Author Topic: Cato's Grammar Grumble  (Read 554778 times)

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sul G

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Re: Why, yes, I guess I could care less!
« Reply #320 on: March 05, 2009, 06:33:46 AM »
Mistake or not, "could care less" is commonly used.  Most important, it represents understood communication.

Except that it doesn't make a smooth translation across the Atlantic - I don't think I've ever heard a Brit use the phrase ('I couldn't care less' is universal here, I think). So, though we might all know what you mean by it, it's impossible to hear it without thinking, quite simply, 'that doesn't make sense, you know' (well, that's my reaction in any case). IOW, it's a phrase which carries more baggage than its user might think.

karlhenning

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Re: Why, yes, I guess I could care less!
« Reply #321 on: March 05, 2009, 06:37:21 AM »
Except that it doesn't make a smooth translation across the Atlantic - I don't think I've ever heard a Brit use the phrase ('I couldn't care less' is universal here, I think). So, though we might all know what you mean by it, it's impossible to hear it without thinking, quite simply, 'that doesn't make sense, you know' (well, that's my reaction in any case). IOW, it's a phrase which carries more baggage than its user might think.

Gives one pause.  For some what are barking mad, may appear fairly normal most of the time, and it can be these little linguistic slips which tip yer off.

Offline Cato

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Re: Cato's Grammar Grumble
« Reply #322 on: March 05, 2009, 06:46:42 AM »
Don't know if it's any improvement, but in the Romance languages, the term is "biological"  8)

Yes, and in Germany a "Bio-Laden" is a "health-food store" i.e. no pesticides ever used, the cucumbers were sung to, the tomatoes and melons were kissed and tucked in every night, and there's a joke growing here which we will avoid!   8)

On "could care less/could not care less" - The relativists want us to ignore such grammar mistakes, since, after all, something comprehensible is in fact communicated, and anyway, rules are just ways for oppressors to stifle people's expression and to make judgments about them!   $:)

Judgments like: "What a moron!"   0:)
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sul G

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Re: Cato's Grammar Grumble
« Reply #323 on: March 05, 2009, 06:54:25 AM »
On "could care less/could not care less" - The relativists want us to ignore such grammar mistakes, since, after all, something comprehensible is in fact communicated, and anyway, rules are just ways for oppressors to stifle people's expression and to make judgments about them!   $:)

Judgments like: "What a moron!"   0:)

In that sense, such uses of language serve a valuable function!

Offline Florestan

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Re: Cato's Grammar Grumble
« Reply #324 on: March 05, 2009, 06:59:28 AM »
The relativists want us to ignore such grammar mistakes, since, after all, something comprehensible is in fact communicated, and anyway, rules are just ways for oppressors to stifle people's expression and to make judgments about them!   $:)

The brand-new issued Romanian Ortographical Dictionary lists, alongside the right variant, several which are incorrect and brands them "accepted variant", (translation: this is the way some people --- usually illiterate or uncultured --- write or pronounce them).  :o
"Beauty must appeal to the senses, must provide us with immediate enjoyment, must impress us or insinuate itself into us without any effort on our part."

 --- Claude Debussy

Offline Cato

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Re: Cato's Grammar Grumble
« Reply #325 on: March 06, 2009, 04:38:51 AM »
One of my 7th Graders, in an attempt to spell the word "tragedy" for his translation from Latin, came up with the word "trageditty", and I thought that was a splendid word to describe certain operas!   8)

Things by Puccini perhaps?   :o

Or that German guy, Dick Wagner?   $:)
"Meet Miss Ruth Sherwood, from Columbus, Ohio, the Middle of the Universe!"

- Brian Aherne introducing Rosalind Russell in  My Sister Eileen (1942)

karlhenning

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Re: Cato's Grammar Grumble
« Reply #326 on: March 06, 2009, 05:37:39 AM »
Lovely little neologism, that! (trageditty)

Offline DavidRoss

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Re: Cato's Grammar Grumble
« Reply #327 on: March 06, 2009, 06:24:38 AM »
Lovely little neologism, that! (trageditty)
Sounds apt to describe commercial jingles relating the dire consequences of using the wrong deodorant:

Alas my underarms
Were stained with sweat--
The boss didn't like my presentation
Or was it...my perspiration!

No more job
Woe is me
If only I'd used
New improved Sweat Free®
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Offline Cato

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Re: Cato's Grammar Grumble
« Reply #328 on: March 06, 2009, 11:14:14 AM »
While contemplating the moronic lifestyles of many Californians and my junior-high students, who expect Life to smile upon them and drop raisins into their tender mouths without any labor or even the slightest effort on their part, a word from Ancient Greek came back to me, which I often Anglicized for my students.

καθαδυπαθέω = to squander your life in luxury and immoral living

"Cathadypathy" therefore may be the main disease of our day!    >:D

The practioner thereof being the "cathadypathist."   8)
"Meet Miss Ruth Sherwood, from Columbus, Ohio, the Middle of the Universe!"

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karlhenning

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Re: Cato's Grammar Grumble
« Reply #329 on: March 06, 2009, 11:28:03 AM »
Questing for Cathadypathogens . . . .

Offline Cato

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Re: Cato's Grammar Grumble: Save the G, Save the Have/Has
« Reply #330 on: March 09, 2009, 04:24:41 AM »
A certain high-rankin' politician has been drivin' your Grumbler Cato nutzoid on various levels, one of them bein' the Orwellian language employed, so far successfully, in callin' 3 trillion in tax hikes either "fairness" or actually "tax cuts." 

But let us not become too political!   0:)

Somethin' else is drivin' Cato nutzoid, and that is the refusal of more and more Americans, e.g. this politician and certain members of the faculty of Cato's school, to say the final G on the -ing endings.   $:) 

I suspect this is his way of showin' linguistically that he is just a member of the lower classes, a true man o' the peepul.  My fellow faculty members have no such excuse!   $:)

On this grumble is the related death of "have" and "has" with the present perfect progressive.

e.g. "We been lookin' at ways to help all Americans pay more taxes."   8)
 
"I was tellin' the 8th Grade they been slackin' off this past week."  A quote from a 60-year old flower child.  :o

"Meet Miss Ruth Sherwood, from Columbus, Ohio, the Middle of the Universe!"

- Brian Aherne introducing Rosalind Russell in  My Sister Eileen (1942)

Offline Benji

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Re: Cato's Grammar Grumble: Save the G, Save the Have/Has
« Reply #331 on: March 09, 2009, 04:39:49 AM »
Somethin' else is drivin' Cato nutzoid, and that is the refusal of more and more Americans, e.g. this politician and certain members of the faculty of Cato's school, to say the final G on the -ing endings.   $:) 

I'm guilty of this, but it's just a function of my accent and upbringin'.  ;)

Offline Cato

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Re: Cato's Grammar Grumble: Save the G, Save the Have/Has
« Reply #332 on: March 09, 2009, 05:19:46 AM »
I'm guilty of this, but it's just a function of my accent and upbringin'.  ;)

Thank you for confessin', uh, confessing!   8)

Go and sin no more!   0:)

Related to the lack of "have" and "has" with the present perfect progressive is the use of the wrong past participle!   :o

Recently I heard: "Yep, that company was ran into the ground!"   :o

"Those cookies were all ate up by the junior high."    $:)

Anybody else hear such monstrosities?



"Meet Miss Ruth Sherwood, from Columbus, Ohio, the Middle of the Universe!"

- Brian Aherne introducing Rosalind Russell in  My Sister Eileen (1942)

Dr. Dread

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Re: Cato's Grammar Grumble
« Reply #333 on: March 09, 2009, 05:22:57 AM »
Do you hang out with hillbillies, or something?  ;D

karlhenning

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Re: Cato's Grammar Grumble
« Reply #334 on: March 09, 2009, 05:24:44 AM »
Oof.

Offline Cato

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Re: Cato's Grammar Grumble
« Reply #335 on: March 09, 2009, 05:35:02 AM »
Do you hang out with hillbillies, or something?  ;D

Ohio has been invaded by Kentuckians and Tennesseans throughout the last decades, and so yes, you do too often hear "briarhoppers" opining on God, the Universe, cheese, etc. when you are out in public.

"Briarhopper" being a rough term of affection, of course!   0:)

"Meet Miss Ruth Sherwood, from Columbus, Ohio, the Middle of the Universe!"

- Brian Aherne introducing Rosalind Russell in  My Sister Eileen (1942)

karlhenning

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Re: Cato's Grammar Grumble
« Reply #336 on: March 09, 2009, 05:37:28 AM »
Greg Incognito's thread was the occasion for remembering a Cat Stevens cover:

Quote
If I can meet 'em, I can get 'em,
But as yet I haven't met 'em,
That's how I'm in the state I'm in . . . .

File that under Dumb Tautologies in Pop-dom.

I'm in a state.
– What state are you in?
I'm in the state I'm in.

Dr. Dread

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Re: Cato's Grammar Grumble
« Reply #337 on: March 09, 2009, 05:40:50 AM »
Greg Incognito's thread was the occasion for remembering a Cat Stevens cover:

File that under Dumb Tautologies in Pop-dom.

I'm in a state.
– What state are you in?
I'm in the state I'm in.


I think lyrics play by different rules. Like repetition and what sounds good for the song.

karlhenning

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Re: Cato's Grammar Grumble
« Reply #338 on: March 09, 2009, 05:44:49 AM »
I think lyrics play by different rules. Like repetition and what sounds good for the song.

To an extent, yes.  I don't think the rules are utterly different, but one makes allowances.  There's never really any musical necessity for junk words.

Dr. Dread

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Re: Cato's Grammar Grumble
« Reply #339 on: March 09, 2009, 05:48:20 AM »
To an extent, yes.  I don't think the rules are utterly different, but one makes allowances.  There's never really any musical necessity for junk words.

This staaaaaaaaaaaate. This state that I'm iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiin. I'm in it, this staaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaate. That I'm iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiin.

:)