Started by BachQ, April 06, 2007, 03:12:18 AM
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Quote from: Bill on April 08, 2007, 05:04:48 PMYou may recall this Gurn, and possibly yourself George, that about a year and half ago here at GMG Kempff was getting all sorts of "run" from many here, including myself. However, of late, he has almost left the radar screen. Good to see him back on as he is still my favorite when it comes to Beethoven Sonatas.
Quote from: Gurn Blanston on April 08, 2007, 05:09:37 PMYes, I do remember that Bill. But my philosophy is to like what I like and let others like what they like, so I didn't (and don't) particularly care about it. I think Kempff was among the top pianists of his generation, so I'm going to like him no matter what.
Quote from: Bill on April 08, 2007, 05:14:40 PMAbsolutely. As David Ross once concluded with a post:If you like him, what difference does it make whether 10% or 90% share your tastes?Some people like muscle cars, some prefer luxury sedans, some like sports cars, and others just want economical transportation.
Quote from: Gurn Blanston on April 08, 2007, 04:59:22 PMI have the stereo Kempff too, So yes, that one. Kempff is one of my favorite pianists, all in all.
Quote from: George on April 08, 2007, 05:43:35 PMI particularly like his Schumann, though I find his Beethoven uneven, the high points are so high that its totally worth it.Like the Pastoral Sonata and Op. 78-111. Superb!
Quote from: Gurn Blanston on April 08, 2007, 06:10:12 PMYes, I really like his Schumann too. That 4 disk box is a really nice one, lots of good stuff on there!
Quote from: Gurn Blanston on April 08, 2007, 04:29:26 PM1. What do you think are among Beethoven's greatest achievements? Most "influential" works?I think that Beethoven's greatest achievement was in forming a presenting a role model for composers after him on how to be a proper tortured soul, and to work towards composing things with their own standards of perfection in mind instead of someone else's (a patron, the Church, whatever). His works with the longest-lasting influence have clearly been the symphonies from 3-9, although the Late Quartets ran at the back of the pack before making a last second dash with a furlong left to go, and were more influential later. That says a lot about them, I think.2. What are your favorite works by Beethoven? Least favorite?Well, the 3rd & 9th symphonies in about a dead heat. I don't have a least favorite, I view each in context and am quite content with them the way they are. Beethoven knew what he was doing far better than I do.3. Do you feel that Beethoven's personal challenges (deafness; nephew issues; etc) considerably heightened the emotional content of his music?Probably less than people tend to give them the weight for. I think the bigger issues of the day (Napoleon, politics in Vienna, the Fall of the Aristocracy &c) probably lent at least as much if not more. 4. Any favorite recordings? Of Symphonies? Piano Sonatas? Concertos? Chamber? Overtures?Savall's 3rd, Gardiner's 9th, Arrau's 4th Concerto, Perlman/Giulini's Violin Concerto, Kempff's "Pathetique", L'Archibudelli's String Trios, Fischer-Dieskau's "An die ferne Geliebte"... dozens more.
Quote from: Gurn Blanston on April 08, 2007, 04:29:26 PM1. What do you think are among Beethoven's greatest achievements? Most "influential" works?I think that Beethoven's greatest achievement was in forming a presenting a role model for composers after him on how to be a proper tortured soul, and to work towards composing things with their own standards of perfection in mind instead of someone else's (a patron, the Church, whatever).
Quote from: lukeottevanger on April 09, 2007, 12:54:03 AMGurn, this is a great and very perceptive post. Your #1 is really very important, I think, as is your #3. And I approve of the sentiment of your #2.As for #4, the one single Beethoven set I spin more than any other is that old standby - the Busch Quartet in op 127, 130-3 and 135 (sorry to be unimaginative).I've recently got hold of their Rasumovskys 1 and 2, and I can see that one joining the bunch also, though the playing is a little less accurate, I think.
Quote from: D Minor on April 09, 2007, 03:31:30 AMLate Mozart was also an independent-minded tortured soul . . . . . and may have served as a role model to Beethoven . . . . .
Quote from: Gurn Blanston on April 09, 2007, 04:03:34 PMd minor,But you are not discriminating between what we know now and what was believed about Mozart, even when he was still alive. He was, indeed, an independent-minded, tortured soul. But no one knew or believed that, not until the relatively late 20th century were many of the myths surrounding Mozart dispelled. Ones like "He was Divinely inspired, all he did was hold the pen and it was like automatic writing" and "he was a drunken, whoring playboy who was so gifted that it didn't stop him from writing beautiful music anyway", and lots of others too. And don't forget, he was a lightweight, rococo tunesmith too. Beethoven was the archetype of the tortured artist, each note squeezed from the pen only after hours or days of frenzied thought, crossing out, tearing up &c &c &c. In its own way, this picture is just as wrong as Mozart's. But it was perfect for the Romantic sensibility hhall around him. Add Schubert to the mix, and this was indeed the Age of Tortured Artists...
Quote from: Lady Chatterley on April 09, 2007, 04:23:13 PMDid Beethoven have celiac disease?That's torture enough for anyone.
Quote from: Lady Chatterley on April 09, 2007, 05:53:29 PMPerhaps it was peptic ulcers?
Quote from: edward on April 09, 2007, 01:35:26 PMI think one thing that often gets missed out in discussing Beethoven is just how witty a composer he was. Not knock-down laugh-out-loud, but those sudden sforzandi and unexpected hiatuses keep the listener deliciously off-balance.
Quote from: Gurn Blanston on April 09, 2007, 06:06:58 PMAny other symptoms support that? More likely, it was too much wine.
Quote from: Gurn Blanston on April 08, 2007, 05:16:30 PMA wise man, David Ross. And of course, I judge wisdom by the extent to which people share my opinions....
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