What is it about Tchaikovsky?

Started by dave b, June 03, 2013, 09:44:40 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

dave b

I thought long and hard about putting this thread in the general classical discussion section, but in good conscience could not---it has to go here. There is a Tchaikovsky thread in the Composer section, but that deals chiefly with recordings of his work. That is a monumental thread, and is extremely interesting.

What I've been wondering for a few days is this, and it is so basic I had to put it in this Beginner's section: What makes Tchaikovsky (or any other composer) great? I'm not arguing that he is not great. I have been listening to his music lately, quite a bit, and appreciate it. I wondered, though, what is it about the music that make this composer great.

Is it simply that people like the sound of his music, is it that his compositions took an extraordinary amount of skill to compose, or that his works are well known, or all these things combined.

This sounds like a basic question, and in a way it is--but I'm not sure I know the precise answer to it, or if there is one. It's like asking something seemingly simple, and it turns out that there are a number of answers to the question. E.g. why is Christmas so hectic a season? Simple and yet the answers not only vary, but are far reaching.

Karl Henning

Quote from: Dave B on June 03, 2013, 09:44:40 AM
I thought long and hard about putting this thread in the general classical discussion section, but in good conscience could not---it has to go here. There is a Tchaikovsky thread in the Composer section, but that deals chiefly with recordings of his work.

But it oughtn't, certainly oughtn't to give you that impression!  So I'm taking this thither : )
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

dave b

#2


I had the opportunity to listen to these works uninterrupted, in a leisurely way, with absolutely nothing to distract my attention from the music itself.

I began to appreciate that composer more and more. Not because of any technical reason. I'm not experienced enough for that. Just the sound of his music, is what I liked, compared to many other composers.

Karl Henning

Quote from: Dave B on June 03, 2013, 09:44:40 AM
I thought long and hard about putting this thread in the general classical discussion section, but in good conscience could not---it has to go here. There is a Tchaikovsky thread in the Composer section, but that deals chiefly with recordings of his work. That is a monumental thread, and is extremely interesting.

What I've been wondering for a few days is this, and it is so basic I had to put it in this Beginner's section: What makes Tchaikovsky (or any other composer) great? I'm not arguing that he is not great. I have been listening to his music lately, quite a bit, and appreciate it. I wondered, though, what is it about the music that make this composer great.

Is it simply that people like the sound of his music, is it that his compositions took an extraordinary amount of skill to compose, or that his works are well known, or all these things combined.

This sounds like a basic question, and in a way it is--but I'm not sure I know the precise answer to it, or if there is one. It's like asking something seemingly simple, and it turns out that there are a number of answers to the question. E.g. why is Christmas so hectic a season? Simple and yet the answers not only vary, but are far reaching.


Here's the thread we want.
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Sean

Aesthetics is the oldest branch of philosophy- nobody quite knows what the heck is going on with it but it's some kind of non-rational non-conceptual but fundamental region of meaning, prior to linguistic description and of course beyond mere technical proficiency in composition or whatever. I see it in terms of Indian philosophy but won't trouble you with that here.

Sammy

Quote from: Dave B on June 03, 2013, 09:44:40 AM
What I've been wondering for a few days is this, and it is so basic I had to put it in this Beginner's section: What makes Tchaikovsky (or any other composer) great? I'm not arguing that he is not great. I have been listening to his music lately, quite a bit, and appreciate it. I wondered, though, what is it about the music that make this composer great.

For me, it's his fantastic melodies and thematic development. 

dave b

#6
There are 2 other threads about Tchaikovsky---Karl pointed out one. But it still deals (mainly, it appears) with recordings and very specific works--the other is a monumental and extremely interesting analysis (ongoing) of Tchaikovsky's Symphony No. 5---that is a very well thought out thread. I'm still delving into the wealth of information on that thread. It is extensive info.

The one I started here perhaps should be in the Composer section after all, so as not to focus exclusively on one composer here in the Beginners section/ will ask a mod to move it there.

dave b

#7
Thank you for moving this....I suggested the title be changed, too...

Karl Henning

When [ too much time on one's hands ] = [ more listening ], it's the good thing : )

Dave, what do you have on your iPod, then, what were you listening to last night?
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

dave b

Let me check it out, Karl.

Here's the list.

Serenade for Strings
The Nutcracker Suite
Romeo and Juliet Overture
Coronation March
Symphony No. 6
Capriccio Italian
1812 Overture
Variations on a Rococo Theme
Sleeping Beauty
Swan Lake

dave b

#10
I found the Serenade For Strings to be simply unlike anything I've heard before.

Serenade For Strings in C, Op. 48

I bought David Brown's book several years ago, did not get into it all that much, will order it again from amazon..I'd like to pick a few composers and really explore their works.

Karl Henning

The BSO strings played that conductorless a season or two back. That's all good stuff, no wonder.  The Capriccio italien is still a sentimental favorite of mine, and the Waltz of the Flowers from The Nutcracker is a pinnacle of Art.
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

TheGSMoeller

Quote from: karlhenning on June 03, 2013, 10:37:50 AM
The BSO strings played that conductorless a season or two back. That's all good stuff, no wonder.  The Capriccio italien is still a sentimental favorite of mine, and the Waltz of the Flowers from The Nutcracker is a pinnacle of Art.

Got a chance to perform Capriccio Italian years ago. Fun piece.

mc ukrneal

Sammy has given a nice concise answer. I would add that Tchaikovsky also nicely meshes Western music with Russian music, so it is both familiar and exotic to some degree.
Be kind to your fellow posters!!

jochanaan

For me it comes down to this: Tchaikovsky has heart.  If that seems cryptic, well, that's the best I can do. :-\
Imagination + discipline = creativity

dave b

#15
It doesn't seem cryptic at all--especially after listening to his works for that long period of time the other night.

jut1972

Been reading some of daveb's posts tonight I think we are kindred spirits!

Ive wondered this same question because I dont get Bach AT ALL. I get Haydn, Mozart,  Beethoven but I dont understand why Bach is considered great.   I know I'm wrong on this he is a great but for the life of me I've no idea why!

That said my ignorant two penneth worth would be
1 has to advance the development of music
2 has to have memorable tunes
3 has to have a decent hit rate

Number 2 is why I cant get atonal and great to reconcile either.

Sean

dave b!!!

Another poster I saw off...