fight in me for making points,...

I just don't want tax dollars going to some...ewww :P... Composer!! (ok, that's just ONE Rant :-* ;D)


I wonder if I'm one of those people like in the Westerns when the 'Old' West types can't keep up with the 'New' World, such as the auto... Wild Bunch... where I just like would throw this whole Thread away for Hindemith, or something.

I guess I never hear 'someguy' champion the mostly recently deceased generation of the High Modernists, of whom Carter and Boulez and Dutilleux are the very last, though I'm sure that just like me (Xenakis) and James (Stockhausen), he has his favorites.

I can't even fake an argument, haha ;)!

Me personally, I just can't see myself needing all this new music year after year, hundreds and hundreds,... I mean, I just got into a Liszt phase!,... by the time I get back here I could have missed the next big thing. I mean, seriously, if Lachenmann starts sounding like Mahler, I'm out! >:D


Speaking of the Next Big Thing,... when was the last time we had that? Gorecki? :-\

Oh, I'm 'trying' to be positive. ('Do, or do not. There is no try.')
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Offline some guy

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Re: 21st century classical music
« Reply #51 on: June 05, 2012, 09:32:22 PM »
I just don't want tax dollars going to some...ewww :P... Composer!! (ok, that's just ONE Rant :-* ;D)
But one man's "ewww composer" is another man's "wow! composer." So who gets to decide?

And your tax dollars go to all sorts of different things. Better that they go to bullets to kill kids halfway around the world, maybe? (I.e., there are lots of much more rant-worthy topics than ewww composers getting a miniscule fraction of your tax money.

Anyway, most composers I know pay their bills by teaching and by selling CDs and by concerts. It's not a lot, but they get by. You were thinking that they got huge grants of hundreds of thousands of dollars from government grants? This only happens in their dreams.

Online North Star

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Re: 21st century classical music
« Reply #52 on: June 05, 2012, 09:50:42 PM »
North,

I've done all that other stuff, too.

Guy
Cool. Not that this really surprises. I just read your post as saying that you considered mere listening as training.

Karlo
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Offline some guy

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Re: 21st century classical music
« Reply #53 on: June 05, 2012, 10:44:29 PM »
Well, I certainly do not consider listening to be "mere"! :o

Online North Star

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Re: 21st century classical music
« Reply #54 on: June 05, 2012, 10:47:29 PM »
Well, I certainly do not consider listening to be "mere"! :o
Yeah, bad word perhaps - but 'only listening' would have an entirely different meaning.
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Offline snyprrr

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Re: 21st century classical music
« Reply #55 on: June 06, 2012, 07:11:17 AM »
But one man's "ewww composer" is another man's "wow! composer." So who gets to decide?

And your tax dollars go to all sorts of different things. Better that they go to bullets to kill kids halfway around the world, maybe? (I.e., there are lots of much more rant-worthy topics than ewww composers getting a miniscule fraction of your tax money.

Anyway, most composers I know pay their bills by teaching and by selling CDs and by concerts. It's not a lot, but they get by. You were thinking that they got huge grants of hundreds of thousands of dollars from government grants? This only happens in their dreams.

Yes I was!!!!!


ok, if you say so,... frankly, yes, there are other topics, such as using the US military to safeguard heroin production,...


I guess,... I just read that we are at our most polarized (as Americans) right now. When you ask, Who gets to decide?, that certainly IS the question isn't it?

I guess that when a 'Cute Kitty Video' can become just as famous as a 'New Music Video', then maybe the playing field has been slightly leveled?

I suppose I just react to... c'mon guys, aren't most Composers today flaming libtards?? I mean, can't I HEAR the politics in music by now??

Oh, maybe I just NEED to keep arguing,... I know my 'cause' is lost.

I declare, I have 'New' Music by Cristobal Halffter, written in 2007. Used to be that NO Classical Music was famous until after the death of the Composer

UNCLE!!

UNCLE!!

I'd LOVE to meet some of these Composers-in-Training. I just can't see where wanting to be a Composer TODAY is any kind of noble thing. Rather, I'd like to see students more concerned with the music of the last 100 years, and maybe we need them more to be Custodians!! rather than more post-Post Modern's who think there IS anything left to say.

I still declare There is Nothing New Under the Sun. The technology

I'm done. :-[ :-[ :-[
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Leon

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Re: 21st century classical music
« Reply #56 on: June 06, 2012, 07:36:34 AM »
I'm done. :-[ :-[ :-[

If only this were true ...

 :o

ibanezmonster

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Re: 21st century classical music
« Reply #57 on: June 06, 2012, 07:50:41 AM »
Yea good luck getting anywhere doing just that ..
The only problem of not going to school is that you probably won't have connections for people to actually perform your music.

I taught myself guitar and how to compose through books and the internet. For composing, the vast majority of your study will come from studying scores. The other sources will come from music theory books (I'd say only around 10 or so are really necessary, though it all depends).

Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: 21st century classical music
« Reply #58 on: June 06, 2012, 07:53:50 AM »
Oh, maybe I just NEED to keep arguing,... I know my 'cause' is lost.

(* munches popcorn *)
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
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[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Leon

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Re: 21st century classical music
« Reply #59 on: June 06, 2012, 08:36:33 AM »
Formal music/composition training is very valuable and can, depending on the teacher, be a crucial process for a student finding his/her voice and learning the craft of musical composition.  However, there have been some composers who learned their craft in another fashion.  I am thinking here of Harry Partch, John Luther Adams (who despite earning a B.A. in music got most of his training through alternative methods), and others who did not follow the traditional path.

There are no rules.

 :)

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