Are Swedish composers unjustly neglected?

[karlhenning]

Poke him with the soft cushions, Greg.

[Dundonnell]

I feel as though I have strayed into the Mad Hatter's Tea Party in 'Alice in Wonderland'.

I am trying, increasingly feebly, to make sense of what others are saying!

Or to echo an old American soap(whose name I forget)..."Confused-you will be".

[karlhenning]

Hang on there, Dundonnell!

[some guy]

Dundonnel, all you have to do is say "Splunge," and all will be well.

(Oh, and "splunge" for me, too, sir!)

So now that I've passed the obligatory Python test (including the question with all the stuffing pushed to the one side), I have a serious response to this thread, too.

And here it is, and what it is, too:

It depends entirely on where you're standing. If you're looking for symphonic music, or even instrumental music, then Dundonnel's list is pretty good. Where I'm standing, however, I notice that Lars Gunnar Bodin is not on either list. And a list of good Swedish composers that doesn't start with Bodin is a list that's going to leave off all sorts of worthy people, not the least of which is Åke Parmerud. Parmerud's not a particular favorite of mine, but he is played all the time, all over Europe anyway. But if you're not going to electroacoustic concerts, or buying emprientes DIGITALes discs, then you won't know about Parmerud.

Otherwise, some prominent Swedes are Rolf Enström and Ragnar Grippe and Erik Mikael Karlsson and, even though not Swedish born, Ákos Rózmann. (In the same way that Varèse is an American composer.)

[karlhenning]

. . . Ákos Rózmann. (In the same way that Varèse is an American composer.)

Oh, yeah? Did this Rózmann character write a piece, Swedens?

[Sergeant Rock]

I feel as though I have strayed into the Mad Hatter's Tea Party in 'Alice in Wonderland'.

Treacle!

I want a clean cup. Let's all move one place on.

Mad Sarge, pouring the tea

[some guy]

Quote from: some guy on Today at 07:24:03 AM
. . . Ákos Rózmann. (In the same way that Varèse is an American composer.)

Oh, yeah? Did this Rózmann character write a piece, Swedens?

Hahaha. I was all poised to look up Swedens, too, but I recalled that Varèse piece just in time. Tee hee. Brain fart.

(Plus, I'd like to complain about my "new" cup. It looks like someone took a huge bite out of it.)

[pjme]

Swedish composers are indeed neglected - BUT THEY ARE NOT UNHAPPY!

[Sergeant Rock]

(Plus, I'd like to complain about my "new" cup. It looks like someone took a huge bite out of it.)

All complaints should be referred to the Dormouse.

Sarge

[Sergeant Rock]

Swedish composers are indeed neglected - BUT THEY ARE NOT UNHAPPY!

[Dundonnell]

Dundonnel, all you have to do is say "Splunge," and all will be well.

(Oh, and "splunge" for me, too, sir!)

So now that I've passed the obligatory Python test (including the question with all the stuffing pushed to the one side), I have a serious response to this thread, too.

And here it is, and what it is, too:

It depends entirely on where you're standing. If you're looking for symphonic music, or even instrumental music, then Dundonnel's list is pretty good. Where I'm standing, however, I notice that Lars Gunnar Bodin is not on either list. And a list of good Swedish composers that doesn't start with Bodin is a list that's going to leave off all sorts of worthy people, not the least of which is Åke Parmerud. Parmerud's not a particular favorite of mine, but he is played all the time, all over Europe anyway. But if you're not going to electroacoustic concerts, or buying emprientes DIGITALes discs, then you won't know about Parmerud.

Otherwise, some prominent Swedes are Rolf Enström and Ragnar Grippe and Erik Mikael Karlsson and, even though not Swedish born, Ákos Rózmann. (In the same way that Varèse is an American composer.)

I was totally convinced that I had entered some parallel universe and that all normal points of logical reference had disappeared until I actually googled the names above to ensure that I was not being taken on some disturbing journey into the realms of total insanity.

Yes-these people do actually exist and are all-clearly-serious figures working in areas of musical experimentation with which I am wholly and utterly unfamiliar.

I bow to the members of this forum who are so much more up to date in terms of their musical knowledge than myself.

I shall, however, forego getting involved in Pythonesque references(if you don't mind!). My brain(or what's left of it) is too scrambled already. I am(I think/hope) just a simple music lover lured into a surreal 'discussion' of what I (mistakenly) thought was a topic of some interest on which I have(had?) strong views.


And so....clad in the mantle of self-righteous pomposity and nursing my somewhat bruised remaining wits I shall beat what I hope is a semi-dignified retreat from the scene of my ritual humiliation. 

[Sergeant Rock]

I was totally convinced that I had entered some parallel universe and that all normal points of logical reference had disappeared until I actually googled the names above to ensure that I was not being taken on some disturbing journey into the realms of total insanity.

Yes-these people do actually exist and are all-clearly-serious figures working in areas of musical experimentation with which I am wholly and utterly unfamiliar.

I bow to the members of this forum who are so much more up to date in terms of their musical knowledge than myself.

I shall, however, forego getting involved in Pythonesque references(if you don't mind!). My brain(or what's left of it) is too scrambled already. I am(I think/hope) just a simple music lover lured into a surreal 'discussion' of what I (mistakenly) thought was a topic of some interest on which I have(had?) strong views.


And so....clad in the mantle of self-righteous pomposity and nursing my somewhat bruised remaining wits I shall beat what I hope is a semi-dignified retreat from the scene of my ritual humiliation. 

Emerging into a rare moment of clarity and sanity, I will say that I found your serious post well worth reading, and might even respond in a like seriousness tomorrow...after the "tea" has worn off.  My enthusiasm for Stenhammer remains, no matter what mental state I'm residing in.

Sarge

[pjme]

and, after a long period of self-reflection, I listened again to Gösta Nystroem's Sinfonia del mare

" Sasom man flyr fran den elskade
inte orkar förtäras och förnyas i ett, i ett...
....
Och sasom till sist allt liv är förgäves
som man lever allena utan den âlskade..."

As you are running away from the one you love
and cannot manage to be consumed again and again
....
And as, in the end, all life is in vain
when you live alone without the one you love"

"Det enda" by Ebba Lindqvist (fragm.)
as sung by Elisabeth Söderström on the (old) Swedish Society/Discofil recording -Stig Westerberg conductor .
And : It is NOT a pessimistic work !

From Musicweb/rob Barnett :
For me this work catches the essence of the striding, whispering, glimmering sea sorrow - a hyper-romantic work startlingly inspired not by Northern seas but by time spent in the Mediterranean. Not all that unusual: Peterson-Berger, Nielsen and Sibelius each wrote some of their finest music looking out on that warm ocean.
http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2001/apr01/nystroem.htm

[Hector]

OK, serious ones, name a popular Swedish comic opera?

'Mama Mia' doesn't count

[Sergeant Rock]

OK, serious ones, name a popular Swedish comic opera?

Pettersson's little known comic-opera The Herring and the Meatball, an opera of anthropomorphism much like The Cunning Little Vixen. Instead of animals with human characteristics, various Swedish foodstuffs interact with human beings, producing many delightful and not a few laugh-out-loud moments. The basic plot revolves around the human efforts to try to outwit the Herring and the Meatball in order to finally have lunch. It ends tragically for the meatball but a trip to the supermarket and a final rousing chorus in which food and humans unite as one voice, leaves us optimistic that life in the food chain will regenerate and endure.

Sarge

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Pettersson's little known comic-opera The Herring and the Meatball, an opera of anthropomorphism much like The Cunning Little Vixen. Instead of animals with human characteristics, various Swedish foodstuffs interact with human beings, producing many delightful and not a few laugh-out-loud moments. The basic plot resolves around the human efforts to try to outwit the Herring and the Meatball in order to finally have lunch. It ends tragically for the meatball but a trip to the supermarket and a final rousing chorus in which food and humans unite as one voice, leaves us optimistic that life in the food chain will regenerate and endure.

Sarge

Always good for a laugh, is Pettersson.

[karlhenning]

Pettersson's little known comic-opera The Herring and the Meatball, an opera of anthropomorphism much like The Cunning Little Vixen.

The composer did authorize an Italian adaption, Sarge, The Anchovy and the Spiedino, for a production in Palermo.  Local intrigues forced the production to close up after only two performances, though.

[pjme]

Only a few photographs of that Palermo production survive....fortunately.

[Symphonien]

All around there's countries with "big names"- the other Scandinavian countries, for example ... Then there's exceptions (Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia) but those countries are extremely small, anyways.

Arvo Pärt is not a "big name"? There's also Erkki-Sven Tüür and Eduard Tubin. I agree with Lithuania and Latvia though (although Peteris Vasks's profile does seem to be rising somewhat).

Just thought I'd point that out.

[greg]

Arvo Pärt is not a "big name"? There's also Erkki-Sven Tüür and Eduard Tubin. I agree with Lithuania and Latvia though (although Peteris Vasks's profile does seem to be rising somewhat).

Just thought I'd point that out.

you know, i didn't think of Part when i was writing. But yeah, he is Estonian after all, and a big name. I didn't know Tuur was Estonian, and I've only heard Tubin's name in passing.
Part, i think is the only real "big name" out of the list. The other's have a while until they can be as known as him.