Author Topic: John Cage (1912-92)  (Read 53286 times)

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Offline San Antone

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Re: John Cage (1912-92)
« Reply #600 on: December 16, 2016, 03:44:16 AM »
Have you heard Stockhausen's Momente?

It's interesting for me to reflect on how I appreciate the Cage Songbook and, for example, Winterreise. The problem I have is to get beyond being amused and impressed by the shock of the new, Yes, Cage has succeeded in "épater la bourgeoisie" - has he done more?

Like Marcel Duchamp.

Cage said this about the Song Books, " … to consider the Song Books as a work of art is nearly impossible. Who would dare? It resembles a brothel, doesn’t it?”

But do not be misled by Cage's often self deprecating comments.  Although he admired Duchamp and cited him as a major influence - Cage was producing work on an almost daily basis right up to the end of his life.  Very different from Duchamp who, stopped working fairly early in his career and became a personality and commentator.

While there is humor in much of Cage's work, it is a well trod path in Zen to use humor to wake up a disciple.

Offline Mandryka

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Re: John Cage (1912-92)
« Reply #601 on: December 16, 2016, 03:46:51 AM »
Cage said this about the Song Books, " … to consider the Song Books as a work of art is nearly impossible. Who would dare? It resembles a brothel, doesn’t it?”

But do not be misled by Cage's often self deprecating comments.  Although he admired Duchamp and cited him as a major influence - Cage was producing work on an almost daily basis right up to the end of his life.  Very different from Duchamp who, stopped working fairly early in his career and became a personality and commentator.

While there is humor in much of Cage's work, it is a well trod path in Zen to use humor to wake up a disciple.

You didn't give me a chance to finish the post.

Duchamp because it is so totally disorienting, we have a fractured version  of the Large Glass in London, I haven't seen Etant Donnés - has anyone here seen it?
« Last Edit: December 16, 2016, 03:51:44 AM by Mandryka »
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Offline San Antone

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Re: John Cage (1912-92)
« Reply #602 on: December 16, 2016, 03:50:56 AM »
You didn't give me a chance to finish the post.

 :D

Offline torut

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Re: John Cage (1912-92)
« Reply #603 on: December 16, 2016, 08:18:09 AM »
^^^^^ this looks very cool! Vinyl only?

Download is available from bandcamp.
https://karlrecords.bandcamp.com/album/complete-song-books

Offline Mandryka

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Re: John Cage (1912-92)
« Reply #604 on: December 16, 2016, 08:25:01 AM »
Download is available from bandcamp.
https://karlrecords.bandcamp.com/album/complete-song-books

There are two recordings of the songbooks, that one and with Lore Lixenberg and others - the latter a selection. You NEED both. Or Neither. But one will not do.

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Offline edward

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Re: John Cage (1912-92)
« Reply #605 on: December 19, 2016, 09:31:26 AM »
I don't know if anyone's posted this already, but the OgreOgress recordings of many of the Number Pieces are now available as lossless downloads from cdbaby at very cheap prices. Three of them are almost free, but there's lots around the $5-$7 mark, many with 2+ hours of music.

The really cheap ones:

Three2, Twenty-Three, Six, Twenty-Six: $1.75
Four4: $1.85
One4, Four, Twenty-Nine: $2.45
"I don't at all mind actively disliking a piece of contemporary music, but in order to feel happy about it I must consciously understand why I dislike it. Otherwise it remains in my mind as unfinished business."
 -- Aaron Copland, The Pleasures of Music

Offline torut

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Re: John Cage (1912-92)
« Reply #606 on: December 19, 2016, 10:41:07 PM »
There are two recordings of the songbooks, that one and with Lore Lixenberg and others - the latter a selection. You NEED both. Or Neither. But one will not do.

I listened to both. The Sub Rosa recording (with Lixenberg), which I prefer, has more variety of voice, and the usage of electronics and the accompaniment are less intense. No. 17 is the most beautiful.

According to Sub Rosa, it is also a complete recording (and the first one) of Song Books. The "mix" tracks "comprise layered 'Solos for Voices' in superimpositions that were created using chance operations." (discogs)

Amelia Cuni and Joan La Barbara are also very good, though they recorded just few selections.

Offline torut

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Re: John Cage (1912-92)
« Reply #607 on: December 19, 2016, 10:57:00 PM »
I don't know if anyone's posted this already, but the OgreOgress recordings of many of the Number Pieces are now available as lossless downloads from cdbaby at very cheap prices. Three of them are almost free, but there's lots around the $5-$7 mark, many with 2+ hours of music.

The really cheap ones:

Three2, Twenty-Three, Six, Twenty-Six: $1.75
Four4: $1.85
One4, Four, Twenty-Nine: $2.45

It's really nice. I downloaded Three2 etc. and Three, Twenty-Eight, Fifty-Four, Fifty-Seven. I believe there are few (none?) other recordings of Twenties pieces. Fifty-Four is actually Twenty-Six performed with Twenty-Eight, and Fifty-Seven is Twenty-Eight with Twenty-Nine. These are rich works.

Offline Mandryka

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Re: John Cage (1912-92)
« Reply #608 on: December 20, 2016, 01:11:49 AM »
I listened to both. The Sub Rosa recording (with Lixenberg), which I prefer, has more variety of voice, and the usage of electronics and the accompaniment are less intense. No. 17 is the most beautiful.

According to Sub Rosa, it is also a complete recording (and the first one) of Song Books. The "mix" tracks "comprise layered 'Solos for Voices' in superimpositions that were created using chance operations." (discogs)

Amelia Cuni and Joan La Barbara are also very good, though they recorded just few selections.

I agree with you completely, I had noticed that it was probably complete after I made that post.
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Offline snyprrr

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Re: John Cage (1912-92)
« Reply #609 on: August 13, 2017, 06:06:43 PM »
It's Monday now so, last week I had a little Cage revival and I happen to be listening to him quite frequently at the moment (being one of the only 20th century composers that I'm actively listening to right now.

BRB

I had just gotten out of my Cage rediscovery before you got here... I was surprised by the later works, sounding much like a random Feldman.
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Offline Mandryka

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Re: John Cage (1912-92)
« Reply #610 on: August 13, 2017, 10:12:34 PM »
Strangely enough I listened to some of the harmonies from the Apartment House, both in the version for violin by Arditti and the version for violin and keyboard by Roger Zahab and Eric Moe. The Arditti caught my imagination, their transcription makes the music sound like nothing else.
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Offline San Antone

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Re: John Cage (1912-92)
« Reply #611 on: August 17, 2017, 09:03:22 AM »
One can never listen to too much Cage.

 ;)

millionrainbows

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Re: John Cage (1912-92)
« Reply #612 on: August 17, 2017, 09:35:25 AM »
Cage tried to remove as much of his personality as possible from his work, but, ironically, it is those works in which I can detect his personal touch that are some of my favorites.

Offline Turner

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Re: John Cage (1912-92)
« Reply #613 on: October 17, 2017, 02:21:14 AM »

Offline San Antone

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Re: John Cage (1912-92)
« Reply #614 on: October 17, 2017, 04:50:32 AM »
Picked up a copy of "Silence" by John Cage from the library:





 8)

Excellent book.

millionrainbows

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Re: John Cage (1912-92)
« Reply #615 on: October 17, 2017, 12:35:32 PM »
I'm glad you reproduced that cover image; it has a lot of zen character. It reminds me of when Suzuki visited Cage's loft studio; there was a small table,some bamboo mats, and a piano. The rest was empty, no curtains or anything. Suzuki said, "An old shoe would look beautiful in this room."