Shostakovich's Preludes and Fugues

Started by The Mad Hatter, June 07, 2007, 03:04:39 AM

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staxomega

#200
Quote from: aukhawk on September 12, 2021, 04:03:36 AM
Presto has it as downloads at a low price (for 3 CDs-worth) which I couldn't resist even though I do have my reservations about the recording.  Fortunately I know and like the Stevenson 'filler'.
The pdf booklet is included but the notes are fairly superficial but do include a couple of generalised insights into the music that I haven't read anywhere else.  Apparently if you buy the vinyl you get "a limited edition printed insert of the 'cryptogram' that Shostakovich used as his musical signature"  ::)

I'm not diligent enough to have proper backups which is why I prefer buying CDs.

edit: removed because I was hearing this on headphones, maybe needs speakers

milk

Quote from: aukhawk on September 11, 2021, 12:58:48 AM
Interesting thanks.  I'd overlooked him, must backtrack and listen.

It was your post in WAYL2N that alerted me, and I scurried off to Spotify.  Have listened to 1-12 so far, will not get around to 13-16 until tomorrow, and the final eight only if I'm still enjoying the rest.

What stands out - well I have to say mostly it's the piano sound which to my ears is verging on the clangorous.  ???  Sort of, the sonic equivalent to the cover image (below).  :o :o  I'm kinda dreading getting to the Stevenson Passacaglia if the sound is going to be the same for that.  Possibly it's an incompatibility with my speakers which sometimes are not as laid-back as I could wish, and a forward, bright piano recording is just the sort of thing that sets them off.  A lot of sustain gives the right-hand notes a tinkling bell-like quality. 
[edit - I now have the booklet and note that the Passacaglia was recorded in a different location - hopefuly a bit less lively and ringy.  Incidentally the P&F was a Covid recording - May 2020 - in the famous (for recording) Jesus-Christus-Kirche.]

Apart from that, first impressions of the performance are that it's fairly neutral (think: Weichert) but with very pointed articulation (think: Lin).  The shorter faster pieces are taken very quickly - actually quite attractive - the slow fugues about par for the course, meaning not quite as slow as I would wish.  But I greatly prefer the piano sound in those two recordings (and most others) compared with Levit.
[edit - Levit absolutely excels in No.12 (both Prelude and Fugue) and even more so in No.15 where both are right up his alley.  Conversely, Prelude 14 is a failure - where's the thunder?? ]


Shostakovich: Preludes & Fugues - Stevenson: Passacaglia on DSCH - Igor Levit

Interesting. Musicweb calls it "a landmark recording." I don't know. I guess I need many more listens. It seems to me that one's Shostakovich is only as good as one's Bach. How's his Bach? But there are so many choices I'm not sure that this one stands out so far above.
http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2021/Oct/Shostakovich-preludes-19439809212.htm

aukhawk

#202
Well that review is at least partly about the Stevenson Passacaglia as much as the Shostakovich P&F, which is fair enough given that the title of the release is "On DSCH" implying that the Stevenson is much more than just a glorified filler.  I've wanted to write about the Stevenson (from the vantage point that this is the 4th recording I have, and probably not the best) but to do so here at any length would be to derail this thread.

As far as the P&F goes, one thing this thread has shown is that it's not just (as Musicweb implies) a question of Nikolayeva vs the latest wunderkind recording.  There are plenty of alternatives and although I agree with the review that Levit finishes well (majestically, in the final fugue) it's a rather long haul to get to that point and overall (IMHO) most of the other recordings have better piano sound and many offer comparable interpretive insight.  I think you don't go far wrong with Weichert, in a middle-of-the-road sort of way.

Karl Henning

Quote from: milk on October 12, 2021, 03:47:27 AM
Interesting. Musicweb calls it "a landmark recording." I don't know. I guess I need many more listens.

Or it may be hyperbole on the part of the Musicweb writer ....
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Madiel

I rarely find musicweb reviews enlightening to be honest. Though it's a better-written review than a lot on that site (though it gets the date of Nikolayeva's recording wrong).

I haven't listened to Levit myself yet. If I had it would be on this thread.  :laugh:
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aukhawk

Oh it's good.  Just not head-and-shoulders-above-the-rest good, as the review seeks to imply. 
And the Stevenson Passacaglia is the sort of music you only need to hear once in every 10 years ... it broadly divides into 3 sections (although the music is continuous) and I think the 2nd and 3rd sections are much more likeable music than the 1st.  Rather unfortunate because the 1st 20 minutes or so can be a bit off-putting in a head-banging sort of way.

staxomega

"Igor Levit's peculiar and unique combination of the Germanic and Russian traditions of piano playing" I wonder what the MusicWeb reviewer means by this. With current recording pianists I can't tell any particular "Russian style" of piano playing since the days of direct Neuhaus taught pianists. I wonder if he would have still made such a statement if we was listening to Levit's recordings blind.

Madiel

#207
After an interruption of over 6 months while I found a new house, bought it and moved into it, and really didn't have time/concentration for 2.5 hour epics...

Today listening to Peter Donohoe



And time and again it's... 'okay'.

Things actually get off to a bad start with a tediously slow C major prelude, and a slowish fugue as well. But that's actually about as bad as it gets. The problem is, a heck of a lot of the performance only registers as 'fairly good', and some pieces are just sort of... there. Rarely does a performance feel like it's great.

It's pretty technically secure (except the G sharp minor fugue somehow sounds muddy), but what never quite comes through is character. Okay, sometimes it does, a couple of the livelier fugues have a nice bounce. But then others don't. And the pieces that call for some Russian drama and intensity, I don't feel it, except the back half of the D minor fugue is really rather enjoyable. Maybe the recording is partly an issue, but it doesn't sound particularly distant or anything. I think it's more the performance.

And I'm not alone in these reactions, or lack of them. I found reviews referring to a hint of plainness, a slight blandness. One referred to 'detachment'. That works in some of the P&Fs like the B flat minor, but over the space of 2.5 hours I was looking for more engagement. I wanted it. I only got it in fits and starts.

Not terrible by any means, but not a version I would recommend either.
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Madiel

Today I pulled the trigger on Igor Levit. And to my mind it's pretty impressive.



If you have a spectrum between Lin's bright and light approach and Melnikov's more Romantic drama, Levit is in the middle but leaning towards Melnikov, and perhaps similar to Caroline Weichert. Levit uses pedal fairly generously at times, not just in the A major fugue which is a delicate haze of notes but also some other pieces where you wouldn't necessarily expect it. But what he never seems to do is push for the extremes. There's a poise and a slight restraint - possibly influenced by the recording which is not one of those super up-close, hear-the-pianist-breathing recordings. Although, Levit's B major prelude and fugue are both faster than just about anyone, so it's not as if he always plays it completely safe. And his technique holds up in the G sharp minor and D flat major fuges (the only places where Lin feels cautious).

Now, your opinion on whether a bit of restraint is a good thing might vary. If you think Shostakovich should ever sound harsh and ugly, Levit won't give you that, and none of the moodier pieces are ever quite as moody as some other performances. The colour difference between a low bass and a high treble isn't brought out the way some other pianists would do it. But to my mind pieces aren't colourless or characterless: there's still enough fire where it's warranted, even if I admit to occasionally wishing that he'd go for it just that little more, and at the other end there's some wonderfully delicate playing. One of my favourite moments is the contrast between the loud end of the G major fugue and the sotto voce beginning of the E minor prelude. And where Melnikov sometimes overdoes music that should be simple, Levit lets it be simple.

Not every single tempo fits with my mental 'Platonic ideal' - for example some of the Adagios don't feel all that Adagio to me - but nearly every single movement feels like a justifiable musical choice. Over and again Levit convinced me that his was a legitimate way to play the music. And there's some really excellent shaping of the music. Where some people bash away at the B minor prelude, Levit keeps it interesting. The lengthy F sharp minor fugue has moments where you can feel the music slowly ebbing away and losing its strength, which is surely the effect Shostakovich imagined. Even if my brain tells me the F major fugue is just a fraction too slow, it still sounds good. I think the concluding D minor prelude and fugue is the slowest on record, and a bit ponderous. But if you're going to go for a big, ponderous grand gesture, that's the place to do it.

I'd put this up in the top tier of performances, along with Lin, Ashkenazy, Weichert and Melnikov.
I am now working on a discography of the works of Vagn Holmboe. Please visit and also contribute!

Mirror Image

Quote from: Madiel on June 25, 2022, 07:02:09 PM
Today I pulled the trigger on Igor Levit. And to my mind it's pretty impressive.



If you have a spectrum between Lin's bright and light approach and Melnikov's more Romantic drama, Levit is in the middle but leaning towards Melnikov, and perhaps similar to Caroline Weichert. Levit uses pedal fairly generously at times, not just in the A major fugue which is a delicate haze of notes but also some other pieces where you wouldn't necessarily expect it. But what he never seems to do is push for the extremes. There's a poise and a slight restraint - possibly influenced by the recording which is not one of those super up-close, hear-the-pianist-breathing recordings. Although, Levit's B major prelude and fugue are both faster than just about anyone, so it's not as if he always plays it completely safe. And his technique holds up in the G sharp minor and D flat major fuges (the only places where Lin feels cautious).

Now, your opinion on whether a bit of restraint is a good thing might vary. If you think Shostakovich should ever sound harsh and ugly, Levit won't give you that, and none of the moodier pieces are ever quite as moody as some other performances. The colour difference between a low bass and a high treble isn't brought out the way some other pianists would do it. But to my mind pieces aren't colourless or characterless: there's still enough fire where it's warranted, even if I admit to occasionally wishing that he'd go for it just that little more, and at the other end there's some wonderfully delicate playing. One of my favourite moments is the contrast between the loud end of the G major fugue and the sotto voce beginning of the E minor prelude. And where Melnikov sometimes overdoes music that should be simple, Levit lets it be simple.

Not every single tempo fits with my mental 'Platonic ideal' - for example some of the Adagios don't feel all that Adagio to me - but nearly every single movement feels like a justifiable musical choice. Over and again Levit convinced me that his was a legitimate way to play the music. And there's some really excellent shaping of the music. Where some people bash away at the B minor prelude, Levit keeps it interesting. The lengthy F sharp minor fugue has moments where you can feel the music slowly ebbing away and losing its strength, which is surely the effect Shostakovich imagined. Even if my brain tells me the F major fugue is just a fraction too slow, it still sounds good. I think the concluding D minor prelude and fugue is the slowest on record, and a bit ponderous. But if you're going to go for a big, ponderous grand gesture, that's the place to do it.

I'd put this up in the top tier of performances, along with Lin, Ashkenazy, Weichert and Melnikov.

Nice! I've heard many good things about this recording. I might go for it, but I have Melnikov, Ashkenazy and the second recording from Nikolayeva on Melodiya, so I probably don't need any more, but this hasn't stopped me before. ;)

Madiel

Quote from: Mirror Image on June 25, 2022, 09:03:15 PM
Nice! I've heard many good things about this recording. I might go for it, but I have Melnikov, Ashkenazy and the second recording from Nikolayeva on Melodiya, so I probably don't need any more, but this hasn't stopped me before. ;)

Look, I'm not going to discourage you from having multiple recordings of this work when even I, of all people, deliberately own 3!

I haven't yet decided whether I'm nuts enough to try hunting down the other ones I like (Weichert might be pretty hard to get). For Levit I need to also listen to the other Stevenson work it's paired with, see what I think of it. If I like the Stevenson that gives me the excuse...
I am now working on a discography of the works of Vagn Holmboe. Please visit and also contribute!

MusicTurner

I've just ordered the Hanssler 5CD box on offer from JPC, with Shosty himself in what appears to be the complete set, and 1950s recordings by Richter, Gilels and Nikolayeva also only in pieces from that work.

I had some Shosty, Richter and Gilels on LP, but this will be a most welcome, much more temperamental addition to my Ashkenazy set that is too cold, IMO. Skipped a later Nikolayeva recording, but today I might have kept it.

Madiel

#212
I could be wrong, but as far as I know the composer didn't ever record the entire set. Only certain pieces (some of them more than once).

EDIT: In fact, having found an image of the back of the relevant box, it shows him missing 9, 10, 15, 19 and 21. So over time he did perform more of them than I had realised, but it's not quite complete.
I am now working on a discography of the works of Vagn Holmboe. Please visit and also contribute!

Karl Henning

Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

aukhawk

#214
Quote from: Madiel on June 25, 2022, 09:21:32 PM
Look, I'm not going to discourage you from having multiple recordings of this work when even I, of all people, deliberately own 3!

I haven't yet decided whether I'm nuts enough to try hunting down the other ones I like (Weichert might be pretty hard to get). For Levit I need to also listen to the other Stevenson work it's paired with, see what I think of it. If I like the Stevenson that gives me the excuse...

The Weichert is readily available both from Presto and Amazon, at very good prices for what is effectively a 4-disc set, but downloads only.  (But hey, this is the 21st century.)  The other piano music included is interesting I suppose, but only the 2nd Sonata really adds value.  So judge the price and value on the Preludes & Fugues alone - Amazon is very cheap but to have MP3s only of what is actually one of the best-recorded sets out there is rather a shame.

I agree with your general assessment of the Levit but personally I find the recorded sound problematic - as mentioned upthread - perhaps I'm just unlucky and something at the treble end sets off some resonance in my B&W speakers.  The Stevenson was recorded at a different location and sounds a bit better to me - but, like the other items included with the Weichert set, this is essentially a 'free' inclusion and I'm unlikely to listen to it much if at all - I already have 3 other recordings and I don't listen to those either!

I would expect an up-coming new recording of the P&F from Eugenio Catone sometime in the next 12 months - he has vols 1 & 2 of DSCH piano music already released.

MusicTurner

#215
Quote from: Madiel on June 25, 2022, 10:30:06 PM
I could be wrong, but as far as I know the composer didn't ever record the entire set. Only certain pieces (some of them more than once).

EDIT: In fact, having found an image of the back of the relevant box, it shows him missing 9, 10, 15, 19 and 21. So over time he did perform more of them than I had realised, but it's not quite complete.

I found a better track list, and correct, it is not complete. Still, there are more, than on most other versions with Shosty I've seen.

Included are:
Nos. 1-8, 12-14, 16-18, 20, 22-24,
so 6 of them missing.

= Hanssler Profil PH 20054 (5 CD).

The Warner 'Shostakovich Plays Shostakovich' 2CD only includes 9 pieces, btw.
But the 'Russia Revelation' series did include all these (and no more pieces from that opus).

Karl Henning

Quote from: MusicTurner on June 25, 2022, 09:58:56 PM
I've just ordered the Hanssler 5CD box on offer from JPC, with Shosty himself in what appears to be the complete set, and 1950s recordings by Richter, Gilels and Nikolayeva also only in pieces from that work.

I had some Shosty, Richter and Gilels on LP, but this will be a most welcome, much more temperamental addition to my Ashkenazy set that is too cold, IMO. Skipped a later Nikolayeva recording, but today I might have kept it.

Help me find it?
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

MusicTurner

#217
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on June 26, 2022, 11:31:24 AM
Help me find it?

I'm in Sweden without a computer and can't post links, but the JPC number is 9895574, and the price is still 14,99 Euros.

Note the later comments, not a complete version with Shosty himself at the piano.

Am looking forward to all of these recordings, as said. The Discogs listing of the set has better/precise performance information than JPC.

Karl Henning

#218
Quote from: MusicTurner on June 26, 2022, 11:35:29 AM
I'm in Sweden without a compouter and can't post links, but the JPC number is 9895574, and the price is still 14,99 Euros.

Note the later comments, not a complete version with Shosty himself at the piano.

Am looking forward to all of these recordings, as said. The Discogs listing of the set has better/precise performance information than JPC.

Thanks! Found it!
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Madiel

Quote from: aukhawk on June 26, 2022, 08:17:36 AM
The Weichert is readily available both from Presto and Amazon, at very good prices for what is effectively a 4-disc set, but downloads only.  (But hey, this is the 21st century.)

I know it's readily available as downloads. I don't like buying downloads if I can possibly help it.
I am now working on a discography of the works of Vagn Holmboe. Please visit and also contribute!