Haydn Keyboard Sonatas

Started by Que, May 27, 2008, 09:52:45 PM

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Geo Dude

Quote from: Mandryka on January 01, 2012, 11:40:17 PM
I'm glad to hear it. I enjoyed his Beethoven Op 12/3 rather more than the Mozart. Even so, they're far from the most noble and elegant there. I also saw him perform some Schumann last year: that was a nice night out.

Try some of the samples here, I think you'll find that his interpretations have grown with time.

Geo Dude

#261
Quote from: Geo Dude on January 01, 2012, 03:59:00 PMTime for thread duty.  Preliminary thoughts on the Beghin set: 

I'm on disc four and having mixed feelings about this set up to now.  On the one hand, the whole concept and execution behind the set is astounding and I'm glad that Haydn has finally been given the proper treatment, more so because it's at a budget price that will draw in new listeners.  On the other hand, Beghin and I seem to disagree on what kind of harpsichord and clavichord (or tuning of those instruments) makes for a good sound.  Thus far, the harpsichord and clavichord that he has used strike me as very bright and thin, even by harpischord/clavichord standards.  (Here are some samples of harpsichords that I love for a point of reference.)  As a result of this, I have trouble stringing together the series of pretty sounds into structured music without a deeper bass end to help put everything into focus.

Fortunately, there are moments of brilliance here and there that I love and I'm sure that in time I'll gain a better understanding of the harpsichord/clavichord section of this set.  Until then, I will be immersing myself in harpsichord and clavichord music.  (Looks like I may be going on a bit of a baroque binge...)  I will note that this set has made me much more appreciative of the Schornsheim set which previously turned me off.  Her darker toned harpsichord and staccato playing don't sound so 'heavy' now that I've heard this, and I would certainly recommend it as a contrasting set for Schornsheim lovers.  For that matter, my feelings on the music up to this point are not all negative:  While I don't particularly like the instruments I do love Beghin's playing style, and I am sure he will come across wonderfully on the works for square piano and the two fortepianos.  All three instruments performed magnificently in the 'making of' documentary on the DVD.

I would recommend this set to anyone interested in Haydn's music for the historical information if nothing else, but I think that one should do some sampling to make sure they like the sound of the keyboards used, or at least be prepared for a set that may take some time to grow on them.

By the way, this set hasn't been reviewed on Amazon yet and I'm sure it would be beneficial for Haydn newcomers.  Gurn?

I've listened to discs five and six today and my impressions are improving, fortunately.  I still find the clavichord a bit twangy in the high notes and spongy, for lack of a better term, in the lower notes but I'm enjoying the music.  I don't know if this is a result of adjustment to the clavichord sound, the improvements occurring in Haydn's compositional skills, or both of the above, but I'm happy.  For that matter, I much prefer the sound of the French harpsichord to the previous one.  It's quite beautiful.  Also, the adagio in Sonata No. 38 in F major, Hob.XVI:23 is sublime.  I know that Haydn is known for his great slow movements, and it's great to see one show up.  The lute register that shows up in that movement (I think it's a lute register) is stunningly beautiful.

Leo K.

Quote from: Geo Dude on January 02, 2012, 06:57:47 PM
I've listened to discs five and six today and my impressions are improving, fortunately.  I still find the clavichord a bit twangy in the high notes and spongy, for lack of a better term, but I'm enjoying the music.  I don't know if this is a result of adjustment to the clavichord sound, the improvements occurring in Haydn's compositional skills, or both of the above, but I'm happy.  For that matter, I much prefer the sound of the French harpsichord to the previous one.  It's quite beautiful.  Also, the adagio in Sonata No. 38 in F major, Hob.XVI:23 is sublime.  I know that Haydn is known for his great slow movements, and it's great to see one show up.  The lute register that shows up in that movement (I think it's a lute register) is stunningly beautiful.

Much thanks for your thoughts and impressions. I've just received the set and so far, have watched most of the documentary. I'm blown away at the information and the chance to witness the making of such a project! I am looking forward to listening to the disks soon!

8)


Opus106

Reading all the comments here about Beghin set, it seems it would do Naxos some good if they released the documentary separately for those who don't wish for an overdose of Haydn's keyboard oeuvre. The DVD/BR/whatever plus a sampler disc or two will be nice. :)
Regards,
Navneeth

Karl Henning

Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Leon

Quote from: Opus106 on January 03, 2012, 10:38:26 AM
Reading all the comments here about Beghin set, it seems it would do Naxos some good if they released the documentary separately for those who don't wish for an overdose of Haydn's keyboard oeuvre. The DVD/BR/whatever plus a sampler disc or two will be nice. :)

Actually the DVD has seven ( I think) performances along with the film on the project - so it comes with a sampler of sorts already.    :)

For myself, I have no complaints at all with the instruments and value having the entire collection of the works since they are a very nice contrast to both Brautigam and SchornsheimBeghin's scholarship is impeccable, as is his playing, IMO.

:)

Opus106

Quote from: Arnold on January 03, 2012, 10:47:51 AM
Actually the DVD has seven ( I think) performances along with the film on the project - so it comes with a sampler of sorts already.    :)

Ah, perfect.

Quote
For myself, I have no complaints at all with the instruments and value having the entire collection of the works since they are a very nice contrast to both Brautigam and SchornsheimBeghin's scholarship is impeccable, as is his playing, IMO.

:)

Don't mistake me: I don't intend to belittle the value of Haydn's music or Beghin's playing (and I shouldn't, as I haven't even heard his playing). Given the plaudits that the documentary has received so far (at least in the forum), it appears that it could be a worthy 'stand-alone' product. And Naxos is a label that is known to produce educational material on music alongside its regular recordings. :)
Regards,
Navneeth

Geo Dude

Quote from: Leo K on January 03, 2012, 10:02:55 AM
Much thanks for your thoughts and impressions. I've just received the set and so far, have watched most of the documentary. I'm blown away at the information and the chance to witness the making of such a project! I am looking forward to listening to the disks soon!

8)

My first step was also to watch the documentary, and yes, the scope of the project and dedication required is mind blowing.  I'm sure you'll enjoy the set and I hope you don't have the same issues with some of the instruments that I did.

Mandryka

#268
I think whatever you think of the tone of the instruments he uses, Beghin has done  some really special things.

In the C minor sonata Hob 20 # 33, the conception of the music, the depth of feeling and wealth of ideas, are pretty memorable, and I'd be hard put to think of a more successful record from that point lf view. For me unnerving edginess and tension are part of what makes me value Haydn's music, and Beghin here is one of the musicians who seems to share this point of view. Same for the D major  # 30 Hob 19 (there must be some better way of naming these sonatas!)

I like most of the instruments, though that maybe novelty. I seem to be pretty open minded about tones, it's not what I listen for really. I can even enjoy Glenn Gould playing Handel, but that's another story. I'm not bothered about historical authenticity.

I discovered Beghin through his Beethoven Op 111, which I think has some real interesting things to say in the first movement especially.
Wovon man nicht sprechen kann, darüber muss man schweigen

Todd

Quote from: admiralackbar on November 24, 2012, 06:02:08 PMNot to hijack the thread, by any means, but what's your impression of Jando's Haydn Sonatas, Todd?



Haven't heard any yet.
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People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

Propaganda death ensemble - Tom Araya

admiralackbar

Quote from: Todd on November 25, 2012, 08:45:00 AM
Haven't heard any yet.

Gotcha.

I have the complete Haydn set by Jando. I really enjoy the early sonatas (especially Nos. 1-10, which I think are available on a separate disc by themselves) mostly b/c I've played and/or taught all of them at one point or another. They're really lovely works and Jando was, at least originally, the only well-reviewed performer of those particular works I could find. Now, of course, Bavouzet has embarked on a complete set, and I do love his playing. I'm planning on adding the Brautigam set, too, but that's on fortepiano, so I don't mind having a modern piano set and a fortepiano set. Just wondering if I should hang on to the Jando long-term or plan on replacing it with something better. (I've listened to the late sonatas from Jando's set and they're neither great nor terrible.)

Will look to post in one of the Haydn threads to continue the conversation. Thanks.

Chris L.

#271
Diving into Haydn's piano sonatas. Pianist Walter Olbertz really makes these sonatas come alive. There is none of the meandering, overly-intellectual soul searching style of playing to be found here. Just pure Haydnesque mischievousness, full of zest and life, in the way that I feel this music should be played. Sound quality is excellent, with crisp, clear, bright tones. I've only heard Brendel's and Ax's recordings as a reference, but as much as I like those I think I like Olbertz a bit better. This is a set that I won't put off listening to in it's entirety.


SonicMan46

Quote from: Chris L. on March 23, 2015, 10:09:13 AM
Diving into Haydn's piano sonatas. Pianist Walter Olbertz really makes these sonatas come alive. There is none of the meandering, overly-intellectual soul searching style of playing to be found here. Just pure Haydnesque mischievousness, full of zest and life, in the way that I feel this music should be played. Sound quality is excellent, with crisp, clear, bright tones. I've only heard Brendel's and Ax's recordings as a reference, but as much as I like those I think I like Olbertz a bit better. This is a set that I won't put off listening to in it's entirety.



Boy, has been a couple of years since this thread was last posted to until now!  I've not been active here for about 4 years or so, but have acquired 4 'complete' sets of these works on both PIs & MIs (shown below) - have not heard the set mentioned above and would be curious what some of the newer or re-packaged (e.g. by Brilliant et al) offerings might be of these works?  Dave :)

 

 

San Antone

Quote from: SonicMan46 on March 24, 2015, 09:59:39 AM
Boy, has been a couple of years since this thread was last posted to until now!  I've not been active here for about 4 years or so, but have acquired 4 'complete' sets of these works on both PIs & MIs (shown below) - have not heard the set mentioned above and would be curious what some of the newer or re-packaged (e.g. by Brilliant et al) offerings might be of these works?  Dave :)



 

The period instrument sets are the ones I listen to the most.  But for piano versions, I like

[asin]B001JJX7ME[/asin]

[asin]B00BHEG6CO[/asin]

Chris L.

#274
Quote from: SonicMan46 on March 24, 2015, 09:59:39 AM
Boy, has been a couple of years since this thread was last posted to until now!  I've not been active here for about 4 years or so, but have acquired 4 'complete' sets of these works on both PIs & MIs (shown below) - have not heard the set mentioned above and would be curious what some of the newer or re-packaged (e.g. by Brilliant et al) offerings might be of these works?  Dave :)

 

 
2 years? Well then... it's due time for the thread to be revived a bit! I'd be curious if this pianist, Walter Olbertz of my Berlin Classics set, recorded any of Mozart's sonatas. I would love to hear his take on them if he did. There is no info in this set as to what piano he used or what label these originally released on.

BTW... that "Virtual Haydn" complete solo keyboard set from Naxos has me mesmerized!

Jo498

The Dershavina box is now EUR 19,99 at jpc.de. (It includes a bunch of fragments/single movements and dubious sonatas but no variations or other non-sonata pieces.) It is a great bargain, I think, but I have not heard Olbertz, McCabe or Buchbinder. Still, many commenters found hers the best set on a modern instrument.
Tout le malheur des hommes vient d'une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos, dans une chambre.
- Blaise Pascal

SonicMan46

Quote from: Jo498 on March 25, 2015, 12:46:16 AM
The Dershavina box is now EUR 19,99 at jpc.de. (It includes a bunch of fragments/single movements and dubious sonatas but no variations or other non-sonata pieces.) It is a great bargain, I think, but I have not heard Olbertz, McCabe or Buchbinder. Still, many commenters found hers the best set on a modern instrument.

Yep, I saw that price yesterday and was tempted, but had just received a moderate sized order from JPC and could not justify there shipping fee 'across the pond' - also looked for the Gulda Beethoven there and did not find the box listed (could have missed it) - THEN, I probably would have used them.  Instead ordered both from an Amazon MP seller - the Hadyn box was $29 (+ $4) (although I just checked and that seller has jumped their price up to $34 today!) - Amazon Prime wanted $44 & ArkivMusic wants $99 - SO, I'm happy w/ the price paid.  Dave :)

premont

Quote from: SonicMan46 on March 25, 2015, 08:30:58 AM
..had just received a moderate sized order from JPC and could not justify there shipping fee 'across the pond' - also looked for the Gulda Beethoven there and did not find the box listed (could have missed it) - THEN, I probably would have used them..

Voilá:

https://www.jpc.de/jpcng/classic/detail/-/art/Ludwig-van-Beethoven-1770-1827-Klaviersonaten-Nr-1-32/hnum/4850290
γνῶθι σεαυτόν

SonicMan46

#278
Quote from: (: premont :) on March 25, 2015, 08:38:06 AM
Voilá:

https://www.jpc.de/jpcng/classic/detail/-/art/Ludwig-van-Beethoven-1770-1827-Klaviersonaten-Nr-1-32/hnum/4850290

WOW!  Well, I missed it so too late - would have added a few other items and saved a little money - thanks!  Dave :)

ADDENDUM:  Curious about the the pricing for the two boxes - JPC would have been $48 + $14 (to USA) = $62; Amazon MP seller was $55 + $8 = $63, so basically even - however, I could have looked for other 'bargains' at JPC w/o adding extra shipping.

jlaurson

I love what I've heard of Dershavina, so far.

And those 11 Sonatas of Brendel's are of course a must-have, regardless. His best recordings, I think.

Anyway... all those sets bring the discographical curiosity out in me... so how many sets are there?

Olbertz
McCabe
Buchbinder
Dershavina
Brautigam
Schornsheim
von Alpenheim (that never made it onto CD, did it?)
Beghin
...

am I missing something?