Author Topic: J.S. Bach on the Organ  (Read 268128 times)

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Offline 71 dB

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Re: J.S. Bach on the Organ
« Reply #20 on: July 24, 2007, 10:57:37 AM »
This depends of course much upon the acoustics of the church in question. You can´t move the organ to the studio for the recording, and by the way how much reverberation, you want, is a matter of taste.

This volume 9 in question has been recorded with very near microphones. The direct sound is much stronger than the reverberation. It sounds like the organ was in a large living room instead of a church!
Spatial distortion is a serious problem deteriorating headphone listening.
Crossfeeders reduce spatial distortion and make the sound more natural
and less tiresome in headphone listening.

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Offline (: premont :)

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Re: J.S. Bach on the Organ
« Reply #21 on: July 24, 2007, 01:31:25 PM »
This volume 9 in question has been recorded with very near microphones. The direct sound is much stronger than the reverberation. It sounds like the organ was in a large living room instead of a church!

Well, I own the CD in question, and shall investigate this. Probably the problem arises, because the church is rather small.
res severa verum gaudium

Offline Bogey

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Re: J.S. Bach on the Organ
« Reply #22 on: July 24, 2007, 01:50:10 PM »
For those of you that have multiple recordings, how much does the actual organ used effect the recording sound....I know one obviously has to take into account the performer, venue, sound egineers etc.....  But what are your thoughts on particular organs?  Do you have a favorite?
There will never be another era like the Golden Age of Hollywood.  We didn't know how to blow up buildings then so we had no choice but to tell great stories with great characters.-Ben Mankiewicz

Offline Que

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Re: J.S. Bach on the Organ
« Reply #23 on: November 04, 2007, 12:45:04 AM »
A recommended post from Val: :)



J S BACH:     Orgelbüchlein          / André Isoir  (CALIOPE)

One of the most touching works of Bach, consisting on 45 short chorals, each one with a deep symbolism. Most of the chorals were composed between 1713 and 1716.

André Isoir is very poetic and fluent, and the instrument is beautiful. The best version I know of this work.

À chacun son goût.

Offline FideLeo

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Re: J.S. Bach on the Organ
« Reply #24 on: November 04, 2007, 06:16:29 AM »
For those of you that have multiple recordings, how much does the actual organ used effect the recording sound....I know one obviously has to take into account the performer, venue, sound egineers etc.....  But what are your thoughts on particular organs?  Do you have a favorite?

Bach performances played on northern (European) baroque style organs, especially originals built by the workshops of (Gottfried) Silbermann, (Christian) Mueller, (Arp) Schnitger etc. are particularly faithful in reproducing the kinds of timbres and tone colours that the composer may have heard and was used to himself.  Various Silbermann's in Saxony and Alsace are often the favourites for organists and listeners alike in this repertory.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2007, 06:19:47 AM by masolino »
HIP for all and all for HIP! Harpsichord for Bach, fortepiano for Beethoven and pianoforte for Brahms!

Offline FideLeo

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Re: J.S. Bach on the Organ
« Reply #25 on: November 04, 2007, 06:30:11 AM »
Jacques Oortmerssen's series on Channel Classics is well-recorded (on various famous baroque instruments) but the interpretations are unfortunately quite too literal and unexciting to these ears.  His account of fantasia and fugue in a minor (BWV 543) in vol. 6 sounds really like a non-event compared to the sizzling performance by Lorenzo Ghielmi in his album "Bach and Romanticists."  Ghielmi chose preludes for the same chorales as composed by Bach (from Orgelbuechlein) and Brahms and used baroque and romantic style instruments respectively.  A beautiful album from Winter & Winter.
HIP for all and all for HIP! Harpsichord for Bach, fortepiano for Beethoven and pianoforte for Brahms!

Offline (: premont :)

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Re: J.S. Bach on the Organ
« Reply #26 on: November 04, 2007, 08:46:25 AM »
For those of you that have multiple recordings, how much does the actual organ used effect the recording sound....I know one obviously has to take into account the performer, venue, sound egineers etc.....  But what are your thoughts on particular organs?  Do you have a favorite?

An interest in organ music almost inevitably leads to an interest in historical organs. Since the greater part of informed organists to day uses restored historical organs or competent builded copies, these interests go hand in hand.
res severa verum gaudium

Offline (: premont :)

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Re: J.S. Bach on the Organ
« Reply #27 on: November 04, 2007, 08:55:20 AM »




Isoir´s Bach integral was made during a long period of time and is rather uneven. He got better with time. I find his playing generally brilliant and flowing but often too streamlined, something made possible by the modern organs he preferred to use. The best part of the cycle is IMO the Clavierübung III played on the historical Joseph Gabler organ in Weingarten, whereas the sound of the Grenzing organ he uses much, is less suited for Bach, at least in these ears.
res severa verum gaudium

Offline Que

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Re: J.S. Bach on the Organ
« Reply #28 on: November 04, 2007, 09:00:14 AM »
Isoir´s Bach integral was made during a long period of time and is rather uneven. He got better with time. I find his playing generally brilliant and flowing but often too streamlined, something made possible by the modern organs he preferred to use. The best part of the cycle is IMO the Clavierübung III played on the historical Joseph Gabler organ in Weingarten, whereas the sound of the Grenzing organ he uses much, is less suited for Bach, at least in these ears.

With recommendations by two experts*, I gues this is a winner! :)
Val, Premont, thank you both!  :)


* I believe some members mind me saying that - but I'll do it anyway... 8)

Q
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Offline (: premont :)

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Re: J.S. Bach on the Organ
« Reply #29 on: November 04, 2007, 09:05:34 AM »
Jacques Oortmerssen's series on Channel Classics is well-recorded (on various famous baroque instruments) but the interpretations are unfortunately quite too literal and unexciting to these ears.  His account of fantasia and fugue in a minor (BWV 543) in vol. 6 sounds really like a non-event compared to the sizzling performance by Lorenzo Ghielmi in his album "Bach and Romanticists."   

Van Oortmerssen, hmmm. I agree, he is often conspicuously uneventful. For the same reason I do not "subscribe" to his still incomplete set. However I have acquired four of the CDs because of the organs he uses (NB Bogey look above). I think Oortmerssen somtimes at least succeds in creating a kind of cumulative effect in the longer choral free pieces, e.g. BWV 538 and 540.
res severa verum gaudium

Offline FideLeo

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Re: J.S. Bach on the Organ
« Reply #30 on: November 05, 2007, 04:04:41 AM »
Isoir? Bach integral was made during a long period of time and is rather uneven. He got better with time.

I have the Bach AoF and organ concertos (mostly reconstructed arrangements) recorded by Isoir and while liking both, actually listen more to the latter (Martin Gester is the conductor).  I believe the light textures/registration
favoured by Isoir (as pointed out above by Premont) sound probably more appealing in a concerto than in solo music.  Does anyone know whether Isoir has recorded Handel's concertos? 
HIP for all and all for HIP! Harpsichord for Bach, fortepiano for Beethoven and pianoforte for Brahms!

Offline Que

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Re: J.S. Bach on the Organ
« Reply #31 on: November 10, 2008, 07:01:47 AM »
Repost:

cpo has just issued this:



I've had some positive experiences with Weinberger in the past: HIP approach, beautiful historical organs, well recorded, played with insight and (mostly) gusto. Though Weinberger lacks the musical brilliance of - say - a Jean-Charles Ablitzer, Weinberger has also his less remarkble and plain "solid" moments of playing.

This set is $245 at Amazon.com (preorder) but €50 at jpc! (which owns cpo::)
Well, we know that the US dollar has declined a bit but this is a rather steep difference.... ::)

Q
À chacun son goût.

Bulldog

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Re: J.S. Bach on the Organ
« Reply #32 on: November 10, 2008, 07:08:56 AM »
Jacques Oortmerssen's series on Channel Classics is well-recorded (on various famous baroque instruments) but the interpretations are unfortunately quite too literal and unexciting to these ears. 

I agree with the opinions but not the label - it's Challenge.

Offline Que

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Re: J.S. Bach on the Organ
« Reply #33 on: November 10, 2008, 07:14:50 AM »
And I'm considering these:



The idea of four hands organ arrangements of movements from the cantatas, performed on Dutch historical organs, seems pretty irresistible to me! :)
And it sounds good... 8)

AUDIA SAMPLES (links open Windows Media Player):

Concerto super: Was mein Gott will,das g’scheh allzeit (BWV 111/1)
canto fermo in soprano > audiofragment [615 KB]

Adagio assai BWV 12/1 > audiofragment [477 KB]

And more information on the site of the performers, two brothers, HERE.

And the link for Harry HERE! ;D

Part I - the organ in the Martinikerk in Bolsward:              Part II - the organ in the Grote of Jacobijnekerk in Leeuwarden:



Part III - the Hinsz-organ in the Bovenkerk in Kampen:



Mouthwatering! 8)

Q
« Last Edit: November 10, 2008, 07:53:22 AM by Que »
À chacun son goût.

Offline Opus106

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Re: J.S. Bach on the Organ
« Reply #34 on: November 23, 2008, 11:14:18 AM »
The complete organ works, plus the AoF, for $25. On 5 non-hybrid SACDs.  :'(

http://www.mdt.co.uk/MDTSite/product/SO_BIS/BISSACD1527-28.htm

Do I understand them correctly? They've used SACD just to store 17 CDs worth of music, and this doesn't have the any benefits sonically?
« Last Edit: November 23, 2008, 11:17:32 AM by opus67 »
Regards,
Navneeth

Offline Que

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Re: J.S. Bach on the Organ
« Reply #35 on: November 23, 2008, 11:24:20 AM »
The complete organ works, plus the AoF, for $25. On 5 non-hybrid SACDs.  :'(

http://www.mdt.co.uk/MDTSite/product/SO_BIS/BISSACD1527-28.htm

Do I understand them correctly? They've used SACD just to store 17 CDs worth of music, and this doesn't have the any benefits sonically?

So it seems, and unplayable on ordinary CD-players.
But you can get the same recordings in the normal format on Brilliant Classics.

Q
À chacun son goût.

Offline Opus106

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Re: J.S. Bach on the Organ
« Reply #36 on: November 23, 2008, 11:27:16 AM »
But you can get the same recordings in the normal format on Brilliant Classics.
Q

Oh. I didn't know that. Thanks. :)
Regards,
Navneeth

Offline (: premont :)

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Re: J.S. Bach on the Organ
« Reply #37 on: November 23, 2008, 01:01:44 PM »

But you can get the same recordings in the normal format on Brilliant Classics.

This is not quite true, as Fagius´ AoF is missing in the Brilliant release.

This is BTW not a great loss in my opinion.
res severa verum gaudium

Offline Norbeone

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Re: J.S. Bach on the Organ
« Reply #38 on: November 23, 2008, 03:03:05 PM »
And I'm considering these:



The idea of four hands organ arrangements of movements from the cantatas, performed on Dutch historical organs, seems pretty irresistible to me! :)
And it sounds good... 8)

AUDIA SAMPLES (links open Windows Media Player):

Concerto super: Was mein Gott will,das g’scheh allzeit (BWV 111/1)
canto fermo in soprano > audiofragment [615 KB]

Adagio assai BWV 12/1 > audiofragment [477 KB]
Mouthwatering! 8)

Q


Thanks for posting these. They sound quite amazing!

 :)

Offline Que

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Re: J.S. Bach on the Organ
« Reply #39 on: December 24, 2008, 01:48:29 PM »
Yes, Bach boys and girls - what to make of these recent reissues? :o :)

I'm getting a choice overload... ::)

   

Q
À chacun son goût.

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