Author Topic: Schoenberg's Sheen  (Read 78518 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline scottscheule

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 73
Re: Let Schoenberg Schine
« Reply #60 on: May 15, 2007, 11:28:42 AM »
About 18 listenings into Pierrot.  My favorite selection?  Has to be the penultimate barcarolle.  Second place goes to Madonna.

Offline Brewski

  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 12024
  • "Man With No Shadow" by Makoto Tojiki (2009)
Re: Let Schoenberg Schine
« Reply #61 on: May 15, 2007, 11:36:19 AM »
I've been listening to Boulez's Erwartung:

http://www.amazon.com/Schoenberg-Waldtaube-Erwartung-Zukerman-Barenboim/dp/B00000281B

Anyone know the disc, have an opinion?  Most reviews I find seem to be negative--I've never heard other recordings of the pieces, so I can't really say.

I wish I could comment, but I don't have this collection.  The reviews seem to be all over the map.  I love all the pieces, though, and had the good fortune in the last couple of years to hear Pierrot three times live, by Dawn Upshaw, Phyllis Bryn-Julson and Lucy Shelton, all quite good in different ways.

--Bruce
"Do you realize that we're meteorites; almost as soon as we're born, we have to disappear?"

~Iannis Xenakis

Twitter: @BruceHodgesNY

Offline scottscheule

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 73
Re: Let Schoenberg Schine
« Reply #62 on: May 15, 2007, 11:41:13 AM »
I wish I could comment, but I don't have this collection.  The reviews seem to be all over the map.  I love all the pieces, though, and had the good fortune in the last couple of years to hear Pierrot three times live, by Dawn Upshaw, Phyllis Bryn-Julson and Lucy Shelton, all quite good in different ways.

--Bruce

No worries.  The consensus seems to be that the Pierrot's got too much song, not enough Spreche.  But that may be a good recording for approaching Schoenberg for the uninitiated.  To that end, the entire form of this album works well.  Erwartung is wonderfully done (save for this bizarre moment where the soloist gets too close to the mic and it feels like she's whispering in your ear, for no reason I can tell), and sounds tonal--if only vestigially.  You get lost in the dream of all that jagged romanticism--then Pierrot is a bucket of cold water.  And the final selection from Gurrelieder is a gorgeous little piece of dessert.

Offline Cato

  • Veteran member
  • *
  • Posts: 8758
  • An American Hero!
Re: Let Schoenberg Schine
« Reply #63 on: May 16, 2007, 09:36:49 AM »
About 18 listenings into Pierrot.  My favorite selection?  Has to be the penultimate barcarolle.  Second place goes to Madonna.

Say it ain't so!  The poor girl will just be crushed!

"Meet Miss Ruth Sherwood, from Columbus, Ohio, the Middle of the Universe!"

- Brian Aherne introducing Rosalind Russell in  My Sister Eileen (1942)

greg

  • Guest
Re: Let Schoenberg Schine
« Reply #64 on: June 10, 2007, 10:19:46 AM »
anyone know German?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Ig2KCb_jVE

Nuria Schoenberg is pretty  0:)

Offline mjwal

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 525
  • Location: Lagorce/France - Berlin
  • Currently Listening to:
    Goehr, Beethoven, William Lawes, Giuffre Trio, Steve Lacy, Eisler
Re: Let Schoenberg Schine
« Reply #65 on: June 14, 2007, 09:03:28 AM »
How marvellous to find a group of Schoenberg lovers. I recently fell in love with string quartet #4 by the Wihan Quartet. I may feel the same about #3 one day, but not yet; the great thing about S. is that one is always "discovering" pieces. One of my absolute favourites is the Violin Concerto - which I heard in Frankfurt about a year ago played by Hilary Hahn: a stunning eye-opener, though I have several recordings starting with Krasner/Mitropoulos. The good news is she has recorded this with Salonen  (it's coupled with the Sibelius). One of S.'s most moving works to me is Die glückliche Hand: I have the Boulez recording, but for expressiveness it must cede to the Scherchen recording on Orfeo (also containing op.16 and Erwartung, it is essential listening to understand the authentic style). DgH is the true precursor of Die Jakobsleiter, that perfect unfinished work, as has already been pointed out on this thread. And Pierrot was what introduced me to real modern music in my teens, together with Bartók's Sonata for 2 Pianos and Percussion - my latest thrill has been listening to the Silja/Craft version just out on Naxos.
The Violin's Obstinacy

It needs to return to this one note,
not a tune and not a key
but the sound of self it must depart from,
a journey lengthily to go
in a vein it knows will cripple it.
...
Peter Porter

Offline Brewski

  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 12024
  • "Man With No Shadow" by Makoto Tojiki (2009)
Re: Let Schoenberg Schine
« Reply #66 on: June 14, 2007, 09:18:42 AM »
Wow, somehow Hilary Hahn's recording of the Violin Concerto has escaped me!  Here's a very good review of her live performance last year at the Barbican -- sounds fantastic.  Thanks for mentioning it!

--Bruce
"Do you realize that we're meteorites; almost as soon as we're born, we have to disappear?"

~Iannis Xenakis

Twitter: @BruceHodgesNY

Offline rubio

  • Veteran member
  • *
  • Posts: 1918
Re: Let Schoenberg Schine
« Reply #67 on: June 29, 2007, 02:38:59 PM »
I haven't listened at all to Schoenberg's music yet. Where should I start (1-2 works)? The string quartets, perhaps? Any recommendations for performances?
“One good thing about music, when it hits- you feel no pain” Bob Marley

Kullervo

  • Guest
Re: Let Schoenberg Schine
« Reply #68 on: June 29, 2007, 07:59:23 PM »
I haven't listened at all to Schoenberg's music yet. Where should I start (1-2 works)? The string quartets, perhaps? Any recommendations for performances?

Start with Verklärte Nacht and the first Chamber Symphony.

Greta

  • Guest
Re: Let Schoenberg Schine
« Reply #69 on: June 29, 2007, 09:12:42 PM »
Quote
The good news is she has recorded this with Salonen  (it's coupled with the Sibelius)

Can't wait for this release. Two gorgeous works and a great team. And Bruce, you haven't missed it yet, it's due for '08, with the Swedish RSO! ;)

Offline val

  • Veteran member
  • *
  • Posts: 2090
Re: Let Schoenberg Schine
« Reply #70 on: June 30, 2007, 02:56:19 AM »
Quote
rubio

I haven't listened at all to Schoenberg's music yet. Where should I start (1-2 works)? The string quartets, perhaps? Any recommendations for performances?

Regarding the string quartets, I suggest the 2nd (with a soprano voice). To me it's the most beautiful of the four. But the 4th quartet, very dramatic but with a more traditional structure, may also be a good choice.

I love the interpretation of the Quartet Prazak.

bwv 1080

  • Guest
Re: Let Schoenberg Schine
« Reply #71 on: June 30, 2007, 06:43:16 AM »
I haven't listened at all to Schoenberg's music yet. Where should I start (1-2 works)? The string quartets, perhaps? Any recommendations for performances?

You can listen to his entire output for free at the Schoenberg Center's website:

http://www.schoenberg.at/6_archiv/music/works/op/compositions_op_e.htm

I would start with:

5 Orchestral Pieces:
http://www.schoenberg.at/6_archiv/music/works/op/compositions_op16_e.htm

Pierrot Lunaire
http://www.schoenberg.at/6_archiv/music/works/op/compositions_op21_e.htm

Piano Concerto
http://www.schoenberg.at/6_archiv/music/works/op/compositions_op42_e.htm

Offline edward

  • Veteran member
  • *
  • Posts: 3684
  • Hello, little man. I will destroy you.
Re: Let Schoenberg Schine
« Reply #72 on: June 30, 2007, 07:43:35 AM »
I haven't listened at all to Schoenberg's music yet. Where should I start (1-2 works)? The string quartets, perhaps? Any recommendations for performances?
The easy way in would be through Verklarte Nacht and the Chamber Symphonies. Beyond that, the Second Quartet is an ideal introduction to the composer's atonal world--it starts tonal and ends almost atonal--along with the masterly Five Orchestral Pieces, while the Piano Concerto is, I think, the most accessible of his serial pieces (as well as one of the best).

But try it before you buy with the website bwv 1080 mentioned.
"I don't at all mind actively disliking a piece of contemporary music, but in order to feel happy about it I must consciously understand why I dislike it. Otherwise it remains in my mind as unfinished business."
 -- Aaron Copland, The Pleasures of Music

Offline rubio

  • Veteran member
  • *
  • Posts: 1918
Re: Let Schoenberg Schine
« Reply #73 on: July 06, 2007, 08:54:02 AM »
Start with Verklärte Nacht and the first Chamber Symphony.

So I started with this disc from the library - Karajan/BPO performing Verklärte Nacht and Pelleas und Melisande. I especially liked the Verklärte Nacht. It has a nice atmosphere and is quite tonal. Part of the first movement makes me think of Mahler, but later it has a different voice. The Pelleas und Melisande was also nice, and I think this recording was really good. Are there any you prefer for Verklärte Nacht?

So next up are the Chamber Symphonies.

« Last Edit: July 06, 2007, 08:55:34 AM by rubio »
“One good thing about music, when it hits- you feel no pain” Bob Marley

Offline Brewski

  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 12024
  • "Man With No Shadow" by Makoto Tojiki (2009)
Re: Let Schoenberg Schine
« Reply #74 on: July 06, 2007, 09:07:49 AM »
Are there any you prefer for Verklärte Nacht?

I love that Karajan recording.  I don't have another that I really like better, but if you're curious you might want to hear it in its original string sextet version, such as this one by the Juilliard Quartet.  (With special guests Walter Trampler and Yo-Yo Ma.  ;D)

And I haven't heard a version of Pelleas und Melisande that I like better than that one.  :D

--Bruce
« Last Edit: July 06, 2007, 09:18:58 AM by bhodges »
"Do you realize that we're meteorites; almost as soon as we're born, we have to disappear?"

~Iannis Xenakis

Twitter: @BruceHodgesNY

karlhenning

  • Guest
Re: Let Schoenberg Schine
« Reply #75 on: July 06, 2007, 09:16:12 AM »
Quote from: David Byrne?
And you may ask yourself, well, how does a quartet play a sextet? . . .

Same as I ever was 8)

Offline Brewski

  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 12024
  • "Man With No Shadow" by Makoto Tojiki (2009)
Re: Let Schoenberg Schine
« Reply #76 on: July 06, 2007, 09:20:25 AM »
;D

--Bruce
"Do you realize that we're meteorites; almost as soon as we're born, we have to disappear?"

~Iannis Xenakis

Twitter: @BruceHodgesNY

karlhenning

  • Guest
Re: Let Schoenberg Schine
« Reply #77 on: July 18, 2007, 05:53:07 AM »
All right, he was Schoenberg's student and friend . . . .

I've really enjoyed re-immersion in the Berg Violin Concerto.

(The following comment is a momentary thought, and in no way intended as firm advice second-guessing the composer.)

It would have to be so because of the row, of course;  but even as the soloist is playing those last ascending whole-tones, I couldn't help thinking how good a minor-second quasi-leading-tone would sound at the end . . . not that the pitch reached by that gesture would have to be the "tonic," at all.

greg

  • Guest
Re: Let Schoenberg Schine
« Reply #78 on: July 18, 2007, 12:39:29 PM »
maybe Berg would've thought the same thing if he decided to not stick with the tone row?

Offline Brewski

  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 12024
  • "Man With No Shadow" by Makoto Tojiki (2009)
Re: Let Schoenberg Schine
« Reply #79 on: July 24, 2007, 10:09:44 AM »
From Alex Ross' blog, an interesting post about Schoenberg's 1935 meeting with Irving Thalberg, head of production at MGM.

--Bruce
"Do you realize that we're meteorites; almost as soon as we're born, we have to disappear?"

~Iannis Xenakis

Twitter: @BruceHodgesNY