Author Topic: Haydn's Haus  (Read 821647 times)

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Online Gurn Blanston

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Re: Haydn's Haus
« Reply #11900 on: June 09, 2018, 04:38:27 PM »
Thank you for yet another article, equally delightful and informative. And hearty congratulations on the milestone!

Thank you kindly, Dr. H. I really do enjoy the chance to share the fruits of my research with others who love Haydn's music as much as I do. :)

8)
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Offline Mookalafalas

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Re: Haydn's Haus
« Reply #11901 on: June 10, 2018, 12:56:49 AM »
Well, he's right of course, but you knew that. Classic Era can be stretched to encompass Beethoven (big debate, not for here), but you gotta love a purist. My kind of guy! :)

There were some fine recordings in that era, as you see. Some of the issues that 'modern purists' would complain about is that they didn't have reliable scores to work from, only heavily edited scores from earlier times which had a lot of Haydn's own abrasiveness and dissonance removed, on the premise that "he certainly mustn't have meant that, must be a mistake. He's Papa Haydn..."  ::) And don't want to wear out the audience with repeats, they'll never know the difference. There were also quite some few who played Haydn like he was Tchaikovsky. Of course, they did the same to Mozart.  My own distaste for historic recordings usually has nothing at all to do with the musicians, who were normally quite as fine as any today. It is more what they inherited from the time leading up to them. :-\

That said, anyone who listens to Haydn in any form comes away from it better off for the experience. :)

8)

  Thanks for the generous response.  It's too bad we can't sit down and listen to it :-\  You might still have reservations, but I don't think for the reasons you mentioned...
It's all good...

Online Gurn Blanston

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Re: Haydn's Haus
« Reply #11902 on: June 10, 2018, 05:02:16 AM »
  Thanks for the generous response.  It's too bad we can't sit down and listen to it :-\  You might still have reservations, but I don't think for the reasons you mentioned...

That would be most enjoyable, I'm sure. Always a pleasure to listen to Haydn. And just to show that I'm not rigid abut such things, I do have a Symphony #100 conducted by Hans Knappertsbusch.  :)

8)
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Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Haydn's Haus
« Reply #11903 on: June 22, 2018, 08:48:07 AM »
Cross-post:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/tPk0OuYiWDw" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/tPk0OuYiWDw</a>

I've heard Haydn symphonies twice in Symphony Hall, but on neither occasion did the performance sparkle like this.
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
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[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
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Offline SonicMan46

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Re: Haydn's Haus
« Reply #11904 on: June 30, 2018, 08:03:44 AM »
Well, I've not been here in a while, but have been listening to several of my 3 box collections of the Haydn Piano Trios - left a couple of posts in the 'listening thread' which will be shortly buried there, so thought I'd repeat each here; also a couple of PDFs of reviews for those interested.  Dave :)

Quote
Haydn, Joseph - Piano Trios w/ Trio 1790 on period instruments; keyboardist is Harald Hoeren on fortepiano (after Matthäus Heilmann, c. 1790, built by Derek Adam, 1978) for first 6 discs, then harpsichord for last 3 CDs; also own the other two sets shown below w/ Haydn Trio Eisenstadt on modern instruments - several reviews attached for first two collections, for those interested.  Dave :)

   

Quote
Haydn, Joseph - Piano Trios w/ the Haydn Trio Eisenstadt (HTE) on modern instruments - yesterday, I listened to one of my two period instrument boxes of these works, i.e. Trio 1790 - now I did own a 2-CD set of these trios w/ the Beaux Arts Trio (BAT), but 10 or so years ago (according to my Amazon record), I went w/ the Trio Eisenstadt box which cost me about $30 (now OOP and selling as a used set on Amazon USA for $200) - of course, the BAT box w/ recordings from the 1970s (shown below) is available at a good price (i.e. $35) - seems to be the least expensive choice for a complete collection, and highly recommended performances over the decades (a review of each is attached); also, there are some 'lively' comments on Amazon USA for both the BAT & HTE listings.  Dave :)

 

Online Gurn Blanston

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Re: Haydn's Haus
« Reply #11905 on: July 14, 2018, 06:35:05 PM »
With 1797 in the rearview, we move ahead to the Year of the Creation, one of Haydn's Greatest Hits. Since we talked recently about 'where is Michael?', I finally found him right here in Vienna in 1798. All in all, quite a year. :)

The creation of The Creation, and that's not all!

Thanks!
8)
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Offline vandermolen

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Re: Haydn's Haus
« Reply #11906 on: July 16, 2018, 12:32:39 AM »
Another rare guest appearance from me on this thread.  8)
BBC Music Magazine (August) feature a cover CD which features Haydn's String Quartet in D, Op.64 No.5 'The Lark' performed by the Calidore Quartet. I know very little Haydn but, on the whole, prefer him to Mozart and this work has been a very nice discovery.
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Haydn's Haus
« Reply #11907 on: July 16, 2018, 01:58:55 AM »
Visit more often  0:)
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline vandermolen

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Re: Haydn's Haus
« Reply #11908 on: July 16, 2018, 02:51:43 AM »
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Haydn's Haus
« Reply #11909 on: July 16, 2018, 03:05:20 AM »
With 1797 in the rearview, we move ahead to the Year of the Creation, one of Haydn's Greatest Hits. Since we talked recently about 'where is Michael?', I finally found him right here in Vienna in 1798. All in all, quite a year. :)

The creation of The Creation, and that's not all!

Thanks!
 8)

Another wonderfully informative post, O Gurn.  How curious that Elßler spelt Haydn with that diacritic!  The composer up at 6, and . . . dinner is at 10pm?  He was a marvel (even allowing for dinner consisting of bread and wine).  Michael Haydn wrote 47 Masses!  Holy cats.

Goldarnit, I always learn something (and usually more than one something) when I read your blog, sieur.
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
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http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Online Gurn Blanston

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Re: Haydn's Haus
« Reply #11910 on: July 16, 2018, 03:21:10 AM »
Another rare guest appearance from me on this thread.  8)
BBC Music Magazine (August) feature a cover CD which features Haydn's String Quartet in D, Op.64 No.5 'The Lark' performed by the Calidore Quartet. I know very little Haydn but, on the whole, prefer him to Mozart and this work has been a very nice discovery.

Always a pleasure to host you here, sir. Op 64 #5 has been a major hit in England, especially, since its composition in 1790. As it should very well be, it is that fine combination between technical perfection and caprice for the listener. :)

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Online Gurn Blanston

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Re: Haydn's Haus
« Reply #11911 on: July 16, 2018, 03:35:00 AM »
Another wonderfully informative post, O Gurn.  How curious that Elßler spelt Haydn with that diacritic!  The composer up at 6, and . . . dinner is at 10pm?  He was a marvel (even allowing for dinner consisting of bread and wine).  Michael Haydn wrote 47 Masses!  Holy cats.

Goldarnit, I always learn something (and usually more than one something) when I read your blog, sieur.

Thanks, Karl. I love to inform.

I am hoping someone will inform me about what that should sound like and why he did it, did everyone do it in the time? Only Hungarians perhaps? I had just never seen it before, and Landon reprinted it without comment, so I was at a loss. The only use I ever saw of it was Ÿasӱe's name. Character Map calls it a "Cyrillic letter U with diaresis". Must be Slavic??

Anyway, as far as factoids go, I join you in my fascination with them. :)

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Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Haydn's Haus
« Reply #11912 on: July 16, 2018, 03:44:52 AM »
At first blush, it suggests making the y more an equally strong vowel, rather than the closing shade of a diphthong.  But, this is an amateur speculating.
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
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[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
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His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline Gordo

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Re: Haydn's Haus
« Reply #11913 on: July 16, 2018, 04:15:45 AM »
With 1797 in the rearview, we move ahead to the Year of the Creation, one of Haydn's Greatest Hits. Since we talked recently about 'where is Michael?', I finally found him right here in Vienna in 1798. All in all, quite a year. :)

The creation of The Creation, and that's not all!

Thanks!
8)

Thanks, Gurn, an excellent essay, as usual. What stroke me the most was Haydn's time managing. I think it deserves a close inspection because probably without those firmly established habits, his immense output is almost unexplainable.   
Musica lætitiæ comes medicina dolorum
(Music is a companion to joy and a medicine for pains)

Online Gurn Blanston

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Re: Haydn's Haus
« Reply #11914 on: July 16, 2018, 04:18:22 AM »
At first blush, it suggests making the y more an equally strong vowel, rather than the closing shade of a diphthong.  But, this is an amateur speculating.

That makes sense, but many of the European letters are nothing but a puzzle to me, as they likely were to our ancestors in America, who only emigrated here so they could drop all diacriticals. I think it was one of their recruiting slogans... ;)

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Re: Haydn's Haus
« Reply #11915 on: July 16, 2018, 04:21:11 AM »
Thanks, Gurn, an excellent essay, as usual. What stroke me the most was Haydn's time managing. I think it deserves a close inspection because probably without those firmly established habits, his immense output is almost unexplainable.   

Thanks, Gordo. Yes, the time management is one of those quirks of character (he seems to have been like that all his life) which no doubt contributed to the firm foundation needed to become who and what he was. Even though I am somewhat boring in my regularity, I can't approach my scheduling with anywhere near the constancy Haydn did. :-\

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Offline Gordo

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Re: Haydn's Haus
« Reply #11916 on: July 16, 2018, 04:28:55 AM »
Thanks, Gordo. Yes, the time management is one of those quirks of character (he seems to have been like that all his life) which no doubt contributed to the firm foundation needed to become who and what he was. Even though I am somewhat boring in my regularity, I can't approach my scheduling with anywhere near the constancy Haydn did. :-\

8)

That small description of his habits, immediately recalled me a famous anecdote about Kant (a Haydn's contemporary), "a man whose habits were so regular that housewives could set their watches by his legendary afternoon walk." Boring? I wildly want something like that for me...  :)

« Last Edit: July 16, 2018, 04:32:16 AM by Gordo »
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Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Haydn's Haus
« Reply #11917 on: July 16, 2018, 04:40:56 AM »
That makes sense, but many of the European letters are nothing but a puzzle to me, as they likely were to our ancestors in America, who only emigrated here so they could drop all diacriticals. I think it was one of their recruiting slogans... ;)

 8)

Death Before Umlauts!  0:)

Quote
Character Map calls it a "Cyrillic letter U with diaresis". Must be Slavic??

I am no expert in Polish, but I have not seen that in Polish names.  I am much less any expert in Czech . . . .

A footnote which may not enlighten . . . but maybe the diacritic is not meant to emphasize the vowel.  I am thinking of the Russian vowel и . . . when it appears with no mark, it is the full vowel, e.g. икра (caviar).  When it is part of a diphthong, is when there is a diacritic, e.g. край (edge).  So maybe Elßler did not mean to emphasis it as a vowel . . . .
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
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[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
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His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline vandermolen

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Re: Haydn's Haus
« Reply #11918 on: July 16, 2018, 05:25:08 AM »
Always a pleasure to host you here, sir. Op 64 #5 has been a major hit in England, especially, since its composition in 1790. As it should very well be, it is that fine combination between technical perfection and caprice for the listener. :)

8)

Thanks Gurn - totally agree.
 :)
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Offline Florestan

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Re: Haydn's Haus
« Reply #11919 on: July 16, 2018, 05:40:45 AM »
many of the European letters are nothing but a puzzle to me

FWIW, here are the Romanian correct transliteration of some famous composers, with the additional mention that what you see is what you pronounce:

Ceaikovski
Șostakovici
Rahmaninov

and also some famous capitals of the world:

Londra
Varșovia
Moscova


As a rule of thumb, though, Western names are spelled exactly as in the original language (except geographical names, as partially illustrated above); it's only in cases which use a different alphabet than Latin that a phonetical spelling is the norm.

For instance, although all Romanian newspapers print Sharapova, this is blatantly incorrect; the correct spelling is Șarapova.





« Last Edit: July 16, 2018, 05:46:03 AM by Florestan »
"Music expresses that which cannot be said and upon which it is impossible to remain silent." - Victor Hugo