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The Back Room => The Diner => Topic started by: Mirror Image on February 26, 2012, 07:31:18 PM

Title: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on February 26, 2012, 07:31:18 PM
Continuing with the TV theme that's occurred on GMG lately...

(http://collider.com/uploads/imageGallery/Frasier/frasier_logo.jpg)

(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2010/07/15/article-1294817-0A5C6D87000005DC-524_468x573.jpg)

For me, Frasier was one of the most sophisticated comedies on television. I remember watching the pilot of the show thinking "This is absolutely first-rate." Usually shows take awhile to get really comfortable, but I always thought Frasier was a success from the very beginning. This is a thinking man's comedy, but they did have many moments of purely accessible humor thanks to Frasier's dad, Martin (played John Mahoney).

Anybody else a fan of this, now classic, sitcom?
Title: Re: Fraiser - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: eyeresist on February 26, 2012, 07:52:16 PM
I found Frasier (note correct spelling) quite enjoyable, but think you might be overselling its intellectual qualities. The two brothers mentioned various highbrow consumer items, but the humour was fairly generic (to my recollection - it's been a while). I did enjoy the moment when Frasier's plot to conceal his non-Jewishness from his girlfriend's mother fell through...
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on February 26, 2012, 08:03:22 PM
There were many moments that I found incredibly funny throughout the entire 11 seasons. I own all seasons and have watched the series from the beginning to the end twice. I thought the series took a bit of dive when Niles and Daphne finally got together. For me, a lot of the show's tension, besides Frasier's and his Dad's relationship, came from Niles drooling with animal lust over Daphne. I do think the show was very intelligent and I don't feel I'm overselling those qualities at all. The show was remarkable, but, as with anything, it's all subjective.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Karl Henning on February 26, 2012, 08:09:58 PM
Sacrée vache! It ran for ee leaven seasons?!
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on February 26, 2012, 08:12:12 PM
Quote from: karlhenning on February 26, 2012, 08:09:58 PM
Sacrée vache! It ran for ee leaven seasons?!

Yeah, that's a long time for a sitcom.
Title: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: fridden on February 26, 2012, 08:16:12 PM
Quote from: Mirror Image on February 26, 2012, 07:31:18 PM
Anybody else a fan of this, now classic, sitcom?

This is really a coincident. A few weeks ago I started a run-through and I am currently on season 2 episode 4. :-)
This is one my favorite sitcoms for sure. I also agree that it really did hit off right away.
I also think they did a really good job in creating the characters around Frasier, like Ross, Daphne, His father and (my favorite) Nigel his brother.

/fridden
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Lethevich on February 26, 2012, 08:23:14 PM
It's my favourite "normal" US sitcom - for something that follows a very standard format, it's consistently interesting - partly because of the setting, partly because of the scripts, but mostly for the characters (typical "fiasco" plots seem to have added bite when conflicted with the characters individual pretentions, or lack of).

As to the intelligence, it can be hit or miss, and sometimes it's hard to tell whether the scriptwriters are just throwing things in to sound right, or whether they are setting up the characters. For example, at one point Niles (I think) was playing something harsh on the piano, and Frasier asked if it was Mahler, Niles said "god no" and they chortled together about how ghastly his music is. But really, the two characters represent the kind of American intelligentsia who would be great fans. There is a kind of scattered feel to such writing, but it's just me being pickly.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on February 26, 2012, 08:25:30 PM
Quote from: fridden on February 26, 2012, 08:16:12 PM
This is really a coincident. A few weeks ago I started a run-through and I am currently on season 2 episode 4. :-)
This is one my favorite sitcoms for sure. I also agree that it really did hit off right away.
I also think they did a really good job in creating the characters around Frasier, like Ross, Daphne, His father and (my favorite) Nigel his brother.

/fridden

I'm glad you enjoy the show, fridden. :) It's surely one of the greats I think. The dynamic between all of the characters and how that dynamic grew organically season by season is really what made the show a success or at least in my opinion. Niles really was one of the key factors in what made this show such a hit.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on February 26, 2012, 08:31:02 PM
Quote from: Lethevich on February 26, 2012, 08:23:14 PM
It's my favourite "normal" US sitcom - for something that follows a very standard format, it's consistently interesting - partly because of the setting, partly because of the scripts, but mostly for the characters (typical "fiasco" plots seem to have added bite when conflicted with the characters individual pretentions, or lack of).

Yes, it did follow a pretty standard format, but, like I mentioned to fridden, what made the show incredibly unique is the character dynamic and how it, over 11 seasons, grew and matured. Not too many shows pay attention to this, but it's one of the reasons this show was a big hit early on because people seemed to respond to the brother/brother and father/son aspect of the show, but also because of the natural feel that these incredible actors brought to their characters.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: eyeresist on February 26, 2012, 08:36:23 PM
Quote from: Lethevich on February 26, 2012, 08:23:14 PMFor example, at one point Niles (I think) was playing something harsh on the piano, and Frasier asked if it was Mahler, Niles said "god no" and they chortled together about how ghastly his music is. But really, the two characters represent the kind of American intelligentsia who would be great fans.

The piano works of Mahler??? I wonder what the music actually was.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: kishnevi on February 26, 2012, 08:40:42 PM
Quote from: Lethevich on February 26, 2012, 08:23:14 PM
It's my favourite "normal" US sitcom - for something that follows a very standard format, it's consistently interesting - partly because of the setting, partly because of the scripts, but mostly for the characters (typical "fiasco" plots seem to have added bite when conflicted with the characters individual pretentions, or lack of).

As to the intelligence, it can be hit or miss, and sometimes it's hard to tell whether the scriptwriters are just throwing things in to sound right, or whether they are setting up the characters. For example, at one point Niles (I think) was playing something harsh on the piano, and Frasier asked if it was Mahler, Niles said "god no" and they chortled together about how ghastly his music is. But really, the two characters represent the kind of American intelligentsia who would be great fans. There is a kind of scattered feel to such writing, but it's just me being pickly.

I liked it because it had, much of the time, a rather dry and understated sort of humor, and when the actors hammed it up,  they managed to do so in a restrained and understated way (which may sound impossible, and is certainly paradoxical, but it's the best way I can describe many of the best moments).  Added to this was the feeling that there was a strong bond of love among Frasier, Niles and their father, and respect for the other major characters as well--something that is often lacking from other so-called hit shows.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on February 26, 2012, 08:41:25 PM
Quote from: Lethevich on February 26, 2012, 08:23:14 PMAs to the intelligence, it can be hit or miss, and sometimes it's hard to tell whether the scriptwriters are just throwing things in to sound right, or whether they are setting up the characters. For example, at one point Niles (I think) was playing something harsh on the piano, and Frasier asked if it was Mahler, Niles said "god no" and they chortled together about how ghastly his music is. But really, the two characters represent the kind of American intelligentsia who would be great fans. There is a kind of scattered feel to such writing, but it's just me being pickly.

Yeah, it's just you being pickly. ;D It was a known fact that both of the Crane brothers didn't like Mahler and this was only mentioned a few times during the entire series. I do remember the Crane brothers being more into the Classical and early Romantic era composers.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on February 26, 2012, 08:43:35 PM
Quote from: Jeffrey Smith on February 26, 2012, 08:40:42 PMAdded to this was the feeling that there was a strong bond of love among Frasier, Niles and their father, and respect for the other major characters as well--something that is often lacking from other so-called hit shows.

Which is exactly what I've been saying all along about the character dynamic.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Lethevich on February 26, 2012, 09:03:39 PM
Quote from: Jeffrey Smith on February 26, 2012, 08:40:42 PM
I liked it because it had, much of the time, a rather dry and understated sort of humor, and when the actors hammed it up,  they managed to do so in a restrained and understated way (which may sound impossible, and is certainly paradoxical, but it's the best way I can describe many of the best moments).  Added to this was the feeling that there was a strong bond of love among Frasier, Niles and their father, and respect for the other major characters as well--something that is often lacking from other so-called hit shows.

The strange thing is they are not spectacular actors elsewhere, but something about each character worked perfectly for them.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: eyeresist on February 26, 2012, 09:03:49 PM
Quote
Well, I'm afraid I'm not very well-connected in the doo-wop world, Dad.  Uh, if there's ever a "Mahler-palooza", I'm your man.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: fridden on February 26, 2012, 09:16:05 PM
Quote from: fridden on February 26, 2012, 08:16:12 PM
His father and (my favorite) Nigel his brother.

Ouch, of course I meant Niles.  :-[

I also like the way this show could bring up serious issues in a natural and humorous way. I don't know how to express this in English, but sometimes sitcoms can be too PC and write it on your nose somehow, something I feel is not the case with Frasier.

So whats your favorite episode, or since it perhaps has been a long time, the episode you most remember?
One of my favorites, is The Club, where Niles and Frasier tries to get membership to Seattle's prestigious Empire Club.

Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Lethevich on February 26, 2012, 09:30:05 PM
Quote from: fridden on February 26, 2012, 09:16:05 PM
So whats your favorite episode, or since it perhaps has been a long time, the episode you most remember?
One of my favorites, is The Club, where Niles and Frasier tries to get membership to Seattle's prestigious Empire Club.

Is that the one where they end up shut outside because they went through a fancy exit trying to reach the next tier? I like that one too - I also like the one where Frasier buys a painting that turned out to be a fake.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: fridden on February 27, 2012, 02:46:44 AM
Quote from: Lethevich on February 26, 2012, 09:30:05 PM
Is that the one where they end up shut outside because they went through a fancy exit trying to reach the next tier? I like that one too - I also like the one where Frasier buys a painting that turned out to be a fake.

No, the one where they end up shut outside is called Door Jam, from season 10. It's a really good one too  :D
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Sergeant Rock on February 27, 2012, 03:12:54 AM
Quote from: fridden on February 26, 2012, 09:16:05 PM
So whats your favorite episode, or since it perhaps has been a long time, the episode you most remember? One of my favorites, is The Club, where Niles and Frasier tries to get membership to Seattle's prestigious Empire Club.

Actually, one of my favorites is the one that aired just prior to The Club: from season 2 episode 17, Daphne's Room. This is the one where Frasier is caught several times in Daphne's room, including once when he is accused of spying on Daphne from the closest as she's about to take a shower. Some superb physical comedy by all the characters...and the quick cuts to each of the Crane men's faces (including Eddie's) when they are caught seemingly going through her belongings is priceless.

Sarge
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: mc ukrneal on February 27, 2012, 04:23:43 AM
Quote from: Sergeant Rock on February 27, 2012, 03:12:54 AM
Actually, one of my favorites is the one that aired just prior to The Club: from season 2 episode 17, Daphne's Room. This is the one where Frasier is caught several times in Daphne's room, including once when he is accused of spying on Daphne from the closest as she's about to take a shower. Some superb physical comedy by all the characters...and the quick cuts to each of the Crane men's faces (including Eddie's) when they are caught seemingly going through her belongings is priceless.

Sarge
Frasier was not my personal favorite, but it sure could be funny (and was so well written). One that comes to mind - the episode that takes place entirely in the coffee shop. Frasier keeps returning his coffee - while the discussion is in turns serious, light, and philosophical (and of course often rediculously funny). The back and forth is so natural and really builds well. Are you Happy?

Frasier: Do you love her (Maris)?
Niles: Of course. But it's a different kind of love.
Frasier: You mean it's not human?

Niles: I don't think she (Roz) likes me.
Frasier: It's not a question of liking or not liking. She despises you. 
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: ibanezmonster on February 27, 2012, 06:14:52 AM
Although it's been years since I watched it, I couldn't stand that show, despite trying to get into it. Just didn't find it interesting.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on February 27, 2012, 06:33:18 AM
Quote from: Sergeant Rock on February 27, 2012, 03:12:54 AM
Actually, one of my favorites is the one that aired just prior to The Club: from season 2 episode 17, Daphne's Room. This is the one where Frasier is caught several times in Daphne's room, including once when he is accused of spying on Daphne from the closest as she's about to take a shower. Some superb physical comedy by all the characters...and the quick cuts to each of the Crane men's faces (including Eddie's) when they are caught seemingly going through her belongings is priceless.

Sarge

That's a great episode, Sarge.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on February 27, 2012, 06:38:04 AM
Quote from: Greg on February 27, 2012, 06:14:52 AM
Although it's been years since I watched it, I couldn't stand that show, despite trying to get into it. Just didn't find it interesting.

What's one of your favorite sitcoms then, Greg?
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: North Star on February 27, 2012, 06:49:17 AM
One of the few American shows I watch. David Hyde-Pierce is absolutely brilliant as Niles.
Hyde-Pierce playing Bach: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSKZTu60c-o
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: ibanezmonster on February 27, 2012, 07:39:15 AM
Quote from: Mirror Image on February 27, 2012, 06:38:04 AM
What's one of your favorite sitcoms then, Greg?
As far as American evening sitcoms go, I wouldn't call any of them "great" shows, but... the ones I most enjoyed included Everybody Hates Chris, The Office, Seinfeld, George Lopez, Bernie Mac, King of Queens, Everybody Loves Raymond, and probably a couple more I don't remember because they didn't run as long. Currently, I've been watching Big Bang episodes when my family has it on, and it's pretty enjoyable.

But that's just my personal taste. These shows are just entertainment and have little artistic value, so I wouldn't even bother debating which one is "better."
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: DavidW on February 27, 2012, 07:48:31 AM
Quote from: Greg on February 27, 2012, 07:39:15 AM
As far as American evening sitcoms go, I wouldn't call any of them "great" shows, but... the ones I most enjoyed included Everybody Hates Chris, The Office, Seinfeld, George Lopez, Bernie Mac, King of Queens, Everybody Loves Raymond, and probably a couple more I don't remember because they didn't run as long. Currently, I've been watching Big Bang episodes when my family has it on, and it's pretty enjoyable.

But that's just my personal taste. These shows are just entertainment and have little artistic value, so I wouldn't even bother debating which one is "better."

Better is whichever makes you laugh more.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Sergeant Rock on February 27, 2012, 07:59:51 AM
Quote from: DavidW on February 27, 2012, 07:48:31 AM
Better is whichever makes you laugh more.

Plus memorable, and unique, characters. Sheldon, Amy, Leonard's mother, Sheldon's mother...yeah, Big Bang qualifies  8)

Sarge
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: ibanezmonster on February 27, 2012, 08:12:57 AM
Quote from: DavidW on February 27, 2012, 07:48:31 AM
Better is whichever makes you laugh more.
No clear decision on that one for me, then...
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Ataraxia on February 27, 2012, 08:19:05 AM
Quote from: Sergeant Rock on February 27, 2012, 07:59:51 AM
Plus memorable, and unique, characters. Sheldon, Amy, Leonard's mother, Sheldon's mother...yeah, Big Bang qualifies  8)

The only sitcom I watch.  ;D
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Sergeant Rock on February 27, 2012, 11:12:57 AM
Quote from: Discobole on February 27, 2012, 09:32:23 AM
Sitcoms today are not that good. I mean, Big Bang Theory is just not as funny as it has been, How I Met Your Mother has had good moments (season 4-5) but is now really boring, The Office is not the same without Michael. 30Rock is probably the only really good sitcom today.

I agree about Big Bang and Mother. Both disappointing this season. But I'm enjoying Community, Modern Family, Raising Hope (by the creator of My Name is Earl) and 30Rock.

Sarge
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: canninator on February 27, 2012, 11:51:52 AM
At its height, Only Fools and Horses, was positive television gold in the UK. After the seven regular series it started to go down hill in a number of Christmas specials. A US remake is heading your way. It really was something of its time so I predict it flunking in the remake.

Another absolute favourite was Blackadder, I could watch that all day.

On topic, I lived in NYC during a large part of the Frasier years and loved every minute of it, despite having missed and not really connected with Cheers.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: eyeresist on February 27, 2012, 03:39:09 PM
That was a great post, Soapy. I don't think I saw the "La Scala" episode, but I think we can all understand the agonising dilemma. OTOH, I wonder how the "average" viewer saw that joke.


And yes, In & Out was an insult of a movie. I like musicals - --> I must be gay! (As opposed to "I prefer to have sex with the same sex --> ...")
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Karl Henning on February 27, 2012, 04:08:20 PM
Quote from: Mirror Image on February 26, 2012, 08:41:25 PM
... It was a known fact that both of the Crane brothers didn't like Mahler and this was only mentioned a few times during the entire series. I do remember the Crane brothers being more into the Classical and early Romantic era composers.

Speaking as one who enthuses over fewer than half a dozen US TV shows, myself ... this is is exactly the sort of "known fact" one cannot expect a casual fan of such a show to have picked up.

Luckily, John, I saw that you were wearing your Mild Irony Beanie.

Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Karl Henning on February 27, 2012, 04:14:03 PM
Quote
Quote from: Lethevich on February 26, 2012, 09:03:39 PM
The strange thing is they are not spectacular actors elsewhere, but something about each character worked perfectly for them.

I think this more than fair. I don't know that they're any of them great actors, but here they've found a felicitous ensemble which drew out their best.

Pure luck of the draw, I think, that this show doesn't "click" with me.

I'm okay with that.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Karl Henning on February 27, 2012, 04:16:58 PM
Quote from: Greg on February 27, 2012, 06:14:52 AM
Although it's been years since I watched it, I couldn't stand that show, despite trying to get into it. Just didn't find it interesting.

Dude, we must have tea sometime.

Separately, I met a couple from Orlando to-day.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Karl Henning on February 27, 2012, 04:26:24 PM
Quote from: DavidW on February 27, 2012, 07:48:31 AM
Better is whichever makes you laugh more.

You may be on to something here, Davey ... and this raison d'être may just be why sitcoms from about M*A*S*H on, fail to click with me. I feel too much that they're drilling for laughs...
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: eyeresist on February 27, 2012, 04:37:54 PM
Quote from: Discobole on February 27, 2012, 04:23:36 PMThis is mentioned in an episode during the 5-season long breakup with Maris. Niles is recalling his quiet Sundays with her as a couple, when he would play Mahler for her on the piano. Then Frasier goes like : "But you hate Mahler !" and Niles answers : "Who doesn't, besides Maris ?"

No, I looked this up and this is actually a misquote. What happens is Niles recalls, amongst other things, playing Mahler on the piano for Maris, and later Frasier tells him:
Niles, before you make your decision, just make sure that you're remembering things the way they really were.  Yes, you bought that chair on your honeymoon in Vienna.  But remember, you wanted to buy the chair that you saw in Paris.  Yes, you sit at the piano every Sunday morning and play Mahler for Maris.  But you hate Mahler!  Besides Maris, who doesn't?!


The only other Mahler reference from the show I could find is the "Mahler-palooza" quote, above.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Karl Henning on February 27, 2012, 04:43:00 PM
Quote from: Discobole on February 27, 2012, 04:23:36 PM
This is mentioned in an episode during the 5-season long breakup with Maris. Niles is recalling his quiet Sundays with her as a couple, when he would play Mahler for her on the piano. Then Frasier goes like : "But you hate Mahler !" and Niles answers : "Who doesn't, besides Maris ?"
Even when you like Mahler, this is quite funny actually ;D Even more when you consider the relation between Mahler and Freud, the birth of psychoanalysis in Vienna 1900-1910... Frasier and Niles would supposedly be the typical fans of Mahler (at least Frasier, who is openly Freudian when Niles is more Jungian), this repulsion is kind of like turned against themselves (or could have fueled a fight if the topic on hand was not Maris). I guess this is not merely clumsy writing, but a subtle allusion for a part of the public.

A most interesting, and insightful, comment, Disco.

Perhaps it is good writing, but not great writing for television?

OTOH ... to echo a comment of Davey's — perhaps ambition on writing and even a marginal degree of success in reaching a comprehending audience ... all right, this already has no connection with aught Davey said...

Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on February 27, 2012, 06:11:40 PM
Quote from: Greg on February 27, 2012, 07:39:15 AM
As far as American evening sitcoms go, I wouldn't call any of them "great" shows, but... the ones I most enjoyed included Everybody Hates Chris, The Office, Seinfeld, George Lopez, Bernie Mac, King of Queens, Everybody Loves Raymond, and probably a couple more I don't remember because they didn't run as long. Currently, I've been watching Big Bang episodes when my family has it on, and it's pretty enjoyable.

But that's just my personal taste. These shows are just entertainment and have little artistic value, so I wouldn't even bother debating which one is "better."

I hate Big Bang Theory. Such annoying, dreadful characters. Seinfeld had annoying characters too, but the way that show was written was just brilliant.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on February 27, 2012, 06:19:51 PM
Quote from: Discobole on February 27, 2012, 09:32:23 AM
When I think about the funniest episodes of Frasier IMO, I think about two dinner parties.
In season 2 episode 3 Frasier invites his new boss, who he doesn't know is gay. Therefore, the guy thinks its a date and is led to believe that Frasier, Niles and even their father are gay. Some of the misunderstandings are simply  hilarious (Martin : "Il love to hang out at Dukes. A lot of young cops" :D)
In season 4 episode 1, Daphne's ex boyfriend comes to dinner and she wants him to believe she's married to Niles, just not to appear available. Then things get quite wild, Roz is supposed to be married to Frasier but she hits on the guy, and Daphne gets interested in him again, and Martin even tells he's an ex astronaut ;D That must be one of the funniest episodes of any TV series I've watched.
But there are so many other episodes I liked. The one with "Dirty girl"... The one Sergeant Rock mentioned (Daphne's Room). And so many others.

Yes, I remember these episodes quite well. So many funny moments.

QuoteAnd I might start to watch Curb Your Enthusiasm.

I've love Curb..., if you enjoy Seinfeld, then I'll think you'll enjoy this show. Larry David is a comedic genius IMHO.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Sergeant Rock on February 28, 2012, 03:43:05 AM
Quote from: Mirror Image on February 26, 2012, 08:41:25 PM
It was a known fact that both of the Crane brothers didn't like Mahler and this was only mentioned a few times during the entire series. I do remember the Crane brothers being more into the Classical and early Romantic era composers.

Quote from: karlhenning on February 27, 2012, 04:08:20 PM
Speaking as one who enthuses over fewer than half a dozen US TV shows, myself ... this is is exactly the sort of "known fact" one cannot expect a casual fan of such a show to have picked up.

The Crane brothers also love Wagner...so, Karl, I understand completely why you don't like Frasier  ;D

Sarge
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Sergeant Rock on February 28, 2012, 04:09:31 AM
Quote from: Mirror Image on February 27, 2012, 06:11:40 PM
I hate Big Bang Theory. Such annoying, dreadful characters. Seinfeld had annoying characters too...

And Larry David (Curb Your Enthusiasm) has to be the single most annoying, and embarrassing, character ever invented. If, in fact, he is an invention and not the real Larry David  ;D  But see, you admit annoying characters can be extremely funny. That's what makes Sheldon such a remarkable character  8)

Sarge
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Lethevich on February 28, 2012, 04:40:33 AM
Quote from: Mirror Image on February 27, 2012, 06:11:40 PM
Seinfeld had annoying characters [...]

You're too well-adjusted - I share so many George characteristics that I view him as a rolemodel.
Title: Re: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Karl Henning on February 28, 2012, 04:46:48 AM
Quote from: Sergeant Rock on February 28, 2012, 03:43:05 AM
The Crane brothers also love Wagner...so, Karl, I understand completely why you don't like Frasier  ;D

Sarge

I had no idea, Sarge — truly! : )
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Sergeant Rock on February 28, 2012, 05:44:05 AM
Quote from: Lethevich on February 28, 2012, 04:40:33 AM
You're too well-adjusted - I share so many George characteristics that I view him as a rolemodel.

I sincerely hope you haven't poisoned your partner because you were too cheap to buy the good stuff  :D

Sarge
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Lethevich on February 28, 2012, 06:11:55 AM
Quote from: Sergeant Rock on February 28, 2012, 05:44:05 AM
I sincerely hope you haven't poisoned your partner because you were too cheap to buy the good stuff  :D

I'm plenty capable of doing that with my cooking ::) I've managed to follow George's "do the exact opposite of what you think best" wisdom for so long, I've almost become a capable individual by complete accident :P
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Kontrapunctus on February 28, 2012, 08:44:41 AM
It's absolutely one of my favorites! (I have the complete series on DVD.) The acting, writing, cast chemistry, memorable characters--just one of the best.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on February 28, 2012, 09:15:32 PM
Quote from: Sergeant Rock on February 28, 2012, 04:09:31 AM
And Larry David (Curb Your Enthusiasm) has to be the single most annoying, and embarrassing, character ever invented. If, in fact, he is an invention and not the real Larry David  ;D  But see, you admit annoying characters can be extremely funny. That's what makes Sheldon such a remarkable character  8)

Sarge

Sheldon in annoying in a bad way, Larry David is annoying in a truly funny way. I just hate Big Bang. Sorry...
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on February 28, 2012, 09:17:05 PM
Quote from: Toccata&Fugue on February 28, 2012, 08:44:41 AM
It's absolutely one of my favorites! (I have the complete series on DVD.) The acting, writing, cast chemistry, memorable characters--just one of the best.

+1

I own all seasons on DVD too.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Kontrapunctus on February 28, 2012, 09:49:58 PM
I sometimes use the episode when Frasier invites the new station manager over to meet Daphne (but the man is gay and thinks he's on a date with Frasier) to teach the concept of dramatic irony to my high school literature students! It's one of my favorites.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on February 29, 2012, 08:09:25 AM
Quote from: Toccata&Fugue on February 28, 2012, 09:49:58 PM
I sometimes use the episode when Frasier invites the new station manager over to meet Daphne (but the man is gay and thinks he's on a date with Frasier) to teach the concept of dramatic irony to my high school literature students! It's one of my favorites.

Yes, that's a fantastic episode. I know  this was an early episode. Was this on the second season? I can't quite remember.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Lethevich on February 29, 2012, 08:42:32 AM
Quote from: Mirror Image on February 29, 2012, 08:09:25 AM
Yes, that's a fantastic episode. I know  this was an early episode. Was this on the second season? I can't quite remember.

Yip. In fact, many of the suggestions seem to be (Empire Club, Daphne's Bedroom). I've been watching what I can on Youtube, like the cheapskate I am, and most of series 1 is not available, so I began with series 2, and found myself immediately familiar with all these things people had been mentioning earlier that day ;D
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on February 29, 2012, 09:06:59 AM
Quote from: Lethevich on February 29, 2012, 08:42:32 AM
Yip. In fact, many of the suggestions seem to be (Empire Club, Daphne's Bedroom). I've been watching what I can on Youtube, like the cheapskate I am, and most of series 1 is not available, so I began with series 2, and found myself immediately familiar with all these things people had been mentioning earlier that day ;D

I remember the second and third seasons being especially great. I'm re-watching the entire series again (for the third time) and I'm on the last episode of the Season 1 now.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Sergeant Rock on February 29, 2012, 11:25:34 AM
Quote from: Mirror Image on February 28, 2012, 09:15:32 PM
Sheldon in annoying in a bad way, Larry David is annoying in a truly funny way. I just hate Big Bang. Sorry...

Sheldon suffers from Asperger syndrome; his annoying habits make sense, and are forgivable. Larry David is just a clueless asshole  :D  I wouldn't care to associate with either, but they are both fun to watch.

Sarge
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Lethevich on February 29, 2012, 12:01:00 PM
We don't suffer, per-se, we... unintentionally infuriate both others and ourselves - often in impressively long combo chains :P
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on February 29, 2012, 12:24:18 PM
Quote from: Sergeant Rock on February 29, 2012, 11:25:34 AM
Sheldon suffers from Asperger syndrome; his annoying habits make sense, and are forgivable. Larry David is just a clueless asshole  :D  I wouldn't care to associate with either, but they are both fun to watch.

Sarge

I don't think Sheldon is fun to watch. You do, that's fine, but I can't stand the character, whereas with David, in some instances, I understand where he's coming from. I associate more with David than Sheldon, which makes David the more approachable character for me.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: mc ukrneal on February 29, 2012, 12:45:11 PM
With all this talk of best sitcoms, I really think there are a few that are not mentioned, but are as good or better than Frasier.
All in the Family - a real consideration for best ever. The characters were incredible - Archie was an SOB that you could not help watching. The social issues they touched upon were quite different from most other sitcoms (especially today). Some great writing here.
M*A*S*H - The only other that gives All in the Family a run for its money in its quality and ability to merge drama into a sitcom. Sometimes it's hard to tell what kind of show you are watching and that is special. Many of the issues dealt with are still relevant today.

Both shows are a bit different from the usual sitcom in their ability to mix drama and humor together. The tension on both could be unbearable and there still episodes of both that I have difficulty watching - because they are too true, hit too close to home, or are just painful to watch. There are not many sitcoms like that and perhaps not appreciated or liked by all. But it is precisely these qualituies that draw me to them.

There are others like the Jeffersons or Sanford and Son, though they come behind the other two (IMO). The Cosby Show ranks up there too.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on February 29, 2012, 01:07:35 PM
Quote from: mc ukrneal on February 29, 2012, 12:45:11 PM
With all this talk of best sitcoms, I really think there are a few that are not mentioned, but are as good or better than Frasier.
All in the Family - a real consideration for best ever. The characters were incredible - Archie was an SOB that you could not help watching. The social issues they touched upon were quite different from most other sitcoms (especially today). Some great writing here.
M*A*S*H - The only other that gives All in the Family a run for its money in its quality and ability to merge drama into a sitcom. Sometimes it's hard to tell what kind of show you are watching and that is special. Many of the issues dealt with are still relevant today.

Both shows are a bit different from the usual sitcom in their ability to mix drama and humor together. The tension on both could be unbearable and there still episodes of both that I have difficulty watching - because they are too true, hit too close to home, or are just painful to watch. There are not many sitcoms like that and perhaps not appreciated or liked by all. But it is precisely these qualituies that draw me to them.

There are others like the Jeffersons or Sanford and Son, though they come behind the other two (IMO). The Cosby Show ranks up there too.

Never have cared for any of the shows which you listed. M*A*S*H wasn't particularly interesting, but, then again, I never thought the idea of a show in the middle of a war was particularly funny or even amusing. Sanford & Son had some good moments, but I found it to be one-dimensional and just not entertaining enough. The Jeffersons was never funny IMHO. All In The Family didn't do much for me either. I didn't relate at all to any of the characters. The writing wasn't particularly noteworthy either.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on February 29, 2012, 01:28:31 PM
Anyway...getting back on topic ::)

Another episode I liked from the second season is when Frasier and Niles felt compelled to get into politics and chose a complete nutjob candidate to support while Martin's candidate of choice was a war veteran.

One of the more memorable lines from this episode was when, during a break from Frasier's commercial with Phil Patterson (the Crane brothers' choice) being filmed at Frasier's apartment, was when Niles walked up to Patterson and said "The Crane family has a long history of political involvement. You know, my wife Maris actually has all our servants down at your campaign headquarters licking envelopes. She'd do it herself, but the poor thing can't produce saliva."

I also like this line from Daphne when she talks to Phil Patterson: "You know, my uncle was a political writer for one of those
London tabloids. I can still remember his biggest scoop. The headline read: "High-ranking politician caught wearing
women's clothing." Of course, you turn to page two and you found out it was Margaret Thatcher, but by then you'd already bought the paper."
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Sergeant Rock on February 29, 2012, 01:50:58 PM
Quote from: Lethevich on February 29, 2012, 12:01:00 PM
We don't suffer, per-se, we... unintentionally infuriate both others and ourselves - often in impressively long combo chains :P

I didn't mean suffers in the sense of suffering...just as a synonym for has. Sheldon seems quite content most of the time with his condition.

Sarge
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Kontrapunctus on February 29, 2012, 06:14:50 PM
Quote from: Mirror Image on February 29, 2012, 08:09:25 AM
Yes, that's a fantastic episode. I know  this was an early episode. Was this on the second season? I can't quite remember.

Yes, season 2. Here is a complete episode guide: http://frasierzone.tripod.com/s1.html
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Lethevich on March 27, 2012, 05:43:37 PM
I've been watching it a bit recently because of this thread. It is really good, but does sometimes overuse the following (and varients of):

X knew what Y was going to confront Z with something
Y didn't changed their mind and exits
X comes in and Z gives the impression Y told them the thing, X unintentionally reveals the unsaid thing relieved that it now appears to be out in the open

More than once the exchange ends in "...he didn't say a word to you did he?" or a close varient of.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Philoctetes on March 27, 2012, 05:46:50 PM
Quote from: Lethevich on March 27, 2012, 05:43:37 PM
I've been watching it a bit recently because of this thread. It is really good, but does sometimes overuse the following (and varients of):

X knew what Y was going to confront Z with something
Y didn't changed their mind and exits
X comes in and Z gives the impression Y told them the thing, X unintentionally reveals the unsaid thing relieved that it now appears to be out in the open

More than once the exchange ends in "...he didn't say a word to you did he?" or a close varient of.

It also suffers from being really white and oft times unrelatable.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on March 27, 2012, 06:27:23 PM
Quote from: Philoctetes on March 27, 2012, 05:46:50 PM
It also suffers from being really white and oft times unrelatable.

I wonder if someone has ever accused Sanford & Son of being really black or whatever the hell this means?
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on March 27, 2012, 06:30:23 PM
Quote from: Lethevich on March 27, 2012, 05:43:37 PM
I've been watching it a bit recently because of this thread. It is really good, but does sometimes overuse the following (and varients of):

X knew what Y was going to confront Z with something
Y didn't changed their mind and exits
X comes in and Z gives the impression Y told them the thing, X unintentionally reveals the unsaid thing relieved that it now appears to be out in the open

More than once the exchange ends in "...he didn't say a word to you did he?" or a close varient of.

I have found that in the later seasons the show did suffer from less than good writing. I felt the first couple of seasons (maybe 1-5) were really what made me love the show. I kind of lost interest in it when Daphne and Niles got together because so much of that show's edge was lost IMHO.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Lethevich on March 27, 2012, 06:31:03 PM
Quote from: Philoctetes on March 27, 2012, 05:46:50 PM
It also suffers from being really white and oft times unrelatable.

Hehe, I've haven't had problems with that so far. I may be terminally poor and kinda-asian, but I have enough subtle snobby inclinations and terminal neuroses to cringe at the characters from a point of understanding rather than bemusement.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Philoctetes on March 27, 2012, 06:33:27 PM
Quote from: Lethevich on March 27, 2012, 06:31:03 PM
Hehe, I've haven't had problems with that so far. I may be terminally poor and kinda-asian, but I have enough subtle snobby inclinations and terminal neuroses to cringe at the characters from a point of understanding rather than bemusement.

I assume I may be singular in that reaction. I also find the show mostly unfunny, except for Niles. He took being white to a whole new level.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on March 27, 2012, 06:36:25 PM
Quote from: Philoctetes on March 27, 2012, 06:33:27 PM
I assume I may be singular in that reaction. I also find the show mostly unfunny, except for Niles. He took being white to a whole new level.

::)

I wonder if people found that Fred Sanford took being black to whole new level?
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Philoctetes on March 27, 2012, 06:43:06 PM
Quote from: Mirror Image on March 27, 2012, 06:36:25 PM
I wonder if people found that Fred Sanford took being black to whole new level?

He's not even close to being the blackest guy on television. He was moderately black. But that show was actually funny, so it does have that advantage.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on March 27, 2012, 06:59:22 PM
Quote from: Philoctetes on March 27, 2012, 06:43:06 PM
He's not even close to being the blackest guy on television. He was moderately black. But that show was actually funny, so it does have that advantage.

Something being funny is purely subjective. If you don't like Frasier then that's fine, but there are plenty of people who do like the show as indicated by this thread and I think it's very funny.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Philoctetes on March 27, 2012, 07:00:46 PM
Quote from: Mirror Image on March 27, 2012, 06:59:22 PM
Something being funny is purely subjective. If you don't like Frasier then that's fine, but there are plenty of people who do like the show as indicated by this thread and I think it's very funny.

Hence why I indicated why I was singular.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on March 27, 2012, 07:05:57 PM
Quote from: Philoctetes on March 27, 2012, 07:00:46 PM
Hence why I indicated why I was singular.

You didn't indicate it to me, Philo, so that why I made that comment to you.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Philoctetes on March 27, 2012, 07:07:28 PM
Quote from: Mirror Image on March 27, 2012, 07:05:57 PM
You didn't indicate it to me, Philo, so that why I made that comment to you.

It wasn't indicated to anyone in particular. It was indicated to anyone who happened to actually read my post.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on March 27, 2012, 07:11:38 PM
Quote from: Philoctetes on March 27, 2012, 07:07:28 PM
It wasn't indicated to anyone in particular. It was indicated to anyone who happened to actually read my post.

Well, your indication failed to make over my way. Anyway...moving on...::)

One of my favorite episodes of Frasier occurs in the 5th season. The episode is titled The Ski Lodge and here is a breakdown of the storyline:

Roz wins a free trip to a ski lodge, including lessons from a skiing instructor, but is talked into trading them to Frasier in return for a big screen TV. So Frasier decides to take the whole family to the ski lodge, including Daphne and her friend Annie, a swimsuit model. There they meet Guy (played by James Patrick Stuart), a gay ski instructor, who likes Niles and thinks he is gay too. This is confirmed by misinformation given by Martin who has hearing difficulty due to a blocked ear. Throughout the episode confusion arises as Frasier is lusting after Annie, who desires Niles. Niles, however, attempts throughout the episode to confess his feelings for Daphne, while Daphne attempts to pick up Guy, who thinks that Daphne and Annie are lesbians. Throughout the night, various people visit each other's rooms or discover someone in their bed. Once the truth is revealed, Frasier realized that no one is lusting after him.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: eyeresist on March 27, 2012, 11:44:19 PM
Quote from: Philoctetes on March 27, 2012, 06:43:06 PMHe's not even close to being the blackest guy on television. He was moderately black. But that show was actually funny, so it does have that advantage.

"See, black guys drive like this: a-doom... pah! a-doom-a-doom pah! But white guys, they drive like this: de-doo-doo-doo-doo de-doo-doo-doo..."
"It's true! We are so lame!"
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Philoctetes on March 28, 2012, 12:22:23 AM
Quote from: eyeresist on March 27, 2012, 11:44:19 PM
"See, black guys drive like this: a-doom... pah! a-doom-a-doom pah! But white guys, they drive like this: de-doo-doo-doo-doo de-doo-doo-doo..."
"It's true! We are so lame!"

Whites are pretty lame.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: eyeresist on March 28, 2012, 12:53:00 AM

I smell racisms....
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Philoctetes on March 28, 2012, 12:56:56 AM
Quote from: eyeresist on March 28, 2012, 12:53:00 AM
I smell racisms....

I'm fairly suspicious as well.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on March 28, 2012, 09:30:51 AM
Quote from: Soapy Molloy on March 28, 2012, 03:05:18 AM
In fact it was watching that episode when it was repeated in the UK recently that made me see the connection to Feydeau.  That plot is pure French farce, characters running in and out of (the wrong) bedrooms the whole time.   And superbly done.  Love it. ;D

Yeah, it's fantastic.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Bulldog on March 28, 2012, 09:44:34 AM
Quote from: Mirror Image on March 27, 2012, 07:11:38 PM
Well, your indication failed to make over my way. Anyway...moving on...::)

One of my favorite episodes of Frasier occurs in the 5th season. The episode is titled The Ski Lodge and here is a breakdown of the storyline:

Roz wins a free trip to a ski lodge, including lessons from a skiing instructor, but is talked into trading them to Frasier in return for a big screen TV. So Frasier decides to take the whole family to the ski lodge, including Daphne and her friend Annie, a swimsuit model. There they meet Guy (played by James Patrick Stuart), a gay ski instructor, who likes Niles and thinks he is gay too. This is confirmed by misinformation given by Martin who has hearing difficulty due to a blocked ear. Throughout the episode confusion arises as Frasier is lusting after Annie, who desires Niles. Niles, however, attempts throughout the episode to confess his feelings for Daphne, while Daphne attempts to pick up Guy, who thinks that Daphne and Annie are lesbians. Throughout the night, various people visit each other's rooms or discover someone in their bed. Once the truth is revealed, Frasier realized that no one is lusting after him.

That was one of my least favorite episodes - way too contrived. 
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Karl Henning on March 28, 2012, 09:52:58 AM
Could be part of why I never wanted to take up skiing . . . .
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on March 28, 2012, 09:59:30 AM
Quote from: Bulldog on March 28, 2012, 09:44:34 AM
That was one of my least favorite episodes - way too contrived.

I liked it because of everything that was happening in such a limited space. Almost the entire episode revolved around that ski lodge. I find that the writing was really well done, especially considering, again, how limited their surroundings were.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: TheGSMoeller on March 28, 2012, 10:41:53 AM
http://www.youtube.com/v/RlpDFJZ_5gs

Here is some proof that the show is not completely white.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Philoctetes on March 28, 2012, 02:23:08 PM
Quote from: TheGSMoeller on March 28, 2012, 10:41:53 AM
http://www.youtube.com/v/RlpDFJZ_5gs

Here is some proof that the show is not completely white.

You're right. There are different shades of white like egg-shell and off-white and off-off-white.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Mirror Image on March 28, 2012, 04:59:53 PM
Quote from: TheGSMoeller on March 28, 2012, 10:41:53 AM
http://www.youtube.com/v/RlpDFJZ_5gs

Here is some proof that the show is not completely white.

Lol...:D
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: eyeresist on March 28, 2012, 05:02:36 PM
I don't have flash enabled. I will just carry on imagining this is a sketch with Frasier and Niles in blackface.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Philoctetes on March 28, 2012, 05:04:21 PM
Quote from: eyeresist on March 28, 2012, 05:02:36 PM
I don't have flash enabled. I will just carry on imagining this is a sketch with Frasier and Niles in blackface.

That's not far from the truth. It might even confirm your suspicions about racisms.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: ibanezmonster on March 28, 2012, 07:35:49 PM
Good LAWD, man!!!!
This weekend was wack! On Saturday, I had just finished spittin' some rhymes wit my homie, when I realized I had to go to the grocery store. So, I picked up some dinner- a packet of Purple Kool-Aid, fried chicken, collard greens, watermelon, and a biscuit. I went to check out and saw that I didn't have no more food stamps!  :o So I dashed out and the cops got me! Good lawd, you can never outrun white cops if you're a black man!

Spent Saturday night in jail... got out Sunday and went to church- I'm the bass guitarist. Got in at 8am, got out at 4pm. Short service. Then I drove my pimped out Cadillac to the court to shoot some hoops, and I saw one of my homeboys sniffin' some crack from the sidewalk!  :o I said, "Good lawd, don't you know a white cop can sense a black man sniffin' crack from up to 20 miles away?" We organized a game, and this fool fouled me so hard that I wanted a flagrant foul! I told that jit, "Yo dawg, you gonna give me an extra free throw. That's a flagrant!" Then he pulled out a gun, pointed it at me, and said, "You want a flagrant foul? I'll give you a flagrant foul."

Good lawd, the white man hates the black man and the black man hates the black man. I think I'm gonna quit this rap stuff and listen to BB King. Nobody loves me but my mother, and she whips me with a belt daily!  :(



;)
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: eyeresist on March 28, 2012, 08:49:25 PM
I don't see how it denigrates anyone to say they like fried chicken. (Unless you - or they - are a hardcore vegetarian.)
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Philoctetes on March 28, 2012, 09:31:02 PM
Quote from: eyeresist on March 28, 2012, 08:49:25 PM
I don't see how it denigrates anyone to say they like fried chicken. (Unless you - or they - are a hardcore vegetarian.)

Curious.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: eyeresist on March 28, 2012, 09:40:39 PM
I used to live in a vegetarian household, and would sometimes sneak out to the nearby KFC for a big box of greasy chicken. It always made me feel a bit sick afterwards - karma or guilt?
Title: Re: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Karl Henning on March 29, 2012, 03:17:34 AM
Quote from: eyeresist on March 28, 2012, 09:40:39 PM
I used to live in a vegetarian household, and would sometimes sneak out to the nearby KFC for a big box of greasy chicken. It always made me feel a bit sick afterwards - karma or guilt?

Neither: that stuff's purt near indigestible.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: ibanezmonster on March 29, 2012, 05:56:10 AM
Quote from: eyeresist on March 28, 2012, 09:40:39 PM
I used to live in a vegetarian household
:'(

Quote from: eyeresist on March 28, 2012, 09:40:39 PM
It always made me feel a bit sick afterwards - karma or guilt?
Probably the grease.

Hey, guess who also likes fried chicken? Mitt Romney!  :o He's really one of us!  :o

http://cnettv.cnet.com/mitt-romney-eats-lunch-kfc/9742-1_53-50018236.html
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Karl Henning on March 29, 2012, 06:04:40 AM
Funny how, every four years, you learn that someone unlikely enjoys grits . . . .
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: eyeresist on March 29, 2012, 04:42:20 PM
Quote from: karlhenning on March 29, 2012, 06:04:40 AMFunny how, every four years, you learn that someone unlikely enjoys grits . . . .

Also beer.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Ten thumbs on March 30, 2012, 01:31:12 PM
Quote from: Mirror Image on March 27, 2012, 07:11:38 PM

One of my favorite episodes of Frasier occurs in the 5th season. The episode is titled The Ski Lodge and here is a breakdown of the storyline:

Roz wins a free trip to a ski lodge, including lessons from a skiing instructor, but is talked into trading them to Frasier in return for a big screen TV. So Frasier decides to take the whole family to the ski lodge, including Daphne and her friend Annie, a swimsuit model. There they meet Guy (played by James Patrick Stuart), a gay ski instructor, who likes Niles and thinks he is gay too. This is confirmed by misinformation given by Martin who has hearing difficulty due to a blocked ear. Throughout the episode confusion arises as Frasier is lusting after Annie, who desires Niles. Niles, however, attempts throughout the episode to confess his feelings for Daphne, while Daphne attempts to pick up Guy, who thinks that Daphne and Annie are lesbians. Throughout the night, various people visit each other's rooms or discover someone in their bed. Once the truth is revealed, Frasier realized that no one is lusting after him.

This sounds like a classic farce scenario, which is hardly encouraging. Still, good new sitcoms are hard to find. Maybe the supply of situations has been exhausted. Also, we're sick to death of dysfunctional families.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: The new erato on March 31, 2012, 01:35:18 AM
Quote from: Ten thumbs on March 30, 2012, 01:31:12 PM
Also, we're sick to death of dysfunctional families.
Yes, Stuff like King of Queens (and several others) make me choke. When I occasionally stumble across it, all I can do is think "why don't she divorce the stupid slob?".

"How I met your mother OTOH" I find works.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Bulldog on March 31, 2012, 08:13:36 AM
Quote from: The new erato on March 31, 2012, 01:35:18 AM
Yes, Stuff like King of Queens (and several others) make me choke. When I occasionally stumble across it, all I can do is think "why don't she divorce the stupid slob?".

I guess you're not aware of the host of poor traits the wife exhibits.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Sergeant Rock on March 31, 2012, 08:31:18 AM
Quote from: Bulldog on March 31, 2012, 08:13:36 AM
I guess you're not aware of the host of poor traits the wife exhibits.

Her taste in men being the most obvious  ;D

Sarge
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: The new erato on March 31, 2012, 08:44:52 AM
Quote from: Bulldog on March 31, 2012, 08:13:36 AM
I guess you're not aware of the host of poor traits the wife exhibits.
Oh yes I am. But compared to him she's a peach. Anyway; the point is that such settings only can take so much before they go beyond the probable and ends in pure annoyance at the participants pure stupidity.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: Bulldog on March 31, 2012, 09:27:44 AM
Quote from: The new erato on March 31, 2012, 08:44:52 AM
Oh yes I am. But compared to him she's a peach. Anyway; the point is that such settings only can take so much before they go beyond the probable and ends in pure annoyance at the participants pure stupidity.

That's exactly how I feel about "How I met your mother" - infantile humor that gets old long before the half-hour ends.
Title: Re: Frasier - One Of The Greatest Sitcoms Of All-Time?
Post by: The new erato on March 31, 2012, 09:47:51 AM
Quote from: Bulldog on March 31, 2012, 09:27:44 AM
That's exactly how I feel about "How I met your mother" - infantile humor that gets old long before the half-hour ends.
I didn't know you had met my mother.  ;D

I feel the characters work in that series, and the jokes aren't all about picking on each others weaknesses. In short, I can understand why the characters can stand each other, and how their relationships actually might work in real life, which is the problem I have with many series where the only point is that the characters are all a......s and that the series would have no jokes if they weren't just that.