Now it's Beethoven's turn.
Different rules once again. You are teaching a 12-week, 36-contact hour college course in Beethoven's music and you must create a syllabus. You may feel that some works will require 3 classes, while others can be covered in less than one contact hour each. Obviously you cannot cover everything. Obviously some works will be duplicated in various lists. Your job is to (a) create the syllabus, and (b) write a brief proposal so that your department head understands what you are trying to achieve with the course.
The Beethoven catalog (excluding all the works without opus numbers) lists 138 opus numbers. Following post 138 (if we get that far), further proposals will be ignored and the thread will be locked as soon as possible after. Then a new thread will be started where we can vote for the top three courses and have a discussion.
Quote from: Sforzando on September 01, 2009, 07:31:41 PM
Now it's Beethoven's turn.
Different rules once again. You are teaching a 12-week, 36-contact hour college course in Beethoven's music and you must create a syllabus. You may feel that some works will require 3 classes, while others can be covered in less than one contact hour each. Obviously you cannot cover everything. Obviously some works will be duplicated in various lists. Your job is to (a) create the syllabus, and (b) write a brief proposal so that your department head understands what you are trying to achieve with the course.
This sounds like real work.
This sounds like your work. :P
Some time ago I posted a topic about Fauré in the General Section.
It was immediately relegated to the Composers Section by an anonymous moderator.
As I suggested at the time, does this happen to Beethoven topic nr 1001, too?
Quote from: Sforzando on September 01, 2009, 07:31:41 PM
(excluding all the works without opus numbers)
I think this
a priori exclusion would be more formulaic than necessary; for instance, it would exclude among others two rather substantial cantatas:
Trauerkantate auf den Tod Kaiser Josephs II. (Funeral Cantata on the Death of Emperor Joseph II) WoO.87 and
Kantate auf die Erhebung Leopolds II. zur Kaiserwürde (Cantata on the Accession/Elevation of Leopold II to the Imperial Dignity) WoO.88, works no less substantial - especially the former - than e.g.
Der glorreiche Augenblick op.136.
Quote from: Wanderer on September 01, 2009, 10:52:57 PM
I think this a priori exclusion would be more formulaic than necessary; for instance, it would exclude among others two rather substantial cantatas: Trauerkantate auf den Tod Kaiser Josephs II. (Funeral Cantata on the Death of Emperor Joseph II) WoO.87 and Kantate auf die Erhebung Leopolds II. zur Kaiserwürde (Cantata on the Accession/Elevation of Leopold II to the Imperial Dignity) WoO.88, works no less substantial - especially the former - than e.g. Der glorreiche Augenblick op.136.
I agree. Other sensible losses would be the Andante favori WoO 57 and the most remarkable 32 Variations WoO 80.
Quote from: Wanderer on September 01, 2009, 10:52:57 PM
I think this a priori exclusion would be more formulaic than necessary; for instance, it would exclude among others two rather substantial cantatas: Trauerkantate auf den Tod Kaiser Josephs II. (Funeral Cantata on the Death of Emperor Joseph II) WoO.87 and Kantate auf die Erhebung Leopolds II. zur Kaiserwürde (Cantata on the Accession/Elevation of Leopold II to the Imperial Dignity) WoO.88, works no less substantial - especially the former - than e.g. Der glorreiche Augenblick op.136.
Perhaps I was insufficiently clear, but there is no a priori exclusion of any works whatsoever. I have simply used the number 138 to indicate
the number of posts after which the thread will close. By all means include any WoO you wish in your course.
OK, six posts so far that have done nothing but discuss or complain about the challenge as formulated. Does anyone actually want to participate?
Molto bene, Sforzando.
Hope I understand the rules, Poco. I'll have a go at it. The chronology can change for the actual course presentation; in fact it should. But I'm starting at the beginning anyway, since I won't get so mixed up. :)
Op 7 Piano Sonata in Eb - .5 hour
Op 9 #3 String Trio in c minor - .5 hour
Op 13 Piano Sonata in c minor - .5 hour
Op 20 Septet in Eb - .5 hour
Op 19 Piano Concerto #2 in Bb - 1 hour (actually the 1st concerto)
Op 18 6 String Quartets - 2 hours
Op 21 Symphony #1 - .5 hour
Op 27 2 Sonatas
"quasi una Fantasia" - 1 hour
Op 28 Sonata in D for Keyboard - .5 hour
Op 31 3 sonatas for Keyboard - 1 hour
Op 34 6 Variations in F on an
Original Theme for Keyboard - .5 hour
Op 35 The Eroica Variations - .5 hour
Op 36 Symphony #2 in D - 1 hour
Op 43 "Creatures of Prometheus - .5 hour
Op 47 Sonata in A & a
for Violin & Keyboard - .5 hour
Op 53 Piano Sonata in C +
WoO 57 "Andante favori" - .5 hour
Op 55 Symphony in Eb - 1 hour
Op 57 Sonata in f minor - .5 hour
Subtotal 12 hours (first 1/3 of the course)
Op 58 Piano Concerto #4 - .5 hour
WoO 80 Variations for keyboard - .5 hour
Op 59 3 String Quartets - 2 hours
Op 60 Symphony #4 in Bb - .5 hour
Op 61 Violin Concerto in D - .5 hour
Op 67 Symphony #5 - .5 hour
Op 68 Symphony #6 - .5 hour
Op 69 Cello Sonata #3 in A - .5 hour
Op 72 Fidelio or Leonore - 2 hours
Op 73 Piano Concerto #5 - .5 hour
Op 74 String Quartet in Eb - .5 hour
Op 81a Piano Sonata in Eb - .5 hour
Op 90 Piano Sonata in e - .5 hour
Op 92 Symphony #7 - .5 hour
Op 93 Symphony #8 - .5 hour
Op 95 Quartet in f - .5 hour
Op 96 Violin Sonata in G - .5 hour
Op 97 Piano Trio in Bb - .5 hour
Subtotal 12 (2/3 of the course)
Op 101 Piano Sonata - .5 hour
Op 102 2 Cello Sonatas - 1 hour
Op 106 Piano Sonata in Bb - 1 hour
Op 109 Piano Sonata in E - .5 hour
Op 110 Piano Sonata in Ab - .5 hour
Op 111 Piano Sonata in c - .5 hour
Op 120 Diabelli Variations - 1 hour
Op 124 Missa Solemnis - 1 hour
Op 125 Symphony #9 - 1.5 hours
Op 126 6 Bagatelles - .5 hour
Op 127 String Quartet in Eb - .5 hour
Op 132 String Quartet in a - .5 hour
Op 130 SQ in Bb - .5 hour
Op 133 Große Fuge for SQ - .5 hour
Op 131 SQ in c# - .5 hour
Op 135 SQ in F - .5 hour
Subtotal 12 (3/3 of course)
Grand Total 36 hours
Why these works? Well, the sonatas were Beethoven's 'workshop' where he worked out formal ideas to be used later in orchestral settings. So I chose major works that showed some of this working out, and minor works (like the Op 34 & 35 variations, for example) that showed how he developed his ideas. Then I chose 2 keys, c minor and Eb major in which a lot of the 'real' Beethoven seems to be displayed. Some formal advancement works (like the Op 102 sonatas), and then the unique works like the late quartets. I think it is well-rounded. :)
Anyway, that's what I would do. :)
8)
I think that to reach a broader audience the course might have to double as music appreciation in a way. So I would select a few works to illustrate forms and what to listen for. The Moonlight Sonata might illustrate sonata-allegro form, but of course it can be used to illustrate many other things.
I would structure it based on complexity of form, reserving complex compositions of several techniques for the end. I think that this approach would not only help students appreciate classical music in general, by also illustrating what makes Beethoven so special in not only what he does, but what he doesn't do will also give an appreciation for his music.
Biographical detail would be included as well, but only to give context.
These are very good starts, and I hope to see more along these lines. I will challenge both posters:
Gurn: I would say your work list needs considerable pruning. Massive pruning, in fact. You're teaching students in a course who know far less about Beethoven than you. You may want to leave time for discussion. Just 1/2 hour for the 5th symphony or the A minor quartet? I think you'd find that covering the first movement of the Fifth alone needs more time.
DavidW: I like the rationale, but there's no work list. But to speak of "selecting a few works" is I think a productive way to go about this.
This is the problem I posed: in effect, if you had to introduce LvB to people who knew very little about him, and your time and resources were limited, what would be the approach you would take and the representative works to illustrate it? Since you can't include everything, what would you include, what leave out?
Quote from: Sforzando on September 02, 2009, 07:42:28 AM
These are very good starts, and I hope to see more along these lines. I will challenge both posters:
Gurn: I would say your work list needs considerable pruning. Massive pruning, in fact. You're teaching students in a course who know far less about Beethoven than you. You may want to leave time for discussion. Just 1/2 hour for the 5th symphony or the A minor quartet? I think you'd find that covering the first movement of the Fifth alone needs more time.
DavidW: I like the rationale, but there's no work list. But to speak of "selecting a few works" is I think a productive way to go about this.
This is the problem I posed: in effect, if you had to introduce LvB to people who knew very little about him, and your time and resources were limited, what would be the approach you would take and the representative works to illustrate it? Since you can't include everything, what would you include, what leave out?
I see what you mean, Poco. Distributing time among them was the hardest part. Far easier to cut back and select some key works for more in depth study. Thanks.
8)
Quote from: Sforzando on September 02, 2009, 07:42:28 AM
DavidW: I like the rationale, but there's no work list. But to speak of "selecting a few works" is I think a productive way to go about this.
This is the problem I posed: in effect, if you had to introduce LvB to people who knew very little about him, and your time and resources were limited, what would be the approach you would take and the representative works to illustrate it? Since you can't include everything, what would you include, what leave out?
I'm going to get on that this evening. :)
OK, here is the trimmed down version. I still hope to discuss innovative works and the 2 keys that I mentioned, c minor and Eb Major.
Op 9 #3 String Trio in c minor - \
2 hours
Op 13 Piano Sonata in c minor - /
Op 27 2 Sonatas
"quasi una Fantasia" - 2 hours
Op 34 6 Variations in F on an
Original Theme for Keyboard - \
1 hour
Op 35 The Eroica Variations - /
Early Period – 5 hours
Op 53 Piano Sonata in C + WoO 57 "Andante favori" - 1 hour
Op 55 Symphony in Eb - 2 hour
Op 67 Symphony #5 in c - 2 hours
Op 70 #2 Piano Trio in Eb - 1 hour
Op 72 Fidelio or Leonore - 2 hours
Op 73 Piano Concerto #5 in Eb - 1 hour
Op 74 String Quartet in Eb - 1 hour
Op 97 Piano Trio in Bb - 1 hour
Middle Period – 11 hours
Op 102 2 Cello Sonatas - 1.5 hours
Op 106 Piano Sonata in Bb - 2 hours
Op 111 Piano Sonata in c - 1.5 hours
Op 120 Diabelli Variations - 2 hours
Op 124 Missa Solemnis - 1.5 hours
Op 125 Symphony #9 - 2 hours
Op 126 6 Bagatelles - 1 hour
Op 127 String Quartet in Eb - 2 hour
Op 132 String Quartet in a - 2 hours
Op 130 SQ in Bb - 1.5 hour
Op 133 Große Fuge for SQ - 1 hour
Op 131 SQ in c# - 2 hours
Late period - 20 hours
Grand Total 36 hours
I know, it's hard to see that it has been trimmed down, but I see it as an introductory course, and I feel like giving a broad cross-section is equally necessary in order to get an idea of the variety of the music. Obviously, I, the teacher, am going to put some overtime in on this one... :)
8)
Quote from: Sforzando on September 02, 2009, 07:42:28 AM
This is the problem I posed: in effect, if you had to introduce LvB to people who knew very little about him, and your time and resources were limited, what would be the approach you would take and the representative works to illustrate it?
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51t5QVmWPGL._SS500_.jpg)
>:D ;D >:D
I would just teach one work per week for the most part like this:
week #: 1) Sym. #3
2) Sym. #5
3) Sym. #9
4) Piano Sonata Op. 106
5) Piano Sonata Op. 110
6) Piano Sonata Op. 111
7) SQ Op. 59 #1, 2 and 3 and Piano Sonata in Eb (Op. 7)
8) Fidelio
9) Missa Solemnis
10) SQ Op. 130
11) SQ Op. 132
12) SQ Op. 135
Quote from: PerfectWagnerite on September 02, 2009, 11:56:56 AM
I would just teach one work per week for the most part like this:
week #: 1) Sym. #3
2) Sym. #5
3) Sym. #9
4) Piano Sonata Op. 106
5) Piano Sonata Op. 110
6) Piano Sonata Op. 111
7) SQ Op. 59 #1, 2 and 3 and Piano Sonata in Eb (Op. 7)
8) Fidelio
9) Missa Solemnis
10) SQ Op. 130
11) SQ Op. 132
12) SQ Op. 135
Very interesting. What is your principle of organization? You're very heavily concentrated towards the late works, with one early piano sonata sneaking in midway. If they're relatively new to Beethoven, are you throwing too many late piano sonatas and quartets at them?
I just think life is too short to be spending valuable time on less than great works. Early and middle Beethoven is interesting but late Beethoven is just so rich, incomprehensible, almost bizarre at times that sometimes I can't believe it is the same composer. It was really music that was way ahead of its time. There was nothing remotely resembling the final sonatas and string quartets at the time.
I have the early and mid periods covered pretty well with the 3 and 5th symphonies, the Razumovsky Quartets, and the Op. 10 Grand Sonata in Eb (a favorite of mine other than the final sonatas BTW) and Fidelio (if you call that mid-period). So that's 1/3 the time devoted to early and mid period and 2/3 the time devoted to his late period which I think is correct.
As to the schedule I would pretty much stick with what I had written earlier. The middle quartets and Fidelio pretty much serves as a break between the late sonatas and SQ.
I am not of the opinion that you should start beginners with more "approachable" works. I took a general opera class once and we started out with Tristan. So there.
I guess to elaborate on what I was suggesting before:
Looks like the Moonlight Sonata, the Diabelli Variations, the 1st symphony, the 5th symphony, one of the Op 18 String Quartets, and the Great Fugue would be the choices for my hypothetical class. And the concept is going through the basics and keep falling back to synthesis where we can look at more than one perspective (of the four), and along the way gain an appreciation for Beethoven.
Some of the works (the early works) are to exemplify classical form, the later stuff to show Beethoven's genius and see how it all fits in together.
Timetable: variations and binary form = 1 week, sonata allegro form = 4 weeks, rhythm and Beethoven's 5th = 1 week, counterpoint = 3 weeks, Great Fugue = 3 weeks
Variations: Diabelli Variations or Eroica Variations
The minuet and binary form: Ex: the minuet 1st symphony, and then we go from there to the scherzo and the 2nd symphony
The Introduction: establishing the dominant key, I might use the first symphony or the Pathetique for examples, the 4th symphony as a counter-example
Sonata Allegro Form:
* Moonlight Sonata as primary example
Emphasis on variations of a theme and building tension/drama by deviating from the dominant key and so forth you see it should build on the previous topics
Fifth Symphony:
* motivic unity
* since the motif is in every movement (just transformed you know) it's easier to keep of the different meters used in each movement--> which is our introduction to rhythm. I know rhythm is the most basic thing, but since our modern ears hear melody first and foremost we can sneak it in late.
* we can also revisit the discussions of keys with the bridge between the 3rd and 4th movement.
Counterpoint:
* I would probably choose one of the Op. 18 String Quartets since they are rich in simple to the point counterpoint. The point is to use the music to demonstrate inversions, multiple voices in simple context like a canon or a fugati.
And then the Great Fugue can be investigated using all of the principles presented before to understand the relationships between counterpoint, rhythm, modulation and so forth in that work, and I guess it would be the final project.
Well I don't know much about music, but heck I tried. :)
Quote from: PerfectWagnerite on September 02, 2009, 01:13:37 PM
I am not of the opinion that you should start beginners with more "approachable" works. I took a general opera class once and we started out with Tristan. So there.
Definitely an approach. Did you find yourself starting as a beginner with the late quartets? If you were teaching the course, what would you do if your students found these works so bizarre and incomprehensible that they dropped out like flies?
Quote from: DavidW on September 02, 2009, 03:24:34 PM
I guess to elaborate on what I was suggesting before:
Looks like the Moonlight Sonata, the Diabelli Variations, the 1st symphony, the 5th symphony, one of the Op 18 String Quartets, and the Great Fugue would be the choices for my hypothetical class.
. . .
Well I don't know much about music, but heck I tried. :)
Surely you did, and in very interesting directions, attempting to dealing with form and not spending as much time on the "three periods." In the process you have perhaps gone to the opposite extreme as Gurn's first list. What if your students came to class on the 8th or 9th hour devoted to the Great Fugue and said, "Not the GF again! I'm so bored with this Great Fugue!" Do you think you have enough material for nine contact hours on this one piece alone?
Quote from: Sforzando on September 02, 2009, 04:14:05 PM
Surely you did, and in very interesting directions, attempting to dealing with form and not spending as much time on the "three periods." In the process you have perhaps gone to the opposite extreme as Gurn's first list. What if your students came to class on the 8th or 9th hour devoted to the Great Fugue and said, "Not the GF again! I'm so bored with this Great Fugue!" Do you think you have enough material for nine contact hours on this one piece alone?
Yeah probably would not have enough material, stretched a bit thin there. Discussing two or three late works instead might have more of a payoff, or perhaps more time spent on rhythm. :)
Purchase this:
http://www.teach12.com/ttcx/CourseDescLong2.aspx?cid=730
then this:
http://www.teach12.com/ttcx/CourseDescLong2.aspx?cid=7250
then this:
http://www.teach12.com/ttcx/CourseDescLong2.aspx?cid=755
DONE ;D
Quote from: hornteacher on September 02, 2009, 07:19:37 PM
Purchase this:
http://www.teach12.com/ttcx/CourseDescLong2.aspx?cid=730
then this:
http://www.teach12.com/ttcx/CourseDescLong2.aspx?cid=7250
then this:
http://www.teach12.com/ttcx/CourseDescLong2.aspx?cid=755
DONE ;D
That sure took a lot of thought on your part.
Quote from: Sforzando on September 02, 2009, 07:33:25 PM
That sure took a lot of thought on your part.
This is Horn Teacher at work--
(http://theappslab.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/real-genius.jpg)
;D
OK, maybe this educational approach has reached its limit. But since I know all you guys love making lists of top 3's or whatever, let's do this as well for Ludwig van. Here I'm going to try a new approach:
Name your top Beethoven work in the following categories:
1-3. One work each from the early, middle, and late periods.
4-6. One work each from the piano sonatas, symphonies, and quartets.
7-9. Up to three other works from any other genre (chamber, choral, opera, etc.).
Duplications and overlaps allowed. It will be interesting to see if a concensus emerges, or even if I spelled concensus right. :D
Today's choices:
1. Early: Cantata on the death of Emperor Joseph II.
2. Middle: Fidelio.
3. Late: Missa Solemnis.
4. Piano sonatas: op. 109.
5. Symphonies: op. 55.
6. Quartets: op. 130.
7. An die ferne Geliebte.
8. Piano concerto op. 37.
9. Piano trio op. 97.
Quote from: DavidW on September 03, 2009, 05:04:42 AM
This is Horn Teacher at work--
(http://theappslab.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/real-genius.jpg)
;D
You made me giggle. ;D
Quote from: hornteacher on September 03, 2009, 04:41:53 PM
You made me giggle. ;D
tehehe ;D Oh let's see here...
1. Early: I think I can cheat here, it was composed at the very end of his early period and beginning of his middle period, as an early work I think the
Kreutzer Sonata shines quite brightly.
2. Middle: The
Third Symphony for being one of those watershed moments in musical history. 0:)
3. Late: Must it be?
Op. 135 String Quartet. It must be. :)
4. Piano sonatas:
Op. 110.
5. Symphonies:
Symphony #4.
6. Quartets: Op. 127.
7.
Missa Solemnis.
8.
Piano Concerto #4.
9.
Archduke Trio.
Edit: (a) I learned what "other" means, also (b) I was trying to NOT reproduce other lists but I see that it's not the case, so this is a little more up my alley. :)
Actually, Poco, this is harder than the first one... :)
1-3. One work each from the early, middle, and late periods.
4-6. One work each from the piano sonatas, symphonies, and quartets.
7-9. Up to three other works from any other genre (chamber, choral, opera, etc.).
1. String Quartet Op 18 #6 'La Malinconia'
2. Piano Sonata in f Op 57 'Appassionata'
3. Cello Sonata in C Op 102 #1
4. Piano Sonata in c Op 111
5. Symphony in Eb Op 55
6. Quartet in c# Op 131
7. Symphony in d Op 125
8. Song Cycle "An die ferne Geliebte" Op 98
9. Piano Trio in Eb Op 70#2
8)
----------------
Listening to:
Schönbrunn Ensemble - Hob 04 07 Divertimento in G for Flute, Violin & Cello 2nd mvmt - Adagio
Quote from: Gurn Blanston on September 03, 2009, 05:27:33 PM
1. String Quartet Op 18 #6 'La Malinconia'
2. Piano Sonata in f Op 57 'Appassionata'
3. Cello Sonata in C Op 102 #1
I almost picked that cello sonata for my #7-9, so close. I always thought the Appassionata was a guilty pleasure that I was supposed to keep to myself, but here you are boldy putting it on your tops middle era pic. ;D
Quote
7. Symphony in d Op 125
Ha, I bet you haven't listened to that one in along time! ;D
Quote from: DavidW on September 03, 2009, 05:30:50 PM
I almost picked that cello sonata for my #7-9, so close. I always thought the Appassionata was a guilty pleasure that I was supposed to keep to myself, but here you are boldy putting it on your tops middle era pic. ;D
Ha, I bet you haven't listened to that one in along time! ;D
Not since Sunday, at least. But the weekend's almost here... :) Probably won't be Toscanini this week, maybe Hickox... :D
8)
----------------
Listening to:
Schönbrunn Ensemble - Hob 04 09 Divertimento in G for Flute, Violin & Cello 3rd mvmt - Finale: Presto
You know between us too and Gabriel we have the whole final three PSs! Sweet! :)
Quote from: DavidW on September 03, 2009, 05:36:30 PM
You know between us too and Gabriel we have the whole final three PSs! Sweet! :)
I could make a box set out of just we three's selections and be happy for quite some time. Hmmm, not a bad idea. :)
8)
----------------
Listening to:
Schönbrunn Ensemble - Hob 04 10 Divertimento in A for Flute, Violin & Cello 1st mvmt - Andante con espressione
We can call it the Beethoven sampler. :)
Quote from: Sforzando on September 03, 2009, 12:26:30 PMOK, maybe this educational approach has reached its limit.
I'm going to go, I just haven't had the time to sit down and actually think through the topic. Says the person who only had one hour of classes today. Oh well, I'll do it by Saturday, you have my word of honor!
Quote from: Dana on September 03, 2009, 06:17:20 PM
I'm going to go, I just haven't had the time to sit down and actually think through the topic. Says the person who only had one hour of classes today. Oh well, I'll do it by Saturday, you have my word of honor!
I look forward to it.
Quote from: Gurn Blanston on September 03, 2009, 05:27:33 PM
Actually, Poco, this is harder than the first one... :)
But actually, not much different ...
And please, folks, read the instructions for 7-9 again. The key word there is "other."
Quote from: DavidW on September 03, 2009, 05:42:39 PM
We can call it the Beethoven sampler. :)
A most excellent sampler! ;D
But David, the Kreutzer sonata, an example of his early period? Hmmm... ;)
Quote from: Sforzando on September 03, 2009, 07:04:41 PM
But actually, not much different ...
And please, folks, read the instructions for 7-9 again. The key word there is "other."
Quote from: Gurn Blanston on September 03, 2009, 05:27:33 PM
Actually, Poco, this is harder than the first one... :)
1-3. One work each from the early, middle, and late periods.
4-6. One work each from the piano sonatas, symphonies, and quartets.
7-9. Up to three other works from any other genre (chamber, choral, opera, etc.).
1. String Quartet Op 18 #6 'La Malinconia'
2. Piano Sonata in f Op 57 'Appassionata'
3. Symphony in d Op 125
4. Piano Sonata in c Op 111
5. Symphony in Eb Op 55
6. Quartet in c# Op 131
7. Cello Sonata in C Op 102 #1
8. Song Cycle "An die ferne Geliebte" Op 98
9. Piano Trio in Eb Op 70#2
8)
Correction duly noted and made, Poco. My bad. :)
8)
OK, so I haven't worked out the exact hour usage of time, but here is the general outline of my course. Lessons are numbered, but some will take up more than one class period. The series from the Eroica Symphony to the 5th Symphony will probably take up 8 or 9 classes in all, since it is so pivotal. Additionally, there are also certain lectures where 3-5 works are mentioned as required listening. Listening to all the music is not the point. The lectures in these cases will touch on a number of features common to all the music.
This is an upper level (200-500) course for upperclassmen/graduate students designed to give an idea of exactly how Beethoven singlehandedly carried classical music into the romantic period. Therefore, listening assignments will not be limited to Beethoven. Being an upper level course, students are required to have a basic knowledge of both basic forms and diatonic harmony, although there won't be too much analysis.
1. Op.25 flute serenades, First Symphony - discuss early Beethoven, and his classical tendencies. Also provide brief review of sonata-allegro form.
2. Symphony No.2, Mozart Symphony 35 - discuss how Beethoven differs from Mozart, with particular emphasis on harmonic rhythm, and how each composer was a genius in his own rite.
3. Archduke Trio, 26th Piano Sonata, Eine Kleine Nachtmusik - further discussions on how Beethoven differed from Mozart, with particular emphasis on the piano, and Beethoven's unprecedented virtuosity on the instrument.
4. Violin Variations on Se Vuol Ballare, 3rd mvt of 5th Piano Concerto, first movement of 4th Symphony - Beethoven's favorite forms: theme & variations, rondo, and sonata-allegro
5. Fidelio - Beethoven tries to write an opera.
6. Op.18 Quartets - Beethoven's first entry in the cannon.
7. Variations on Mozarts Bei Mannern, and 3rd Cello Sonata - Beethoven and the cello.
8. Kruetzer Sonata and Violin Concerto - Beethoven, the violin, and Clementi.
9. Eroica Symphony - Beethoven breaks from the mold.
10. Op.59 Quartets - Beethoven the madman!
11. Moonlight Sonata, Op.95 Quartet, look ahead to 5th symphony - what differentiates romanticism emotionally and thematically from classicism? Also touch on Beethoven's deafness, the Heilegenstadt Testament, and his self-perception as an artist.
12. Further discussion on Eroica Symphony and Op.59 Quartets - what formal rules did Beethoven break in his quest for romanticism?
13. 4th & 5th Piano Concertos - Beethoven's last great piano concertos. Also discuss on how his reputation as a composer is beginning to become more important than his reputation as a concert artist.
14. 5th Symphony - romanticism arrives full on the scene.
15. Pastoral Symphony - Beethoven invents program music.
16. 7th & 8th Symphonies - Beethoven's art continues to mature.
17. Missa Solemnis - Beethoven's sacred work.
18. 9th Symphony - His last great symphony.
19. Op.127, 130, 132, 135 Quartets, and the Grosse Fugue - the music of the future. Reflect upon the op.18 quartets, and where Beethoven's harmonic and thematic language has gone.
20. Schubert Unfinished Symphony, Brahms 1st Symphony Mahler Symphonies 1 (1st & 2nd movements), 2 (5th movement), Shostakovich Symphonies 5 & 9 - discuss the stigma left by the 9th symphony. This includes how the work acted as both beacon and intimidating obstacle to the romantics, and how future composers sought to emulate the work.
Wow that's amazing! If you offered that class I would take it. :) Except of course I have to note:
Quote from: Dana on September 06, 2009, 10:05:29 AM
5. Fidelio - Beethoven tries to write an opera.
Damn! That's harsh! >:D
Upon further reflection, I might want to reverse the order of the last two lectures - the last quartets reached much further into the future than the 9th symphony.
Quote from: Dana on September 06, 2009, 02:13:55 PM
Upon further reflection, I might want to reverse the order of the last two lectures - the last quartets reached much further into the future than the 9th symphony.
That's a very interestingly thought out syllabus, and more than exceeds my expectations for what a well-considered response should look like. Even at the 500 level, however, I suspect you'd have a hard time fitting all your material in. It looks like a year-long course to me. But I especially like the way you're seeing B. in relation to other composers preceding and following him.
Quote from: Dana on September 06, 2009, 02:13:55 PM
Upon further reflection, I might want to reverse the order of the last two lectures - the last quartets reached much further into the future than the 9th symphony.
In order to justify the premise of #15, you are either going to have to ignore a couple of centuries of music plus ignore what Beethoven himself said about the music, or else you are going to have to invent something.... :-\
That said, I would enjoy spending a year in this class. :)
8)
----------------
Listening to:
Cyril Huvé / Jorja Fleezanis - Bia 293 Op 23 Sonata #4 in a for Fortepiano & Violin 1st mvmt - Presto
Quote from: Gurn Blanston on September 06, 2009, 04:05:42 PM
In order to justify the premise of #15, you are either going to have to ignore a couple of centuries of music plus ignore what Beethoven himself said about the music, or else you are going to have to invent something.... :-\
Yeah like all of Bach's cantatas being program music, in fact that was what I was how I was going to start phase 2 of the greatest Bach project. Like Vivaldi's 4 Seasons (I seem to remember some old curmudgeon leading us through those elements...) etc etc etc
Quote from: DavidW on September 06, 2009, 04:08:41 PM
Yeah like all of Bach's cantatas being program music, in fact that was what I was how I was going to start phase 2 of the greatest Bach project. Like Vivaldi's 4 Seasons (I seem to remember some old curmudgeon leading us through those elements...) etc etc etc
And that's just a dip of the wick. :)
8)
----------------
Listening to: Cyril Huvé / Jorja Fleezanis - Bia 293 Op 23 Sonata #4 in a for Fortepiano & Violin 2nd mvmt - Andante scherzoso pìu Allegretto
Quote from: Sforzando on September 06, 2009, 03:21:42 PMI suspect you'd have a hard time fitting all your material in. It looks like a year-long course to me.
Possibly. A lot would depend on the pace of the students. For example, 2 & 3 are one super-lecture split into two aspects, and the same is true of 11 & 12. How quickly we get through these would depend strictly upon the familiarity of the students with the subject matter, and how readily they grasp the essential concepts presented in these lectures. Also, some of this stuff, like Fidelio, the cello and violin lectures, and the flute serenades, would probably take up less than a single lecture. While that material may be important in understanding Beethoven as a composer, they are decidedly less important in the big picture than his symphonies and quartets.
Quote from: (poco) Sforzando on September 01, 2009, 07:31:41 PM
Now it's Beethoven's turn.
Different rules once again. You are teaching a 12-week, 36-contact hour college course in Beethoven's music and you must create a syllabus. You may feel that some works will require 3 classes, while others can be covered in less than one contact hour each. Obviously you cannot cover everything. Obviously some works will be duplicated in various lists. Your job is to (a) create the syllabus, and (b) write a brief proposal so that your department head understands what you are trying to achieve with the course.
The Beethoven catalog (excluding all the works without opus numbers) lists 138 opus numbers. Following post 138 (if we get that far), further proposals will be ignored and the thread will be locked as soon as possible after. Then a new thread will be started where we can vote for the top three courses and have a discussion.
I know it's been 7 years, buuuuuuut you didn't reach Post #138 yet. Also I can't sleep. So, basic idea:
Week 1: Introduction to Beethoven. I'll allow 30 minutes for explaining exactly what the course is going to be about, how to turn in your assignments, how to use the University's learning management system etc. For the remaining 2 1/2 hours I will concentrate on Beethoven's Opus 1, the three piano trios, using them to explain the basic harmonic, rhythmic, motivic and contrapuntal background of Beethoven's style, and possibly contrasting snippets with short excerpts from earlier works by Beethoven's forebears (Mozart, Haydn, Clementi, etc) if there's time for that, to show the influences as well as the differences.
The rationale for using Opus 1 is simply that it was Beethoven's first published work, and therefore the one with which he first presented himself to the Viennese public as a composer.
Week 2: Seeking Perfection. In this week I'll talk about the Quartet, Op. 18 no. 5, and the Sonata, Op. 22, using them to demonstrate Beethoven's form and long-range planning as well as his lifelong affection for traditional, "conservative" models, and his ability to write highly conventional music with no "tricks" or apparent originality. Discussion of the major forms Beethoven used (sonata, variations, rondo, scherzo/minuet), in the sense of what they meant to Beethoven.
The rationale for choosing these two works is that they are unpopular and little-known, that both look back to earlier models (the quartet more explicitly), and that Beethoven himself was very proud of them.
Week 3: Looking Forwards. In this module I'll try to explain the tension between Beethoven's love of conventional form and highly basic, almost characterless material, and his relentless push towards a wider range of expression, using some "experimental" works from the years 1800-1804: the third+fourth movements of the Sonata Op. 27/1, the first movement of the Sonata Op. 27/2, excerpts from the Variations Op. 34, and one of the Bagatelles Op. 33 (probably either No. 2 or No. 5). I will hope to show that (a) when Beethoven is experimenting with an aspect of musical structure he tends to radically simplify other aspects, to the point where their extreme conventionality itself becomes unconventional; and (b) the piano works were at this time Beethoven's "workshop" where he tried out new ideas.
Reason for choosing these works is because they're all experimental in some way, obviously.
Week 4: Breakthrough. In the first half of this lecture I plan to analyse the first movement of the Symphony No. 3, Op. 55. This work "realised" Beethoven's years of experimentation and fused them with his concept of traditional form and whatever. The analysis will point out the conventional forms from Week 2 and the experimental devices played around with from Week 3 and how they are integrated into one of Beethoven's longest and most coherent symphonic movements. In the second half I will more briefly touch on the other three movements pointing out similar devices, and encouraging the students to listen the entire work with score and produce an analysis of a selected movement (not more than 1000 words).
Choice of work should go without saying.
Week 5: Rhythm. Charles Rosen talks about how Beethoven could not do without purely rhythmic figures at this point in his career. I plan to go into why that is the case, with reference to the first movement of Symphony No. 5, the first movement of Piano Concerto No. 4, and the first movement of the Sonata Op. 57. So this lecture will basically be about the contribution of rhythm to the "Beethoven sound" and how the works would be less effective if they were less obsessional.
Choice of the works here is because they all involve a very similar rhythmic figure (although with subtle differences. The symphony is three shorts and a long. In the piano concerto the fourth note is also shortened, and in the sonata the first note is stressed)
Week 6: Beethoven and the sublime. From about 1805 onwards Beethoven became quite keen on attempting to depict awe and terror in music, as well as the idea of transfiguration. Works touched upon will be the graveyard scene from Fidelio (possibly a few other excerpts also), parts of the Leonore No. 2 overture, possibly the Egmont overture if there's time, and the 3rd and 4th movements of the Symphony No. 5. Reference will be made to precursors such as the opening of Haydn's Creation and the coda to Mozart's Symphony No. 41, to put Beethoven's ideas in a Classical context.
The rationale for choosing these works is simply that they illustrate Beethoven's processes for doing these things and show that this flowed to some extent out of dramatic music, but he successfully used similar strategies in absolute works.
Mid-semester break. Listening assignment will be the three Op. 59 quartets.
Week 7: Move towards fantasy. After a short quiz (no marks) to see who actually did the listening, this lecture will briefly touch on the idea of fantasy and refer to the opening of the Op. 77 Fantasia before concentrating on the Quartets Op. 74 and 95, analysing them in light of techniques discussed in Week 6 to show how these more dramatic techniques led to a more intense subjectivity that would influence some of the early Romantics. Attention will also be drawn to the beginning of a new element in Beethoven's style, that of composing with the specific acts of performance in mind, and making instrumental timbre as important a part of his music as everything else had been.
Choice of these works is fairly obvious I think.
Week 8: Looking forwards (2). In this lecture I will analyse two of the works that form the culmination of this period in Beethoven's work,
An die ferne Geliebte and the Sonata Op. 101, after which he entered a sort of creative crisis and composed little music for about two years. These works carry this level of fantasy far enough that it creates an intractable conflict with Beethoven's sense of conventional form and tonality. Both works come close to being open-ended and are among Beethoven's more radical experiments. Reference will be made to some of the composers influenced by these works, such as Schumann (probably
Frauenliebe und Leben) and Mendelssohn (the A minor quartet, most likely).
Choice of works is, again, pretty obvious I'd think.
Week 9: Monuments. The start of Beethoven's "third period" in 1818 or so was in some ways a return to tradition—even archaism—and a radical simplification of means. At the same time, the sheer level of concentration Beethoven imparts is unprecedented. I will primarily concentrate on the Missa solemnis although also with references to the Diabelli Variations and the Consecration of the House Overture. That said, towards the end of the lecture I would want to bring up the idea of fugue with reference to the Sonata Op. 106, even though counterpoint will be discussed in the next lecture, as Op. 106 also played the role of a "monument". It won't be analysed in any detail though.
Choice of works is difficult—ideally I could devote an entire lecture, or even an entire course, to the Missa Solemnis, but instead I'll have to cover it from the perspective of archaism or at least dialogue with an older tradition. This means also bringing in other works (even if only for a few minutes each).
Week 10: Counterpoint. After a brief rundown of fugal writing in Beethoven's output (Op. 10/2, Op. 59/3, etc) the first half of the lecture will talk about the general principles of Beethoven's fugue with reference to
In gloria Dei Patris from the Gloria and
Et vitam venturi from the Credo of the Missa Solemnis and the finale of Op. 106. The second half will be a detailed analysis of the first movement of the Quartet Op. 131.
Choice of works is fairly obvious. I'm leaving the Grosse Fuge in reserve for the students' final essay.
Week 11: Unity. The lecture will return to Op. 131 and analyse the entire work, detailing Beethoven's strategies for creating unities and disjunctions, and how he establishes or threatens coherence on the largest scale. All of the knowledge previously covered in the course will be used, the goal being to give students ways to explain
why Beethoven's works are great. Students will then be assigned to produce a similar analysis for Op. 130/133 (let's say 3000-4000 words depending on department requirements).
Rationale for choosing the work is because it's Beethoven's best one, mostly. >_>
Week 12: Beethoven against the sublime. For the final lecture I'll examine how Beethoven's last works repudiate the grander, more dramatic works of his middle period, with reference to Variation 33 from the Diabelli Variations, the third movement of Op. 130, the first movement of Op. 135 and the 1826 finale to Op. 130. These have been interpreted as a sign of conservatism, a wish to revisit musics he heard in his youth before losing his hearing, or a threshold to a new creative period that went unrealised due to his death. We will talk about the extent to which this reflected the reception of Beethoven's work in the 19th century, with the more subjective and sublime middle period music venerated whilst the late works were often misunderstood. Cake will be served. If there is time left over, the students will play Beethoven Bingo using 10-second snippets from works covered in the course or recommended listening.
The exam I guess will be an essay question and an analysis of a set work. Set work may be a movement of the Symphony No. 9 or something. I dunno.
Can I make mine a Stockhausen or Cage syllabus plz
Quote from: nathanb on October 19, 2016, 07:40:52 AM
Can I make mine a Stockhausen or Cage syllabus plz
Will the first Cage lecture be the professor
not speaking for an hour? ;D
Sorry!...carry on.
Sarge
Quote from: Sergeant Rock on October 19, 2016, 07:49:41 AM
Will the first Cage lecture be the professor not speaking for an hour? ;D
Sorry!...carry on.
Sarge
You have completely turned me off from intelligent discourse.
Quote from: nathanb on October 19, 2016, 07:52:20 AM
You have completely turned me off from intelligent discourse.
Oh, let a fellow make the odd joke!
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on October 19, 2016, 07:55:05 AM
Oh, let a fellow make the odd joke!
I was being sarcastically overdramatic, and I should know better because it doesn't translate into type very well. That being said, 4'33" jokes are hardly "the odd joke", "now and then", or anything of the sort. I mean I've never seen a "deader" horse.
Quote from: nathanb on October 19, 2016, 07:57:27 AM
I was being sarcastically overdramatic, and I should know better because it doesn't translate into type very well. That being said, 4'33" jokes are hardly "the odd joke", "now and then", or anything of the sort. I mean I've never seen a "deader" horse.
I'm a fan of John Cage's music. I believe he had a sense of humor (his 4'33'' is one proof of that). You should learn from him...and learn from us Brianites, who take the brunt of teasing on this forum for our fandom. We don't take ourselves so seriously. We join in the laughter while celebrating the music.
Sarge
Quote from: nathanb on October 19, 2016, 07:40:52 AM
Can I make mine a Stockhausen or Cage syllabus plz
You can make as many syllabi as you want, I'm sure there will be interest in them. Maybe a new thread for each, or all of your syllabi.
Wow, I completely forgot this thread. But it just goes to show that creating a syllabus for a college course is by no means easy. The temptation is always to do too much, and you have to gauge where your students are before throwing a ton of stuff at them that they won't be able to absorb. Thanks to amw for taking the question seriously even though his course may be a bit on the dense side for the typical college kid.
Yes, to be fair, this wouldn't be a particularly unusual workload for the university at which I got my undergrad degree—we were on the trimester system (so 8 weeks instead of 12), and typically covered about that much material per lecture, or slightly more. But the university I attended was uh..... actually ranked #1 worldwide at the time lmao (it's dropped down a bit since then, but still in the top ten). So I might just be used to doing atypical amounts of work. >_>
Quote from: amw on October 19, 2016, 05:53:48 AM
I know it's been 7 years, buuuuuuut you didn't reach Post #138 yet. Also I can't sleep. So, basic idea:
Week 1: Introduction to Beethoven.
...
Reason for choosing these works is because they're all experimental in some way, obviously.
....
All very interesting, although it almost looks like you were consciously avoiding many of the most famous works from the first ca. 35 opus numbers.
Quote
Week 6: Beethoven and the sublime. From about 1805 onwards Beethoven became quite keen on attempting to depict awe and terror in music, as well as the idea of transfiguration. Works touched upon will be the graveyard scene from Fidelio (possibly a few other excerpts also), parts of the Leonore No. 2 overture, possibly the Egmont overture if there's time, and the 3rd and 4th movements of the Symphony No. 5. Reference will be made to precursors such as the opening of Haydn's Creation and the coda to Mozart's Symphony No. 41, to put Beethoven's ideas in a Classical context.
The rationale for choosing these works is simply that they illustrate Beethoven's processes for doing these things and show that this flowed to some extent out of dramatic music, but he successfully used similar strategies in absolute works.
Among the things I miss from your overall rather fascinating suggestions but it might be included in this section are the "programmatic" elements, e.g. Pastoral symphony, Les adieux sonata, maybe the Leonore, Egmont and Coriolan ouvertures, maybe the "Prometheus program" of the Eroica, maybe also the 9th symphony.
Quote
Mid-semester break. Listening assignment will be the three Op. 59 quartets.
Week 7: Move towards fantasy. After a short quiz (no marks) to see who actually did the listening, this lecture will briefly touch on the idea of fantasy and refer to the opening of the Op. 77 Fantasia before concentrating on the Quartets Op. 74 and 95, analysing them in light of techniques discussed in Week 6 to show how these more dramatic techniques led to a more intense subjectivity that would influence some of the early Romantics. Attention will also be drawn to the beginning of a new element in Beethoven's style, that of composing with the specific acts of performance in mind, and making instrumental timbre as important a part of his music as everything else had been.
Choice of these works is fairly obvious I think.
It's not really obvious for me why the op.59 is only a break assignment and why and how opp. 74 and 95 fall unter the heading "fantasy". I'd be delighted to be enlighted on the latter if you can explain it non- or not too technically.
Missing or somewhat short-changed are violin and cello sonatas. One of op.102 could maybe be covered either in the "fantasy" section or with op.101 and Ferne Geliebte. Also, some of the violin sonatas seem among the most accomplished earlier works although I see your point in going with op.1 and op.18/5.
Also, the 9th symphony seems missing among the "monuments" and Fidelio might deserve a whole section. Of course your suggestions are all sufficiently interesting so that one hesitates to cut anything.
Short side lecture on "Beethoven at his most uninspired and forgettable." Highlight: Nameday overture. :P
Beethoven's turn: ~
Sigh...its always Beethoven, innit?
(https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5006188cc4aa3dba77367284/t/503aa9cc24ace92134d96b0e/1346021837210/tumblr_m293wsek0R1r1227oo1_r2_1280.jpg)
Quote from: The new erato on October 21, 2016, 10:25:42 PM
(https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5006188cc4aa3dba77367284/t/503aa9cc24ace92134d96b0e/1346021837210/tumblr_m293wsek0R1r1227oo1_r2_1280.jpg)
:P Love it and I agree!
Quote from: The new erato on October 21, 2016, 10:25:42 PM
(https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5006188cc4aa3dba77367284/t/503aa9cc24ace92134d96b0e/1346021837210/tumblr_m293wsek0R1r1227oo1_r2_1280.jpg)
Borrowed with thanks
I'm sorry. My responses are limited. You must ask the right questions.
I think Tovey has a brief essay on the "Namensfeier" so apparently he thinks it is better than its reputation (but I admittedly do not remember how the piece sounds like).