GMG Classical Music Forum

The Music Room => Composer Discussion => Topic started by: Moonfish on May 14, 2018, 11:08:18 AM

Title: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: Moonfish on May 14, 2018, 11:08:18 AM
Jules Émile Frédéric Massenet (12 May 1842 – 13 August 1912) was a French composer.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jules_Massenet

Compositions: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_compositions_by_Jules_Massenet

I'm surprised that Massenet doesn't have a composer thread or am I mistaken? Surely there must be a number of Massenet fans here at GMG?

What are your favorite works and recommendations within the realm of Massenet?


(http://www.operademontreal.com/sites/default/files/styles/mobile/public/composers/compositeur_massenet_h.jpg?itok=ih7Bwh-J)


Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: kyjo on May 15, 2018, 07:35:43 PM
The orchestral suites found on this disc are absolutely delightful in every regard:

[asin]B00000144Q[/asin]

These tuneful, colorfully orchestrated works would make nice substitutes for the Bizet Carmen and L'arlesienne suites and the Grieg Peer Gynt suites every once in a while on concert programs. I'm really surprised they aren't played more often.
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: Florestan on May 16, 2018, 01:10:30 AM
Quote from: kyjo on May 15, 2018, 07:35:43 PM
The orchestral suites found on this disc are absolutely delightful in every regard:

[asin]B00000144Q[/asin]

These tuneful, colorfully orchestrated works would make nice substitutes for the Bizet Carmen and L'arlesienne suites and the Grieg Peer Gynt suites every once in a while on concert programs. I'm really surprised they aren't played more often.

Plus:

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51p7BdUuxXL._SY355_.jpg) (https://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_500/MI0003/398/MI0003398996.jpg?partner=allrovi.com) (https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51s8y7Ub-RL._SY355_.jpg)

I beg to differ on Peer Gynt, though, which is an altogether different affair, a much darker and serious work; the suites do the whole a great injustice and after hearing it in its entirety I have no wish to ever hear just the suites again --- the excising of spoken melodrama robs the composition of more than half of its substance.
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: snyprrr on May 16, 2018, 12:38:27 PM
DudeMan, sorry, it shoulda been 'Massenet's Basonette'

Massenet isn't badass enough to evoke a maelstrome,... is he???
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: Moonfish on May 18, 2018, 03:34:02 PM
Quote from: snyprrr on May 16, 2018, 12:38:27 PM
DudeMan, sorry, it shoulda been 'Massenet's Basonette'

Massenet isn't badass enough to evoke a maelstrome,... is he???

An alliteration was required!   :P
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: Brian on May 19, 2018, 08:18:18 PM
Massenet's Massive Fête

I remember listening to and thoroughly enjoying the piano concerto in that EMI Ciccolini recording, posting about it here, and discovering that everyone else thinks it's a superficial piece that dies on second listen. That scared me off. Maybe it's finally time to try again and see if I still enjoy it!
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: amw on May 19, 2018, 08:32:04 PM
I am a consistent fan of the Massenet concerto across multiple listens, for what it's worth.

The Hyperion Romantic Piano Concerto series pairs it with Reynaldo Hahn's piano concerto which is also excellent.
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: Moonfish on May 23, 2018, 10:24:34 PM
A brief article from NPR with some samples...

https://www.npr.org/sections/deceptivecadence/2012/08/14/158750921/making-a-case-for-massenet-the-misunderstood-sentimentalist

(https://media.npr.org/assets/img/2012/08/14/massenet-702cbb84f1ba7af7160a692c97baf51d01019533-s1500-c85.jpg)
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: Moonfish on May 23, 2018, 10:26:58 PM
Quite a number of recordings out there. Warner/EMI/Erato recently compiled a Massenet collection (16 cd):

[asin] B079851VR7[/asin]
(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/81QLYpqxkyL._SX522_.jpg)
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: Moonfish on May 23, 2018, 10:30:22 PM
Back in 2012 Decca/Universal released this compilation (23 cd) to honor the centennial of his death:

I was thrilled to see Frederica von Stade's "Werther" in this box. 

[asin] B007NUP7Y4[/asin]
(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/61DcKFae8EL.jpg)
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: Baron Scarpia on May 23, 2018, 11:00:48 PM
Quote from: Brian on May 19, 2018, 08:18:18 PMI remember listening to and thoroughly enjoying the piano concerto in that EMI Ciccolini recording, posting about it here, and discovering that everyone else thinks it's a superficial piece that dies on second listen. That scared me off. Maybe it's finally time to try again and see if I still enjoy it!

I have that recording in a big box. I should drag it out and give a listen.
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: DaveF on May 24, 2018, 01:05:06 AM
It's the one thing that probably everybody has heard, but the ballet from Le Cid is gorgeous, endlessly charming, spirited and unforgettable.  (I'm rehearsing for a performance at the moment - castanets, tambourine and side-drum.)
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: Jaakko Keskinen on May 28, 2018, 04:54:46 AM
To quote my favorite Massenet opera, it will always be "Thaïs, Thaïs, Thaïs."  :) I saw a spectacular gold-clad production in Finnish national opera once and it's coming again the next season.
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: mjmosca on May 31, 2018, 02:22:08 AM
Great to see Massenet getting attention. All of his operas are superb!- Don't miss Werther with Georges Thill and Ninon Vallin, ca. 1930, Manon ca. 1954 with de los Angeles and Henri Gay lead by Monteux, Thais ca. 1962 with Renee Doria and Robert Massard, and Esclarmonde with Sutherland & Bonynge. The new box of collected works looks really good too.

Massenet's works really seem to spring to life when sung by Francophone singers. Esclarmonde recording is the "odd man out" in the list above, but it is really well done nonetheless, as one would expect from the cast and conductor. 
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: Dry Brett Kavanaugh on February 14, 2021, 08:59:30 AM
Enjoying various works by the talented composer, including his lesser-known pieces, this weekend.
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: Dry Brett Kavanaugh on March 21, 2021, 05:19:09 PM
Wonderful recordings by John Eliot Gardiner. Solid performance and excellent recording sound.
As for the compositions, the orchestration is very innovative and creative for the time period.
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: kyjo on July 01, 2023, 10:30:32 AM
Only one page for Massenet?! Quel horreur!! :o Seriously though, this guy deserves to be remembered for so much more than just the Meditation from Thaïs. The other day I was re-listening to his Piano Concerto in E-flat major (the excellent Ciccolini/Cambreling recording on EMI). Massenet has a reputation as a rather "light and fluffy" composer, but this concerto is actually anything but: heroic and dramatic in the 1st movement, hymn-like and soulful (and surprisingly dramatic at times) in the 2nd, and rip-roaringly Slavic in the incredibly catchy finale, which ends the concerto in C minor! This highly individual concerto really deserves to be played much more often in concert - I can only imagine how much the finale would bring the house down!

I really ought to start exploring the works which are, of course, central to Massenet's output - his operas. What would fellow members suggest as good starting points? :)
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: vers la flamme on July 01, 2023, 10:33:36 AM
I have not heard a note of Massenet. I saw a complete recording of Thaïs on Decca at the record store the other day and thought about getting it but didn't. What else is good?
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: Florestan on July 01, 2023, 10:51:26 AM
Quote from: kyjo on July 01, 2023, 10:30:32 AMOnly one page for Massenet?! Quel horreur!! :o

Well, vocal music is the Cinderella of GMG, and non-Austro-Germanic vocal music is the Cinderella's Cinderella of GMG...  ;D

Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: Florestan on July 01, 2023, 10:58:21 AM
Quote from: vers la flamme on July 01, 2023, 10:33:36 AMI have not heard a note of Massenet. I saw a complete recording of Thaïs on Decca at the record store the other day and thought about getting it but didn't. What else is good?

(https://www.warnerclassics.com/sites/default/files/styles/release_and_playlist_cover_756_x_756_webp/public/0190295683474%20MASSENET%20Operas.jpg.webp?itok=OzWgBSnE) (https://d1iiivw74516uk.cloudfront.net/eyJidWNrZXQiOiJwcmVzdG8tY292ZXItaW1hZ2VzIiwia2V5IjoiOTM4MTA4MC4xLmpwZyIsImVkaXRzIjp7InJlc2l6ZSI6eyJ3aWR0aCI6OTAwfSwianBlZyI6eyJxdWFsaXR5Ijo2NX0sInRvRm9ybWF0IjoianBlZyJ9LCJ0aW1lc3RhbXAiOjE2Njc1MDcwOTd9)

Beauty is truth, truth is beauty. that is all ye know on earth and all ye need to know
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: Spotted Horses on July 01, 2023, 11:14:05 AM
Quote from: vers la flamme on July 01, 2023, 10:33:36 AMI have not heard a note of Massenet. I saw a complete recording of Thaïs on Decca at the record store the other day and thought about getting it but didn't. What else is good?

In the first act Thais is a libertine and sensualist. Then she gets religion and it gets really boring.  >:D
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: ritter on July 01, 2023, 01:02:06 PM
Quote from: vers la flamme on July 01, 2023, 10:33:36 AMI have not heard a note of Massenet....
Lucky you!  ;D 
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: Symphonic Addict on July 01, 2023, 06:16:02 PM
Quote from: kyjo on July 01, 2023, 10:30:32 AMOnly one page for Massenet?! Quel horreur!! :o Seriously though, this guy deserves to be remembered for so much more than just the Meditation from Thaïs. The other day I was re-listening to his Piano Concerto in E-flat major (the excellent Ciccolini/Cambreling recording on EMI). Massenet has a reputation as a rather "light and fluffy" composer, but this concerto is actually anything but: heroic and dramatic in the 1st movement, hymn-like and soulful (and surprisingly dramatic at times) in the 2nd, and rip-roaringly Slavic in the incredibly catchy finale, which ends the concerto in C minor! This highly individual concerto really deserves to be played much more often in concert - I can only imagine how much the finale would bring the house down!

+1 for the Piano Concerto, that 3rd movement is something else indeed, but the whole work deserves more attention without a doubt.
Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: pjme on July 03, 2023, 02:20:36 AM
"Visions" is well worth discovering. 

https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,11592.msg1314073.html#msg1314073 (https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,11592.msg1314073.html#msg1314073)

And I like this little sentimental gem from Le Cid 







Title: Re: Massenet's Maelstrom
Post by: Roasted Swan on July 03, 2023, 02:57:29 AM
Quote"Visions" is well worth discovering.

https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,11592.msg1314073.html#msg1314073 (https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,11592.msg1314073.html#msg1314073)

And I like this little sentimental gem from Le Cid



+1 for Vision - this whole Naxos disc is full of unexpected delights.  All rather melodrammatic and impressive I reckon

[img=350x350]https://d1iiivw74516uk.cloudfront.net/eyJidWNrZXQiOiJwcmVzdG8tY292ZXItaW1hZ2VzIiwia2V5IjoiODgxNTY5NS4xLmpwZyIsImVkaXRzIjp7InJlc2l6ZSI6eyJ3aWR0aCI6OTAwfSwianBlZyI6eyJxdWFsaXR5Ijo2NX0sInRvRm9ybWF0IjoianBlZyJ9LCJ0aW1lc3RhbXAiOjE2MDIxOTE0Nzl9[/img]