What audio system do you have, or plan on getting?

[Mandryka]

I'd like to set it up at home. I'm looking for a minimalistic kind of look. Don't want to have big or too many speakers. Right now I have 5+1 system, but I'm getting the feeling that all those speakers aren't that necessary for listening to something like Morton Feldman, for example.

One obvious recommendation to investigate is the Kef LS50

One that's been recommended to me, I haven't heard it but the guy who recommended it is someone who IMO has a good pair of ears, is the Revox Piccolo. The Piccolo system consists of two small speakers and a subwoofer, the crossover is in the sub, and the sub is easily hidden.

[Daverz]

One obvious recommendation to investigate is the Kef LS50

And there's the powered version, the LS50W.  That would satisfy the minimalist requirement.  And KEF has a smaller powered speaker, the LSX, at half the price of the LS50W.

At a much lower price point, these look interesting for $600:

https://www.stereophile.com/content/vanatoo-transparent-one-encore-powered-loudspeaker-system

though I think they'd run out of gas on big stuff like Bruckner and Strauss.

[Herman]

I have a friend who has a stacked 57's setup very similar to this....





Admittedly he has a large house and a very tolerant wife. I forget what they are driven by, certainly low wattage valves, but they sound wonderful, particularly with jazz and acoustic music.

I was going to ask "Does his wife know about this room?" but I guess you answered the question.

In the case of people who have such extensive (and expensive) stereos, I keep wondering, Do they live in the absolute middle of nowhere? Because I would prefer to spend that money and attention on getting to live concerts.

[SurprisedByBeauty]

I was going to ask "Does his wife know about this room?" but I guess you answered the question.

Where do you think the flowers come from. That's the compromising touch. 

[Herman]

Where do you think the flowers come from. That's the compromising touch. 

"Honey, you can't take a picture and post it like this. People will think you're crazy!

"Let me at least add some flowers, I'll take 'em back after you're done."

[SurprisedByBeauty]

"Honey, you can't take a picture and post it like this. People will think you're crazy!

"Let me at least add some flowers, I'll take 'em back after you're done."

In truth, it's a very beautiful room, actually, except for the low, panel-type ceiling and those hideous speakers.

[Daverz]

I was going to ask "Does his wife know about this room?" but I guess you answered the question.

In the case of people who have such extensive (and expensive) stereos, I keep wondering, Do they live in the absolute middle of nowhere? Because I would prefer to spend that money and attention on getting to live concerts.

Not everyone enjoys concerts.

It looks like all vintage gear.  It doesn't necessarily represent a huge expense.

[Fëanor]

Not everyone enjoys concerts.

It looks like all vintage gear.  It doesn't necessarily represent a huge expense.

Indeed.  I enjoy concerts but don't get to go very often.  Two reasons: first, there are relatively few good performance in my immediate area, and secondly, the cost of very good performance is high for my personal budget, especially if I have to travel 2-3 hours to get to them.

OTOH, I listen to my stereo system 1-2 hours every evening.  Having great sound -- in my case -- greatly enhances my enjoyment.  BTW, the sound quality of the the particular recordings is a least as important as playback equipment;  unfortunately most recordings have mediocre sound quality, IMHO.

Audiophilia is a separate disease than music-loving.  Many music lovers are quite content with mediocre sound;  many audiophiles are content with playing a relatively small number of recordings again & again.  Also, the majority of audiophiles have little if any interest in classical music.

[Mandryka]

The truth is that quite often when I'm at a concert I get angry because my music at home doesn't sound as good, and it would inspire me to try and improve the hifi. It's all the spacial cues that get lost in reproduction, the sense of the hall, the location of the musicians relative to each other.  Things have got much better in that respect since I got the Krell.

I am quite clear that I want to recreate a concert like sound. Most people don't want this, they want a smoother more processed studio sound at home.

Concerts have become so expensive!

[Irons]

Audiophilia is a separate disease than music-loving.  Many music lovers are quite content with mediocre sound;  many audiophiles are content with playing a relatively small number of recordings again & again.  Also, the majority of audiophiles have little if any interest in classical music.

100%. Also true that (trained) music lovers are content with mediocre sound - as the appreciation takes place between the ears not the ears themselves - if that makes sense. You did say "majority" so I guess that makes me a minority as I am an audiophile and it was a natural progression to classical music from jazz and other forms. After many years it is true now that the music is more important then what I play it on which is a good thing.

[Fëanor]

The truth is that quite often when I'm at a concert I get angry because my music at home doesn't sound as good, and it would inspire me to try and improve the hifi. It's all the spacial cues that get lost in reproduction, the sense of the hall, the location of the musicians relative to each other.  Things have got much better in that respect since I got the Krell.

I am quite clear that I want to recreate a concert like sound. Most people don't want this, they want a smoother more processed studio sound at home.

Concerts have become so expensive!

I'm not sure about "most" people, but certainly many audiophiles know concert hall sound and would prefer to hear it at home if they could get it.  I doubt that really convincing concert hall sound is consistently possible with playback equipment.

For that matter concert hall sound itself isn't just one thing;  it depends on the hall and your particular seat in it, plus other sometimes such and the placement of the performers.

IMHO, the closest one can get to concert hall is a high-quality multichannel system.  Such system, though, are expensive and difficult to set up in the average home setting.  And the same is true for multichannel as it is for stereo:  most recordings are mediocre.

[aligreto]

In the case of people who have such extensive (and expensive) stereos, I keep wondering, Do they live in the absolute middle of nowhere? Because I would prefer to spend that money and attention on getting to live concerts.

In this particular case, yes he does.

[Mandryka]

I'm not sure about "most" people, but certainly many audiophiles know concert hall sound and would prefer to hear it at home if they could get it.  I doubt that really convincing concert hall sound is consistently possible with playback equipment.

For that matter concert hall sound itself isn't just one thing;  it depends on the hall and your particular seat in it, plus other sometimes such and the placement of the performers.

IMHO, the closest one can get to concert hall is a high-quality multichannel system.  Such system, though, are expensive and difficult to set up in the average home setting.  And the same is true for multichannel as it is for stereo:  most recordings are mediocre.

One thing I will say is that the Krell KSA50 with Spendor SP1s and a Theta DAC gave a sense of space which is astonishingly real. Of course you need a good input to start with. The amp is a big contributor here.

I've heard people say a few times that the sound of live music is splashy compared with a well engineered studio recording, which irons out the asperities of real sound, and which they prefer.

[Fëanor]

Audiophilia is a separate disease than music-loving.  Many music lovers are quite content with mediocre sound;  many audiophiles are content with playing a relatively small number of recordings again & again.  Also, the majority of audiophiles have little if any interest in classical music.

100%. Also true that (trained) music lovers are content with mediocre sound - as the appreciation takes place between the ears not the ears themselves - if that makes sense. You did say "majority" so I guess that makes me a minority as I am an audiophile and it was a natural progression to classical music from jazz and other forms. After many years it is true now that the music is more important then what I play it on which is a good thing.

I'm not a musician nor have any serious musical train, I'm just a listener.  Maybe a consequence of that is that I really enjoy great sound.  Frankly I'd rather have a good performance and great sound than great performance and mediocre sound -- philistine that I am. 

Classical musical-loving audiophiles are, in my observation, a minority though a substantial one.

[Fëanor]

One thing I will say is that the Krell KSA50 with Spendor SP1s and a Theta DAC gave a sense of space which is astonishingly real. Of course you need a good input to start with. The amp is a big contributor here.

I've heard people say a few times that the sound of live music is splashy compared with a well engineered studio recording, which irons out the asperities of real sound, and which they prefer.

It wouldn't surprise me that the Krell, Spendor, Theta combo sounds great.  I would put my own current setup against it a expect a similar result.

But neither combination is going to produce terrific sound with the average recording.  As you suggest, the typical recording is mediocre:  the garbage in - garbage out principle applies.

[Mandryka]

But neither combination is going to produce terrific sound with the average recording.  As you suggest, the typical recording is mediocre:  the garbage in - garbage out principle applies.

Sure, this is right.

[Archaic Torso of Apollo]

Audiophilia is a separate disease than music-loving.  Many music lovers are quite content with mediocre sound;  many audiophiles are content with playing a relatively small number of recordings again & again.  Also, the majority of audiophiles have little if any interest in classical music.

Interesting discussion. My own observations:

Lots of classical music listeners are not interested in collecting recordings. I run into people who listen on the radio, go to concerts, say "I love X composer," but their collection might run to 5-10 CDs.

Musicians I've known are usually not audiophiles. Whether because they spend so much time around live music that they don't care enough about home listening to invest in it, or they don't think it's worth the expense.

Conversely, audiophiles I've known often are more interested in sound than music. One audiophile I knew said the only reason he went to concerts was "to get the reference for great stereo sound." (They seem to use the word "reference" a lot.)

Concerts have become so expensive!

That is a problem. I can rarely justify going to them nowadays, unless I can get some kind of discount, or it's free in the first place.

[staxomega]

Then £500 sounds like a good price, if you can do the assembly yourself (the cabs may be hard to make, BBC speaker cabinets are thin and have to be glued in a special way, the cabinet vibrations are an important aspect of the sound. They need to be on stands in a way which allows the cabs to vibrate.)

I don't have LS3/5A, I have bigger BBC monitors, Spendor SP1, the closest I get to LS3/5a is with my JR149s, which  are really speakers which are only excellent for low volume near-field listening, they really can't fill a room with sound very well. I suspect the same is true for LS3/5As

That's bound to be a major difference between ESLs and LS3/5As -- the panels of the ESLs can move so much more air.

Thanks, I will update if I decide to go through with it.

I'm not sure about "most" people, but certainly many audiophiles know concert hall sound and would prefer to hear it at home if they could get it.  I doubt that really convincing concert hall sound is consistently possible with playback equipment.

For that matter concert hall sound itself isn't just one thing;  it depends on the hall and your particular seat in it, plus other sometimes such and the placement of the performers.

IMHO, the closest one can get to concert hall is a high-quality multichannel system.  Such system, though, are expensive and difficult to set up in the average home setting.  And the same is true for multichannel as it is for stereo:  most recordings are mediocre.

I think it is possible to get close to reproducing concert hall sound but it will never get you all the way there. For my ears the best I have heard are constant directivity speakers that the likes of Floyd Toole and Earl Geddes have published papers on combined with high sensitivity. The speakers that got the closest there in terms of tone, detail, dynamic range and that "live feeling" were a huge pair of custom built horns, with a midbass horn driver. I estimate sensitivity of that system somewhere around 102-105 db/w.

The system was not entirely problem free, but from what I could pick up much was due to the complete untreated and live room (cement floors, really exacerbating floor bounce).

[SurprisedByBeauty]

For a while I was looking at the picture, thinking: I don't see the speakers! 


Eventually I realized I was ONLY seeing speakers.

[Fëanor]

For a while I was looking at the picture, thinking: I don't see the speakers! 


Eventually I realized I was ONLY seeing speakers.

Haha ... Yes, they are monsters.  Such at those are out of the question for me.

I think "constant directivity" is a valid concept, though.