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The Music Room => Composer Discussion => Topic started by: SurprisedByBeauty on March 13, 2018, 03:26:49 PM

Poll
Question: Which is your favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle (if you have one) [max. 2 votes]
Option 1: Rozhdestvensky, Moscow RSO, Melodiya, 1962-67 votes: 7
Option 2: Martinon, NO ORTF, Vox, 1970s? votes: 1
Option 3: Kosler, Czech Phil, Supraphon, 1973-82 votes: 1
Option 4: Weller, LSO & LPO, Decca, 1974-78 votes: 2
Option 5: Järvi, RSNO, Chandos, 1984-85 votes: 8
Option 6: Rostropovich, OdNFrance, Erato/Warner, 1985-?? votes: 0
Option 7: Ozawa, BPh, DG, 1989-92 votes: 5
Option 8: Kitayenko I, Moscow Phil., Melodiya [does not exist] votes: 1
Option 9: Kuchar, Ukraine NSO, Naxos, 1994/95 votes: 3
Option 10: Gergiev I, LSO, Decca, 2004 votes: 3
Option 11: Kitayenko II, Gürzenich, Capriccio/Phoenix, 2005-07 votes: 3
Option 12: Ashkenazy, Sydney Symphony, Exton, 2009 votes: 0
Option 13: Karabits, Bournemouth, Onyx, 2014? votes: 3
Option 14: Alsop, OSESP, Naxos, 2011-15? votes: 0
Option 15: Gaffigan, Netherlands RPO, Challenge, 2014?-2017? votes: 0
Option 16: Too little exposure to say votes: 9
Option 17: Has not been made yet votes: 2
Title: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: SurprisedByBeauty on March 13, 2018, 03:26:49 PM
Gergiev and Litton are working toward (new) cycles. Sokhiev may be.

I had included Leinsdorf's, which is not complete (2, 3, 5, 6) but removed it. Even Ashkenazy's first go would count at 4/7 or, counting the 4th twice, 50%. Kitayenko's first is nowhere to be found. I suspect I may have missed one or two, but this should cover most. Corrections and add. info most welcome.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Baron Scarpia on March 13, 2018, 03:47:14 PM
I voted for Ozawa, since the only other one I've listened to is Jarvi, and I know Jarvi is not my favorite.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Sergeant Rock on March 13, 2018, 03:53:49 PM
Of the eight and a half cycles I own, Ozawa and Kitajenko II are favorites.

Sarge
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Karl Henning on March 13, 2018, 03:58:30 PM
Quote from: Baron Scarpia on March 13, 2018, 03:47:14 PM
I voted for Ozawa, since the only other one I've listened to is Jarvi, and I know Jarvi is not my favorite.

I voted for Ozawa full heartily; and likewise, know the Järvi, but cannot endorse it.

Quote from: Sergeant Rock on March 13, 2018, 03:53:49 PM
Of the eight and a half cycles I own, Ozawa and Kitajenko II are favorites.

Sarge

Well, my curiosity is piqued. Darn you, Jens! 8)
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: SurprisedByBeauty on March 13, 2018, 04:00:08 PM
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on March 13, 2018, 03:58:30 PM
I voted for Ozawa full heartily; and likewise, know the Järvi, but cannot endorse it.

Well, my curiosity is piqued. Darn you, Jens! 8)

Muargh-muargh-muargh! ( <- my evil laugh)
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: SurprisedByBeauty on March 13, 2018, 04:02:34 PM
Quote from: Sergeant Rock on March 13, 2018, 03:53:49 PM
Of the eight and a half cycles I own, Ozawa and Kitajenko II are favorites.

Sarge

I must say that I found that Jarvi made it easy to appreciate these symphonies, but I've not actually understood them. I voted for ignorance and Jaervi, therefore. In concert, only Gergiev has made me really dig them.

Also on my shelf: Kosler, Gergiev I and all his new recordings (perhaps not listened-to, yet), most of Kuchar, Leinsdorf, Kitayenko (not sufficiently listened-to, yet), and lots of individ. recordings that don't amount to a cycle. Oh, and I should have most of Gaffigan, but haven't heard them yet.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Karl Henning on March 13, 2018, 04:08:02 PM
Quote from: SurprisedByBeauty on March 13, 2018, 04:02:34 PM
I must say that I found that Jarvi made it easy to appreciate these symphonies, but I've not actually understood them.

The Järvi IMO is something of a missed opportunity. I've revisited it now and again, but generally find insufficient there, there.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Sergeant Rock on March 13, 2018, 04:20:21 PM
Quote from: SurprisedByBeauty on March 13, 2018, 04:02:34 PM
I must say that I found that Jarvi made it easy to appreciate these symphonies, but I've not actually understood them. I voted for ignorance and Jaervi, therefore. In concert, only Gergiev has made me really dig them.

Also on my shelf: Kosler, Gergiev I and all his new recordings (perhaps not listened-to, yet), most of Kuchar, Leinsdorf, Kitayenko (not sufficiently listened-to, yet), and lots of individ. recordings that don't amount to a cycle. Oh, and I should have most of Gaffigan, but haven't heard them yet.

I have: Rozhdestvensky, Rostropovich, Gergiev I, Kosler, Ozawa, Kitajenko, Järvi, Weller and Martinon 1-4. Järvi has grown on me (as I mentioned in the listening thread awhile ago) but his happy ending Seventh really grates. I like Gergiev much more than I expected to. Kosler was a disappointment (but I may have been expecting too much; need to give it another listen with no expectations).

Kitajenko and Ozawa both milk the symphonies for their beauty (even the tough ones); I like that.

Sarge
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Baron Scarpia on March 13, 2018, 04:22:05 PM
Quote from: Sergeant Rock on March 13, 2018, 04:20:21 PM
I have: Rozhdestvensky, Rostropovich, Gergiev I, Kosler, Ozawa, Kitajenko, Järvi, Weller and Martinon 1-4. Järvi has grown on me (as I mentioned in the listening thread awhile ago) but his happy ending Seventh really grates. I like Gergiev much more than I expected to. Kosler was a disappointment (but I may have been expecting too much; need to give it another listen with no expectations).

Sarge

Weller?
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Sergeant Rock on March 13, 2018, 04:23:13 PM
Quote from: Baron Scarpia on March 13, 2018, 04:22:05 PM
Weller?

Another one with the happy ending Seventh. Cannot abide that  ;D

Sarge
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Cato on March 13, 2018, 04:32:05 PM
My initial experiences with the Second,Third, and Sixth Symphonies was through Erich Leinsdorf (hard to believe he died 25 years ago!) on RCA.  I first heard the Fifth Symphony on Herbert von Karajan's DGG record: all of these recordings were magnificent the latter nearly blew up my speakers!

Anyway, I also have the Jaervi, and they are good, but not on the same level as Leinsdorf or von Karajan.

Or at least...such is my memory of them!  It would seem like it is time to revisit them all!

Even...(cue dramatic Boom-Boom-Boom BOOM music) The Seventh Symphony!  :o 8)

Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Josquin13 on March 13, 2018, 06:15:28 PM
I much prefer young Kirill Karabits recent Prokofiev Symphony 1-7 cycle in Bournemouth to any other of recent years, including Gergiev & Kitayenko's.  (Karabits' cycle is well recorded too.)  If you compare Karabit's 3rd to Gergiev's, I expect you'll come away with little doubt as to who's more deeply inside this music; at least, that's how I felt, & it was Karabits' 3rd by a good margin.  I'd even put Karabits' 7th in the same class with Nikolai Malko's legendary recording, which is saying something.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=553PovHqHPE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OUn3PMZRzKM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ac6rto6r7Ww

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fytnJA156xw

Historically, Gennady Rozhdestvensky's Moscow RSO cycle is easily my top pick, despite the less than ideal 1960s Russian sound.  Rozhdestvensky is masterful in these symphonies--it's a benchmark set, IMO. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlvStcZvqrs

It's also worth trying to track down any other Prokofiev performances conducted by Rozhdestvensky, such as his 1971 5th with the Leningrad Philharmonic (a BBC legends CD):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1UQQH5NfwCw

I also like Malko's 1st & 7th very much too.

Those are all the recordings of these symphonies I need.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Mirror Image on March 13, 2018, 06:59:30 PM
If Litton completes his cycle with the same kind of enthusiasm and expert playing his other recordings have displayed then his cycle gets my vote. I suppose if backed into a corner then Kitajenko's cycle on Phoenix would get my vote right now. But to be honest, Prokofiev's symphonies are far from favorite works of mine. I prefer his ballets and chamber works. I haven't ventured into his piano music yet or the operas (but I don't like opera in general with a few noted exceptions).
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Daverz on March 13, 2018, 09:09:38 PM
Quote from: Mirror Image on March 13, 2018, 06:59:30 PM
If Litton completes his cycle with the same kind of enthusiasm and expert playing his other recordings have displayed then his cycle gets my vote. I suppose if backed into a corner then Kitajenko's cycle on Phoenix would get my vote right now. But to be honest, Prokofiev's symphonies are far from favorite works of mine. I prefer his ballets and chamber works. I haven't ventured into his piano music yet or the operas (but I don't like opera in general with a few noted exceptions).

If you want to ease into the opera, I suggest the video of Betrothal in a Monastery with Netrebko.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: ritter on March 14, 2018, 12:21:51 AM
Good you're running this poll, Jens! Baron Scarpia and I were  asking about Prokofiev symphony cycles in the WAYLTN thread, and we may find the answer here  :). I won't vote, as I have only the Rostropovich cycle, and am not really thrilled with it....
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on March 14, 2018, 02:26:06 AM
Listened to quite a few and Kitajenko II made the biggest impression on me. I hope that there is another excellent one to be made in the future.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Draško on March 14, 2018, 03:05:54 AM
Quote from: SurprisedByBeauty on March 13, 2018, 03:26:49 PM
Kitayenko's first is nowhere to be found.

Kitayenko I doesn't exist. 6 & 7 were never recorded. He emigrated, or USSR collapsed, whichever came first. Recording dates for 1-5 are '85-'89.

As for the topic, I have only Gergiev I, with which I'm reasonably satisfied. The sound is bit close and dry.

Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Cato on March 14, 2018, 03:51:51 AM
Josquin 13 recommended Kirill Karabits above: this morning I compared the opening movement of the Third Symphony from him and the Bournemouth Symphony to the 1960's Erich Leinsdorf/Boston Symphony performance.

The former is a good performance, but the "bite" and hysteria in the music is really brought out by Leinsdorf and Company.

Still, I will give Karabits a chance, along with revisiting the Jaervi cycle.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: vandermolen on March 14, 2018, 03:55:26 AM
I voted for Rozhdestvensky whose No.5 is unrivalled in my view - however, I also thoroughly enjoyed the Martinon cycle with the ORTF - my introduction to no.6 in particular.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Karl Henning on March 14, 2018, 04:11:09 AM
Quote from: Cato on March 14, 2018, 03:51:51 AM
Josquin 13 recommended Kirill Karabits above: this morning I compared the opening movement of the Third Symphony from him and the Bournemouth Symphony to the 1960's Erich Leinsdorf/Boston Symphony performance.

The former is a good performance, but the "bite" and hysteria in the music is really brought out by Leinsdorf and Company.

Still, I will give Karabits a chance, along with revisiting the Jaervi cycle.

The Leinsdorf was a wonderful surprise.  Pity we don't have all seven (eight 8) ) from that team.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: SurprisedByBeauty on March 14, 2018, 06:02:28 AM
Quote from: Draško on March 14, 2018, 03:05:54 AM
Kitayenko I doesn't exist. 6 & 7 were never recorded. He emigrated, or USSR collapsed, whichever came first. Recording dates for 1-5 are '85-'89.


Ah, thanks much for that info! I was getting frustrated not finding much of a trace of it, except one or two individual recordings.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Mirror Image on March 14, 2018, 06:23:38 AM
Quote from: Daverz on March 13, 2018, 09:09:38 PM
If you want to ease into the opera, I suggest the video of Betrothal in a Monastery with Netrebko.

Thanks, but I doubt I'll be watching/listening to the music if Netrebko is involved. She's a babe and I'll be envisioning her in another form of entertainment. ;) ;D

(https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4025/4348740008_f5a9d050b2_b.jpg)
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: SurprisedByBeauty on March 14, 2018, 06:57:58 AM
Quote from: Mirror Image on March 14, 2018, 06:23:38 AM
Thanks, but I doubt I'll be watching/listening to the music if Netrebko is involved. She's a babe and I'll be envisioning her in another form of entertainment. ;) ;D

(https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4025/4348740008_f5a9d050b2_b.jpg)

She ain't looking like that anymore, she doesn't.

But Prokofiev!
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Mirror Image on March 14, 2018, 07:58:28 PM
Quote from: SurprisedByBeauty on March 14, 2018, 06:57:58 AM
She ain't looking like that anymore, she doesn't.

Well, I can certainly continue to dream. :D
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Daverz on March 14, 2018, 08:41:47 PM
Quote from: SurprisedByBeauty on March 14, 2018, 06:57:58 AM
She ain't looking like that anymore, she doesn't.

But Prokofiev!

She's adorable in the Betrothal video.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: vandermolen on March 14, 2018, 10:57:10 PM
I realise that I'm allowed two votes - so, I've put Jean Martinon and the ORTF on the map.
8)
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: SurprisedByBeauty on March 15, 2018, 12:48:55 AM
Can anyone who has the MARTINON check the recording dates (earliest and last) for me?

Much appreciated!
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: vandermolen on March 15, 2018, 11:11:27 AM
Quote from: SurprisedByBeauty on March 15, 2018, 12:48:55 AM
Can anyone who has the MARTINON check the recording dates (earliest and last) for me?

Much appreciated!

I do have the complete Vox/Turnabout cycle but due to redecoration my CDs are all over the place at the moment. I will look out for them however. Early 1970s is my guess.

PS The Arkiv Music website shows a date of 1971 for the recording of symphonies 2,3 and 6 (ORTF Martinon Vox/Turnabout). Probably the same for the others as well.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Baron Scarpia on March 15, 2018, 02:17:38 PM
Placed an order for one volume of Karabits, V4 including the relatively unpopular 4th and 6th symphonies. Maybe that will be the set for me. Litton/BIS occurred to me, but I have to admit the uniformly negative reviews put me off.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: NikF on March 15, 2018, 03:54:54 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on March 15, 2018, 11:11:27 AM
I do have the complete Vox/Turnabout cycle but due to redecoration my CDs are all over the place at the moment. I will look out for them however. Early 1970s is my guess.

PS The Arkiv Music website shows a date of 1971 for the recording of symphonies 2,3 and 6 (ORTF Martinon Vox/Turnabout). Probably the same for the others as well.

Yeah, I just looked and the case and booklet for the 2, 3 and 6 etc states a recording date of 1971. But the case/booklet for the other symphonies has no recording date. Neither have details of where the recording took place.

And fwiw, I had another listen and to my untutored ear these performances sound very romantic - hugely different from any other interpretations I've heard, although I'm sure others will find more in them.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: SurprisedByBeauty on March 15, 2018, 04:03:47 PM
Quote from: NikF on March 15, 2018, 03:54:54 PM
Yeah, I just looked and the case and booklet for the 2, 3 and 6 etc states a recording date of 1971. But the case/booklet for the other symphonies has no recording date. Neither have details of where the recording took place.

And fwiw, I had another listen and to my untutored ear these performances sound very romantic - hugely different from any other interpretations I've heard, although I'm sure others will find more in them.

Thanks much!
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Baron Scarpia on March 15, 2018, 04:04:21 PM
Martinon also recorded 5 and 7 for Decca with the Paris Conservatory orchestra. Anyone have an opinion? (Not a cycle, but still.)
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: NikF on March 15, 2018, 04:11:31 PM
Quote from: Baron Scarpia on March 15, 2018, 04:04:21 PM
Martinon also recorded 5 and 7 for Decca with the Paris Conservatory orchestra. Anyone have an opinion? (Not a cycle, but still.)

I've heard the fifth (if it's the one from the late 1950s) and found it more rugged/less romantic than the later recording.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: vandermolen on March 15, 2018, 10:20:54 PM
Quote from: Baron Scarpia on March 15, 2018, 04:04:21 PM
Martinon also recorded 5 and 7 for Decca with the Paris Conservatory orchestra. Anyone have an opinion? (Not a cycle, but still.)

I recently bought this CD and only heard it once. I enjoyed it but not necessarily more than the Vox/Turnabout versions. Opinions are quite polarised on it. No 5 has a faster slow movement than other recordings I know and No 7 has the 'happy ending' which I don't like. Will listen again.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Baron Scarpia on March 16, 2018, 06:26:13 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on March 15, 2018, 10:20:54 PM
I recently bought this CD and only heard it once. I enjoyed it but not necessarily more than the Vox/Turnabout versions. Opinions are quite polarised on it. No 5 has a faster slow movement than other recordings I know and No 7 has the 'happy ending' which I don't like. Will listen again.

Useful information, thanks.

Quote from: NikF on March 15, 2018, 04:11:31 PM
I've heard the fifth (if it's the one from the late 1950s) and found it more rugged/less romantic than the later recording.

Can you put your finger on what makes it "romantic?"
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Baron Scarpia on March 16, 2018, 06:30:48 AM
I've found my way with No 3.

I started with Jarvi, and I was lost. I experienced incomprehension.

I listened to Ozawa, I felt I understood, but there was little pleasure.

Then I found this, I understand, and I enjoy it.

[asin]B00000E554[/asin]

Chailly is working for me, and this recording has genuinely good audio engineering. Still, the symphony has some features that grate on me. One of the things I like best from orchestral sound is the way the bass violins can provide a deep, rich foundation for the music. In this work, too often it is the rumble of percussion that is providing the foundation. And there are too many extended passages of screeching (treble instruments playing loud in high register with no bass foundation). It's never going to become a favorite work, but I can say it gave me pleasure to listen to this one.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: vandermolen on March 16, 2018, 06:48:48 AM
Quote from: Baron Scarpia on March 16, 2018, 06:30:48 AM
I've found my way with No 3.

I started with Jarvi, and I was lost. I experienced incomprehension.

I listened to Ozawa, I felt I understood, but there was little pleasure.

Then I found this, I understand, and I enjoy it.

[asin]B00000E554[/asin]


That's a great CD. The sad, lyrical closing section of the first movement of Symphony No.3 is one of my favourite moments in any Prokofiev symphony.
Chailly is working for me, and this recording has genuinely good audio engineering. Still, the symphony has some features that grate on me. One of the things I like best from orchestral sound is the way the bass violins can provide a deep, rich foundation for the music. In this work, too often it is the rumble of percussion that is providing the foundation. And there are too many extended passages of screeching (treble instruments playing loud in high register with no bass foundation). It's never going to become a favorite work, but I can say it gave me pleasure to listen to this one.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: NikF on March 16, 2018, 07:07:39 AM
Quote from: Baron Scarpia on March 16, 2018, 06:26:13 AM

Can you put your finger on what makes it "romantic?"

Probably not, but I'll try.
In comparison to other performances it sounds less than straightforward. Sometimes there's an the impression of meandering through passages, being sidetracked, maybe even adding deeper colour to them.

Maybe it's better to define what I mean by romantic in the first place and then there's a frame of reference. The example that comes to mind is if I compare Pollini playing the adagio of the Brahms D minor to that of Grimaud; the latter emoting all over the place, perhaps indulging herself in a passing whimsy, and moments that seem delivered almost with a sigh. She's putting a Softar filter on it.

Yeah, that's my best shot. But I think the Martinon/ORTF is definitely worth a a listen, although my copy was a gift and knowing what I do now I'm not sure I'd have bought it for myself.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Baron Scarpia on March 16, 2018, 07:41:43 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on March 16, 2018, 06:48:48 AM
The sad, lyrical closing section of the first movement of Symphony No.3 is one of my favourite moments in any Prokofiev symphony.

Yes, the first movement is the highlight of the work and the passage you describe made an impression on me also.

Looks like I will be piecing my Prokofiev cycle together one symphony at a time. (Where's Haitink, when you need him?) On the other hand, maybe Karabits will do it for me.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Baron Scarpia on March 16, 2018, 07:55:24 AM
Quote from: NikF on March 16, 2018, 07:07:39 AMShe's putting a Softar filter on it.

...and Pollini is shooting Tri-X with a #25 red filter.  I think I get you.  :)

Damn, now I need to put Pollini's Prokofiev 7 on my listening list...
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Karl Henning on March 16, 2018, 08:26:49 AM
Quote from: Baron Scarpia on March 16, 2018, 07:55:24 AM
Damn, now I need to put Pollini's Prokofiev 7 on my listening list...

You knew the risks . . . .
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: NikF on March 16, 2018, 08:30:41 AM
Quote from: Baron Scarpia on March 16, 2018, 07:55:24 AM
...and Pollini is shooting Tri-X with a #25 red filter.  I think I get you.  :)

Damn, now I need to put Pollini's Prokofiev 7 on my listening list...

Couldn't have said it better myself.  8)
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: vandermolen on March 16, 2018, 12:30:36 PM
Quote from: Baron Scarpia on March 16, 2018, 07:41:43 AM
Yes, the first movement is the highlight of the work and the passage you describe made an impression on me also.

Looks like I will be piecing my Prokofiev cycle together one symphony at a time. (Where's Haitink, when you need him?) On the other hand, maybe Karabits will do it for me.

Sorry, I cocked-up the quote system above, making it look like my comments were yours.
::)
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Baron Scarpia on March 17, 2018, 12:34:22 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on March 16, 2018, 12:30:36 PM
Sorry, I cocked-up the quote system above, making it look like my comments were yours.
::)

No problem.

After my newfound appreciation of #3 derived from Chailly's recording I listened to Ozawa and Jarvi again. There is no reason to listen to either of those recordings ever again. Jarvis seems uncontrolled, under-rehearsed, as KH has previously commented.

I have one disc from the Karabits cycle coming, and I will be exploring Rostropovich, Gergiev and Kitajenko all of which, astonishingly, I have. Amazing how I could accumulate recordings of a composer whose symphonies I thought I hated.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Turner on March 17, 2018, 12:41:34 AM
I´ve only got the Weller cycle and most of Järvi´s, plus some individual recordings, so am not really able to vote here ... :(

Favourites for me have been Svetlanov´s, Ancerl´s, Martinon/Lamoureux & Fricsay/RIAS 1st, Kondrashin/CtGebouw´s 3rd, Järvi´s 6th ...
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: vandermolen on March 17, 2018, 01:25:52 AM
Quote from: Turner on March 17, 2018, 12:41:34 AM
I´ve only got the Weller cycle and most of Järvi´s, plus some individual recordings, so am not really able to vote here ... :(

Favourites for me have been Svetlanov´s, Ancerl´s, Martinon/Lamoureux & Fricsay/RIAS 1st, Kondrashin/CtGebouw´s 3rd, Järvi´s 6th ...
Nothing wrong with Weller cycle.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Baron Scarpia on March 18, 2018, 11:23:46 PM
Kitajenko!

Just listened to the Kitajenko/Koln recording of the third and I find it just as satisfying as Chailly, I think I have found my cycle. Crisp execution, very good sound, all that heavy brass orchestration properly balanced with the rest of the orchestra. A spot listen to Rostropovich finds him more to my taste than Ozawa and Jarvi, but less so than Kitajenko, although that might change with more listening. I think the my next step will be listen to Kitajenko's recording of the second, and go from there.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Karl Henning on March 19, 2018, 01:10:15 AM
Cool.

Mine should land, well, tomorrow . . . .
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: snyprrr on March 19, 2018, 07:54:52 AM
No.1: don't care

No.2: Ozawa

No.3: ???Chailly?

No4A:
No.4B:... I thought I had Rosty with both but it has only one... Rosty/Erato

No.5: Muti, Ashkenazy

No.6: Rostropovich

No.7: Ozawa
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Baron Scarpia on March 19, 2018, 09:10:37 AM
One advantage with Ozawa: with the anemic bass in that DG recording the bass drum isn't so disruptive as it is is Kitajenko and Chailly, where it is realistically captured.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Mirror Image on March 19, 2018, 09:14:12 AM
Quote from: Baron Scarpia on March 18, 2018, 11:23:46 PM
Kitajenko!

Just listened to the Kitajenko/Koln recording of the third and I find it just as satisfying as Chailly, I think I have found my cycle. Crisp execution, very good sound, all that heavy brass orchestration properly balanced with the rest of the orchestra. A spot listen to Rostropovich finds him more to my taste than Ozawa and Jarvi, but less so than Kitajenko, although that might change with more listening. I think the my next step will be listen to Kitajenko's recording of the second, and go from there.

Have you heard any of Litton's performances on BIS? I quite like them.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Baron Scarpia on March 19, 2018, 09:21:53 AM
Quote from: Mirror Image on March 19, 2018, 09:14:12 AM
Have you heard any of Litton's performances on BIS? I quite like them.

I was tempted but the bottom line is that, in the grand scheme of things, these works are not that important to me. It is not a matter of finding the perfect recording, but finding a recording that doesn't have deficiencies that render them unlistenable to me (Jarvi and Ozawa). Kitajenko and Rostropovich have fixed that. I also have Gergiev somewhere. It is really absurd that I have so many recordings of this stuff already. The only Prokofiev symphonies that I really like are 5 and 7, and I already have multiple good options for those.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: vandermolen on March 19, 2018, 09:23:21 AM
Quote from: Mirror Image on March 19, 2018, 09:14:12 AM
Have you heard any of Litton's performances on BIS? I quite like them.
Not aimed at me I know but Litton's No.6 is my favourite modern recording of that great work.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Mirror Image on March 19, 2018, 09:33:10 AM
Quote from: Baron Scarpia on March 19, 2018, 09:21:53 AM
I was tempted, but the bottom line is that, in the grand scheme of things, these works are not that important to me. It is not a matter of finding the perfect recording, but finding a recording that doesn't have deficiencies that render them unlistenable to me (Jarvi and Ozawa). Kitajenko and Rostropovich have fixed that. I also have Gergiev somewhere. It is really absurd that I have so many recordings of this stuff already. The only Prokofiev symphonies that I really like are 5 and 7, and I already have multiple good options for those.

I'm of a similar mind. I don't really consider these symphonies the pinnacle of Prokofiev's oeuvre, but I'm afraid I don't know his oeuvre as well as I should (i. e. piano music, operas). This said, his ballet music is much more important to me.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Daverz on March 19, 2018, 09:49:11 AM
I like all the symphonies, perhaps 7 the least of them, and No. 6 is particularly close to my heart.  Among oft-recorded Prokofiev, I think the Scythian Suite is the only thing I can do without.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Baron Scarpia on March 19, 2018, 09:53:38 AM
Perhaps I will develop a better appreciation now that I have found recordings that appeal to me more. I think I'd hate Beethoven if my only choices were Ozawa and Jarvi.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Karl Henning on March 19, 2018, 10:15:59 AM
I am very fond indeed of the First, Second, Fifth, Sixth and Seventh.  I genuinely like the Third & Fourth (both versions), though my own ardor there does not rise to the level of my preferred five.

Are there pieces which I like even better than my favorite symphonies?  Romeo & Juliet, L'enfant prodigue, the g minor Violin Concerto, the f minor Violin Sonata, probably the Seventh & Eighth Piano Sonatas.  But I do not feel these "crowding out" the symphonies from my musical affection.


Quote from: Baron Scarpia on March 19, 2018, 09:53:38 AM
[...]I think I'd hate Beethoven if my only choices were Ozawa and Jarvi.


I am sorry if the Ozawa has been such a disappointment.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Baron Scarpia on March 19, 2018, 10:22:35 AM
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on March 19, 2018, 10:15:59 AMI am sorry if the Ozawa has been such a disappointment.

I am not sure if you are under the impression that I got the Ozawa under the influence of your recommendation. Maybe I did, I'm not sure myself. Regardless, I don't really regret getting it, because at least it gave me the impression that there is something worthwhile in Prokofiev's symphonies (which Jarvi did not). So it opened the door to Prokofiev for me (sort of like one of those slapstick comedy scenes where the person opens the door to a taxi and promptly exits the other door).
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Karl Henning on March 19, 2018, 10:25:43 AM
Ah, very good.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Baron Scarpia on March 25, 2018, 09:48:59 PM
Prokofiev Roundup, most to least favorite (disclaimer based on incomplete listening)

Kitajenko/Koln - Remarkable clarity and balance, great audio
Rostropovich/Orchestra National de France - Slightly less clarity, a bit more sentimental, great audio
Gergiev/London Symphony - Not bad, lacks clarity, audio less than ideal
Ozawa/Berlin - might have like it, audio too shrill and lacking in convincing soundstage
Jarvi/Scottish - sounds unrehearsed, uncontrolled, audio to reverberate for my taste

Recently listened to the original version of Symphony No 4 and found it interesting and enjoyable. What are you thoughts about what versions of the 4th symphony is best?
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Andy D. on July 25, 2019, 05:57:06 AM
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on March 19, 2018, 10:15:59 AM
I am very fond indeed of the First, Second, Fifth, Sixth and Seventh.  I genuinely like the Third & Fourth (both versions), though my own ardor there does not rise to the level of my preferred five.

Are there pieces which I like even better than my favorite symphonies?  Romeo & Juliet, L'enfant prodigue, the g minor Violin Concerto, the f minor Violin Sonata, probably the Seventh & Eighth Piano Sonatas.  But I do not feel these "crowding out" the symphonies from my musical affection.



I am sorry if the Ozawa has been such a disappointment.

I had my first listen to Profokiev's 5th today and really liked it. Is the Ozawa a winner, Karl?
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: SymphonicAddict on July 25, 2019, 05:59:54 PM
I'm not Karl, but the Ozawa on DG is one of my favorites. I enjoy the N. Järvi on Chandos as well.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: vandermolen on July 25, 2019, 10:30:35 PM
Quote from: SymphonicAddict on July 25, 2019, 05:59:54 PM
I'm not Karl, but the Ozawa on DG is one of my favorites. I enjoy the N. Järvi on Chandos as well.
I'm also not Karl but Rozhdestvensky's Melodiya recording would be my No.1 choice.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: SurprisedByBeauty on July 26, 2019, 12:16:36 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on July 25, 2019, 10:30:35 PM
I'm also not Karl but Rozhdestvensky's Melodiya recording would be my No.1 choice.

I'm also not Karl, but Sarge would recommend the Ozawa.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: relm1 on July 26, 2019, 06:19:43 AM
Quote from: Andy D. on July 25, 2019, 05:57:06 AM
I had my first listen to Profokiev's 5th today and really liked it. Is the Ozawa a winner, Karl?

I'm also not Karl, but am speaking on his behalf when I say also very much like Dutoit/Montreal No. 5, Jarvi too.  MTT/LSO is very good.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: André on July 26, 2019, 08:25:09 AM
I'm not Karl either, but Leinsdorf/Boston in an incomplete cycle is just the ticket for me.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Sergeant Rock on July 26, 2019, 08:37:27 AM
Quote from: SurprisedByBeauty on July 26, 2019, 12:16:36 AM
I'm also not Karl, but Sarge would recommend the Ozawa.

'tis true.

Sarge
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Karl Henning on July 26, 2019, 09:51:47 AM
Quote from: Andy D. on July 25, 2019, 05:57:06 AM
I had my first listen to Profokiev's 5th today and really liked it. Is the Ozawa a winner, Karl?


The Sarge & I are united in our admiration of the Ozawa set, Andy.
Title: Re: Favorite Prokofiev Symphony Cycle
Post by: Andy D. on July 26, 2019, 12:26:12 PM
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on July 26, 2019, 09:51:47 AM

The Sarge & I are united in our admiration of the Ozawa set, Andy.
Then I'm doubly sold.