Author Topic: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas  (Read 506821 times)

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Offline Alek Hidell

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Re: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas
« Reply #3940 on: February 10, 2018, 09:18:42 PM »
I have one thing to say about this Colombo guy: God, what an awful-looking website he has. ??? Looks like something that would have been considered bad web design even by 1997 standards.

Just based on that, I think I can get a pretty good idea of his artistic integrity ...
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Offline SurprisedByBeauty

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Re: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas
« Reply #3941 on: February 11, 2018, 01:40:48 AM »
I've learned -- not quite, but getting there -- to disassociate any sense of aesthetic outside of music (web-design, sleeve art, fonts, clothing et al.) from artistic ability and taste. It's not a very good indicator, strangely. But you are right, an appalling first impression and seeming total disregard of detail doesn't look to be boding well.

Offline Mahlerian

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Re: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas
« Reply #3942 on: February 11, 2018, 09:04:58 AM »
I have one thing to say about this Colombo guy: God, what an awful-looking website he has. ??? Looks like something that would have been considered bad web design even by 1997 standards.

Just based on that, I think I can get a pretty good idea of his artistic integrity ...

Eesh, that is ugly all right.
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Offline Todd

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Re: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas
« Reply #3943 on: February 11, 2018, 09:22:49 AM »
It fell off my radar since it's incomplete, at least for now, but Robert Silverman's set of 23 sonatas recorded in 2010 is available as a free MP3 192 Kbps download at AudioHigh.  They sell CD quality, high res, and MQA downloads as well, and supposedly, if demand is high enough, the remaining nine sonatas will be released later.

(That makes this like Ooi's cycle: a complete cycle incompletely released.)
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Offline Mandryka

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Re: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas
« Reply #3944 on: February 15, 2018, 06:25:37 AM »


Tom Beghin's second recorded op 111, which is one of the more stimulating and inspiring and thought provoking op 111s I know.

He's very good at bringing out the contrapuntal nature of the first few variations. What I mean is that a large part  of the value comes from the way the voices intertwine and respond to each other, at least in the variations before the trills. He's helped because his instrument has a powerful and colourful bass register. You can feel the bass, hear it vibrate and resonate, it's visceral.

In the final trilling variations Beghin makes me feel as though Beethoven's pushing the boundaries of harmony to a sort of limit, that he's taking us to a musical limit. A sense of striving, searching for something new and strange.

In the first movement there's an memorable sense of  incompleteness and undecidedness at the end. throughout  the movement there are lots  of contratsts, contrasts between energy and repose, between extroversion and inwardness, ebb and flow, stop and start
« Last Edit: February 15, 2018, 06:27:36 AM by Mandryka »
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Offline (: premont :)

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Re: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas
« Reply #3945 on: February 22, 2018, 05:48:15 PM »
Todd, , how do you rate Martin Roscoe. Yes I know, that his set is not yet complete. The clips, I have heard, sounded very promising.
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Offline Todd

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Re: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas
« Reply #3946 on: February 22, 2018, 06:21:29 PM »
Todd, , how do you rate Martin Roscoe. Yes I know, that his set is not yet complete. The clips, I have heard, sounded very promising.


I have not listened to any of his cycle yet.  His is one of the ongoing cycles where I will wait to buy when/if a complete cycle is released.  Brawn, Cabassi, Sakiya, and Tchetuev are the others.  Ashkar, Hewitt, and Biss I am buying as released.
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Offline amw

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Re: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas
« Reply #3947 on: March 01, 2018, 12:33:05 AM »
Not that I expect people to be interested, but: some time ago I sought opinions on Eric Heidsieck's Beethoven cycle. This ended up turning into a very desultory and drawn-out comparison of Heidsieck with two other cycles that have been on my radar for some time, Daniel-Ben Pienaar and Michael Korstick. I'm not sure why I picked those three specifically as they don't have a lot in common apart from being slightly weird.

So anyway, the outcome was that I was quite taken with Pienaar's Beethoven style and added his set to my collection; found Heidsieck inconsistent (there was something I really disliked about Op.53 for example.... ) but may pick up his earlier standalone Op.106; already owned Korstick's Op.106 and added his Op.2, 28 and 31 but still not sold on the complete set. Beethoven's piano sonatas have kind of fallen off my radar since, as I was able to get hold of the first ever recorded cycle of Beethoven's string quartets (review probably forthcoming).

Are there any current or forthcoming Beethoven sonatas of interest? The only one I'm following is Olga Pashchenko, who probably isn't doing a cycle per se, but I mean it'd be nice >.>

Offline Brian

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Re: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas
« Reply #3948 on: March 02, 2018, 12:44:08 PM »
Are there any current or forthcoming Beethoven sonatas of interest? The only one I'm following is Olga Pashchenko, who probably isn't doing a cycle per se, but I mean it'd be nice >.>
Agreed, Pashchenko is really good. James Brawn's ongoing cycle is super solid (to me at least). Been a couple years since the last volume, however.

Martin Rasch was sleepy-boring.

Offline SurprisedByBeauty

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Re: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas
« Reply #3949 on: March 02, 2018, 01:53:15 PM »
Beethoven Sonatas - A Survey of Complete Cycles
Part 8, 2010 - 2013
http://ionarts.blogspot.com/2013/07/beethoven-sonatas-survey-of-complete.html

It's not that new, but from the last 10 years or so, I like Paavali Jumppanen's cycle a lot.


Beethoven Sonatas - A Survey of Complete Cycles
Part 9, 2014 - 2016
http://ionarts.blogspot.co.at/2014/12/beethoven-sonatas-survey-of-complete.html

Technically Pollini's cycle (as such) is younger, even.

Zhao's was interesting... or at least better than one had reason to fear.
Bavouzet's is very nice... but perhaps stuck at "nice".
Rasch I can't be bothered to hear; if it is not even good enough for Audite to put it out on their primary label... (although I think their attempt to distance themselves by slapping "Forum" on the name isn't working.)

Ongoing: Jonathan Biss started weakly, I thought, but then got really good, fast -- and now I'm looking forward to more.

Offline Todd

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Re: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas
« Reply #3950 on: March 03, 2018, 08:10:30 AM »
Now that I'm done collecting cycles, however temporarily, I revisited and updated my personal ranking of cycles.

Top Tier – The Holy Tetrarchy
Annie Fischer (Hungarton)
Friedrich Gulda (Amadeo)
Wilhelm Kempff (DG, mono)
Wilhelm Backhaus (mono)

[Rudolf Serkin; no cycle]


Top Tier – The Rest of the Top Ten (sort of in order)
Wilhelm Kempff (DG, stereo)
Eric Heidsieck
Russell Sherman
Andrea Lucchesini
Emil Gilels
Daniel-Ben Pienaar

[Sviatoslav Richter; no cycle]


Second Tier (in no particular order)
Artur Schnabel
Bernard Roberts
Claude Frank
Daniel Barenboim (EMI, 2005)
Eduardo del Pueyo
Francois Frederic Guy
Friedrich Gulda (Orfeo)
Kazune Shimizu (Sony)
Maurizio Pollini
Michael Levinas
Paul Badura-Skoda (JVC/Astree; possible Top 10 Contender)
Peter Takacs
Robert Silverman
Rudolf Buchbinder (Unitel)
Seymour Lipkin
Takahiro Sonoda (Denon)
Takahiro Sonoda (Evica; possible Top 10 Contender)
Wilhelm Backhaus (stereo)
Younwha Lee
Yu Kosuge
Yusuke Kikuchi

[Bruce Hungerford; no cycle]


Third Tier (in no particular order)
Abdel Rahman El Bacha (Mirare)
Akiyoshi Sako
Alfred Brendel (Philips, 1970s)
Alfred Brendel (Vox)
Alfredo Perl
Andras Schiff
Claudio Arrau (1960s)
Claudio Arrau (1980s)
Craig Sheppard
Daniel Barenboim (DG)
Daniel Barenboim (EMI, 1960s)
David Allen Wehr
Dieter Zechlin
Friedrich Gulda (Decca)
Garrick Ohlsson
Gerard Willems
Gerhard Oppitz
Ian Hobson
Ichiro Nodaira (possible second tier)
Irina Mejoueva
John O'Conor
Kun-Woo Paik
Louie Lortie
Malcolm Binns (borderline fourth tier)
Michael Houstoun (Rattle)
Michael Houstoun (Morrison Trust)
Michael Korstick
Paul Badura-Skoda (Gramola)
Pavaali Jumppanen
Peter Rösel
Rudolf Buchbinder (Teldec)
Sequeira Costa
Stephen Kovacevich
Stewart Goodyear
Wilhelm Kempff (1961, King International)
Yaeko Yamane
Yves Nat


Fourth Tier (in no particular order)
Abdel Rahman El Bacha (Forlane)
Aldo Ciccolini
Alfred Brendel (Philips, 1990s)
Andre De Groote
Anton Kuerti
Christian Leotta
Dino Ciani
Georges Pludermacher
Idil Biret
Ikuyo Nakamichi
Jean Bernard Pommier
Jean-Efflam Bavouzet
Jean Muller
Jeno Jando
John Kane
John Lill
Mari Kodama
Maria Grinburg
Martin Rasch   
Melodie Zhao
Paul Lewis
Robert Benz
Richard Goode
Ronald Brautigam
Robert Taub
Rudolf Buchbinder (RCA)
Sebastian Forster
Steven Herbert Smith
Steven Masi
Timothy Ehlen
Vladimir Ashkenazy
Walter Gieseking (Tahra)
Yukio Yokoyama


Bottom Tier (in sorta particular order)
[Glenn Gould; no cycle, thankfully]
HJ Lim
Rita Bouboulidi
Tatiana Nikolayeva
Anne Oland

« Last Edit: March 03, 2018, 08:33:47 AM by Todd »
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Offline Todd

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Re: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas
« Reply #3951 on: March 03, 2018, 08:10:38 AM »
Surveying what else is out there, I've broken the remaining cycles that I am aware of into different categories.  The dead cycles list may very well be incomplete.

Complete/In the Can
Llyr Williams
Tamami Honma


Complete/Never Issued In Full
Hiroaki Ooi
Robert Silverman (AudioHigh)


Multiple Pianists/No Interest
Malcolm Bilson, etc
St.Petersburg Collective


OOP
Daniela Varinska
Gotthard Kladetzky
Michael Steinberg
Robert Riefling
Shoko Sugitani
Walter Gieseking (EMI, incomplete)


Fakes (?)/Questionable
Alicja Kot
Claudio Colombo
Giancarlo Andretti
Joyce Hatto (aka, altered John O'Conor)
Shisei Hanai
Vladimir Morrone


Dead Cycles
Bruno Leonardo Gelber
Giovanni Belluci
Mitsutaka Shiraishi
Muriel Chemin
Per Tengstrand


Ongoing - buying as released
Angela Hewitt
Jonathan Biss
Saleem Abboud Ashkar


Ongoing - others
Akihiro Sakiya
David Ezra Okonsar
Davide Cabassi
Igor Tchetuev
James Brawn
Kazune Shimizu (II)
Letizia Michielon
Martin Roscoe
Maurizio Paciariello
Yoshihiro Kondo
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Offline André

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Re: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas
« Reply #3952 on: March 03, 2018, 01:10:42 PM »
Last November I ourchased the Claude Frank set on Amazon.de for some 2£ and pennies. It was never delivered, but every once in a while they kept me informed, mentioning I could cancel any time. I just let it go. Yesterday they gave me a delivery date (!!). Of course I’ll only believe it when it thumps on the doormat. Someetime between March 28 and April 16 if I am to believe their notification.

Offline SurprisedByBeauty

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Re: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas
« Reply #3953 on: March 03, 2018, 02:03:38 PM »
Now that I'm done collecting cycles, however temporarily, I revisited and updated my personal ranking of cycles.

Top Tier – The Holy Tetrarchy
Wilhelm Kempff (DG, mono)


Top Tier – The Rest of the Top Ten (sort of in order)
Wilhelm Kempff (DG, stereo)


Second Tier (in no particular order)

Third Tier (in no particular order)
Wilhelm Kempff (1961, King International)

Fourth Tier (in no particular order)


Bottom Tier (in sorta particular order)

Not having heard it, I've always been intrigued by the thought of the Kempff cycle from Tokyo, given that Kempff's abilities were said (i.e. by Joachim Kaiser) to translate better live than in the studio. Yet while you very much cherish his studio cycles (as do I), that cycle doesn't rank highly with you at all. How come? Defects? Bad sound? Off-playing?

Offline Oldnslow

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Re: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas
« Reply #3954 on: March 03, 2018, 04:53:04 PM »
I think the Tchetuev must be a dead cycle, with defunct label Caro Mitis. Why is the Bellucci cycle listed as dead, as the first 3 cd volume 1 just recently appeared and was said to be the first volume of a complete cycle?

Offline Todd

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Re: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas
« Reply #3955 on: March 03, 2018, 07:08:51 PM »
Not having heard it, I've always been intrigued by the thought of the Kempff cycle from Tokyo, given that Kempff's abilities were said (i.e. by Joachim Kaiser) to translate better live than in the studio. Yet while you very much cherish his studio cycles (as do I), that cycle doesn't rank highly with you at all. How come? Defects? Bad sound? Off-playing?


http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,22518.msg762410.html#msg762410



Why is the Bellucci cycle listed as dead


If they're new recordings, maybe he has restarted his cycle, but there have been three discs of sonatas floating around for a decade.  Hopefully, he completes his cycle, but I'm not holding my breath. 
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Offline Oldnslow

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Re: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas
« Reply #3956 on: March 03, 2018, 10:19:45 PM »
Bellucci's recordings on the  Brilliant 3 cd set are new recordings, and are volume one so I expect he will finish the sonatas. The early sonatas are decidedly weird---all kinds of hesitations, strange tempos, etc. but worth a listen if you like something different

Offline SurprisedByBeauty

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Re: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas
« Reply #3957 on: March 03, 2018, 11:57:02 PM »

Offline GioCar

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Re: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas
« Reply #3958 on: March 28, 2018, 01:43:10 AM »
The Lucchesini set is available at a very good price (new €70.00 + shipping) on the amazon.it marketplace.

https://www.amazon.it/dp/B0001CPHPU/?coliid=I1KHB5SEX7QO60&colid=3BT5N27NJ5D8U&psc=0&ref_=lv_ov_lig_dp_it

Anyone interested? Me, I've already downloaded the lossless files, and I'm not interested in buying the physical copy as well.


Offline king ubu

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Re: Beethoven's Piano Sonatas
« Reply #3959 on: March 28, 2018, 03:28:17 AM »
How to get the Backhaus mono cycle? The Decca "Original Masters" set has the stereo cycle*, it seems (I've got it and like it a lot).

*) except for the mono "Hammerklavier" - no stereo recording of that around?
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