Author Topic: Composers of the mysterious gap (late 1740's to early 1760's)  (Read 4163 times)

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Handel

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Composers of the mysterious gap (late 1740's to early 1760's)
« on: January 09, 2008, 09:30:55 AM »
Sorry to not post on only one composers, but I think it is necessary to regroup the following composers...

I always wondered what happened between the forementioned years. Between Handel/Bach and the emergence of Haydn (with an obvious change of style).

So I discovered that some second rate composers were the main actors in this musical revolution...

We all know the Mannheim School (It took time for me to hear of it). Johann Stamitz was the pioneer. Rather a great musician and concertmaster than a great composer, but he introduces a lot of novelty in his composition....

An excerpt
Symphony in F major, allegro molto

(composed between 1752 and 1754, Northern Chamber Orchestra/Naxos)

Another School, less known and less structured (since not gathered around one court )than the Mannheim's: The viennise.  Composers like Georg Matthias Monn and Georg Christoph Wagenseil were the front runners.

An excerpt from Wagenseil's symphonic output (to be fair with Wagenseil, there is a better excerpt I would have to post through Box.net, but the cap limit up there forbid me to post it)

Symphony in C major, allegro assai

(composed in 1750, L'Orfeo Barockorchester/CPO)

Both Mannheim and Vienna Schools were influence by Italian music. One of the main composer to emerge was Giovanni Batista Sammartini (and not Giuseppe, his older brother).

An excerpt

Symphony in A major, presto

(composed in 1750, Aradia Ensemble/Naxos)

Surely other composers influence music during this "gap" and beyond.  I think of CPE Bach who influenced a lot Haydn.  But it sums the essential.

I will appeciate any input concerning this now less forgotten era of classical music.

« Last Edit: January 09, 2008, 09:46:00 AM by Handel »

lukeottevanger

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Re: Composers of the mysterious gap (late 1740's to early 1760's)
« Reply #1 on: January 09, 2008, 09:35:29 AM »
It is indeed a fascinating period, containing figures who often have very distinct styles and not always as pallid as is sometimes portrayed. But Gurn is your man here - I'm sure he'll have much of interest to say.






(No pressure, Gurn  ;D )

Mark G. Simon

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Re: Composers of the mysterious gap (late 1740's to early 1760's)
« Reply #2 on: January 09, 2008, 10:03:46 AM »
It was a period not unlike the present, when the complexity of the previous era's music was being discarded, and a premium was put on simplicity and accessibility. Not much of this music is remembered, but it set the stage for the era of Mozart and Haydn.

Handel

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Re: Composers of the mysterious gap (late 1740's to early 1760's)
« Reply #3 on: January 09, 2008, 10:10:36 AM »
Exactly and it why it should not be "forgotten" since the modifications they made had a impact of the style of the future major composers.

Offline JoshLilly

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Re: Composers of the mysterious gap (late 1740's to early 1760's)
« Reply #4 on: January 09, 2008, 10:24:05 AM »
It's not really forgotten, even among the mainstream: after all, G.F. Händel was still actively composing during most of that time. But right up your alley, if you're looking for the basically "big names" of the time, I think it'd look something like this:


Baldassare Galuppi
Willibald von Gluck
Ignaz Holzbauer
Niccolò Jommelli
Pietro Locatelli
Nicola Piccini
Johann Quantz
Giovanni Sammartini
Adolph Scheibe
Johann Stamitz
Giuseppe Tartini
Georg Wagenseil


Thomas Arne might could be on there, he wrote stuff still famous to this day, but I never got the impression that his international reputation during his lifetime was all that high.
Galuppi, Gluck, and Locatelli were quite popular during their lifetimes, though Gluck's reputation was probably at its peak just after the years you named. Carl Friedrich Abel and C.P.E. Bach also became famous later, but mainly I think for stuff they wrote in the 1760s and later.

Galuppi in particular probably stands out, and was in demand all over. One reason not much is musically known about him today is that his reputation appears to have been largely based around his operas, and hearing obscure operas from any period - but particularly the mid/late-18th century - is difficult at best. I have two complete ones myself. He sure was famous, though. Robert Browning wrote an entire poem after hearing an unknown work of Galuppi's. This is the line I knew about:

"Brave Galuppi! that was music! good alike at grave and gay!
I can always leave off talking, when I hear a master play."

I found the entire poem online just now, never read the whole thing before!
His operas are a bit different, and I imagine would be very difficult to stage, for one reason: almost all the numbers have very long non-singing musical starts. I don't know what the performers would have done during these sometimes very long stretches of idleness. The "flow" of the two operas of his that I have is very poor, but the music is especially cheerful. They do translate well to pure listening, but I don't imagine they'd be too successful today to actually watch. On pure musical grounds, I like both of them, in particular Gustavo primo, re di Svezia. Ernesto's aria "Non così e tosto" always sticks in my head.

Handel

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Re: Composers of the mysterious gap (late 1740's to early 1760's)
« Reply #5 on: January 09, 2008, 10:29:06 AM »
It's not really forgotten, even among the mainstream: after all, G.F. Händel was still actively composing during most of that time. But right up your alley, if you're looking for the basically "big names" of the time, I think it'd look something like this:


Baldassare Galuppi
Willibald von Gluck
Ignaz Holzbauer
Niccolò Jommelli
Pietro Locatelli
Nicola Piccini
Johann Quantz
Giovanni Sammartini
Adolph Scheibe
Johann Stamitz
Giuseppe Tartini
Georg Wagenseil


Thomas Arne might could be on there, he wrote stuff still famous to this day, but I never got the impression that his international reputation during his lifetime was all that high.
Galuppi, Gluck, and Locatelli were quite popular during their lifetimes, though Gluck's reputation was probably at its peak just after the years you named. Carl Friedrich Abel and C.P.E. Bach also became famous later, but mainly I think for stuff they wrote in the 1760s and later.

Galuppi in particular probably stands out, and was in demand all over. One reason not much is musically known about him today is that his reputation appears to have been largely based around his operas, and hearing obscure operas from any period - but particularly the mid/late-18th century - is difficult at best. I have two complete ones myself. He sure was famous, though. Robert Browning wrote an entire poem after hearing an unknown work of Galuppi's. This is the line I knew about:

"Brave Galuppi! that was music! good alike at grave and gay!
I can always leave off talking, when I hear a master play."

I found the entire poem online just now, never read the whole thing before!
His operas are a bit different, and I imagine would be very difficult to stage, for one reason: almost all the numbers have very long non-singing musical starts. I don't know what the performers would have done during these sometimes very long stretches of idleness. The "flow" of the two operas of his that I have is very poor, but the music is especially cheerful. They do translate well to pure listening, but I don't imagine they'd be too successful today to actually watch. On pure musical grounds, I like both of them, in particular Gustavo primo, re di Svezia. Ernesto's aria "Non così e tosto" always sticks in my head.

Thanks for your post..

I should have specified that the Schools worked mainly on instrumental music...

Of course, operatic form changed during the period.

Handel was indeed still composing during the late 40's but his style has nothing to do with Stamitz, Sammartini, etc, even if plugged occasionnally a few pre-classical arias in his late works.

Offline 71 dB

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Re: Composers of the mysterious gap (late 1740's to early 1760's)
« Reply #6 on: January 09, 2008, 10:30:59 AM »
I just listened to a superb Naxos disc of Franz Xavier Richter's (1709-1789) Six Grandes Symphonies (1744).



This music has Locatelli-like driving intensity. I don't comment more because I have heard it only once.
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snyprrr

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Re: Composers of the mysterious gap (late 1740's to early 1760's)
« Reply #7 on: July 02, 2009, 08:38:16 PM »
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