Gurn's Classical Corner

[Gurn Blanston]

Arrived not as pictured. I have the rerelease after all, alas! Have listened to it 2.5 times since yesterday and it is utterly gorgeous, the interspersal of forms and textures, voices and instruments, extremely effective.

Questions. What is an "esquisse", other than "sketch"? Can it mean "fragment"? KV484b and e are not on the Wikipedia list of K numbers, so I don't know what these pieces are about or part of.

Isn't the Kegelstatt something else? Wow.

No, it really does mean a sketch. I have the details at home, but IIRC these are realized sketches. Or, like in the case of the bassett horn concerto, he got well into it and then stopped and changed the key and made it a clarinet concerto instead. So it isn't a complete work, but it isn't a fragment in the sense of having some pages missing... they are missing because they were never written, so to speak.

Yes, that's my favorite version of that piece. They way the entire set is done, it is not difficult to imagine an evening at the Jacquin's with all these friends sitting around making music. Especially since in most cases, this music was written just for that purpose.

[SonicMan46]

At the bottom is a quote that I left here about a week ago - well I obtained the recording of the Grétry String Quartets - short works (10 minutes or less each), generally pleasant and nothing profound; well recorded and pretty much agree w/ the Allmusic comments linked below; also attached a Fanfare review from 2006 (a year following the recording), which is somewhat harsh and dismissive.

More information from the liner notes - Gretry was born in Liege (where his remains are now located), and w/ the help of a scholarship headed off to Rome in 1760 to study under various Italians; he stayed 6 yrs and composed these quartets at that time, so likely in his early 20s; now whether he revised the works after his arrival in Paris for later performances (if at all?) is unclear from the brief liner notes.  Also added a portrait of the composer from 1785, likely at the height of his operatic career in France and just before the revolution!

 

Chas.. & Gurn - own nothing by Grétry (1741-1813), so that recording of SQs by a French (i.e. Belgium born) opera composer peaked my interest.  Doing a little searching, I found this short but informative Allmusic Review; apparently these works were composed early in the composer's life while studying in Italy while still in his 20s - so middle of the 18th century w/ the classical SQ developing but yet to reach maturity and likely w/ a more Italianate influence?

Yet, this disc still interests me for those very reasons as pointed out in the review - will be curious to read comments from others who have listened to this recording -

[Uncle Connie]

Looked good enough to buy, Conrad, so I did out of curiosity as much as anything. I have read about Schwindl a few times, so I was wanting to hear something by him.

I agree about the interesting works in g minor. At some point you might be amenable to posting a list of the ones you have; never know what others might show up along the way...

Nicely done disc, I think you'll be pleased despite not being PI.  Also contains one of my favorite Boccherini, Op. 35/6.  And when you listen to that, try to imagine the first movement played at about half speed, with muffled timpani added, and "converted" to part of a so-called Funeral Symphony.  (The final product was the first and second movements from this work, plus one movement each from Op. 35/4 and 35/5.  The second mvt. of 35/6 actually does have a funereal sound to it already; perhaps that was the impetus.)  For all the complete lack of any authenticity whatsoever, that bastardization was a much-cherished ancient LP that I practically wore out.  Never to be heard again, I'm quite certain....

About the g minor list - what the hell, I'm not busy just now.  I'll put it in a separate post. 

[Uncle Connie]

LIST OF G MINOR SYMPHONIES OF THE 'CLASSICAL' ERA (c.1730s - c.1800) - Additions greatly welcomed; uploads of any CD photo for identification on request

NOTE:  Most of these have some sort of number or other identifier, but in general it doesn't much matter as the person involved wrote just one in that key and it's obvious.  Identification by number given when it seems to me to be useful.  Otherwise, just alphabetical by composer.


BACH, Johann Christian (Op. 6/6)
BECK, Franz Ignaz (Op. 1/1)
BECK, Franz Ignaz (Op. 3/3)
BRUNETTI, Gaetano
DITTERSDORF, Karl
EICHNER, Ernst
FILS, Anton  (a.k.a. Antonin Filtz)
HAYDN, Joseph (No. 39)
HAYDN, Joseph (No. 83)
KOZELUCH, Leopold
KUNZEN, F. L. AE.
LE DUC, Simon
MALDERE, Pierre Van
MARTIN, Francois
MEHUL, E.-N. (No. 1)
MOZART, W. A. (K.183)
MOZART, W. A. (K.550)
MYSLIVECEK, Josef (Jiri)
ORDONEZ, Karl von (Carlos d')
RICHTER, Franz Xaver (No. 27)
RICHTER, Franz Xaver (No. 29)
RIGEL, Henri-Joseph
ROSETTI, Antonio
SAMMARTINI, G. B. (J-C 56)
SAMMARTINI, G. B. (J-C 57)
SAMMARTINI, G. B. (J-C 59) (frag.)
STAMITZ, Johann ("Orch. trio Op. 4/5")
VANHAL, J. B. (g1)
VANHAL, J. B. (g2)
WAGENSEIL, G. C.
WEYSE, C. E. F. (No. 1)
WOELFL, Joseph

     Concerning the target dates bracketed, and the "Sturm-und-Drang" relationship:  The three Sammartini, the Richter, and the Stamitz, are best thought of as precursors.  The first two that seem to have clear bearing on my topic are Maldere and Wagenseil, both published in the early 1760s.  At the other end, Woelfl is c.1801 and Mehul as late as c.1808, and as such probably too late to belong here, but they're both such excellent works that I couldn't bear to drop them. 
     Other works that I know of but which aren't recorded:  F.I. Beck also wrote his sym. Op/. 2/2 in g minor.  And Karl von Ordonez apparently wrote several others, but so little of his work is performed (he's definitely in the second or even third rank of quality, being essentially an amateur) that I don't expect to see more.  Sammartini apparently wrote one more that is known to be lost, as is the first part of J-C 59 which survives as a fragment; and Richter wrote more than one lost (?) work in g minor.

[Gurn Blanston]

That's a heck of a list, Conrad! I was hoping to be able to make some suggestions, but for the nonce I don't have one that won't duplicate your current collection. I will tap into my resources though; you never know.

[chasmaniac]

This one's brand new, Boccherini's opus 8 string quartets performed by the Quartetto d'Archi di Venezia. Just having my first listen now. The music is tauter than I expect from Mr. B, quite nice, 6 pieces of 3 movements each. Sound admirably clear. Instruments I assume to be MI. First violinist somewhat wayward at times, unless my ears deceive me. Happy to have.

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[chasmaniac]

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I like! And there is indeed a missing track, #13-Die fruhe Liebe by Rosler.

(Add umlauts to taste.)

[chasmaniac]

And my favourite tune from the lot is by Conrad's Roesler/Rosetti: Goethe's An die Entfernte, of which the The Lied, Art Song, and Choral Texts Archive (http://www.recmusic.org/lieder/get_text.html?TextId=6375) lists 22 settings, but not this one! (Translation from the Archive)

So have I truly lost you?
Have you, o fair one, fled from me?
Yet still I can hear in my accustomed ears
Every word, every tone of your voice.

Just as the wanderer's gaze in the morning
Searchingly pierces the heavens in vain
When, concealed in the blue expanse
High above, the lark sings to him:

So does my gaze anxiously search here and there,
Through field and bush and forest,
Singing to you through all my songs,
O come, my darling, back to me!

[chasmaniac]

This might be interesting: PI piano trios by Gyrowetz. Released late last year on NCA, but JEEPERS! look at the price!

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[Leon]

This might be interesting: PI piano trios by Gyrowetz. Released late last year on NCA, but JEEPERS! look at the price!

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Spotify to the rescue! 

I fail to understand why there are still some people who do not subscribe to it ...

[chasmaniac]

Ride, Arnold, ride!

[Gurn Blanston]

Spotify to the rescue! 

I fail to understand why there are still some people who do not subscribe to it ...

Not for a reason other than technological; can't stream music at work, and have a satellite broadband at home that doesn't stream worth a damn. Conceptually though, I'm there!

[Karl Henning]

Spotify to the rescue! 

I fail to understand why there are still some people who do not subscribe to it ...

Not for a reason other than technological; can't stream music at work, and have a satellite broadband at home that doesn't stream worth a damn. Conceptually though, I'm there!

Right; my reply had been, "And when would I listen to it?" : )

[Leon]

Too bad you can't stream at work.  That is the main reason why I signed up.

I used to bring an external drive to work with my iTunes library on it, but noticed that iTunes soaked up a lot of my pc's resources and impacted on its performance.  Spotify uses hardly anything.  And I've taken to listening even at home instead of my iTunes.  I've created a bunch of playlists that include many things I own as well as things I do not own (while I have maybe a dozen recordings of the Goldberg Variations, there's easily ten times, maybe twenty times, that many on Spotify).

Another added benefit are the playlists that others have created which I have subscribed to.  There is a fellow who has assembled chronological complete catalogs of Beethoven, Stravinsky, Brahms, Couperin and many other composers. 

Those are really nice things to have which I don't want to take the time to create either on iTunes or Spotify.

And I've almost entirely stopped buying new music unless it is not on Spotify - big savings there.

[Karl Henning]

Oh, iTunes is a pig, no quarrel there!  Have nothing to do with it.

[Uncle Connie]

And my favourite tune from the lot is by Conrad's Roesler/Rosetti: Goethe's An die Entfernte, of which the The Lied, Art Song, and Choral Texts Archive (http://www.recmusic.org/lieder/get_text.html?TextId=6375) lists 22 settings, but not this one! (Translation from the Archive)

Yes, but it does say the list is "not necessarily exhaustive."  Obviously that's true here....   

Of the 22 I have heard - er, let's see - five.  Berger, Reichardt, Schubert, Zelter and the Polish version by Moniuszko.  (The latter without realizing what it was!)  The only two I actually remember much about are Schubert and Zelter.  The Schubert is monumental; the Zelter is actually a rather nice precursor of the Schubert.  (Poor Mr. Zelter; one of the truly great precursors in all of music history.  But only that.)

But to be fair, this is one of the very few times Rosetti set major poems by major poets.  Mostly his texts are by nonentities, and frequently the author is unknown (maybe just a ditty taken from a bad greeting card?). 

[chasmaniac]

Pardon me... Excuse me... Is there a clique round here I can join?

[Gurn Blanston]

Pardon me... Excuse me... Is there a clique round here I can join?

Oh... I thought you were the clique! 

[chasmaniac]

Oh... I thought you were the clique! 

*bows*

Speaking of which, this Krommer chap's music is more than pretty. He's had some attention in these parts in the past, but I haven't heard mention of Quartetto di Milano's recording of his opus 18 SQs on Tudor. The disc is not readily available - I nabbed BRO's last copy I think - but it is downloadable and suchforth and so on, so it's not impossible to hear. MI, lovely recording, and music Haydn would have been proud to call his own. A most superior and exclusive listen.

What it doesn't quite do is touch the hem of the sublime. Sorry about that. Maybe next time.



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[Leon]

I had no idea this thread was considered "esoteric"!