GMG Classical Music Forum

The Music Room => Composer Discussion => Topic started by: vandermolen on June 17, 2010, 12:46:58 PM

Title: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on June 17, 2010, 12:46:58 PM
Howells wrote 'Hymnus Paradisi' in 1938 - it was written as a response to the tragic death of his nine-year-old son from polio in 1938. The work was written in 1938 but locked away for years. His friend Vaughan William asked to see it in 1950 and insisted it was published. It is well served on CD but the Naxos version is fine. Like Novak's 'The Storm' It is one of the great, little known, choral works of the 20th Century (IMHO) and intensely moving. Howells wrote other fine orchestral, choral, chamber and church music but the Hymnus Paradisi is his masterpiece. His other fine choral works - the Stabat Mater and Missa Sabrinensis are coupled together on a recent Chandos release.

Any views on Howells?
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: bhodges on June 17, 2010, 01:09:07 PM
Wow, I love Howells, and can't believe there wasn't a thread on him already.  :o  Thanks for starting one. 

I also find Hymnus Paradisi incredibly moving, and I've only heard the one recording below, with Handley on Hyperion.  An English Mass is pretty fine, too.

The other two pieces I know are his Requiem, thanks to the Dale Warland Singers and their very fine CD below (which also includes a wonderful performance of Frank Martin's Mass), and Take Him, Earth, For Cherishing, the piece Howells wrote as a memorial to John F. Kennedy. 

Here (http://saintpaulsunday.publicradio.org/features/0504_dalewarland/) is a performance of the latter by the Dale Warland Singers, via American Public Radio.  (For some reason I can't get it to play, but I think my audio setup is having problems.)

--Bruce
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Lethevich on June 17, 2010, 04:41:38 PM
'In Gloucestershire' is possibly the largest statement of any English composer following Vaughan Williams' "national" style in the string quartet medium after RVW's own second quartet.

Howells' orchestral output is distinctly lacking in stand-out pieces, but despite it mostly being comprised of uninspiringly titled suites (such as 'The B's'), his orchestral music is on a consistently high level and rather neglected save for a few Chandos discs and one or two others. The piano concertos may not equal John Ireland's one, but they come surprisingly close at times. The Concerto for Strings I would rate as an excellent piece. The 3 Dances for violin and orchestra are substantial, albeit rhapsodic.

Has anyone heard his two pieces for cello and orchestra - the fantasia and threnody?

(http://img705.imageshack.us/img705/7884/frontee.jpg) (http://www.hyperion-records.co.uk/al.asp?al=CDD22038&f=howells)

This disc above shows up in Hyperion's sale every now and again (as do a lot of their Howells discs) - it's splendidly atmospheric. Outside of his "statement" pieces, Howells' church music is unsurpassed by any British composer of the period that I have heard, even Britten and Rubbra.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on June 19, 2010, 07:29:33 AM
quote author=Lethe link=topic=16596.msg420459#msg420459 date=1276821698]
'In Gloucestershire' is possibly the largest statement of any English composer following Vaughan Williams' "national" style in the string quartet medium after RVW's own second quartet.

Howells' orchestral output is distinctly lacking in stand-out pieces, but despite it mostly being comprised of uninspiringly titled suites (such as 'The B's'), his orchestral music is on a consistently high level and rather neglected save for a few Chandos discs and one or two others. The piano concertos may not equal John Ireland's one, but they come surprisingly close at times. The Concerto for Strings I would rate as an excellent piece. The 3 Dances for violin and orchestra are substantial, albeit rhapsodic.

Has anyone heard his two pieces for cello and orchestra - the fantasia and threnody?

(http://img705.imageshack.us/img705/7884/frontee.jpg) (http://www.hyperion-records.co.uk/al.asp?al=CDD22038&f=howells)

This disc above shows up in Hyperion's sale every now and again (as do a lot of their Howells discs) - it's splendidly atmospheric. Outside of his "statement" pieces, Howells' church music is unsurpassed by any British composer of the period that I have heard, even Britten and Rubbra.
[/quote]

I agree with you about 'Three Bs' - a very uninspiring title (unless, of course, it was a piece of music about Goldilocks and the Three Bears  :D). Honegger's 5th Symphony 'The Three D's' is a different matter I think.  Howells' orchestral music is a bit of a blind spot for me so I will be playing some over the next few days to see what I think.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Luke on June 19, 2010, 07:41:45 AM
Quote from: Lethe on June 17, 2010, 04:41:38 PM

Has anyone heard his two pieces for cello and orchestra - the fantasia and threnody?

I've heard the fantasia. Or the threnody. Can't remember which, think it's the first one. Whichever is the coupling with the BBC Hymnus Paradisi which I have downstairs. As you can see, it didn't make much of an impression on me, but maybe I should give it another try.

As for the HP - I know it well, I've gone through it mny times with and without score, and I'm afraid that though I can see exactly why it is spoken of with such unvarying reverence, and though it has oodles of passages of great beauty, for me personally it is too unvaried in tone. To be frank, I find it rather boring. I wish I didn't, and I keep on trying...

In case it be thought that Howells is not my cup of tea at all...well, to be honest in the standard Howells repertoire of choral, choral/orchestral, or plain orchestral music I have yet to find a piece which sets my pulse racing, but when we come to his relatively little-discussed keyboard music, and particularly the two sets of archaising (and sometimes deeply moving) pieces for clavichord or piano, we're in a different world as far as my own reactions are concerned. My love for these pieces is surely second to none! It might be because, to me, this is Howells with more air injected, more punch and pungency, the same harmonic language but more bitingly, acidically applied - Ravel's violin and cello sonata compared to Daphnis; Debussy's late pieces compared to the Prelude/Faun...
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on June 19, 2010, 09:01:22 AM
I listened to the Fantasia for Cello and Orch. today too (it is with a great performance of Hymnus Paradisi on an old BBC Radio Classics CD). As with Luke, it did not really grab me - rather amorphous in a way, but I must listen again. Hymnus Paradisi is undoubtedly his masterpiece - in a class of its own - invaraiably moves me to tears.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Lethevich on June 19, 2010, 10:32:52 AM
Quote from: Luke on June 19, 2010, 07:41:45 AM
but when we come to his relatively little-discussed keyboard music, and particularly the two sets of archaising (and sometimes deeply moving) pieces for clavichord or piano, we're in a different world as far as my own reactions are concerned. My love for these pieces is surely second to none! It might be because, to me, this is Howells with more air injected, more punch and pungency, the same harmonic language but more bitingly, acidically applied - Ravel's violin and cello sonata compared to Daphnis; Debussy's late pieces compared to the Prelude/Faun...
Hmm, I have the following disc (on the left) which I have yet to listen to:

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51TT7Q56J6L._SL500_AA300_.jpg) (http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/510T09T118L._SL500_AA300_.jpg)

Is this the one that grabbed you, or are there others? The one to the right I had been eyeing, but yet to pull the trigger in light of the other disc being unlistened...
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Luke on June 19, 2010, 12:34:30 PM
I've seen the McCabe disc but never taken the plunge because, the thing is, I adore playing these pieces so much myself, at my own piano, and they feel so beautiful to play, intricate and knottily rewarding under the fingers (though they don't sound it) that I've never really felt the need to listen to a recording of someone else having all the fun! However, I do have a disc with a selection of them performed on the clavichord, Howells' alternative instrumentation. I also have a clavichord at home and play that too, so don't look for any logic in my behaviour! (Though my clavichord doens't have enough range to play some of the Howells pieces IIRC - maybe that's my excuse). This is wha I have:

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/417ocTP7hOL._SL500_AA300_.jpg)
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Luke on June 19, 2010, 12:44:31 PM
But give the McCabe CD a spin, I don't think you will regret it. Howells' Clavichord in particular is just divine, and deeply moving at times (such as Finzi's Rest, written the day after the death of his close friend), and the slower, more intense numbers in general are particularly rewarding, because Howells' gorgeous, false-relation-laden harmony has time to register fully - Goff's Fireside, Dart's Saraband, Andrew's Air, Rubbra's Soliloquy, Ralph's Pavane (with implied counterpoints to 'that' Tallis tenor), Malcolm's Vision, Julian's Dream....all just exquisite, sublte, magical little pieces. I also adore the Dyson number, with it's little quotation of his 'A Knight there was', and Patrick [Hadley]'s Siciliano, which is second cousin to Ravel' s Forlane (Le Tombeau de Couperin). Walton's Toye, meanwhile, spins away merrily as a tiny-scale clavichord's memory of WW's Crown Imperial (the opening harmonies are the same, in the same key...)
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Lethevich on June 19, 2010, 01:08:57 PM
I just bought seemingly the last affordable copy in the whole of the UK. I considered Amazon US for a moment until I remembered how low the pound had crashed in the past few years. Danke!

(Now, I wonder if I trust the guy who claims it is in VG condition :P I usually avoid secondhand discs like the plague, but I've had one previous great experience with a marketplace seller, at least).

Edit: I picked up the Paul, indeedie - sorry for the confusion. It is remarkable how under-recorded these works seem to be compared to, say, Bax, who has at least three or four complete piano music cycles recorded (random, to say the least - it's good music but not great). Howells on the other hand seems to have only three discs dedicated exclusively to him, and two of them (Paul/Centaur, Fingerhur/Chandos) seem either to be going out of print, or are badly out of print (the latter).
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Luke on June 19, 2010, 01:10:34 PM
I thought you said you had the McCabe, so do you mean the clavichord version? Hope you like it as much as I do!
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Guido on June 19, 2010, 03:24:47 PM
I read somewhere that Finzi's Rest was actually written either significantly before or after his death - I'll have to look it up - but it's Howells old sense of drama and occasion rearing its ugly head again - something that Finzi never liked about Howells.

I personally love Hymnus Paradisi. But when his heart isn't fully in it, Howells music can be exaltation by wrote which is a little depressing -  all these beautiful chords which try to capture some kind of religious ecstasy sound faked when the inspiration flags and it ends up being more theatrical than spiritual. So Hymnus Paradisi, his masterpiece is just superb, and the two follow up pieces - The Stabat Mater and Missa Sabrinensis are sort of depressing despite their magnificent grandiloquence and apparently noble intent.

The two cello works are the remains of a cello concerto that he never completed - as with almost everything else it was written in memory of his son. The Fantasia is too long and despite lovely moments needs better thematic material to sustain its span. The ravishing Threnody is more successful - just very very beautiful, though again the thematic material is not that strong.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Scarpia on June 19, 2010, 04:20:43 PM
Quote from: Guido on June 19, 2010, 03:24:47 PM
I read somewhere that Finzi's Rest was actually written either significantly before or after his death

Finzi wrote the piece significantly after his death?  I'm impressed.   8)
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Guido on June 19, 2010, 05:00:42 PM
The piece is called Finzi's Rest and was written by Howells.  :)
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on June 19, 2010, 10:54:29 PM
Listened to the Threnody for Cello and Orch. This morning. I preferred it to the Fantasia - very poignant and sad. First thing Howells worked on after the death of his child. Better still is the Pastoral Rhapsody - very much in the Delian/VW mould but more personal, I think than VW. Am enjoying discovering Howells' orchestral music. Apropos of nothing if any of you don't know Patrick Hadley's 'The Trees so High' you have to hear that.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Lethevich on June 19, 2010, 11:45:03 PM
I ended up getting that Chandos twofer after your incessent (:P) promotion of it. The Trees so High was excellent, Nadir I was slightly less keen on (preferring The Island for reasons I cannot recall), but I have plenty of time to change my mind.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on June 20, 2010, 12:24:18 AM
Quote from: Lethe on June 19, 2010, 11:45:03 PM
I ended up getting that Chandos twofer after your incessent (:P) promotion of it. The Trees so High was excellent, Nadir I was slightly less keen on (preferring The Island for reasons I cannot recall), but I have plenty of time to change my mind.

Well, I'm delighted that you bought the Chandos twofer - quite right too  ;D I'm listening to the Howells twofer today. Have played the Pastoral Rhapsody and Procession, with pleasure, several times. Raid's Symphony is another highlight of that twofer series (Estonian Music collection - with some fine lyrical works by Eller).
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Mirror Image on June 22, 2010, 09:49:23 PM
I'm quite fond of Howells' music mainly his orchestral music, which seems to be ecilipsed by his choral music. Richard Hickox was a strong advocate of Howells music. Howells obviously was very influenced by his teacher RVW, but he seemed to take his music in a very different direction. Alot of his music is just so lyrically beautiful. Gerald Finzi and John Ireland are two other English composers who seem to have fallen under RVW's spell.

I think two of the finest English composers after RVW are Edmund Rubbra and William Alwyn. Both of these composers seem to be overshadowed by Bax, Ireland, Finzi, and Arnold, but make no mistake about it Rubbra and Alwyn are amazing as well.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on June 23, 2010, 01:48:01 AM
Quote from: Mirror Image on June 22, 2010, 09:49:23 PM
I'm quite fond of Howells' music mainly his orchestral music, which seems to be ecilipsed by his choral music. Richard Hickox was a strong advocate of Howells music. Howells obviously was very influenced by his teacher RVW, but he seemed to take his music in a very different direction. Alot of his music is just so lyrically beautiful. Gerald Finzi and John Ireland are two other English composers who seem to have fallen under RVW's spell.

I think two of the finest English composers after RVW are Edmund Rubbra and William Alwyn. Both of these composers seem to be overshadowed by Bax, Ireland, Finzi, and Arnold, but make no mistake about it Rubbra and Alwyn are amazing as well.

I agree about Rubbra and Alwyn, especially Rubbra's symphonies 4,5 and 7 and Alwyn's Second Symphony - all fine works.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Mirror Image on June 24, 2010, 03:23:16 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on June 23, 2010, 01:48:01 AM
I agree about Rubbra and Alwyn, especially Rubbra's symphonies 4,5 and 7 and Alwyn's Second Symphony - all fine works.

My favorite Alwyn symphony is the 4th. The last movement is especially moving.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Mirror Image on February 22, 2012, 03:02:01 PM
I thought I would resurrect this thread by saying how much I really admire Howells' music. I heard a movement from Hymnus Paradisi a few days ago and was moved by it, so I ordered two recordings of it: Handley and Hickox.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on August 26, 2012, 01:26:53 PM
Really looking forward to Hymnus Paradisi at the proms on Wednesday. The only prom I'll get to this year as I was away for the all Vaughan Williams prom. Hymnus Paradisi is more suited to a cathedral than a concert hall but I'm hoping that it will work better at the Albert Hall than it did at the Festival Hall where I last heard in live (in the presence of the composer) many years ago. It is sharing a programme with Elgar Symphony No 1 and it should be a good evening.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on August 30, 2012, 02:25:49 PM
Hymnus Paradisi was wonderful at the Albert Hall last night - its first ever outing at the Proms, which surprised me. It worked much better at the Albert Hall, as the echoey acoustic suited it much more than did that of the Festival Hall, where I last heard it live, decades ago, in the presence of the composer.

Elgar's 1st Symphony was very fine too - a great concert.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Karl Henning on August 30, 2012, 03:41:02 PM
Excellent, Jeffrey!
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on September 01, 2012, 11:22:57 PM
Thank you Karl :)
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: calyptorhynchus on March 01, 2014, 08:57:59 PM
I was just listening to John McCabe playing Lambert's Clavichord and Howell's Clavichord on Hyperion (as far as I know the only recording). Has it struck anyone else that he plays many of the pieces too fast (to squeeze them all on to one disk?). I haven't listened to the this disk for some years and this is impression I came away with today.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Cato on January 24, 2015, 03:27:13 PM
A reference to the Hymnus Paradisi in an article about Schubert led me to this very positive review of a fairly new CD:

http://audaud.com/2014/10/herbert-howells-the-complete-works-for-violin-and-piano-tracklist-follows-rupert-marshall-luck-violin-matthew-rickard-p-emr-records/ (http://audaud.com/2014/10/herbert-howells-the-complete-works-for-violin-and-piano-tracklist-follows-rupert-marshall-luck-violin-matthew-rickard-p-emr-records/)

[asin]B00JDCZZ42[/asin]
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on January 24, 2015, 10:54:16 PM
Quote from: Cato on January 24, 2015, 03:27:13 PM
A reference to the Hymnus Paradisi in an article about Schubert led me to this very positive review of a fairly new CD:

http://audaud.com/2014/10/herbert-howells-the-complete-works-for-violin-and-piano-tracklist-follows-rupert-marshall-luck-violin-matthew-rickard-p-emr-records/ (http://audaud.com/2014/10/herbert-howells-the-complete-works-for-violin-and-piano-tracklist-follows-rupert-marshall-luck-violin-matthew-rickard-p-emr-records/)

[asin]B00JDCZZ42[/asin]

Looks interesting. All of his music is worthwhile in my view.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Rons_talking on January 26, 2015, 03:54:53 AM
Quote from: Mirror Image on February 22, 2012, 03:02:01 PM
I thought I would resurrect this thread by saying how much I really admire Howells' music. I heard a movement from Hymnus Paradisi a few days ago and was moved by it, so I ordered two recordings of it: Handley and Hickox.

I'm listening to the Hickox recording right now. It's my first time hearing the Hymnus Paradisi. It's so full of warmth and beauty. It's taken way too long for this to be my first listen.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on January 26, 2015, 04:16:28 AM
Quote from: Rons_talking on January 26, 2015, 03:54:53 AM
I'm listening to the Hickox recording right now. It's my first time hearing the Hymnus Paradisi. It's so full of warmth and beauty. It's taken way too long for this to be my first listen.

Oh, it's terrific - a wonderful and deeply moving work. The Willcocks recording is worth hearing too.
[asin]B000026BZL[/asin]
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Cato on January 26, 2015, 04:28:49 AM
Here is the Hickox/BBC Symphony Orchestra performance, with the score, on YouTube:

https://www.youtube.com/v/ILiyzlJqYaU
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Scion7 on March 27, 2016, 06:23:53 AM
Just now starting to get into the man's chamber pieces.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on March 27, 2016, 11:41:55 AM
Quote from: Scion7 on March 27, 2016, 06:23:53 AM
Just now starting to get into the man's chamber pieces.
Do you know his choral/orchestral score 'Hymnus Paradisi' - one of the most moving works known to me!
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Scion7 on March 27, 2016, 05:07:43 PM
He's been sort of in the background on the occasional radio listen to me, before now.  I will be checking him out all next week - so far, I like what he's done very much.  Had to spend my Easter giftee somehow.   :P
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Scion7 on March 28, 2016, 05:47:58 AM
Well, the violin sonatas are quite nice - even the early 1911 in b-minor at over 40 minutes holds together well - it's not the constant invention of Beethoven's or Brahms' but it's good.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Mirror Image on March 28, 2016, 06:20:55 AM
For me, there are two works of Howells' that spring immediately to mind that are personal favorites and both of them written in what must have been some trying times for the composer: Threnody and Elegy. If you don't know these works, Scion7, then do check them out.

Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Scion7 on March 28, 2016, 07:50:42 AM
Quote from: Mirror Image on March 28, 2016, 06:20:55 AMIf you don't know these works, Scion7, then do check them out.

Well, this is the "acquire" list - for most composers, I tend to grab as much of their instrumental work, at least, as I can, and some choice choral bits.  Some of the unpublished stuff has been assembled and arranged by the recording artists - thankfully.

orchestral
Pf Conc. no.1, c, op.4, 1913, unpubd;
The B's, suite, op.13, 1914, unpubd;
3 Dances, op.7, vn, orch, 1915;
Puck's Minuet, op.20 no.1, 1917;
Suite, op.16, str orch, 1917, unpubd;
Elegy, op.15, va, str qt, str orch, 1917;
Thé dansant, 1919, lost;
Merry Eye, op.20 no.2, 1920;
Procession, op.36, 1922;
Pastoral Rhapsody, 1923, unpubd;
Pf Conc. no.2, op.39, 1925, unpubd;
Paradise Rondel, op.40, 1925, unpubd;
In Green Ways, 1928;
Mother's Here (incid music), 1929, collab. G. Jacob, lost;
Penguinski (ballet), 1933, unpubd;
Pageantry, suite, brass band, 1934;
King's Herald, 1937, unpubd [1st movt of Pageantry, arr. orch];
Fantasia, vc, orch, 1937;
Hymnus Paradisi for soprano, tenor, chorus & orchestra, 1938 ;
Threnody, vc, orch, late 1930s, orch C. Palmer, 1992;
Conc. for str, 1938;
Folk Tune Set, 1940, unpubd;
First Suite, str, 1942;
Second Suite, str, 1942, lost;
Fanfare for Schools, brass, timp, str, 1943, unpubd;
Music for a Prince, 1948, unpubd: Corydon's Dance, Scherzo in Arden;
3 Figures: Tryptych, brass band, 1960;
Fanfare to Lead into the National Anthem, brass, perc, org, 1977

chamber
3 or more insts: Variations for 11 solo insts, op.3, c1913, lost;
Sonata in b-minor for vn, pn, 1911;
Lady Audrey's Suite, op.19, str qt, 1915;
Piano Quartet, a, op.21, 1916;
Phantasy Str Qt, op.25, 1916–17;
In Gloucestershire (str qt no.3), 1916–c1935 [1st version lost, rev. 1920, final version early 1930s];
Rhapsodic Qnt, op.31, cl, str, 1919;
The Old Mole, pf qnt, 1937, unpubd [folktune arr.];
Hunsdon House, pf qnt, 1937, unpubd [arr.]
1–2 insts: Sonata, b, vn, pf, 1911, unpubd;
Comedy Suite, op.8, cl, pf, c1913, lost;
Prelude no.1, hp, 1915, unpubd;
3 Pieces, op.28, vn, pf, 1917: Pastorale, 'Chosen' Tune, Luchinushka;
Damsons, vn, pf, c1917, unpubd;
Sonata no.1, E, op.18, vn, pf, 1917–19;
Sonata no.2, E, op.26, vn, pf, 1917, unpubd;
Cradle Song, vn, pf, 1918, unpubd;
Sonata no.3, e, op.38, vn, pf, 1923;
A Country Tune, vn, pf, c1925;
A Croon, vn, pf, c1925;
Slow Air, vn, pf, c1927;
Lambert's Clavichord (3 transcrs), vc, pf, 1929;
Sonata, ob, pf, 1942;
Minuet (grace for a fresh egg), bn, pf, 1945;
Sonata, cl, pf, 1946;
A Near Minuet, cl, pf, 1946;
2 Pieces, fl, vn, unpubd:
Air, Alla Menuetto;
Lento, assai espressivo, vn, pf, unpubd

keyboard
Organ: Sonata, c, op.1, 1911; Phantasy Ground Bass, c1915, lost; 3 Psalm-Preludes set 1, op.32, 1915–16; Rhapsody, op.17 no.1, 1915; Rhapsody, op.17 no.2, 1918; Rhapsody, op.17 no.3, 1918; Sonata (no.2), 1932; 3 Psalm-Preludes set 2, 1938–39; Fugue, Chorale and Epilogue, 1939; Master Tallis's Testament, 1940; Preludio Sine nomine, 1940; Saraband for the Morning of Easter, 1940; Paean, 1940; Intrata (no.2), 1941; Saraband In Modo Elegiaco, 1945; Siciliano for a High Ceremony, 1952; Prelude De profundis, 1958; Rhapsody no.4, 1958; 2 Pieces, 1959: Dalby's Fancy, Dalby's Toccata; A Flourish for a Bidding, 1969; Partita, 1971–2; Epilogue, c1971; St Louis comes to Clifton, 1977; 6 Short Pieces (1987); 2 Slow Airs (1987); Miniatures (1993)
Pianoforte: 4 Romantic Pieces, 1908, unpubd [only no.2 extant]; Marching song, 1909, unpubd; Summer Idylls, 1911, unpubd; Minuet, a, c1915, unpubd; Snapshots, op.30, 1916–18; Phantasie, 1917, unpubd; Sarum Sketches, op.6, 1917; Procession, op.14 no.1, 1918; Phantasy Minuet, op.27, pianola, 1919; Rhapsody, op.14 no.2, 1919; Jackanapes, op.14 no.3, 1919; The Chosen Tune, 1920; Once upon a time ..., suite (London, 1920); Gadabout, c1922; A Mersey Tune, 1924; 2 Pieces, 1926: Slow Dance, Cobler's Hornpipe; Country Pageant (London, 1928); A Little Book of Dances (London, 1928); A Sailor Tune (London, 1930); O Mensch bewein dein Sünde gross (arr. Bach: Chorale prelude,bwv 622); Triumph Tune, 1934, arr. 2 pf, 1941, unpubd; Promenade for Boys (London, 1938); Promenade for Girls (London, 1938); Minuet, 1939, unpubd; Polka, 2 pf, c1939; Puck's Minuet, 2 pf, c1941, unpubd [arr. of 2 Pieces for Small Orch, op.20 no.1]; Musica Sine Nomine, 1959; Pavane and Galliard, 1964, unpubd; Et nunc et semper, 1967, unpubd; Petrus Suite, 1967–73, unpubd; H-plus-H gavotte, 1970, unpubd; Sonatina, 1971
Clavichord: Lambert's Clavichord, op.41, 1926–7; Howells' Clavichord, 1941–61; My Lady Harewood's Pavane, 1949, My Lord Harewood's Galliard, 1949; Finzi: his rest, 1956
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Scion7 on March 29, 2016, 07:23:49 AM
Well, I find his piano pieces better than his organ work (which he seems to be more well-known) - they are mostly too ... static?  No.3 of the Six Pieces for Organ is pretty good, though.  The Sonata for Organ was not what I expected from this guy at all.

But all the piano music I've heard has been entertaining.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Oates on March 03, 2018, 12:43:04 AM
Quote from: Scion7 on March 28, 2016, 07:50:42 AM
Well, this is the "acquire" list - for most composers, I tend to grab as much of their instrumental work, at least, as I can, and some choice choral bits.  Some of the unpublished stuff has been assembled and arranged by the recording artists - thankfully.

orchestral
Pf Conc. no.1, c, op.4, 1913, unpubd;
The B's, suite, op.13, 1914, unpubd;
3 Dances, op.7, vn, orch, 1915;
Puck's Minuet, op.20 no.1, 1917;
Suite, op.16, str orch, 1917, unpubd;
Elegy, op.15, va, str qt, str orch, 1917;
Thé dansant, 1919, lost;
Merry Eye, op.20 no.2, 1920;
Procession, op.36, 1922;
Pastoral Rhapsody, 1923, unpubd;
Pf Conc. no.2, op.39, 1925, unpubd;
Paradise Rondel, op.40, 1925, unpubd;
In Green Ways, 1928;
Mother's Here (incid music), 1929, collab. G. Jacob, lost;
Penguinski (ballet), 1933, unpubd;
Pageantry, suite, brass band, 1934;
King's Herald, 1937, unpubd [1st movt of Pageantry, arr. orch];
Fantasia, vc, orch, 1937;
Hymnus Paradisi for soprano, tenor, chorus & orchestra, 1938 ;
Threnody, vc, orch, late 1930s, orch C. Palmer, 1992;
Conc. for str, 1938;
Folk Tune Set, 1940, unpubd;
First Suite, str, 1942;
Second Suite, str, 1942, lost;
Fanfare for Schools, brass, timp, str, 1943, unpubd;
Music for a Prince, 1948, unpubd: Corydon's Dance, Scherzo in Arden;
3 Figures: Tryptych, brass band, 1960;
Fanfare to Lead into the National Anthem, brass, perc, org, 1977

chamber
3 or more insts: Variations for 11 solo insts, op.3, c1913, lost;
Sonata in b-minor for vn, pn, 1911;
Lady Audrey's Suite, op.19, str qt, 1915;
Piano Quartet, a, op.21, 1916;
Phantasy Str Qt, op.25, 1916–17;
In Gloucestershire (str qt no.3), 1916–c1935 [1st version lost, rev. 1920, final version early 1930s];
Rhapsodic Qnt, op.31, cl, str, 1919;
The Old Mole, pf qnt, 1937, unpubd [folktune arr.];
Hunsdon House, pf qnt, 1937, unpubd [arr.]
1–2 insts: Sonata, b, vn, pf, 1911, unpubd;
Comedy Suite, op.8, cl, pf, c1913, lost;
Prelude no.1, hp, 1915, unpubd;
3 Pieces, op.28, vn, pf, 1917: Pastorale, 'Chosen' Tune, Luchinushka;
Damsons, vn, pf, c1917, unpubd;
Sonata no.1, E, op.18, vn, pf, 1917–19;
Sonata no.2, E, op.26, vn, pf, 1917, unpubd;
Cradle Song, vn, pf, 1918, unpubd;
Sonata no.3, e, op.38, vn, pf, 1923;
A Country Tune, vn, pf, c1925;
A Croon, vn, pf, c1925;
Slow Air, vn, pf, c1927;
Lambert's Clavichord (3 transcrs), vc, pf, 1929;
Sonata, ob, pf, 1942;
Minuet (grace for a fresh egg), bn, pf, 1945;
Sonata, cl, pf, 1946;
A Near Minuet, cl, pf, 1946;
2 Pieces, fl, vn, unpubd:
Air, Alla Menuetto;
Lento, assai espressivo, vn, pf, unpubd

keyboard
Organ: Sonata, c, op.1, 1911; Phantasy Ground Bass, c1915, lost; 3 Psalm-Preludes set 1, op.32, 1915–16; Rhapsody, op.17 no.1, 1915; Rhapsody, op.17 no.2, 1918; Rhapsody, op.17 no.3, 1918; Sonata (no.2), 1932; 3 Psalm-Preludes set 2, 1938–39; Fugue, Chorale and Epilogue, 1939; Master Tallis's Testament, 1940; Preludio Sine nomine, 1940; Saraband for the Morning of Easter, 1940; Paean, 1940; Intrata (no.2), 1941; Saraband In Modo Elegiaco, 1945; Siciliano for a High Ceremony, 1952; Prelude De profundis, 1958; Rhapsody no.4, 1958; 2 Pieces, 1959: Dalby's Fancy, Dalby's Toccata; A Flourish for a Bidding, 1969; Partita, 1971–2; Epilogue, c1971; St Louis comes to Clifton, 1977; 6 Short Pieces (1987); 2 Slow Airs (1987); Miniatures (1993)
Pianoforte: 4 Romantic Pieces, 1908, unpubd [only no.2 extant]; Marching song, 1909, unpubd; Summer Idylls, 1911, unpubd; Minuet, a, c1915, unpubd; Snapshots, op.30, 1916–18; Phantasie, 1917, unpubd; Sarum Sketches, op.6, 1917; Procession, op.14 no.1, 1918; Phantasy Minuet, op.27, pianola, 1919; Rhapsody, op.14 no.2, 1919; Jackanapes, op.14 no.3, 1919; The Chosen Tune, 1920; Once upon a time ..., suite (London, 1920); Gadabout, c1922; A Mersey Tune, 1924; 2 Pieces, 1926: Slow Dance, Cobler's Hornpipe; Country Pageant (London, 1928); A Little Book of Dances (London, 1928); A Sailor Tune (London, 1930); O Mensch bewein dein Sünde gross (arr. Bach: Chorale prelude,bwv 622); Triumph Tune, 1934, arr. 2 pf, 1941, unpubd; Promenade for Boys (London, 1938); Promenade for Girls (London, 1938); Minuet, 1939, unpubd; Polka, 2 pf, c1939; Puck's Minuet, 2 pf, c1941, unpubd [arr. of 2 Pieces for Small Orch, op.20 no.1]; Musica Sine Nomine, 1959; Pavane and Galliard, 1964, unpubd; Et nunc et semper, 1967, unpubd; Petrus Suite, 1967–73, unpubd; H-plus-H gavotte, 1970, unpubd; Sonatina, 1971
Clavichord: Lambert's Clavichord, op.41, 1926–7; Howells' Clavichord, 1941–61; My Lady Harewood's Pavane, 1949, My Lord Harewood's Galliard, 1949; Finzi: his rest, 1956

This impressive list misses a real gem. Sine Nomine (1922) is a substantial (12m) orchestral fantasia with wordless chorus, in Howells' most sublime pastoral mode - its title suggests it is part of Howells' church / choral canon but this is misleading - it should be seen as a key part of the his (too slender) orchestral output. 

I only know of one recording (and it is stunning):

https://www.naxos.com/catalogue/item.asp?item_code=8.573176

I've just discovered this by accident and am delighted and enthralled.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: calyptorhynchus on March 03, 2018, 07:34:09 PM
Thanks for alerting me to Sine Nomine, I hadn't known this work. Very reminiscent of the slow movement of Nielsen's Sinfonia Espansiva, but I don't think this was known in London c 1920 so Howells probably came up with idea himself.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on March 04, 2018, 01:48:35 AM
Coincidentally had just been enjoying the Sonata for Clarinet and Piano (1946) and the early Prelude for Harp (1915) and the moving and eloquent Sonata for Violin and Piano (1923). All are on a Naxos CD.

Here's the short Harp Prelude:
https://youtu.be/dW5OxSiXE2s
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Oates on March 04, 2018, 05:50:58 AM
Another overlooked gem is the orchestral version of the Oboe Sonata recorded here:

https://www.champshillrecords.co.uk/cddetail.php?cat_number=CHRCD025
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: 71 dB on November 08, 2018, 11:39:51 AM
Wow, just listened to Hymnus Paradisi (Willcocks) for the first time and I'm digging it a lot! Such a magical work! I'm enjoying the Concerto for String Orchestra too, so Howells seems very interesting composer to explore.  :)
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on November 08, 2018, 11:58:04 AM
I've enjoyed the concerto for string orchestra, and the piano concerto even more. I also love the clarinet sonata that vandermolen mentions above (I have a Hyperion recording with Thea King).
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: 71 dB on November 08, 2018, 12:11:55 PM
Damn, the CD doesn't work during the last minute. Scratches. I try toothpaste.  :P
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on November 08, 2018, 03:09:27 PM
Quote from: 71 dB on November 08, 2018, 11:39:51 AM
Wow, just listened to Hymnus Paradisi (Willcocks) for the first time and I'm digging it a lot! Such a magical work! I'm enjoying the Concerto for String Orchestra too, so Howells seems very interesting composer to explore.  :)

It's an out and out masterpiece and intensely moving in view of the circumstances of its composition. The Willcock's is the best version.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: relm1 on November 08, 2018, 04:38:55 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 08, 2018, 03:09:27 PM
It's an out and out masterpiece and intensely moving in view of the circumstances of its composition. The Willcock's is the best version.

I think Howells is a very fine composer and educator having taught impressive composers.  I believe he was just overshadowed by the more flamboyant Walton and RVW's shadow.  I believe he wrote a symphony that is excellent (but I might be remembering this incorrectly and am thinking of another composer).
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: calyptorhynchus on November 08, 2018, 10:57:23 PM
Quote from: relm1 on November 08, 2018, 04:38:55 PM
I think Howells is a very fine composer and educator having taught impressive composers.....

He taught Robert Simpson  ;D
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on November 08, 2018, 11:20:59 PM
Quote from: relm1 on November 08, 2018, 04:38:55 PM
I think Howells is a very fine composer and educator having taught impressive composers.  I believe he was just overshadowed by the more flamboyant Walton and RVW's shadow.  I believe he wrote a symphony that is excellent (but I might be remembering this incorrectly and am thinking of another composer).

That's interesting - I don't know of a symphony unless he withdrew it at some point. I'd love to hear a symphony by Howells.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Irons on November 09, 2018, 01:10:57 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 08, 2018, 11:20:59 PM
That's interesting - I don't know of a symphony unless he withdrew it at some point. I'd love to hear a symphony by Howells.

Not a symphony but the three movement Concerto for String Orchestra is fairly close. With Howells as you wrote in the introduction to this thread the loss of his son had a devastating affect (I did not know it was polio which adds extra poignancy as I had that as a kid during the epidemic. I was a lucky one!). The moving slow movement of this work has a dedication to his son - "In memoriam E.E. (1934) and M.K.H. (1935)".

(https://i.imgur.com/cOAGJtP.jpg)
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Biffo on November 09, 2018, 01:53:22 AM
There is also a Suite for String Orchestra (1942). It is in four movements and loosely follows the outline of a symphony. It has been recorded on Chandos by Richard Hickox and the City of London Sinfonia
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on November 09, 2018, 02:48:48 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 09, 2018, 01:10:57 AM
Not a symphony but the three movement Concerto for String Orchestra is fairly close. With Howells as you wrote in the introduction to this thread the loss of his son had a devastating affect (I did not know it was polio which adds extra poignancy as I had that as a kid during the epidemic. I was a lucky one!). The moving slow movement of this work has a dedication to his son - "In memoriam E.E. (1934) and M.K.H. (1935)".

(https://i.imgur.com/cOAGJtP.jpg)

Thanks - I must listen to that work by Howells again. I remember the LP.
I can imagine the poignancy of these works for you in view of your own personal history.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: relm1 on November 09, 2018, 06:16:00 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 08, 2018, 11:20:59 PM
That's interesting - I don't know of a symphony unless he withdrew it at some point. I'd love to hear a symphony by Howells.

I was mistaken.  The composer I was thinking of and confused with Howells was his contemporary Harold Truscott.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on November 09, 2018, 10:49:57 AM
Quote from: relm1 on November 09, 2018, 06:16:00 AM
I was mistaken.  The composer I was thinking of and confused with Howells was his contemporary Harold Truscott.

I really like Truscott's Symphony.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: 71 dB on November 10, 2018, 05:36:05 AM
After struggling a bit with RVW I turned to Howells, a composer I have totally ignored until now. The only Howells work I have had (for 2 decades!) is his Psalm Preludes (1st set), Op. 32 but only recently noticed it's nice. Vandermolen inspired to get the Hymnus Paradisi/Concerto for Orchestra disc which I really like even if the last minute of the scratched disc doesn't play despite of toothpaste treatment.  :-X

So I explore Howells more. Now streaming Stabat Mater (Naxos) on Spotify and liking it! Just like Finzi, Howells seems to have a bit "Elgarism" in his music. It's some kind of underlying complexity, tension, organic fluidity and warm humanism I love so much in Elgar's music.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on November 10, 2018, 06:34:25 AM
Quote from: 71 dB on November 10, 2018, 05:36:05 AM
After struggling a bit with RVW I turned to Howells, a composer I have totally ignored until now. The only Howells work I have had (for 2 decades!) is his Psalm Preludes (1st set), Op. 32 but only recently noticed it's nice. Vandermolen inspired to get the Hymnus Paradisi/Concerto for Orchestra disc which I really like even if the last minute of the scratched disc doesn't play despite of toothpaste treatment.  :-X

So I explore Howells more. Now streaming Stabat Mater (Naxos) on Spotify and liking it! Just like Finzi, Howells seems to have a bit "Elgarism" in his music. It's some kind of underlying complexity, tension, organic fluidity and warm humanism I love so much in Elgar's music.

Good to know. You might enjoy the Missa Sabrinensis as well.

Please can you explain what is meant by 'toothpaste treatment'.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: 71 dB on November 10, 2018, 06:46:00 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 10, 2018, 06:34:25 AM
Good to know. You might enjoy the Missa Sabrinensis as well.

Please can you explain what is meant by 'toothpaste treatment'.

Thanks. Now listening to Sir Patrick Spens and liking it. Te Deum and Sine Nomine were good too. Seems I like everything by Howells.  :P

Toothpaste treatment is reparing scrathy CDs with toothpaste. It works well if the damage isn't very bad, for example the CD skips in one place. You put normal white tootpaste on the scrathed point on the disc and let it dry 10-15 minutes after which you rub the tootpaste with your wet finger with force and clean the disc.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on November 10, 2018, 09:40:48 AM
Quote from: 71 dB on November 10, 2018, 06:46:00 AM
Thanks. Now listening to Sir Patrick Spens and liking it. Te Deum and Sine Nomine were good too. Seems I like everything by Howells.  :P

Toothpaste treatment is reparing scrathy CDs with toothpaste. It works well if the damage isn't very bad, for example the CD skips in one place. You put normal white tootpaste on the scrathed point on the disc and let it dry 10-15 minutes after which you rub the tootpaste with your wet finger with force and clean the disc.

Thanks for the explanation - can't wait to try it out  8)

I think that Howells is closer to Elgar than VW. You obviously have the Naxos version of Hymnus Paradisi which is excellent. Howells's 'Collegium Regale' is very highly regarded as well.

Here it is (historic recording):

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=CMBm9ZkmHFQ
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: 71 dB on November 10, 2018, 09:59:46 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 10, 2018, 09:40:48 AM
Thanks for the explanation - can't wait to try it out  8)
You're welcome Good luck!

Quote from: vandermolen on November 10, 2018, 09:40:48 AMI think that Howells is closer to Elgar than VW. You obviously have the Naxos version of Hymnus Paradisi which is excellent. Howells's 'Collegium Regale' is very highly regarded as well.

Here it is (historic recording):

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=CMBm9ZkmHFQ

I actually have the Willcocks version on EMI, but I might collect the Naxos discs since Howells seems to be to my liking this much.  :)

'Collegium Regale' appears very nice, althou the sound quality is "below my standards"  ;D
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on November 10, 2018, 01:16:26 PM
Quote from: 71 dB on November 10, 2018, 09:59:46 AM
You're welcome Good luck!

I actually have the Willcocks version on EMI, but I might collect the Naxos discs since Howells seems to be to my liking this much.  :)

'Collegium Regale' appears very nice, althou the sound quality is "below my standards"  ;D

The Willcocks is my favourite version (I have them all  ::)).

There are many modern recordings of Collegium Regale.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: 71 dB on November 10, 2018, 02:11:36 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 10, 2018, 01:16:26 PM
The Willcocks is my favourite version (I have them all  ::)).

That's why I bought it (I have to say I love EMI's British Composers cover art and that helped too  ;D ).

Quote from: vandermolen on November 10, 2018, 01:16:26 PMThere are many modern recordings of Collegium Regale.

Sure!  0:)
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on November 10, 2018, 02:27:02 PM
Quote from: 71 dB on November 10, 2018, 02:11:36 PM
That's why I bought it (I have to say I love EMI's British Composers cover art and that helped too  ;D ).

Sure!  0:)

Do you have the CD coupled with Dies Natalis or Music for Strings?
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: 71 dB on November 11, 2018, 01:32:34 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 10, 2018, 02:27:02 PM
Do you have the CD coupled with Dies Natalis or Music for Strings?

Music for Strings (the last minute of that work doesn't play). I have that Finzi's Dies Natalis on another disc that has also works by RVW and Holst. So I have these:

[asin]B000026BZL[/asin]
[asin]B000005GSD[/asin]
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on November 11, 2018, 08:59:37 AM
Quote from: 71 dB on November 11, 2018, 01:32:34 AM
Music for Strings (the last minute of that work doesn't play). I have that Finzi's Dies Natalis on another disc that has also works by RVW and Holst. So I have these:

[asin]B000026BZL[/asin]
[asin]B000005GSD[/asin]

Both terrific CDs - amongst my very favourites.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: 71 dB on November 11, 2018, 10:17:17 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 11, 2018, 08:59:37 AM
Both terrific CDs - amongst my very favourites.

Sound quality of course not the cleanest "21st century digital audio", but otherwise I agree. Very very good performances.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: SymphonicAddict on November 11, 2018, 08:13:33 PM
My curiosity was piked by the conversation, so I sampled some tracks from this CD, especifically St. Paul's Service:

(https://www.hyperion-records.co.uk/thumbs_550/034571179148.png)

How awe-inspiring this is! The choir sings with such an intensity and beauty that is difficult not to be moved. I'm really delighted by this heavenly music. I'll have to investigate further this composer.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on November 11, 2018, 09:44:51 PM
Quote from: SymphonicAddict on November 11, 2018, 08:13:33 PM
My curiosity was piked by the conversation, so I sampled some tracks from this CD, especifically St. Paul's Service:

(https://www.hyperion-records.co.uk/thumbs_550/034571179148.png)

How awe-inspiring this is! The choir sings with such an intensity and beauty that is difficult not to be moved. I'm really delighted by this heavenly music. I'll have to investigate further this composer.

Glad you liked it Cesar. His music is always worth hearing I think. Do you know Hymnus Paradisi? His masterpiece I think.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Roasted Swan on November 11, 2018, 11:17:06 PM
I would agree with Vandermolen that Howells' "Hymnus" is probably his finest work but do listen to his chamber music as well.  The interesting thing with Howells is that he was considered one of the brightest of his generation at music college but after the tragedy of his son's death his music became much more inward and centred on the church and vocal music on which his current fame rests.  The is a new Naxos disc due out which features some of the chamber music including the 1st recording of a fantastic piece for string quartet called "Lady Audrey's Suite".  Its a much more substantial and impressive work than the title (and movement titles) would suggest
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on November 12, 2018, 06:19:03 AM
Quote from: Roasted Swan on November 11, 2018, 11:17:06 PM
I would agree with Vandermolen that Howells' "Hymnus" is probably his finest work but do listen to his chamber music as well.  The interesting thing with Howells is that he was considered one of the brightest of his generation at music college but after the tragedy of his son's death his music became much more inward and centred on the church and vocal music on which his current fame rests.  The is a new Naxos disc due out which features some of the chamber music including the 1st recording of a fantastic piece for string quartet called "Lady Audrey's Suite".  Its a much more substantial and impressive work than the title (and movement titles) would suggest

Well, I shall keep my eye out for that. Thanks for alerting us to it. I know little of the chamber music although I greatly admire the Sonata No.1 for Violin and Piano (1917-19), described, accurately I think, by its original reviewers as a 'contemplation' in music rather than a sonata.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Irons on November 12, 2018, 06:38:12 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 12, 2018, 06:19:03 AM
Well, I shall keep my eye out for that. Thanks for alerting us to it. I know little of the chamber music although I greatly admire the Sonata No.1 for Violin and Piano (1917-19), described, accurately I think, by its original reviewers as a 'contemplation' in music rather than a sonata.

Lyrita - where would we be without British recordings by Lyrita - released on LP and I assume on CD too, Howells Piano Quartet, Fantasy String Quartet and (deep breath) Rhapsodic Quintet for Clarinet, Two Violins, Viola and Cello by the Richards Ensemble with Thea King (clarinet).
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: kyjo on November 14, 2018, 04:14:49 PM
The epic and gloriously ecstatic Missa Sabrinensis was a fantastic recent discovery of mine, easily comparable with Hymnus Paradisi.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on November 14, 2018, 09:43:59 PM
Quote from: kyjo on November 14, 2018, 04:14:49 PM
The epic and gloriously ecstatic Missa Sabrinensis was a fantastic recent discovery of mine, easily comparable with Hymnus Paradisi.
Glad you liked it Kyle. I must listen to it again soon as I have the Chandos recording.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: calyptorhynchus on November 15, 2018, 11:30:51 AM
Quote from: kyjo on November 14, 2018, 04:14:49 PM
The epic and gloriously ecstatic Missa Sabrinensis was a fantastic recent discovery of mine, easily comparable with Hymnus Paradisi.

This was my cue to dig out my copy. Not being a Christian I don't often listen to music with Christian texts (doesn't seem logical), but with the Missa Sabrinensis you can barely hear that it's a setting of the mass, it's more like a five movement 74 minute symphony with vocal and choral melismas. And it is very good, I'd say it probably has some of Howells' best music in it.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Maestro267 on November 15, 2018, 11:33:55 PM
I love all three of the major choral-orchestral works (Missa Sabrinensis, Hymnus Paradisi and Stabat Mater).
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: DaveF on March 07, 2019, 04:58:52 AM
Cross-posting from Super-Duper bargains thread: Priory Records have some special offers on box sets, including the complete Mags & Nuncs, and complete organ music: https://www.prioryrecords.co.uk/index.php?route=product/special.  Not all reviewers seem convinced by the Collegiate Singers - women's voices, insufficiently reverberant acoustic - but they sound good on Spotify to me.  And am I right in thinking these are the only recordings of some of the less-performed sets of canticles?
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on March 07, 2019, 10:05:07 AM
Quote from: calyptorhynchus on November 15, 2018, 11:30:51 AM
This was my cue to dig out my copy. Not being a Christian I don't often listen to music with Christian texts (doesn't seem logical), but with the Missa Sabrinensis you can barely hear that it's a setting of the mass, it's more like a five movement 74 minute symphony with vocal and choral melismas. And it is very good, I'd say it probably has some of Howells' best music in it.
I'm not a Christian either but I listen to a fair amount of choral music, including by Howells, with Christian texts but have never had a problem with this. Vaughan Williams was agnostic but wrote a fair amount of music featuring Christian texts. He called his Christian 'Pilgrim' in his 'The Pilgrim's Progress' to make it accessibly to everyone. Paradoxically Bloch, a Jewish composer, wanted his 'Sacred Service' to Jewish texts to be open to anyone of any religion or none.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: calyptorhynchus on March 07, 2019, 11:12:57 AM
Quote from: Roasted Swan on November 11, 2018, 11:17:06 PM
I would agree with Vandermolen that Howells' "Hymnus" is probably his finest work but do listen to his chamber music as well.  The interesting thing with Howells is that he was considered one of the brightest of his generation at music college but after the tragedy of his son's death his music became much more inward and centred on the church and vocal music on which his current fame rests.  The is a new Naxos disc due out which features some of the chamber music including the 1st recording of a fantastic piece for string quartet called "Lady Audrey's Suite".  Its a much more substantial and impressive work than the title (and movement titles) would suggest
Has this disk appeared? I can't find any trace of it.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Roasted Swan on March 07, 2019, 11:28:49 AM
Quote from: calyptorhynchus on March 07, 2019, 11:12:57 AM
Has this disk appeared? I can't find any trace of it.

Due to appear very soon I think.  On the Facebook Howells group page someone involved in the disc's production was mentioning it and saying how good it was.....
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on March 07, 2019, 01:21:42 PM
Quote from: Roasted Swan on March 07, 2019, 11:28:49 AM
Due to appear very soon I think.  On the Facebook Howells group page someone involved in the disc's production was mentioning it and saying how good it was.....
Oh thanks. Must look out for that one.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Symphonic Addict on May 27, 2020, 02:23:08 PM
A new recording of Missa Sabrinensis:

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-KnYPo0F2iiM/Xrqf5Fe1YXI/AAAAAAAAHZg/3N2GyZQ6yfQsP_PYMQ1WRcJBtYewfqe7gCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/Howells%2BMissa%2BSabrinensis%2BMichael%2BFanfare%2B.jpg)
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: kyjo on May 27, 2020, 04:24:11 PM
Quote from: Symphonic Addict on May 27, 2020, 02:23:08 PM
A new recording of Missa Sabrinensis:

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-KnYPo0F2iiM/Xrqf5Fe1YXI/AAAAAAAAHZg/3N2GyZQ6yfQsP_PYMQ1WRcJBtYewfqe7gCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/Howells%2BMissa%2BSabrinensis%2BMichael%2BFanfare%2B.jpg)

Wonderful! It's such an ecstatically glorious work, less concise than Hymnus Paradisi but often reaching the same exalted levels of inspiration as that masterwork.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: JohnP on May 28, 2020, 04:33:29 AM
Howell's beautiful King David from YouTube:

https://youtu.be/rN2Jz1vvlHY
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: calyptorhynchus on July 20, 2020, 11:05:24 PM
A disk of Howells' previously unrecorded piano music:

(https://d1iiivw74516uk.cloudfront.net/eyJidWNrZXQiOiJwcmVzdG8tY292ZXItaW1hZ2VzIiwia2V5IjoiODc5MTI2My4xLmpwZyIsImVkaXRzIjp7InJlc2l6ZSI6eyJ3aWR0aCI6MzAwfSwianBlZyI6eyJxdWFsaXR5Ijo2NX0sInRvRm9ybWF0IjoianBlZyJ9LCJ0aW1lc3RhbXAiOjE1OTI4OTUzMTd9)

Here there is a piece called "Finzi: His Rest" which is a distinct piece from the well-known "Finzi's Rest". Apparently the story is that this latter piece was a pre-existing one that Howells revised on the day he heard of Finzi's death and published in Howells' Clavichord, but the  piece recorded here was actually a new one written that same day.

All the pieces are very good. I'm looking forward to volume 2.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Irons on July 22, 2020, 07:35:53 AM
Quote from: calyptorhynchus on July 20, 2020, 11:05:24 PM
A disk of Howells' previously unrecorded piano music:

(https://d1iiivw74516uk.cloudfront.net/eyJidWNrZXQiOiJwcmVzdG8tY292ZXItaW1hZ2VzIiwia2V5IjoiODc5MTI2My4xLmpwZyIsImVkaXRzIjp7InJlc2l6ZSI6eyJ3aWR0aCI6MzAwfSwianBlZyI6eyJxdWFsaXR5Ijo2NX0sInRvRm9ybWF0IjoianBlZyJ9LCJ0aW1lc3RhbXAiOjE1OTI4OTUzMTd9)

Here there is a piece called "Finzi: His Rest" which is a distinct piece from the well-known "Finzi's Rest". Apparently the story is that this latter piece was a pre-existing one that Howells revised on the day he heard of Finzi's death and published in Howells' Clavichord, but the  piece recorded here was actually a new one written that same day.

All the pieces are very good. I'm looking forward to volume 2.

Most interesting. Howells is a composer I warm to but not so keen on vocal music which does narrow the field. I will investigate that CD, thanks.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on July 22, 2020, 09:29:20 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 22, 2020, 07:35:53 AM
Most interesting. Howells is a composer I warm to but not so keen on vocal music which does narrow the field. I will investigate that CD, thanks.
Do you know Hymnus Paradisi Lol?
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Irons on July 23, 2020, 03:17:49 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on July 22, 2020, 09:29:20 AM
Do you know Hymnus Paradisi Lol?

I know of it Jeffrey, but I guess that is not what you are asking. :) Odd really as two of my "Desert Island" discs are vocal, Finzi's Dies Natalis and Britten's Serenade but I have an aversion to choirs and religion in music. Never say never and of course I will give Hymnus Paradisi a listen as I do like Howells.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on July 23, 2020, 03:28:00 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 23, 2020, 03:17:49 AM
I know of it Jeffrey, but I guess that is not what you are asking. :) Odd really as two of my "Desert Island" discs are vocal, Finzi's Dies Natalis and Britten's Serenade but I have an aversion to choirs and religion in music. Never say never and of course I will give Hymnus Paradisi a listen as I do like Howells.
This is one of my all time favourite CDs:
(//)
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Irons on July 23, 2020, 03:58:40 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on July 23, 2020, 03:28:00 AM
This is one of my all time favourite CDs:
(//)

On LP Dies Natalis is coupled with Holst.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on October 16, 2020, 11:18:10 PM
Quote from: Irons on July 23, 2020, 03:58:40 AM
On LP Dies Natalis is coupled with Holst.
OT
I remember hearing Dies Natalis on the radio for the first time when I was on holiday in the Yorkshire Dales, aged about 19 - the last movement really moved me, so when I got back to London I rushed straight up to HMV to get the LP:

Back on topic - now listening to 'Stabat Mater':
(//)
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Symphonic Addict on December 25, 2021, 06:44:26 PM
I'm aware this is not the more ideal listen for Christmas day, but I did have the need to hear this moving and eventually consoling masterpiece. Perhaps it also has to do and/or suits my mood right now


(https://direct.rhapsody.com/imageserver/images/alb.423404184/600x600.jpg)
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Figaro on February 12, 2022, 02:10:44 PM
I wondered if someone could clarify for me:
Howells String Quartet 'In Gloucestershire' is frequently referred to as "No.3", yet I can't find any reference whatsoever to any other String Quartets by the composer besides the "Fantasy String Quartet" which postdates #3 and therefore can't possibly be #1 or #2.

Whatever happened to the first two quartets? They don't appear to have been recorded nor available as sheet music. Are they lost, or withdrawn by the composer or something?
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Roasted Swan on February 13, 2022, 06:43:28 AM
Quote from: Figaro on February 12, 2022, 02:10:44 PM
I wondered if someone could clarify for me:
Howells String Quartet 'In Gloucestershire' is frequently referred to as "No.3", yet I can't find any reference whatsoever to any other String Quartets by the composer besides the "Fantasy String Quartet" which postdates #3 and therefore can't possibly be #1 or #2.

Whatever happened to the first two quartets? They don't appear to have been recorded nor available as sheet music. Are they lost, or withdrawn by the composer or something?

My guess would be one of two things.... either

a) as you suggest there are withdrawn/lost earlier quartets or
b)  Lady Audrey's Suite = No.1, The Fantasy Quartet from 1917 is No.2 and "In Gloucestershire" (because it was finished in 1920 even though started before the Fantasy Quartet) is No.3
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Oates on February 13, 2022, 07:43:34 AM
Quote from: Roasted Swan on February 13, 2022, 06:43:28 AM
My guess would be one of two things.... either

a) as you suggest there are withdrawn/lost earlier quartets or
b)  Lady Audrey's Suite = No.1, The Fantasy Quartet from 1917 is No.2 and "In Gloucestershire" (because it was finished in 1920 even though started before the Fantasy Quartet) is No.3

b) is absolutely correct, according to the most authoritative book I know on Howells The Music of Herbert Howells (2013) (ed Phillip A. Cooke and David Maw). Howells had numbered it No.3 on the manuscript.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Big David on February 14, 2022, 10:07:02 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on July 23, 2020, 03:28:00 AM
This is one of my all time favourite CDs:
(//)

I bought this CD a few years ago after reading an article in Gramophone about the Hymnus Paradisi.  Willcocks' recording was the first available and the soloists are utterly magnificent.  Of course it isn't a digital recording and Gramophone felt that others were better conducted but Harper and Tear are so good that all lovers of English music should acquire the disc if they can find it, IMHO.

IIRC this CD is no longer commercially available, except as a download; but I managed to acquire a copy via ebay.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Figaro on February 17, 2022, 12:01:09 AM
Quote from: Oates on February 13, 2022, 07:43:34 AM
b) is absolutely correct, according to the most authoritative book I know on Howells The Music of Herbert Howells (2013) (ed Phillip A. Cooke and David Maw). Howells had numbered it No.3 on the manuscript.

Thanks very much both for clarifying that!
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on February 17, 2022, 12:56:04 AM
Quote from: Big David on February 14, 2022, 10:07:02 AM
I bought this CD a few years ago after reading an article in Gramophone about the Hymnus Paradisi.  Willcocks' recording was the first available and the soloists are utterly magnificent.  Of course it isn't a digital recording and Gramophone felt that others were better conducted but Harper and Tear are so good that all lovers of English music should acquire the disc if they can find it, IMHO.

IIRC this CD is no longer commercially available, except as a download; but I managed to acquire a copy via ebay.
I agree. I have about 5 recordings of the work but the Willcocks version remains my favourite.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: calyptorhynchus on December 01, 2022, 08:19:01 PM
This disc launched today:

(https://d1iiivw74516uk.cloudfront.net/eyJidWNrZXQiOiJwcmVzdG8tY292ZXItaW1hZ2VzIiwia2V5IjoiOTM4MDU0OC4xLmpwZyIsImVkaXRzIjp7InJlc2l6ZSI6eyJ3aWR0aCI6MzAwfSwianBlZyI6eyJxdWFsaXR5Ijo2NX0sInRvRm9ybWF0IjoianBlZyJ9LCJ0aW1lc3RhbXAiOjE2Njg1MjQyNTF9)

As with the Vol 1 which came out last year, very good. The Sonatina at the end is particularly good, only someone as modest as Howells would call it this, anyone else would call it a Sonata (it clocks in at over 15 minutes).
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: lordlance on March 29, 2023, 05:26:16 PM
Most of the discussion on this thread seems to be around his chamber or vocal music. Any particular recommendations from his orchestral music?
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Spotted Horses on March 29, 2023, 09:45:14 PM
Sorry to bring it back to Chamber Music, but his clarinet sonata, recorded here, is wonderful, if memory serves.

(https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/51BKJLePG1L.jpg)
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: calyptorhynchus on May 05, 2023, 02:16:27 AM
I just dug this disc out my cupboard.

(https://d1iiivw74516uk.cloudfront.net/eyJidWNrZXQiOiJwcmVzdG8tY292ZXItaW1hZ2VzIiwia2V5IjoiODAwMTU0Ni4xLmpwZyIsImVkaXRzIjp7InJlc2l6ZSI6eyJ3aWR0aCI6OTAwfSwianBlZyI6eyJxdWFsaXR5Ijo2NX0sInRvRm9ybWF0IjoianBlZyJ9LCJ0aW1lc3RhbXAiOjE0MzQ1NDg2MjB9)

It has on it a very nice arrangement of Howell's Oboe Sonata (1942) as a Concerto. Works very well. Some of the figurations and material are slightly reminiscent of Finzi's Clarinet Concerto of a few years later. I wonder if Howells played his Oboe Sonata to Finzi during composition and some influence was exerted.
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: vandermolen on May 05, 2023, 04:31:11 AM
Quote from: lordlance on March 29, 2023, 05:26:16 PMMost of the discussion on this thread seems to be around his chamber or vocal music. Any particular recommendations from his orchestral music?
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: Irons on May 05, 2023, 06:28:17 AM
A rite of passage for British composers to compose at least one work for strings. Howells no exception.

(https://i.imgur.com/cOAGJtP.jpg)
Title: Re: Herbert Howells 1892-1983
Post by: calyptorhynchus on May 05, 2023, 02:33:28 PM
Quote from: Irons on May 05, 2023, 06:28:17 AMA rite of passage for British composers to compose at least one work for strings. Howells no exception.

(https://i.imgur.com/cOAGJtP.jpg)

And this seems to be a genre that British composers excel at, every one who tries it seems to produce a masterpiece, eg Grace Williams Sea Sketches.

Just a little plug here for my MIDI version on Robert Simpson's Variations and Fugue on a Theme of J S Bach (1991), which I prepared in default of a commercial recording.