Schubert's Piano Trios

[Gurn Blanston]

I was curious about the L'Archibudelli(sic)/ Bylsma(sic),... the one that has both PTs on one disc.

Either one of two options here:

#1 - There is no such thing. The Bb trio (#1) is coupled with the Notturno which is a one movement trio piece. AFAIK (which is modestly far) they never did the Eb trio   OR

#2 - Everything I know is wrong.

[snyprrr]

Either one of two options here:

#1 - There is no such thing. The Bb trio (#1) is coupled with the Notturno which is a one movement trio piece. AFAIK (which is modestly far) they never did the Eb trio   OR

#2 - Everything I know is wrong.

Seriously, it's one of those Sony discs, and 'they' (the critics) were all upset because of the cuts, which is how they got both PTs on one disc.

[DavidW]

I received the set today (Immerseel/L'Archibudelli) in the mail.  There might be a confusion from different reissues perhaps...

Those two trios are on the first cd and the Notturno is on the cd with the Trout Quintet and Arpeggione sonata.

[Antoine Marchand]

I remember the Schubert from the Hunger, it was beautiful!

Not a trio, but Deneuve and Sarandon perform a famous duo there... 

[Mandryka]

One of the best Op 100's I've heard was from a concert in Schwetzingen last year with Besuidenhout and Wispelwey  and Mullova. It's very good, especially Wispelwey. The concert was recorded and uploaded and it's certainly worth seeking out.

Gaia Scienza's reading is very dark and almost edgy. I like it very much. You know, Schumann said that the |E flat trio is "an angry meteor blazing forth and outshining everything in the musical atmosphere of the time." Gaia Scienza play it like that.

There are also excellent oldies with Casals and his mates, and Busch Bros. with Serkin.

There's another special recording from Golub/Kaplan/Carr which puts back all the cuts made in the final movement. It's a very nice performance in its own rights, and those cuts amount to a lot of music which normally you don't hear, with unique combinations of the themes. The recording also contains a lovely performance of the Notturno, which Schubert intended for the E flat trio.

He didn't use the Noturno because he became captivated by a Swedish folksong (Se solen sjunker ) which he decide to integrate into the Andante (as a cello theme)

I never listen to Op 99.

[Opus106]

Either one of two options here:

#1 - There is no such thing. The Bb trio (#1) is coupled with the Notturno which is a one movement trio piece. AFAIK (which is modestly far) they never did the Eb trio   OR

#2 - Everything I know is wrong.

The trios are in one disc, Gurn. The other contains the piano quintet, the Notturno and the Arpeggione sonata. The "set" is essentially these two discs, plastic casing, booklets and all, residing in a slip case.

[snyprrr]

I ended up getting the Capucon/Virgin,... for the usual reasons $$$.

[SonicMan46]

Schubert's Piano Trios seemed to have brought this thread back TTT!    For years I just had the BAT 2-CD bargain w/ recordings from the 1960s - first question, did this group re-record these works later?

Quoted below is a post I left recently in Gurn's classical thread; I just listened to D.898 from both of these groups and much preferred the PI performances of the Atlantis Trio; now the BAT are still quite excellent & the set is a super bargain, but their playing seemed more restrained to me and the recorded sound is just not as good.

So, now I'm thinking about obtaining another set of these works just to have at least 2 - 

Some considerations are shown below, and I'm sure others exist - thus, just wanted to continue the discussion on these pieces here:

   

   

Schubert, Franz - Piano Trios et al w/ the Atlantis Trio (Schroder on violin, Crawford on fortepiano, & Sutherland on cello); these are older recordings (1994 & 95) released on the Musica Omnia label - I've been collecting other discs w/ this group on Watchorn's label.  Liner notes are excellent w/ a page on Conrad Graf (maker of the piano) & a page written by the restorer of the ca. 1835 Graf fortepiano #2148 - after 2 yrs of restoration the piano was obtained by Penelope Crawford in 1994.

Now I own these works in just a 2-disc collection w/ the BAT from the 1960s - this newer 2-disc offering (in a single double-disc jewel box size) offers superb integrated playing and great up-front sound; these works have just so much variety from beautiful slow melodies to grave and agitated (and dynamic) movements - the performers are beautifully integrated and the sound recording is excellent.  Short review from MusicWeb HERE.  For those wanting PI performances of the early Romantics, explore this label w/ the Atlantis Trio - 

 

[Dancing Divertimentian]

Schubert's Piano Trios seemed to have brought this thread back TTT!    For years I just had the BAT 2-CD bargain w/ recordings from the 1960s - first question, did this group re-record these works later?

Quoted below is a post I left recently in Gurn's classical thread; I just listened to D.898 from both of these groups and much preferred the PI performances of the Atlantis Trio; now the BAT are still quite excellent & the set is a super bargain, but their playing seemed more restrained to me and the recorded sound is just not as good.

So, now I'm thinking about obtaining another set of these works just to have at least 2 - 

Some considerations are shown below, and I'm sure others exist - thus, just wanted to continue the discussion on these pieces here:

 

Dave, I've owned the Schiff/Shiokawa/Prenyi set and had issues with the recording: the cello is too submerged and simply not audible enough for me. Ended up discarding it.

I've also owned the other volume of the Vienna Trio set on MDG and found the performance too airy and light. Not enough bite for me. Also discarded it.

Currently I own the BAT (Cohen edition) and again have problems with the inaudible cello. Will probably discard the set eventually.

Another recording I own is the D.929 from La Gaia Scienza and love it. Won't be discarding this disc!

But the outstanding set for me is without question the Golub/Kaplan/Carr set. Best of everything, here. Great recording and a probing philosophy that brings a freshness and energy to the works that is endearing.

[SonicMan46]

Dave, I've owned the Schiff/Shiokawa/Prenyi set and had issues with the recording: the cello is too submerged and simply not audible enough for me. Ended up discarding it.

I've also owned the other volume of the Vienna Trio set on MDG and found the performance too airy and light. Not enough bite for me. Also discarded it.

Currently I own the BAT (Greenhouse edition) and again have problems with the inaudible cello. Will probably discard the set eventually.

Another recording I own is the D.929 from La Gaia Scienza and love it. Won't be discarding this disc!

But the outstanding set for me is without question the Golub/Kaplan/Carr set. Best of everything, here. Great recording and a probing philosophy that brings a freshness and energy to the works that is endearing.

Hi DD - thanks for the input; I have other recordings w/ Glub/Kaplan/Carr and enjoy tremendously.  I'll go ahead and put this set of discs on my 'to buy' list!  Dave 

[snyprrr]

Hi DD - thanks for the input; I have other recordings w/ Glub/Kaplan/Carr and enjoy tremendously.  I'll go ahead and put this set of discs on my 'to buy' list!  Dave 

ok, so I've never acquainted myself with this Music. I have just listened to the Capucon Bros on Virgin.

First, I must say, that this Music sounds Symphonic, no? Symphonies for Piano Trio? At least that's what I'm hearing. Is it true that Schubert's not 'developing' in the usual manner? Something about him sounds so different than everybody else.

I listened to the long first mvmts. of both PTs first. My first impressions were that these two pieces mirror the 2 Piano Quartets of Mozart. 929 = 478, and 898 = 493. In other words, Schubert's 'famous' PT corresponds to the g-minor Mozart (are they both not more dramatic?), whilst the more major sounding Schubert PT1 sounds more like the more genial Eb Mozart work.

So, I take it that PT2 IS the 'famous' one, and the more dramatic and minor sounding one. PT1 sounded very much like skipping through the park (literally) by comparison, though, the opening of this piece 'sounds' very familiar to me (more movies?). Both of these 15min. mvmts. sound more like 'personal', or Romantic, Music, to me, more than anything else. When we played the said Mozart afterwards, it was clear that Mozart was dealing with a musical argument, whereas, IMHO, it appeared as though Schubert was dealing with emotional arguments. At least, in the Schubert, you have all these drawn out, soloist types of 'yearing' notes all over the place, as if the always subliminal Mozatean undercurrent of

I'm sure you know what I'm talking about!

Now, I don't know if it is this Virgin release, but I'm assuming that it's the music that has all these very particular piano roulades, that I haven't heard in H-M-Beeth. Is this Schubert's piano 'style'? I can see where the pianist is very important in these pieces. The strings don't seem as virtuoso? It is the pianist's show, really?

I also note the relatively laid back quality of the Music, but, I've heard that this particular Virgin recording is very low wattage (which is fine by me is such stormy music as No.2). I can tell that these players are playing waaay after the bar has closed, so to speak. The pianist, in particular, is very... not reticent... clinical? I'll say that this listen gives me the Stravinsky Effect, whatever that means (it's a very crisp listen, you know you are hearing a particular performance). They certainly let the music speak for itself, yet seemed to make every point along the way.

Schubert peppers No.2's first mvmt. with all these little, perfectly placed minor key chords, and you can tell that he's expressing real angst, at least, once again, it 'sounds' like it. Also, we noticed the 'butterflies at the social cocktail' sound of the Music, the very German 'air' that Schubert was breathing (specifically the Notturno).

I can also see where something like Gaia Scienza would be the only way to go for these pieces. I'd really like to find that 2cd cheap. I can see that these pieces are the kinds where you'd want different recordings: there's just so much detail.

I like these PTs, and the String Quintet, much much more than the final SQ that I was whining about before.

[snyprrr]

I ended up getting the Capucon/Virgin,... for the usual reasons $$$.

I like it. You can hear everything, and the group plays very crisply. I hear this is a very low wattage performance, but some have said that this Schubert stripped of the 20th century, so to speak (in the good way). Though I'm ignorant enough of the music, I can tell that this isn't the only performance you'd want. It's definitely a very very pleasant listen, very nice and mellow, and glittering.

[mjwal]

Funny, Mandryka, I also never listen to the first trio D.898 - somehow I am just never inclined to put it on, despite its beauty.
Wasn't the Andante of D. 929 played in Kubrick's Barry Lyndon first, before The Hunger? Never mind, it's so wonderful it can serve both films - of course, both films are among other things about the decadence and corruption of the aristocracy, when one comes to think of it, though The Hunger is predicated upon the myth of Tithonus as well.
Apart from the Busch/Serkin version of D. 929, the classic, I have the fine Beethoven Trio (Berlin Classics) and Fortepiano Trio Florestan (Discover) - the latter sporting the original longer version of the finale. The latter performance  is a bit crudely inflected at times and even poorly tuned, I only listen to it for the extended finale. I would like to praise Oistrakh, Knushevitzky and Oborin (Melodia LP) in  this: they bring a bright effervescence to the exposition of the first movement until the big modulation leading to the waters of regret, as I think of this passage, after which the opening music can never be the same, there is tension - and anger/anguish even - in its return, finally resignation that seems to lead inevitably to the andante, where Knushevitsky moulds the theme with an inimitable aristocratic grace born of melancholia...etc etc - you get the idea; a certain grandezza cum morbidezza is the foundation of this interpretation. I believe it has been reissued in a huge box by Brilliant.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FR6FIE95VzI&NR=1&feature=fvwp

[Mandryka]

Funny, Mandryka, I also never listen to the first trio D.898 - somehow I am just never inclined to put it on, despite its beauty.
Wasn't the Andante of D. 929 played in Kubrick's Barry Lyndon first, before The Hunger? Never mind, it's so wonderful it can serve both films - of course, both films are among other things about the decadence and corruption of the aristocracy, when one comes to think of it, though The Hunger is predicated upon the myth of Tithonus as well.
Apart from the Busch/Serkin version of D. 929, the classic, I have the fine Beethoven Trio (Berlin Classics) and Fortepiano Trio Florestan (Discover) - the latter sporting the original longer version of the finale. The latter performance  is a bit crudely inflected at times and even poorly tuned, I only listen to it for the extended finale. I would like to praise Oistrakh, Knushevitzky and Oborin (Melodia LP) in  this: they bring a bright effervescence to the exposition of the first movement until the big modulation leading to the waters of regret, as I think of this passage, after which the opening music can never be the same, there is tension - and anger/anguish even - in its return, finally resignation that seems to lead inevitably to the andante, where Knushevitsky moulds the theme with an inimitable aristocratic grace born of melancholia...etc etc - you get the idea; a certain grandezza cum morbidezza is the foundation of this interpretation. I believe it has been reissued in a huge box by Brilliant.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FR6FIE95VzI&NR=1&feature=fvwp

Hahaha. Very strange. Good find. The comment on youtube is quite right (was it you?):

belle interprétation , tempo particulièrement lent ,avec une intensité expressive notable!

sans doute pas une version de référence , ne serait ce que du fait de la prise de son hélas médiocre , mais assurément une belle version à garder en éméoire (sic)  , aux coté des wanderer , capuçon et autres! merci pour cette belle découverte!


Except maybe for the bit about  Wanderer and Capucon, whom I haven't heard.

[mjwal]

No, it wasn't me writing on YouTube - I write those (rarely) in English, and reserve my somewhat old-fashioned 19th C French for Amazon.fr, my German comments (more fluent) for its German equivalent. I don't know the  Wanderer or Capuçon etc either. I am beginning to restrict my CD purchases (apart from jazz etc) to "new" music and very special "historical" recordings, I just can't fit in the nth recording of the Eroica etc, quite apart from the cost.

[milk]

Here's something. HIP!

[asin] B003LY5FN4[/asin]

[Gurn Blanston]

Here's something. HIP!

[asin] B003LY5FN4[/asin]

Yes it is. It's been being talked about, haven't heard it though. Have you done? Or are you inquiring? 



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Now playing:
The Hanover Band / Goodman - Hob 01 015 Symphony in D 4th mvmt - Finale: Presto

[milk]

Yes it is. It's been being talked about, haven't heard it though. Have you done? Or are you inquiring? 



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Now playing:
The Hanover Band / Goodman - Hob 01 015 Symphony in D 4th mvmt - Finale: Presto

Yes I have it and like it a lot. Actually I have all recordings by Atlantis. Their Mendelssohn is really great! I wonder if I shouldn't acquire the Immerseel?

[Que]

Yes I have it and like it a lot. Actually I have all recordings by Atlantis. Their Mendelssohn is really great! I wonder if I shouldn't acquire the Immerseel?

I really should investigate the Atlantis Trio!

As for Immerseel et al - I would go for La Gaia Scienza (Winter & Winter) who include all repeats and are more inpired IMO. It's a more edgy and slightly "darker" reading though.

Q

[milk]

I really should investigate the Atlantis Trio!

As for Immerseel et al - I would go for La Gaia Scienza (Winter & Winter) who include all repeats and are more inpired IMO. It's a more edgy and slightly "darker" reading though.

Q

Thanks! I'll check it out!