Gurn's Classical Corner

Started by Gurn Blanston, February 22, 2009, 07:05:20 AM

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Gurn Blanston

Well, I remembered having a Kozeluch Sinfonie Concertante also, and I went back and checked it, and guess what? It turned out to be the Sinfonie Concertante in Eb for mandolin, trumpet, piano, double-bass and orchestra, no opus number (WoO). This is on the splendid 3 disk set from CPO called simply "Sinfonie Concertante". It is all played by ASMitF / Iona Brown & Consortium Classicum / Dieter Klocker. For those of you who are attracted to the form (it is rather like a concerto grosso, only in classical sonata form rather than polyphonic Baroque, of course), this set is a peach. It has works from Kozeluch, Pleyel, Hoffmeister, Winter, Abel, Crusell, Danzi and Schneider. And the solisti range from 2 bassoons to the group mentioned above, with many in between. Highly recommended for SQ, playing, good music, and a chance to hear composers off the beaten path. :)

8)



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SonicMan46

Well, a couple of pages back, I left a link to many of the composers under discussion in Gurn's new thread - these are all linked back to the old forum and seem to be functioning; most of these composers come from the later end of this Classic-Early Romantic era, but a similar list could likely be generated from the earlier end, i.e. Baroque-Early Classic.  But for those interested - pick a name(s) - usually some historic/bio background and specific CD recommendations -  :)

Quote from: SonicMan on April 13, 2007, 07:23:23 PM
As a continuation, below is a shorter list of composers in this category that have had 'separate' threads in our older GMG forum - just click on the names to the right of each composer, if interested; also, feel free to start/continue a new post in our present forum.   :D

Abel, Carl Friedrich (1723 - 1787)  Abel
Boccherini, Luigi (1743-1805) Boccherini
Cartellieri, Antonio (1772- 1807) Cartellieri
Cherubini, Luigi (1760 - 1842) Cherubini
Clementi, Muzio (1752 - 1832) Clementi
Dittersdorf, Carl Ditters von (1739 - 1799) Dittersdorf
Dussek, Jan Ladislav (1760 - 1812) Dussek
Field, John (1782- 1837) Field
Hasse, Johann (1699- 1783) Hasse
Haydn, Franz Joseph (1732 - 1809) Haydn
Hoffmann, Leopold (1738 - 1793) Hoffmann
Holzbauer, Ignaz (1711- 1783) Holzbauer
Hummel, Johann (1778- 1837) Hummel
Kraus, Joseph Martin (1756 - 1792) Kraus
Krommer, Franz (1759 - 1831) Krommer
Locatelli, Pietro (1695- 1764) Locatelli
Mozart, Wolfgang Amadeus (1756 - 1791) Mozart
Onslow, Georges (1785- 1853) Onslow
Pichl, Vaclav (1741- 1805) Pichl
Pleyel, Ignaz Joseph (1757 - 1831) Pleyel
Quantz, Johann Joachim (1697 - 1773) Quantz
Reicha, Anton (1770 - 1836) Reicha
Ries, Ferdinand (1784 - 1838) Ries
Rosetti, Antonio (1750- 1792) Rosetti
Salieri, Antonio (1750 - 1825) Salieri
Spohr, Louis (1784 - 1859) Spohr
Stamitz, Carl (1745 - 1801) Stamitz
Vanhal, Johann Baptist (1739 - 1813)  Vanhal
Viotti, Giovanni Battista (1755 - 1824) Viotti

Gurn Blanston

Quote from: SonicMan on February 28, 2009, 06:54:05 AM
Well, a couple of pages back, I left a link to many of the composers under discussion in Gurn's new thread - these are all linked back to the old forum and seem to be functioning; most of these composers come from the later end of this Classic-Early Romantic era, but a similar list could likely be generated from the earlier end, i.e. Baroque-Early Classic.  But for those interested - pick a name(s) - usually some historic/bio background and specific CD recommendations -  :)


Good list, Dave. As I discovered the other night, going back and finding all those threads can be a time-consuming challenge. :)

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SonicMan46

Quote from: Gurn Blanston on February 28, 2009, 07:00:30 AM
Good list, Dave. As I discovered the other night, going back and finding all those threads can be a time-consuming challenge. :)

8)

Yep, no need to re-duplicate our efforts & those of many others; plus, Sara's 'Composer Index' list is valuable for the 'current' forum - now, if we only had a similar list to the 'old' forum for the earlier 'transition' period -  ;) ;D   Dave

BTW, for those wanting more book recommendations, Mozart in Vienna, 1781-1791 (1986, then translated) by Volkmar Braunbehrens is quite good; obviously covers Wolfie's last 10 years and has plenty of discussion of Vienna of the times, Mozart's friends & fellow composers, and discounts a few myths about his last days.

In addition, I just read in the most recent issue of Fanfare a review of Mozart, Haydn and Early Beethoven: 1781-1802 (2008) by Daniel Heartz (professor emeritus, U. of CA @ Berkeley) - this seems to be part of a 'triology' of books, and likely the last one (he is 80 y/o now) - it is a 'massive' (800 pgs) work and not cheap (Norton); my wife is trying to get me an inter-library loan of his first book in this series Haydn, Mozart and the Viennese School: 1740-1780, published in 1995 and another 800 pg. tome (not sure if I'll make it through these books!) - will try - Dave  :)

   

Gurn Blanston

Quote from: SonicMan on February 28, 2009, 07:17:01 AM
Yep, no need to re-duplicate our efforts & those of many others; plus, Sara's 'Composer Index' list is valuable for the 'current' forum - now, if we only had a similar list to the 'old' forum for the earlier 'transition' period -  ;) ;D   Dave

BTW, for those wanting more book recommendations, Mozart in Vienna, 1781-1791 (1986, then translated) by Volkmar Braunbehrens is quite good; obviously covers Wolfie's last 10 years and has plenty of discussion of Vienna of the times, Mozart's friends & fellow composers, and discounts a few myths about his last days.

In addition, I just read in the most recent issue of Fanfare a review of Mozart, Haydn and Early Beethoven: 1781-1802 (2008) by Daniel Heartz (professor emeritus, U. of CA @ Berkeley) - this seems to be part of a 'triology' of books, and likely the last one (he is 80 y/o now) - it is a 'massive' (800 pgs) work and not cheap (Norton); my wife is trying to get me an inter-library loan of his first book in this series Haydn, Mozart and the Viennese School: 1740-1780, published in 1995 and another 800 pg. tome (not sure if I'll make it through these books!) - will try - Dave  :)

   

Yes, those are handy lists, but it helps to consolidate them in one place. I, for one (and I'm not alone! :D ) am too lazy to do too much searching. Whereas you are a model of researching.   ;D

Books, yes. Braunbehrens' is a highly commendable book, not least because he makes a point of being a "mythbuster", something that is sorely needed for Mozart after the serious distortions of the 19th century. This is a good book.

Heartz is probably the archetype of critical research. His books are extremely well thought of at all levels. Your statement that they are pricey nails the problem nicely though. $80/book is a bit rich for my blood. And I have never seen them at a bargain price either, not even used. But I will own the trilogy one day, probably after the miraculous economic recovery that we are all waiting for... ;)

Some others on classical era music in general:

"Music in the Classic Period" by Reinhard Pauly - this is as much as anything a textbook on music history, specifically on the classical era. Quite readable and very informative.

"Classic and Romantic Music" by Friedrich Blume - This book, more than any single other, has influenced my thoughts on how the classical era fits into music history. Blume was the first to present the idea that there is no dichotomy between "classical" and "romantic" in terms of music, that they are (at their most extreme) simply extremes of the same music, and that nearly all the music of the time fits very neatly into the spectrum of the musical language possibilities. If you have a real interest in this topic, this book is a great starting point.

Interested in other recommendations. If you have read some really good books, please share the titles here. :)

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SonicMan46

Quote from: Gurn Blanston on February 28, 2009, 07:42:39 AM
Yes, those are handy lists, but it helps to consolidate them in one place. I, for one (and I'm not alone! :D ) am too lazy to do too much searching. Whereas you are a model of researching.   ;D

Books, yes. Braunbehrens' is a highly commendable book, not least because he makes a point of being a "mythbuster", something that is sorely needed for Mozart after the serious distortions of the 19th century. This is a good book.

Heartz is probably the archetype of critical research. His books are extremely well thought of at all levels. Your statement that they are pricey nails the problem nicely though. $80/book is a bit rich for my blood. And I have never seen them at a bargain price either, not even used. But I will own the trilogy one day, probably after the miraculous economic recovery that we are all waiting for... ;)

"Classic and Romantic Music" by Friedrich Blume ....................

Yes, all of those years in 'academic radiology' and numerous research projects - does take persistence!  ;D  Fortunately, I've 'slowed down' the last 10 yrs!

Heartz's second book in this triology - Music in European Capitals: The Galant Style, 1720-1780 (2003) - over a 1000 pgs!  :o  Hope that he uses a lot of pictures & musical scores?; but I'll do another borrow if I get through the first one!  The final volume is just over $40 discounted on Amazon, still a hefty price.

Another Mozart book on my shelf is Mozart: The Early Years, 1756-1781 (2006) by Stanley Sadie - complements the previously mentioned one nicely and is of recent vintage (and affordable!) -  :)

 

Gurn Blanston

Quote from: SonicMan on February 28, 2009, 08:06:02 AM
Yes, all of those years in 'academic radiology' and numerous research projects - does take persistence!  ;D  Fortunately, I've 'slowed down' the last 10 yrs!

Heartz's second book in this triology - Music in European Capitals: The Galant Style, 1720-1780 (2003) - over a 1000 pgs!  :o  Hope that he uses a lot of pictures & musical scores?; but I'll do another borrow if I get through the first one!  The final volume is just over $40 discounted on Amazon, still a hefty price.

Another Mozart book on my shelf is Mozart: The Early Years, 1756-1781 (2006) by Stanley Sadie - complements the previously mentioned one nicely and is of recent vintage (and affordable!) -  :)

 

Well, Dave, if you are fortunate enough to get them from the library, we all expect some feedback. This set is destined for my shelves, just not right now. :)

Sadie was the preeminent Mozart scholar. His "Mozart: The Early Years" was the first volume of a projected set that aimed to be the definitive modern English language Mozart biography. The project was interrupted by his untimely death with just the first volume completed. :'(

There are many good books on Mozart, and the peripheral benefit of them is that you also get some information on his contemporaries. That is the bigger picture which is harder to bring into focus due to a lack of documentary material. If anyone has run across such a book, one with material on contemporaries, please add to the list. :)

8)
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sul G

Quote from: Gurn Blanston on February 28, 2009, 07:42:39 AM
Braunbehrens' is a highly commendable book, not least because he makes a point of being a "mythbuster", something that is sorely needed for Mozart after the serious distortions of the 19th century.

I knew it! I knew Gurn was a secret Newman fan..........;D 0:)

Gurn Blanston

Quote from: sul G on February 28, 2009, 08:29:56 AM
I knew it! I knew Gurn was a secret Newman fan..........;D 0:)

Now, that is a low blow! Lucky for you I live 2500 miles away! :D

Actually, I was talking about things like "Poor Mozart" and "Constanze was a leeching bitch" and "Mozart was poisoned", that sort of thing. Newman didn't even want to give credit for the Gran Partitta! And we all saw in "Amadeus" that he really wrote it. ;)

8)
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sul G

Ah yes, now that's a point: it's when Newman ignores documentary evidence like this that he really comes unstuck.  ;D

Gurn Blanston

Quote from: sul G on February 28, 2009, 08:56:03 AM
Ah yes, now that's a point: it's when Newman ignores documentary evidence like this that he really comes unstuck.  ;D

Yup, there you go. Shaffer would never lead us astray. :)

Speaking of Mozart (which I don't want to dwell on, but it is hard not to), have you heard the disk "The Secret Mozart" played by Christopher Hogwood?  It is all solo music played on the clavichord.



If not, I highly recommend it to you especially.

1. Allegro in G minor, K. 312   
2. Andante & 5 Variations in G, K. 501/Andante (Thema)   
3. Andante & 5 Variations in G, K. 501/Var. 1
4. Andante & 5 Variations in G, K. 501/Var. 2
5. Andante & 5 Variations in G, K. 501/Var. 3
6. Andante & 5 Variations in G, K. 501/Var. 4 (minore)
7. Andante & 5 Variations in G, K. 501/Var. 5 (maggiore)
8. Minuetto in D, K. 355/Trio da M. Stadler/Minuetto   
9. Minuetto in D, K. 355/Trio da M. Stadler/Trio & Minuetto reprise
10. Marche funebre, K. 453a   
11. Andantino, K. 236   1:41   
12. Klavierstück in F, K. 33b   
13. Adagio for Glass Harmonica, K. 356   
14. Laßt uns mit geschlungen Händen K. 623   
15. Rondo in F, K. 494   
16. Theme & 2 Variations in A, K. 460/Theme   
17. Theme & 2 Variations in A, K. 460/Var. 1   
18. Theme & 2 Variations in A, K. 460/Var. 2   
19. Fantasia in D minor, K. 397   
20. Sonata in D, K. 381/I. Allegro   
21. Sonata in D, K. 381/II. Andante
22. Sonata in D, K. 381/III. Allegro molto
23. Fantasia in D minor, K.397 (with coda)

8)
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sul G

No - I have the Bach disc in that series, and have meant to get this one but haven't got round to it yet.

Gabriel

I noticed that in the Dusík/Dussek thread of the old forum there was no mention to the very impressive Concerto in B flat major for two pianos, op. 63. A healthy Sunday recommendation: delightfully scored and showing in some parts textures and harmonies 2 or 3 decades ahead (there is even a section that reminds me... Rachmaninov). The exchanges between the piano are particularly enjoyable. One of the most beautiful works of late classicism and surely a jewel in the - unfortunately small - repertoire for two pianos.

I can recommend also to the admirers of beautiful harp playing a splendid CD ("Grands Desserts") of some of Dusík's works for that instrument played by Nasumi Nagasawa. Some of the compositions show a magnificent association between Nagasawa and Richard Egarr at the pianoforte. The sound is simply glorious: the idea of a modern piano there is unthinkable, for the timbres would be too different. There are certainly solos: Egarr plays the (more famous) piano sonata in F sharp minor, while Nagasawa delights with her almost "aerial" performance of the harp sonata op. 34 n. 1.

Gurn Blanston

Ah, thanks for reminding us of Dussek, Gabriel. He is one of my favorites for sure. I haven't got that 2 pianoforte sonata, but now I will look it up. I do, however, have quite a few of his sonatas. This is a first rate piano composer. Haydn heard him play in London (on the 2nd London trip, I believe) and was very impressed. One bit of trivia about Dussek is that he invented the concept of the pianist sitting sideways to the audience so the soundboard would reflect the sound out into the crowd, and so that they could watch him play. I don't think anyone has played otherwise ever since. :)

8)

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Haydn Symphonies 90, 91, Orchestra of the Age of - Sigiswald Kuijken - Symphony No. 90 - II. Andante
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SonicMan46

Quote from: Gabriel on February 28, 2009, 02:12:42 PM
I noticed that in the Dusík/Dussek thread of the old forum there was no mention to the very impressive Concerto in B flat major for two pianos, op. 63. ...

I can recommend also to the admirers of beautiful harp playing a splendid CD ("Grands Desserts") of some of Dusík's works for that instrument played by Nasumi Nagasawa. ......

Gabriel - thanks for your comments; I just reviewed that old thread and despite a good beginning and posts by Gurn & I, the thread had a rather short life!  Thanks for the additional recommendations - now, I've actually added some more Dussek since those 2006/7 posts - boy, 2 years ago!

All of the additions below are excellent; CPO label doing well as usual; the Brilliant addition is a nice introduction, i.e. Piano Quintets by Dussek, Hummel, & Onslow - now after these additions, I've not acquired any of those HARP compositions - would like some recommendations, please, from all -  :D

   

Gabriel

Quote from: SonicMan on February 28, 2009, 03:35:06 PM
All of the additions below are excellent; CPO label doing well as usual; the Brilliant addition is a nice introduction, i.e. Piano Quintets by Dussek, Hummel, & Onslow - now after these additions, I've not acquired any of those HARP compositions - would like some recommendations, please, from all -  :D

I wonder which is the Piano Quintet included in that selection, SonicMan. I have a recording of such a work by Dusík, in F minor, op. 41, in a CD called "Chamber music for piano", also including the piano sonata op. 77 and a piano quartet in E flat major, op. 56. The quintet is not a first-rate work, but very enjoyable (the third movement is particularly beautiful). The CD, from the label Studio Matous, is excellently played and recorded.

I have just the second CD of the CPO series (opp. 9 and 77). I guess I will try to get the other one later.

For the harp works, the choice is Nagasawa. I have another CD with a similar content, played by Danielle Perrett in Meridian, and it is like listening to something different. Both performances are technically good, but I feel that Nagasawa is much more spiritual while playing. And, of course, Egarr is also a plus.

Quote from: Gurn Blanston on February 28, 2009, 02:30:28 PM
One bit of trivia about Dussek is that he invented the concept of the pianist sitting sideways to the audience so the soundboard would reflect the sound out into the crowd, and so that they could watch him play. I don't think anyone has played otherwise ever since. :)

Very interesting, Gurn. I didn't know (or remember) that point. Alas, I'm afraid I will have to deny your last statement. I saw Mitsuko Uchida some months ago playing a magnificent KV 491 with her back towards the audience. ;)

SonicMan46

Quote from: Gabriel on March 01, 2009, 03:47:57 AM
I wonder which is the Piano Quintet included in that selection, SonicMan. I have a recording of such a work by Dusík, in F minor, op. 41, in a CD called "Chamber music for piano", ..........

For the harp works, the choice is Nagasawa...............

Gabriel - the Dussek work on the Brilliant disc is indeed Op. 41 as you indicate above - however, I was curious about 'how many' Piano Quintets he composed (he wrote SO MUCH chamber music); in checking Wiki HERE, this single one is all I found listed (but may have missed others?).

Thanks for the Nagasawa recommendation - added the CD to my 'wish list', if still available?  Dave  :)

Gurn Blanston

I don't know how many either, Dave, but I do enjoy this one (Op 41). In any case, Dussek was most famous for his sonatas. There are quite a few disks of them out there, maybe not enough, but enough to start out with anyway. You can see in my "Listening now..." tag that I am listening to my favorite one, Op 35 #3 in c. Outside of Beethoven, this is as good as it gets at the turn of the century. Unfortunately this particular disk is OOP, and Amazon doesn't even list it in the "Discontinued by manufacturer" section, although I bought it from them only a year ago. It also shows up in a disk that IS available (at least BRO still have it) by Geoffrey Govier. There are also a few other sonatas scattered around (I only look for fortepiano versions, there are probably a lot of others on a modern piano), like the Op 5 which is on a disk called "French Pianoforte Music", which also features works by others of my favorites, such as Méhul and Jadin. There was a whole other classical/romantic transition going on in France at the turn of the century which will also bear discussion here at some point... :)

8)

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Listening to:
Dussek Sonatas / Staier - Andreas Staier - Op 35 #3 Sonata in c for Fortepiano 4th mvmt - Finale: Allegro molto
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springrite

I will have a couple of hours free time before my flight tomorrow. Guess I will pop the Dussek sonata CD in for a spin. It must have been 6 or 7 years since I last played it. (I have played one of the harp CDs a couple of time in the mean time).
Do what I must do, and let what must happen happen.

Gurn Blanston

Quote from: springrite on March 01, 2009, 08:00:11 AM
I will have a couple of hours free time before my flight tomorrow. Guess I will pop the Dussek sonata CD in for a spin. It must have been 6 or 7 years since I last played it. (I have played one of the harp CDs a couple of time in the mean time).

What sonatas are they, Paul? Just curious, always looking for ones I don't have, particularly if they are on fortepiano. :)

8)

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Listening to:
Dussek Sonatas / Staier - Andreas Staier - Op 31 #2 Sonata in D for Fortepiano 3rd mvmt - Pastorale: Allegro non troppo
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