Help a Wagner newbie with Solti's Rheingold

[eyeresist]

Yesterday I picked up a new issue of the classic Solti recording of Das Rheingold on Decca, for only AUD$20 (about US$16 at the moment). This is my first hearing of this opera, apart from highlights from the Haitink cycle in a 5-disc EMI set. It's terrific stuff, and Wagner seems to be the first opera composer I've really enjoyed, due to the symphonic nature of his composition. Quibbles: the sound is a bit bright, and I've found reducing the treble and nudging up the bass makes it a lot more natural. (And I find the highly-rated Flagstad's performance as Fricka very strange - I think she sounds like a pantomime dame!)

However, I want to ask owners of this or previous issues of this recording about the ending of CD 1. It seems to cut off very suddenly, and since this cut-price reissue has no libretto, I'm really not sure if this is an error or not. The final track on CD 1 is described as:

15. [4.32]
Auf, Loge, hinab mit mir!
Wotan
Hehe! hehei! hieher! (Dritte Szene)
Alberich

Is this where previous issues stopped? Does this mean that there is a direct transition from scene 2 to scene 3?

Also, can anyone point me to a good free libretto? (Me, actually wanting to know the plot of an opera - these may well be the end times!)

[Valentino]

From another Wagner newbie: The opera is played without breaks in the theatre. Methinks SqueezeCenter is a good thing. 

I've been using this website for ring librettos, here is the direct link to das Vorabend: http://www.rwagner.net/libretti/rheingold/e-t-rhein.html
Interesting comments on Flagstads performance. I think she's phenomenal, and knowing that it's recorded after the appalling religius songs for the Norwegian Broadcasting Company is surreal; She was 63 in 1958.

[marvinbrown]

I have the Solti Ring in it's current and might I add glorious  0:) incarnation of 14 CDs in one box set:

 Das Rheingold comes in 2 CDs. CD1 ends rather abruptly on mine as you say.  The last phrase is

 Alberich: " Was hier und da? Her das Geschmeid?" with music continuing 2 seconds afterwards before the interruption.

 The action carries on with Alberich on CD2 continuing his vicious enslavement  of his brother Mime.  It is not an ideal way to transition from one CD to the next by disconnecting Alberich's monologue after the first phrase but hey what can you do, a CD can only take so much  !

 PS: WELCOME TO WAGNER!  What can I say the man's a genius  0:) 0:)! Solti's Siegfried is NOT to be missed!

 marvin

[eyeresist]

Thanks, Marvin! I put Richard W off for as long as possible, but once I heard the ending of Walkure, I was hooked...

Thanks also for info on the sudden disc ending.

Valentino, I am certainly no coinoisseur of singers, so my judgement of Flagstad is based on "unformed" tastes. Actually, one reason I've avoided vocal music in general is that I find many voices intolerable. Others seem much more tolerant of huge vibrato, harshness of tone, etc. Also, vocal music often seems unoriginal compared with instrumental music: composers I admire often seem compelled to conform to "operatic style" when writing opera, or "choral style" when writing for choir, forsaking much of what makes their symphonic or chamber music interesting and individual.

[Haffner]

I have the Solti Ring in it's current and might I add glorious  0:) incarnation of 14 CDs in one box set:

 Das Rheingold comes in 2 CDs. CD1 ends rather abruptly on mine as you say.  The last phrase is

 Alberich: " Was hier und da? Her das Geschmeid?" with music continuing 2 seconds afterwards before the interruption.

 The action carries on with Alberich on CD2 continuing his vicious enslavement  of his brother Mime.  It is not an ideal way to transition from one CD to the next by disconnecting Alberich's monologue after the first phrase but hey what can you do, a CD can only take so much  !

 PS: WELCOME TO WAGNER!  What can I say the man's a genius  0:) 0:)! Solti's Siegfried is NOT to be missed!

 marvin

Marvin knows his stuff, But actually 3/4 of the Solti Ring is incredible: both Siegfried and Gotterdammerung are just DEVASTATING. The only weak spot is Die Walkure. Grab the Karajan, or...well, there are plenty of others here with excellent opinions on this matter.

[Valentino]

Solti might not put as much emphasis on the tenderness between father and daughter as others. I haven't really investigated yet.

Ah, the happines of having it all in one box. 

[mark4mich]

Any thoughts on the Levine set?

[Haffner]

Any thoughts on the Levine set?

It has its moments on cd. But you know, you might as well just get the Levine dvd if you're looking to watch your cash outflow. The performance isn't quite as good as one recorded the cd, but still you get a very good, traditional staging, and I personally happened to really like both the Walkure and Gotterdammerung.

[PerfectWagnerite]

It has its moments on cd. But you know, you might as well just get the Levine dvd if you're looking to watch your cash outflow. The performance isn't quite as good as one recorded the cd, but still you get a very good, traditional staging, and I personally happened to really like both the Walkure and Gotterdammerung.

Actually the performances are just about equal, the significant advantage to the DVD set is that you get Siegfried Jerusalem singing his namesake instead of Reiner Goldberg. The cast is otherwise identical. On DVD you get to see a Brunnhilde acted out with conviction by Hildegard Behrens. Some like to bash her because she does not quite have quite the vocal power to be an "ideal" Brunnhilde but I personally think she is fantastic.

Actually I think almost all Ring Cycles out there are very good with the exception of Haitink, Boulez, and Goodall so if you are new to the music it probably make more sense to grab whichever one you happen to find on sale.

[ChamberNut]

Any thoughts on the Levine set?

Hey, you can't go wrong for $40.00 for the CD set.  OK, it has no libretto.  I'm on a strict budget, so this was a great way to get The Ring into my collection.  Sounds great too.  I listen to it very often. 

[Haffner]

Actually I think almost all Ring Cycles out there are very good with the exception of Haitink, Boulez, and Goodall so if you are new to the music it probably make more sense to grab whichever one you happen to find on sale.

I was completely disgusted by the Boulez performance of the second and third acts of Siegfried. The tempos were way too fast and completely pooed over any dynamics. But I really enjoyed alot of the Boulez Ring besides; the first act of Siegfried was often quite stirring, I liked Act One of Die Walkure better than the Solti, and the Gotterdammerung was overall quite good.

Again, this is only my opinion.

[PerfectWagnerite]

I was completely disgusted by the Boulez performance of the second and third acts of Siegfried. The tempos were way too fast and completely pooed over any dynamics. But I really enjoyed alot of the Boulez Ring besides; the first act of Siegfried was often quite stirring, I liked Act One of Die Walkure better than the Solti, and the Gotterdammerung was overall quite good.

Again, this is only my opinion.

The cast in the Boulez set is a complete joke. Altmeyer and Hofmann are okay as the Walsung twins but Jung as Siegfried and Jones as Brunnhilde are alsolutely hideous vocally. And McKintyre's Wotan is just the weakest on record as as as I am cocerned.

Actually I am not so much bothered by the fast tempo. Boehm is also relatively brisk. In fact some of the older Wagner recordings out there are extremely fast. Recently I got an historical Gotterdammerung from Kwoon from 1937 (I think) at the MET with Melchior and Marjorie Lawrence and it has to be the fastest Gotterdammerung I have ever heard. I think it is a recent phenomenon to hear Ring Cycles a la Barenboim or Levine that are quite slow.

[Haffner]

The cast in the Boulez set is a complete joke. Altmeyer and Hofmann are okay as the Walsung twins but Jung as Siegfried and Jones as Brunnhilde are alsolutely hideous vocally. And McKintyre's Wotan is just the weakest on record as as as I am cocerned.

Actually I am not so much bothered by the fast tempo. Boehm is also relatively brisk. In fact some of the older Wagner recordings out there are extremely fast. Recently I got an historical Gotterdammerung from Kwoon from 1937 (I think) at the MET with Melchior and Marjorie Lawrence and it has to be the fastest Gotterdammerung I have ever heard. I think it is a recent phenomenon to hear Ring Cycles a la Barenboim or Levine that are quite slow.

I've read in several different sources that if Wagner heard the Ring and Parsifal as played today, he'd condemn the performance as ridiculously slow. So you might have a point.

I didn't have a huge problem with the casting in Boulez' Ring besides Jones, for obvious reasons. I agree that most were in the wrong opera though. I also feel that the Walkure twins in the Boulez were outstanding, two of the best ever in my humble opinion. Hofman was even past his prime, but he still delivered way beyond expectations. His vibrato wasn't anywhere near as rich and precise as in the past, but yee-hah did he have the edge over the younger Jung and Jones.

[PerfectWagnerite]

I didn't have a huge problem with the casting in Boulez' Ring besides Jones, for obvious reasons. I agree that most were in the wrong opera though. I also feel that the Walkure twins in the Boulez were outstanding, two of the best ever in my humble opinion. Hofman was even past his prime, but he still delivered way beyond expectations. His vibrato wasn't anywhere near as rich and precise as in the past, but yee-hah did he have the edge over the younger Jung and Jones.

Peter Hofmann was born in 1944. Manfred Jung was born in 1940 and Gwyneth Jones was born in 1936. So Hofmann was the youngest of the three.

Altmeyer, if you are curios, was born in '48.

[Haffner]

Peter Hofmann was born in 1944. Manfred Jung was born in 1940 and Gwyneth Jones was born in 1936. So Hofmann was the youngest of the three.

Altmeyer, if you are curios, was born in '48.

eeeEEWWWPS! I boo-booed. Maybe that explains it.

[eyeresist]

Actually I think almost all Ring Cycles out there are very good with the exception of Haitink, Boulez, and Goodall so if you are new to the music it probably make more sense to grab whichever one you happen to find on sale.

So is the Neuhold okay? Reviews seem pretty positive.

[Valentino]

The Boulez can't be bad. It's Boulez.

[Haffner]

The Boulez can't be bad. It's Boulez.

This is an extremely pertinent point.

[Valentino]

A point that's to the point? I had to consult my dictionary.

Ok, I am a Boulez fan. Everything he conducts gives me new relevations to works I know (and I like his compositions too, even if I don't quite get all of them yet). And that Bayreuth production is legendary, and on my must see list. But before that a new big TV and a modest 5.1 system.

[Haffner]

A point that's to the point? I had to consult my dictionary.

I thought you'd like that one  .

Ok, I am a Boulez fan. Everything he conducts gives me new relevations to works I know (and I like his compositions too, even if I don't quite get all of them yet). And that Bayreuth production is legendary, and on my must see list. But before that a new big TV and a modest 5.1 system..

So you haven't seen the Boulez Ring dvd yet? If you've already checked out Levine and Solti, Boulez is going to be one heck of alot of fun for you.