Cato's Grammar Grumble

Started by Cato, February 08, 2009, 05:00:18 PM

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John Copeland

Quote from: Cato on February 10, 2010, 08:45:41 AM
Many thanks for those life-saving commas!

I have mentioned (many moons ago) that I have a somewhat idiosyncratic view of punctuation, where I use it "musically," i.e. as a way to increase or decrease the reader's speed.

Example:

I have mentioned - many moons ago - that I have a (somewhat) idiosyncratic view of punctuation where I use it "musically," i.e. as a way to increase, or decrease, the reader's speed.

And:

I have mentioned many moons ago that I have a somewhat idiosyncratic view of...punctuation, where I use it musically, i.e. as a way to increase - or decrease - the reader's speed. 

I also use punctuation to imply a certain tone.   0:)

But then...don't we all?   :o

Jack Kerouac was very good at using punctuation as a tool to mimic music (and speech) - in his case, Jazz  :-\ .   I think it is a useful and worthwhile method of communicating on a general level.

karlhenning


John Copeland

Well Karl, Jack used to get around a bit as you know, so perhaps you should visit him before he visits you (even if he is dead, he's still on the road).
;D

Spotswood

Quote from: Cato on February 10, 2010, 08:45:41 AMI also use punctuation to imply a certain tone.   0:)

But then...don't we all?   :o

Not. All. Of. Us.

DavidRoss

Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on February 10, 2010, 09:17:02 AM
I need to revisit Kerouac.
Hmmm...it's been awhile for me as well (though I revisited On the Road back in the '80s).  Still, I'm very aware of how much he influenced my adolescence.  That vagabond hipster dharma bum lifestyle sounds more glamorous in print than it is in real life, but it is VERY addictive.  Desolation Angels was my favorite of his books.  It might be interesting to see how well it holds up. 
"Maybe the problem most of you have ... is that you're not listening to Barbirolli." ~Sarge

"The problem with socialism is that sooner or later you run out of other people's money." ~Margaret Thatcher

Franco

Quote from: DavidRoss on February 11, 2010, 12:13:55 AM
Hmmm...it's been awhile for me as well (though I revisited On the Road back in the '80s).  Still, I'm very aware of how much he influenced my adolescence.  That vagabond hipster dharma bum lifestyle sounds more glamorous in print than it is in real life, but it is VERY addictive.  Desolation Angels was my favorite of his books.  It might be interesting to see how well it holds up.

Not very well, at least IMO.  A few years ago I went back and reread most of the books and while parts of them are fun, in general they seemed less compelling than I remembered them.   

karlhenning

Quote from: DavidRoss on February 11, 2010, 12:13:55 AM
. . . That vagabond hipster dharma bum lifestyle sounds more glamorous in print than it is in real life, but it is VERY addictive.

QFT ; )

DavidRoss

Quote from: Franco on February 11, 2010, 02:33:00 AM
Not very well, at least IMO.  A few years ago I went back and reread most of the books and while parts of them are fun, in general they seemed less compelling than I remembered them.
So I suspect.  The things we find appealing in adolescence seldom retain that appeal after we've matured. 
"Maybe the problem most of you have ... is that you're not listening to Barbirolli." ~Sarge

"The problem with socialism is that sooner or later you run out of other people's money." ~Margaret Thatcher

Scarpia

Quote from: DavidRoss on February 11, 2010, 05:18:56 AM
So I suspect.  The things we find appealing in adolescence seldom retain that appeal after we've matured.

You mean Star Wars isn't the greatest film ever made?

karlhenning

Well, to hear Poju tell it . . . .

Florestan

Quote from: DavidRoss on February 11, 2010, 05:18:56 AM
The things we find appealing in adolescence seldom retain that appeal after we've matured.

Classical music excepted. :D
Every kind of music is good, except the boring kind. — Rossini

karlhenning

Quote from: Florestan on February 11, 2010, 05:57:30 AM

Quote from: DavidRossThe things we find appealing in adolescence seldom retain that appeal after we've matured.

Classical music excepted. :D

Yes, my years of adolescence were when Real Music got its hooks in me but good.

MN Dave

I have fond memories of the stuff I read as a kid but, yeah, it doesn't hold up.

DavidRoss

"Maybe the problem most of you have ... is that you're not listening to Barbirolli." ~Sarge

"The problem with socialism is that sooner or later you run out of other people's money." ~Margaret Thatcher

MN Dave


DavidRoss

Quote from: Beethovenian on February 11, 2010, 06:24:45 AM
You guys are mean.  >:(


:P
Well, yes, it feels uncomfortable at times, almost like picking on the Down Syndrome kid, but he's so adamant about his intellectual and aesthetic superiority and so impervious to helpful criticism that poking gentle fun at him might actually be a kindness.
"Maybe the problem most of you have ... is that you're not listening to Barbirolli." ~Sarge

"The problem with socialism is that sooner or later you run out of other people's money." ~Margaret Thatcher

secondwind

     I didn't know what to say; he was right; but all I wanted to do was sneak out into the night and disappear somewhere, and go and find out what everybody was doing all over the country. --Jack Kerouac, On the Road, page 67, paragraph 3 of my September 1957 Second Printing (which I will consider selling when I am much older and grayer and need money to pay the electricity bill, assuming I have finished reading it by then).

Example of musical punctuation?

Cato

Quote from: secondwind on February 11, 2010, 06:53:24 AM
     I didn't know what to say; he was right; but all I wanted to do was sneak out into the night and disappear somewhere, and go and find out what everybody was doing all over the country. --Jack Kerouac, On the Road, page 67, paragraph 3 of my September 1957 Second Printing (which I will consider selling when I am much older and grayer and need money to pay the electricity bill, assuming I have finished reading it by then).

Example of musical punctuation?

Apparently.  The second semicolon, according to the purists, is an error, because of the use of the conjunction "but."

But in a book about slacker, edge-of-society rule-breakers, you expect things like that!   $:)
"Meet Miss Ruth Sherwood, from Columbus, Ohio, the Middle of the Universe!"

- Brian Aherne introducing Rosalind Russell in  My Sister Eileen (1942)

Scarpia

Quote from: Cato on February 11, 2010, 08:42:30 AM
Apparently.  The second semicolon, according to the purists, is an error, because of the use of the conjunction "but."

But in a book about slacker, edge-of-society rule-breakers, you expect things like that!   $:)

I read somewhere that for an anniversary of the publication of On The Road the original, unedited typescript was published.  The one Kerouac prepared by taping a ream of paper together into a continuous scroll, so he could type without interruption while in a drug-addled state.  If I remember correctly, there are no paragraph breaks, I don't know if he used punctuation.

karlhenning

Quote from: Scarpia on February 11, 2010, 08:48:55 AM
I read somewhere that for an anniversary of the publication of On The Road the original, unedited typescript was published.  The one Kerouac prepared by taping a ream of paper together into a continuous scroll, so he could type without interruption while in a drug-addled state.  If I remember correctly, there are no paragraph breaks, I don't know if he used punctuation.

We've got that anniversary edition at the Museum shop; I'll have a look at it tonight.