Author Topic: Johann Jakob Froberger  (Read 10147 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Mr. Minnow

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 411
  • Location: UK
Re: Johann Jakob Froberger
« Reply #100 on: June 28, 2018, 03:09:46 PM »
I have listened to all of Asperen and some of Stella since you made that post. And I now say this with confidence: Asperen’s set is indeed worth getting even for those who, like you, already have Stella, Rampe, Rémy on CPO and Wilson if you are interested in the ricercari, toccatas, capriccios. What you have is very good for suites, and I personally would say that Vartolo is a greater priority given you have Wilson and Rampe, even though Asperen has its own interesting ideas about how the suites should go.

It’s very good to have the ricercari and capriccios collected together, with Asperen’s notes, the CDs have helped me to appreciate Froberger’s Italian style much more.

I meant to ask if Asperen's set really is a complete one as Aeolus say it is. His series consists of 11 discs whereas Stella's box has 16, and five discs is clearly quite a difference. Is it like complete sets of Bach's organ music, where the degree of completeness and number of discs depends on which works are considered authentic and which are excluded on the grounds of doubtful attribution? I'll still get Asperen's series when I have the cash for it whether it's complete or not, I was just wondering about the apparent discrepancy with Stella's set.   
« Last Edit: June 28, 2018, 03:13:46 PM by Mr. Minnow »

Offline Mandryka

  • Veteran member
  • *
  • Posts: 10163
Re: Johann Jakob Froberger
« Reply #101 on: June 28, 2018, 07:56:01 PM »
I meant to ask if Asperen's set really is a complete one as Aeolus say it is. His series consists of 11 discs whereas Stella's box has 16, and five discs is clearly quite a difference. Is it like complete sets of Bach's organ music, where the degree of completeness and number of discs depends on which works are considered authentic and which are excluded on the grounds of doubtful attribution? I'll still get Asperen's series when I have the cash for it whether it's complete or not, I was just wondering about the apparent discrepancy with Stella's set.

Stella recorded work “from secondary sources” which Asperen omitted, I’m not sure what “secondary sources” means or  whether it implies that their authorship is disputable. Maybe someone else can say whether the booklet casts light on this, though this review doesn't fill me with hope (from amazon in the uk)

Quote
Booklet notes totally inadequate, particularly information about music from secondary sources. His organ playing is good but somewhat stiff. He is certainly not a harpsichordist as he treats it like an organ and has no concept of making sound on the instrument - the suites (Partitas) are stiff and colourless. The biggest sin is transposiing the f-sharp minor Ricercar into e minor - utterly criminal...guess he couldn't take the exreme nature of this piece. As someone who was really excited to hear this music interpreted by another obvious Froberger fan I was massively underwhelmed. There are too many keyboard players out there now seeming to speed through and record the complete works of someone without true thought and passion. Beautiful organs on in this set though.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2018, 03:56:46 AM by Mandryka »
Wovon man nicht sprechen kann, darüber muss man schweigen

Offline Mandryka

  • Veteran member
  • *
  • Posts: 10163
Re: Johann Jakob Froberger
« Reply #102 on: June 29, 2018, 12:24:15 AM »
Quote
Booklet notes totally inadequate, particularly information about music from secondary sources. His organ playing is good but somewhat stiff. He is certainly not a harpsichordist as he treats it like an organ and has no concept of making sound on the instrument - the suites (Partitas) are stiff and colourless. The biggest sin is transposiing the f-sharp minor Ricercar into e minor - utterly criminal...guess he couldn't take the exreme nature of this piece. As someone who was really excited to hear this music interpreted by another obvious Froberger fan I was massively underwhelmed. There are too many keyboard players out there now seeming to speed through and record the complete works of someone without true thought and passion. Beautiful organs on in this set though.

The F sharp minor ricercar  mentioned in this review is FbWV 412. There are recordings by Boccaccio, Asperen, Coudurier, Stella, Rampe, Tilney and Egarr. Just thinking of organ performances, Egarr seems the most "extreme" harmonically  (St Martin’s Cuijk, 1/5 comma meantone, I’m not sure whether he's transposed it) Asperen thinks that the ricercar is evidence that Froberger had moved away from meantone tuning, but he doesn’t elaborate and his organ is just described as unequally tuned (now I’m looking at the details, I’m starting to think that maybe the notes aren’t as good as I thought in Asperen’s set.) On organ, Asperen and Egarr seem to me to be very soulful in it. Coudurier is exciting, thrilling, and tough and extrovert.

« Last Edit: June 29, 2018, 01:54:54 AM by Mandryka »
Wovon man nicht sprechen kann, darüber muss man schweigen

Offline Mandryka

  • Veteran member
  • *
  • Posts: 10163
Re: Johann Jakob Froberger
« Reply #103 on: November 07, 2018, 02:30:21 PM »


I think a superb organ recital here, Paolo Crivellaro playing an 1822 organ in Baceno near Turin. Anachronistic obviously,  but very well handled by Crivellaro IMO, and he’s musical, he makes it into music. The recital has maybe half a dozen pieces by Froberger, the rest made up of Muffat and Kerll.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2018, 02:32:01 PM by Mandryka »
Wovon man nicht sprechen kann, darüber muss man schweigen