Six favourite symphonies by (really) lesser-known composers.

Started by vandermolen, March 23, 2009, 04:21:40 AM

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vandermolen

#40
March 24, 2009, 11:47:01 PM
Quote from: springrite on March 23, 2009, 10:15:27 AM
Harrison Symphony #3
Harbison Symphony #2
Shapero: Symphony for Classical Orchestra
Yun: Symphony # 4 (Well, any of them, really)
Lyatoshinsky Symphony #3

Well, I do not consider any of the above names really really lesser-known (save Shapero). But based on the names mentioned so far, I guess they'd quality.

I'd have probably gone for Harrison Symphony No 2, although I like No 3 as well. Yun I must listen to - Lyatoshinsky: Symphony No 3 - YES - a great score (I like all five symphonies).
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

vandermolen

#41
March 24, 2009, 11:49:54 PM
Quote from: Dundonnell on March 23, 2009, 06:59:06 PM
You should not expect much sense from me, Jeffrey, since 'lesser-known composers' are my stock-in-trade ;D The problem with that is that I am no longer able to differentiate 'lesser-known' from '(really) lesser-known' ;D

So....entirely off the top of my head and mostly from the first third of the alphabet:

Kalvei Aho's 10th
Richard Arnell's 3rd
Joly Braga Santos' 4th
Benjamin Frankel's 2nd
Alun Hoddinott's 6th
Arnold Rosner's 5th



....but most of these composers really aren't ('really) lesser-known' are they?

Count me in for these (I only know Aho No 4, which I like very much) - nice to see a vote for Rosner's 5th  :)
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

vandermolen

#42
March 24, 2009, 11:53:19 PM
Quote from: ukrneal on March 24, 2009, 09:18:38 AM
Actually, I like that people are interpreting it differently, giving a nice cross-section of less well known to really obscure. A little something for everyone...

I think that's my thought too.
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

Wanderer

#43
March 25, 2009, 12:21:49 AM
Quote from: some guy on March 24, 2009, 08:35:12 AM
It's like Tourette's, isn't it? Any mention of any music that's not post- or neo-romantic and the knee jerks and the upper lip curls, because it has to. And the Dhomont reference (a list of one!)* wasn't even about electroacoustic music, but about "known-ness." Inside that particular circle, Dhomont is well-known, even revered, while outside it he's "(really) lesser-known."

*There is one piece on my list, in my post that has a list, that is an electroacoustic piece. A Schmidt CD to the first contestant who can identify which one it is! ;D

Off topic mostly. This isn't another modernists vs. universe thread of which we've seen plenty. Perhaps you'd be interested in reviving one of those?
My comment that somehow irked you was also directed at "known-ness"/recognizability. It goes without saying of course that the relations and differences between the relatively unknown, the really obscure and the blatantly esoteric come in many gradations (and levels of pretentiousness). There have appeared some very interesting lists of works on this thread from all three categories so far; many paths to explore.  8)

Christo

#44
March 25, 2009, 12:23:59 AM
I'm intrigued to see that most of us here opt for lesser-known 20th century symphonies. One of the ujoys of this forum is the steady discovery of one of the 20th century's hidden strenghts: the creation of so many superb symphonic cycles.

As I don't consider symphonic masters like e.g. Holmboe, Braga Santos, Tubin or Englund "lesser-known" composers, I would rather opt for these five seconds and one third:

Matthijs Vermeulen 2 `Prélude à la nouvelle journée' (1920)
Léon Orthel 2 `Piccola' (1940)
Camargo Guarnieri 2 `Uirapuru' (1945)
William Wordsworth 2 (1948)
Ulvi Cemâl Erkin 2 (1954)
John Kinsella 3 `Joi de Vivre' (1990)

... music is not only an 'entertainment', nor a mere luxury, but a necessity of the spiritual if not of the physical life, an opening of those magic casements through which we can catch a glimpse of that country where ultimate reality will be found.    RVW, 1948

mc ukrneal

#45
March 25, 2009, 12:56:53 AM
Quote from: Christo on March 25, 2009, 12:23:59 AM
I'm intrigued to see that most of us here opt for lesser-known 20th century symphonies. One of the ujoys of this forum is the steady discovery of one of the 20th century's hidden strenghts: the creation of so many superb symphonic cycles.

As I don't consider symphonic masters like e.g. Holmboe, Braga Santos, Tubin or Englund "lesser-known" composers, I would rather opt for these five seconds and one third:

Matthijs Vermeulen 2 `Prélude à la nouvelle journée' (1920)
Léon Orthel 2 `Piccola' (1940)
Camargo Guarnieri 2 `Uirapuru' (1945)
William Wordsworth 2 (1948)
Ulvi Cemâl Erkin 2 (1954)
John Kinsella 3 `Joi de Vivre' (1990)



Some are and some are not. But even that is debateable. Some are written in the 20th century, but are more romantic in nature (like Langaard), while others are from even earlier. I contemplated some of the 18th century (and early 19th centry) guys like Pleyel, Kozeluch, Marsh, etc., but I find it hard to pick one from that style and era, especially when the form was still developing. But I would still recommend them, and I would add others like Vranicky, Tomasek, Krommer, Gyrowetz, Pichl.., etc (and even Weber, who is well known, but his symphonies are not), to the list.
Be kind to your fellow posters!!

Teresa

#46
March 25, 2009, 01:44:18 AM
Interesting list so far, my six favorite symphonies by lesser-known composers have not been listed yet, so here goes:

JOHAN DE MEIJ: Symphony No. 1 "Lord of the Rings"
JOHAN DE MEIJ: Symphony No. 3 "Planet Earth"
SUNLEIF RASMUSSEN: Symphony No. 1 "Oceanic Days"
GAVRIIL POPOV: Symphony No. 1, Op. 7
JOSEF SUK: Asrael: Symphony for Large Orchestra in C Minor, Op. 27
EDUARD TUBIN: Symphony No. 5 in B Minor

vandermolen

#47
March 25, 2009, 02:20:16 AM
Quote from: Christo on March 25, 2009, 12:23:59 AM
I'm intrigued to see that most of us here opt for lesser-known 20th century symphonies. One of the ujoys of this forum is the steady discovery of one of the 20th century's hidden strenghts: the creation of so many superb symphonic cycles.

As I don't consider symphonic masters like e.g. Holmboe, Braga Santos, Tubin or Englund "lesser-known" composers, I would rather opt for these five seconds and one third:

Matthijs Vermeulen 2 `Prélude à la nouvelle journée' (1920)
Léon Orthel 2 `Piccola' (1940)
Camargo Guarnieri 2 `Uirapuru' (1945)
William Wordsworth 2 (1948)
Ulvi Cemâl Erkin 2 (1954)
John Kinsella 3 `Joi de Vivre' (1990)

I think that this must be the only other time I've seen John Kinsella mentioned here. I totally agree, his Symphony No 3 is a wonderful score - I was attracted to it when a reviewer said that it had echoes of Tubin and Lilburn - I knew then that it was a must for me! He sent me the most charming reply to my fan letter. Guarnieri Symphony 2 (and 3) -YES! Orthel I have discovered (at enormous expense) thanks to you and I do not regret it (I also have you to thank for Alphons Diepenbrock's Marsyas Concert Suite and Vermeulen). Never heard of Erkin.
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

vandermolen

#48
March 25, 2009, 02:24:13 AM
Quote from: Teresa on March 25, 2009, 01:44:18 AM
Interesting list so far, my six favorite symphonies by lesser-known composers have not been listed yet, so here goes:

JOHAN DE MEIJ: Symphony No. 1 "Lord of the Rings"
JOHAN DE MEIJ: Symphony No. 3 "Planet Earth"
SUNLEIF RASMUSSEN: Symphony No. 1 "Oceanic Days"
GAVRIIL POPOV: Symphony No. 1, Op. 7
JOSEF SUK: Asrael: Symphony for Large Orchestra in C Minor, Op. 27
EDUARD TUBIN: Symphony No. 5 in B Minor


Most interesting list - although the Suk and Tubin are perhaps less obscure these days. The Popov is a terrific score which IMHO, along with Weinberg's 4th Symphony, stands alongside Shostakovich's 4th Symphony. Popov's 2nd and 6th symphonies are also favourites.
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

Grazioso

#49
March 25, 2009, 04:29:37 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on March 24, 2009, 11:39:31 PM
Apart from the Rorem, which I am going to listen to again, your other choices are all favourites  of mine - although I'd have chosen Madetoja Symphony No 2.

One thing I love about Madetoja is that his three symphonies are all strong and all dissimilar: each has its own flavor and unique merits. Which one I'd call a favorite depends on the day of the week :) Actually, I do tend to prefer 1 and 3, the former for its hypnotic, nocturnal slow movement and the latter for its surprisingly Gallic flair--not your typical Scandinavian fare. 2 would be the one I'd recommend first for fans of heavy, serious Late Romantic symphonies a la Mahler and Co. Either way, Madetoja's music deserves much wider dissemination. It has real substance and craftsmanship. It's a shame he wrote relatively little.

As for Rorem, he's no towering orchestral master, but his symphonies are fine works with some beautiful themes and a distinctly American sound. I actually tend to prefer Diamond and some of the other Yanks more, but I figured Rorem was less well known, despite his acknowledgment having undergone quite a renaissance in recent years.
There is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact. --Sir Arthur Conan Doyle

Sorin Eushayson

#50
March 25, 2009, 04:57:51 AM
Right now I'm obsessed with the F-Sharp Minor symphony of George Frederick Bristow, a Brooklyn-born composer.  As far as I know it's the only one of his works recorded, which is a shame since this one is so good!

Christo

#51
March 25, 2009, 05:05:53 AM
Quote from: Grazioso on March 25, 2009, 04:29:37 AM
One thing I love about Madetoja is that his three symphonies are all strong and all dissimilar: each has its own flavor and unique merits. Which one I'd call a favorite depends on the day of the week :) Actually, I do tend to prefer 1 and 3, the former for its hypnotic, nocturnal slow movement and the latter for its surprisingly Gallic flair--not your typical Scandinavian fare. 2 would be the one I'd recommend first for fans of heavy, serious Late Romantic symphonies a la Mahler and Co. Either way, Madetoja's music deserves much wider dissemination. It has real substance and craftsmanship. It's a shame he wrote relatively little.

Totally agree on Madetoja. But is he really "really" unknown? Anyhow, time for another favourite sextet:

Johan Willem Wilms 7 (c. 1836)
Hendrik Andriessen 3 (1946)
Eugene Goossens 1 (1940)
Arnold Cooke 3 (1967)
Andrei Eshpai 7 (1992)
Pēteris Vasks 2 (1999)

... music is not only an 'entertainment', nor a mere luxury, but a necessity of the spiritual if not of the physical life, an opening of those magic casements through which we can catch a glimpse of that country where ultimate reality will be found.    RVW, 1948

vandermolen

#52
March 25, 2009, 05:43:29 AM
Quote from: Christo on March 25, 2009, 05:05:53 AM
Totally agree on Madetoja. But is he really "really" unknown? Anyhow, time for another favourite sextet:

Johan Willem Wilms 7 (c. 1836)
Hendrik Andriessen 3 (1946)
Eugene Goossens 1 (1940)
Arnold Cooke 3 (1967)
Andrei Eshpai 7 (1992)
Pēteris Vasks 2 (1999)



Don't know the first two but the others are all favourites. Excellent booklet notes with the Vasks  ;D
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

vandermolen

#53
March 25, 2009, 06:09:45 AM
OK, here we go again.  Like Christo, I'm now going for really,really, really lesser-known composers.


Clifford: Symphony 1940

Bainton: Symphony No 3

Goossens: Symphony 2

Shebalin: Symphony No 1

Arnell: Symphony No 5

A J Potter: Sinfonia "De Profundis"
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

bhodges

#54
March 25, 2009, 07:09:19 AM
I'm enjoying this thread a great deal, especially since many of these composers are not familiar to me.

A few of my faves that haven't been mentioned (I think), although these two composers aren't as lesser-known as others:

James MacMillan: Symphony No. 3, "Silence" (2002)
Carl Vine: MicroSymphony (1986)

--Bruce

Dundonnell

#55
March 25, 2009, 08:14:24 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on March 25, 2009, 06:09:45 AM
OK, here we go again.  Like Christo, I'm now going for really,really, really lesser-known composers.


Clifford: Symphony 1940

Bainton: Symphony No 3

Goossens: Symphony 2

Shebalin: Symphony No 1

Arnell: Symphony No 5

A J Potter: Sinfonia "De Profundis"

Does Katy know that you started this thread to seek out recommendations for more cds to buy, Jeffrey ??? ::)

Dundonnell

#56
March 25, 2009, 08:16:51 AM
Quote from: Christo on March 25, 2009, 12:23:59 AM
I'm intrigued to see that most of us here opt for lesser-known 20th century symphonies. One of the ujoys of this forum is the steady discovery of one of the 20th century's hidden strenghts: the creation of so many superb symphonic cycles.

As I don't consider symphonic masters like e.g. Holmboe, Braga Santos, Tubin or Englund "lesser-known" composers, I would rather opt for these five seconds and one third:

Matthijs Vermeulen 2 `Prélude à la nouvelle journée' (1920)
Léon Orthel 2 `Piccola' (1940)
Camargo Guarnieri 2 `Uirapuru' (1945)
William Wordsworth 2 (1948)
Ulvi Cemâl Erkin 2 (1954)
John Kinsella 3 `Joi de Vivre' (1990)



Ha, Wordsworth's 2nd, Johan....excellent :)

Kinsella No.3  should have been on my list too :)

Christo

#57
March 25, 2009, 08:24:45 AM
Quote from: Dundonnell on March 25, 2009, 08:16:51 AM
Ha, Wordsworth's 2nd, Johan....excellent :)   ;)

And I never heard either the MacMillan or the Vine symphony.  :o Again, many other candidates that where not yet mentioned yet (AFAICS) spring to mind:

Willem Pijper 2 (1921)
Cecil Armstrong Gibbs 3 `Westmoreland' (1943)
Jón Leifs `Saga Symphony' (1943)
Colin McPhee 2 (1957)
Ahmed Adnan Saygun 2 (1957)
Robert Simpson 9 (1987)


... music is not only an 'entertainment', nor a mere luxury, but a necessity of the spiritual if not of the physical life, an opening of those magic casements through which we can catch a glimpse of that country where ultimate reality will be found.    RVW, 1948

Mr. Darcy

#58
March 25, 2009, 03:36:25 PM
Rott: Symphony in E major
Schmidt: Symphony No.2 in E flat major
Stenhammar: Symphony No.2 in G minor, Op.34
Mennin: Symphony No.3
Schmidt: Symphony No.4 in C major
Piston: Symphony No.6

vandermolen

#59
March 25, 2009, 04:13:37 PM
Quote from: Dundonnell on March 25, 2009, 08:14:24 AM
Does Katy know that you started this thread to seek out recommendations for more cds to buy, Jeffrey ??? ::)

What do you think Colin?  ;D
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).
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