What audio system do you have, or plan on getting?

[Harry]

Well said! It is the fear of missing out. It is the capitalism trying to make us feel we never have it good enough.
My philosophy is to buy good enough gear and be content with it while concentrating on the music, the main point of this hobby. I usually use my gear as long as it is working properly.

Most of sound quality comes from how the music is produced/recorded/mixed and mastered. Great gear doesn't make bad music sound better. We are not living the days of wax cylinders anymore. Even somewhat cheap gear can offer very transparent sound quality as long as you know where to invest most money (that would be room acoustics, speakers and headphones).

You do not know what you are talking about  Professor Poju, all your science is worthless compared to my ears.

[drogulus]

   

Why should I scroll past? What's the point for me to be here if I am not supposed to express my views?

    You're entirely correct to be passionate about your views. So, shut up. 

[Harry]

That is it, I will not post a single thing in this thread anymore

[Harry]

This is starting to verge on the ridiculous. Two members appear unable to simply scroll past the posts of a third, whose enthusiasm clearly irks them for reasons they've yet to explain. Instead, they resort to repeated claims that he: a) doesn't understand physics, and b) posts about his interest too often. Despite the fact that he has already addressed these accusations several times before. At this stage, it no longer feels like fair exchange but rather a sustained and rather petty attempt at having a go at him.

And so it is, this is why I will never again utter one word about my travail concerning HiRes. clearly this thread attracts members that like to have a go at me, with zero respect for what I think. You have won, I will not spend anymore energy in this thread, bath in your righteousness.

[71 dB]

You do not know what you are talking about  Professor Poju, all your science is worthless compared to my ears.

I'm not a professor... ..just a dude with a university degree. In order to have that degree I had to learn about many things including how hearing works and how it can deceive us. The audio industry takes a lot of advantage of that.

As I have said before, thanks to science we have things like audio technology in the first place. So, maybe it isn't a bad idea to give a little more credit to science and also admit that our senses can deceive us sometimes.

And so it is, this is why I will never again utter one word about my travail concerning HiRes.

That is totally your choice.

Clearly this thread attracts members that like to have a go at me, with zero respect for what I think.

I'm sorry you feel that way. The fact that I don't respect some of "your" opinions about audio gear doesn't mean I don't respect you as a person or your other opinions. I have a go at snake oil marketing and anti-science sentiments in general.

You have won, I will not spend anymore energy in this thread, bath in your righteousness.

That doesn't feel like a victory to me.

[DavidW]

This is starting to verge on the ridiculous. Two members appear unable to simply scroll past the posts of a third, whose enthusiasm clearly irks them for reasons they've yet to explain. Instead, they resort to repeated claims that he: a) doesn't understand physics, and b) posts about his interest too often. Despite the fact that he has already addressed these accusations several times before. At this stage, it no longer feels like fair exchange but rather a sustained and rather petty attempt at having a go at him.

Referring to me in the third person, how gauche! I'm not irked, I'm concerned. There is a difference. I have no interest in having "a go at him." On the contrary, unlike you and @Irons, I'm not here to argue.

[DavidW]

Well said! It is the fear of missing out. It is the capitalism trying to make us feel we never have it good enough.

I've been down that path so often myself. Spending too much money for small gains. And it opens the door. I was like "boy, with these new speakers, aren't they hindered by my amp? by my dac?" Even outside of audiophilia. I had to talk myself out of thinking I needed a new oled just because it had better color brightness and volume. I need to enjoy what I have. And stop making myself sick with the fomo.

[AnotherSpin]

And so it is, this is why I will never again utter one word about my travail concerning HiRes. clearly this thread attracts members that like to have a go at me, with zero respect for what I think. You have won, I will not spend anymore energy in this thread, bath in your righteousness.

It seems there won't be anything worth reading in this thread anymore. Baseless speculations and scientific references from people who have no idea what good audio sounds like aren't particularly interesting. Well then, we'll read other threads, there's still a lot of interesting stuff there for now.

[hopefullytrusting]

My current audio system:

OneOdio red/black wired, over ear headphones and an Acer Aspire 5 laptop.

[Daverz]

You do not know what you are talking about  Professor Poju, all your science is worthless compared to my ears.

That's such an American attitude.

[drogulus]

My current audio system:

OneOdio red/black wired, over ear headphones and an Acer Aspire 5 laptop.

    It's quite useful to deploy a dongle DAC/amp for your phones. There are excellent options under $100.



     There are many like it, but this one is mine. It's $69 on Amazon.

[Irons]

Referring to me in the third person, how gauche! I'm not irked, I'm concerned. There is a difference. I have no interest in having "a go at him." On the contrary, unlike you and @Irons, I'm not here to argue.

Disappointed I came over as argumentative as that wasn't my intention.

[71 dB]

It seems there won't be anything worth reading in this thread anymore. Baseless speculations and scientific references from people who have no idea what good audio sounds like aren't particularly interesting. Well then, we'll read other threads, there's still a lot of interesting stuff there for now.

Why do you think we don't have an idea what good audio sounds like? You think I haven't heard hi end setups? You think I haven't developed analytic good hearing? 

Good sound quality is very important to me. I just have the knowledge where good sound comes from and what is snake oil. Most of it are things we consumers of music can't do anything about (recording/mixing/mastering) and of the things we can do something about room acoustic/correction, speakers (+their placement in the room) and headphones (+crossfeeders etc. because recordings are typically mixed for speakers and the spatiality is more or less wrong for headphones) are the most important. Cables on the other hand do almost nothing. I say almost, because speaker cables can have an impact on sound if they are too long/and or thin. It is also good if the cable is mechanically robust and doesn't start to develop issues in use. Buying the cheapest cable on the market might not be the smarted move for this reason, but the second or third cheapest option might be the right one.

[71 dB]

Thank you, again a disrespectful response, and please mind your own business if this is all you have to say

You may feel it is disrespectful Harry, but it wasn't intended that way. It was intented to be honest and straight. The purpose was to make you think about your hobby and what you are doing. You may have the money for your hobby for now (good for you!), but audio gets exponentially more expensive the more "hi end" it gets.

Say your good friend starts using alcohol more and more. What do you do? Nothing or do you try to talk to him/her about it? Would the latter be disrespectful?

What kind of responses do you want to your posts Harry? Do you want us to be like 10 years old boys expressing our excitement "Wow, what an awesome audio gear!" or actual grown ups who may even find things to criticise about?

[AnotherSpin]

Why do you think we don't have an idea what good audio sounds like? You think I haven't heard hi end setups? You think I haven't developed analytic good hearing? 

Good sound quality is very important to me. I just have the knowledge where good sound comes from and what is snake oil. Most of it are things we consumers of music can't do anything about (recording/mixing/mastering) and of the things we can do something about room acoustic/correction, speakers (+their placement in the room) and headphones (+crossfeeders etc. because recordings are typically mixed for speakers and the spatiality is more or less wrong for headphones) are the most important. Cables on the other hand do almost nothing. I say almost, because speaker cables can have an impact on sound if they are too long/and or thin. It is also good if the cable is mechanically robust and doesn't start to develop issues in use. Buying the cheapest cable on the market might not be the smarted move for this reason, but the second or third cheapest option might be the right one.

I'm sorry, but I honestly don't see much point in continuing this discussion. It's clear we don't share any real common ground. Your views seem to come from books written by others, books which, to be frank, strike me as rather simplistic and contrived. My perspective is shaped by personal experience, and I don't feel any need for that experience to align with what you or anyone else happens to believe.

Do have a pleasant day, and may your music be truly splendid.

[71 dB]

I'm sorry, but I honestly don't see much point in continuing this discussion.

If you want everyone agree with you then I'm afraid that's not going to happen online.

It's clear we don't share any real common ground.

I'm sure there are some things we do agree upon. Then again there seems to be areas of strong disagreements also...

Your views seem to come from books written by others, books which, to be frank, strike me as rather simplistic and contrived.

Oh now books are useless? What next? Education is evil? We really don't seem to have much common ground. 

My views do come partially from books (such as The Science of Sound by Thomas D. Rossing used as the text book in Acoustics 101 course), but also from having sound reproduction as a hobby for decades, making music and learning from that and thinking about thinks myself. I am not someone who reads books written by others believing everything without critical thinking.

My perspective is shaped by personal experience, and I don't feel any need for that experience to align with what you or anyone else happens to believe.

Your or my experiences are "real" to us, but they don't always align with reality. Our brain interprets the sensory data provided by our senses and that process is often anything but objective. However, you may need to read "simplistic and contrived" books to learn about these things. 

Do have a pleasant day, and may your music be truly splendid.

Thanks! Wishing you the same. 

[Fëanor]

You may feel it is disrespectful Harry, but it wasn't intended that way. It was intented to be honest and straight. The purpose was to make you think about your hobby and what you are doing. You may have the money for your hobby for now (good for you!), but audio gets exponentially more expensive the more "hi end" it gets.

Say your good friend starts using alcohol more and more. What do you do? Nothing or do you try to talk to him/her about it? Would the latter be disrespectful?

What kind of responses do you want to your posts Harry? Do you want us to be like 10 years old boys expressing our excitement "Wow, what an awesome audio gear!" or actual grown ups who may even find things to criticise about?

It's perfectly valid for audiophiles to enjoy the subjective experience of hi-fi and select equipment on the basis of their impressions.  They should not be demeaned on that account:  chacun à son goût.  However there are a couple of caveats.  To be clear, I'm not accusing Harry of violating these constraints.

Subjectivist should never insist their impressions are definitive or proof-positive that one component is better than the other as others may experience.

Subjectivist ought to admit the that people can delude themselves about what they think they hear. Bind test comparisons consistently show that subjective differences tend go away under those conditions.  This has been demonstrated by decades of psychoacoustic research by Dr. Floyd Toole and others.

[AnotherSpin]

If you want everyone agree with you then I'm afraid that's not going to happen online.
I'm sure there are some things we do agree upon. Then again there seems to be areas of strong disagreements also...
Oh now books are useless? What next? Education is evil? We really don't seem to have much common ground. 

My views do come partially from books (such as The Science of Sound by Thomas D. Rossing used as the text book in Acoustics 101 course), but also from having sound reproduction as a hobby for decades, making music and learning from that and thinking about thinks myself. I am not someone who reads books written by others believing everything without critical thinking.
Your or my experiences are "real" to us, but they don't always align with reality. Our brain interprets the sensory data provided by our senses and that process is often anything but objective. However, you may need to read "simplistic and contrived" books to learn about these things. 

Thanks! Wishing you the same. 

Heaven forbid. I have no need for external confirmation to be sure of what I know. My knowing is, to me, beyond doubt. Books have no bearing on the matter. No education makes an individual free; quite the contrary.

Moreover, we appear to have rather different notions of what reality is. That is precisely why I do not seek agreement.

[Florestan]

No education makes an individual free; quite the contrary.

Correct. As any idiot can see or attest, true freedom comes from being uneducated and ignorant.

[71 dB]

It's perfectly valid for audiophiles to enjoy the subjective experience of hi-fi and select equipment on the basis of their impressions.  They should not be demeaned on that account:  chacun à son goût.

I have no issues with people spending big money on gear they can afford and want to own, but I do have issues with claims that are clearly non-scientific and snake-oily. Internet cables don't affect sound quality as long as they are working. Burn in is a thing only in a few aspects of audio gear. Cables don't have burn in and in general cables has almost no impact on sound quality. Also, Hi-rez audio isn't any better than normal CD quality sound. If the Hi-rez version sounds better/different it is because it is different master and he comparison isn't fair.

If you are willing to acknowledge these things then I have no problem with a lot of money put on audio gear. It is everyones' own money after all and not my business how it is spend.

However there are a couple of caveats.  To be clear, I'm not accusing Harry of violating these constraints.

Subjectivist should never insist their impressions are definitive or proof-positive that one component is better than the other as others may experience.

Subjectivist ought to admit the that people can delude themselves about what they think they hear. Bind test comparisons consistently show that subjective differences tend go away under those conditions.  This has been demonstrated by decades of psychoacoustic research by Dr. Floyd Toole and others.

The ability to hear differences were there actually aren't any audible ones to be heard is some kind of indentity for subjectivists and that's why it is so difficult to let go of it. Oftentimes proper double blind listening tests can be humbling enought to help with this, but subjectists typically avoid such tests as unnatural. However, such tests are the only way to get to the OBJECTIVE truth by removing the influence of subjectivity.

Subjectivists also seem to deny the fact that audio industry uses human psychology to increase business just as any other industry does. Do you really believe a certain shampoo makes the hair 65 % fluffier and 55 % shinier? Compared to what? I hope not.