Trying not to go deaf

[DavidW]

I'm going to move my posts over here from the spousal abuse thread and invite a discussion as to what steps you've taken to enjoy music listening without damaging your ears.

Ah, no wonder Dave lives in the garage! Umm, workshop...  But headphones will ruin his hearing, eventually. Then you will need to get him a hearing ear dog. You can see where this is all going, can't you?  

I've been thinking about that issue recently since I wonder if my hearing is going due to headphone listening... you can buy (and I might) a Radioshack spl meter, head-fiers have used an spl meter with cardboard (cut to the size of either ear pad) that they put over the microphone and one of the phones (I guess so it doesn't leak out and emulates what it's like for your ear) and then dial the volume to be no more than 80 dB, and there should be no hearing damage.  But in a quiet room, people are usually content with 65-70 dB and many people that listen all day dial it in to 70 dB and are quite content with that.

Yes, that's progress. Although I have already traveled the route that DavidW is talking about, and even though I have my own music room I have learned to listen at reasonable levels that don't fill the house. Better for what's left of my hearing, too.

Other things I've considered--
1. Use spl meter on the speakers, when I dial that volume in I'll have a baseline for an intuition for what's a safe headphone volume.  The problem is that people have poor intuition for what's damaging loud and what's fine loud.  But perhaps just having a # to associate with an experience at a loudness level makes all the difference.

2. I heard of a test-- put on the radio to something talk, and then set it at just the minimal volume for which you can make out the words.  Listen to music for half an hour, and then turn on the radio again, if you can still make out the words fine, if not you're suffering from temporary hearing loss which means the volume is too high and it needs to be turned down.  So you can use that method in repeat to find the volume in which you're satisfied (or as much as you can be) and not suffer the consequences.  The only thing I worry about is that you listen for an hour or several hours then you actually need it to be several dB below the threshold you find for that test, since exposure also matters.

These are all hypothetical, what I've actually done is observe that what used to be loud (the theater) seemed slightly muted, so I decided to just turn down the volume (at home listening) to can just hear it level and I found after awhile that didn't sound as quiet and I was less afraid of damaging my hearing.

[Gurn Blanston]

David,
That's all good stuff. I don't know if I used the same sort of meter that you are talking about, but it is an industrial noise level meter that I use at work.

Since my speakers more or less all face me in my chair, I just played around to where it read 75 dB on the 'fast sampling' (Type A) mode. In Occupational Health, we use 80 as the level that won't hurt you, even if you were exposed to it for 8-10 hours at a time (a normal work shift). Anything above 85dB will cause hearing damage over time. And as you noted, the longer the exposure time the more damage, since it is cumulative in a dose. Where the sound will vary (not the case here, usually) we use a time weighted average based on going up and down over 8 hours. This gives a more accurate representation of your actual dose, but you need a data recording meter to be able to calculate it, and that's big $$$.

A good rule of thumb for whether you are being overexposed is to try and have a conversation with someone while the sound is at its normal volume. If you have to lean in close to hear, or have to raise your voice to be heard, then you are certainly being exposed to enough noise to hurt your hearing over time.  One may not like to be told those things, but facts are facts. The thing I hear most often from people with a long time exposure is "it used to bother me, but I got used to it, no problem now". What they are saying is "now my hearing is damaged enough that the volume doesn't seem as loud to me, so I'm good"...



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Listening to:
Holmes/Burnett - Hummel Sonata in Eb for Violin & Fortepiano Op 5 #3 1st mvmt

[MN Dave]

I go for a good, solid signal without blasting myself out of my chair. The music should work well enough without adding volume for assistance. The live concerts I've seen at Orchestra Hall weren't loud.

[Gurn Blanston]

I go for a good, solid signal without blasting myself out of my chair. The music should work well enough without adding volume for assistance. The live concerts I've seen at Orchestra Hall weren't loud.

Curious whether you have ever tried my little test. You should have a shot at it, it's easy and free. The results should tell you something useful.



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Listening to:
Holmes/Burnett - Hummel Sonata in Eb for Violin & Fortepiano Op 5 #3 3rd mvmt

[MN Dave]

My wife is out so I cannot test right now. But I'm pretty damn sure I could hold a conversation without raising my voice. I'm careful and don't like it too loud. 

[Gurn Blanston]

My wife is out so I cannot test right now. But I'm pretty damn sure I could hold a conversation without raising my voice. I'm careful and don't like it too loud. 

You are wise, of Great Northerner...



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Listening to:
International Orchestra of Italy/Ciacci - Hummel T & V in F for Oboe & Orchestra Op 102 Intro

[DavidW]

The little test is a good idea, well for speakers.  With headphones you're not going to hear others anyway, especially closed headphones.

[drogulus]

     This is a good hearing test. It starts at 22 kHz, so you won't hear anything at first.

[DavidW]

     This is a good hearing test. It starts at 22 kHz, so you won't hear anything at first.

Unless you have golden ears.   Yeah I was pleased I could hear up to 17k thought my hearing was worse than that.

[Bogey]

Mine seems to be....14K before I hear the ringing.  Too much Nugent through the cans as a youth.

[Bogey]

Just tried it without the dogs barking in the background....15K.

[Bogey]

What is a decent level?

[DavidW]

You have very good hearing Bill, time to listen to some Mahler.

[Bogey]

My 11 year old son was at 16K David.

[DavidW]

My 11 year old son was at 16K David.

I turned up the volume and I could hear it at 18k.  In your face 11 year old!   I guess I have golden ears, guess I better start dumping all of my money onto expensive audiophile cables...

[Diletante]

Are you supposed to say when you hear the buzz? I hear it clearly at 20K.

[Coopmv]

Go tell the iPod generation.  I am sure all the hearing device manufacturers are loving this MP3 trend.  They will all be doing booming business in 15-20 years ...

[Diletante]

I actually quit my iPod cold turkey about a month ago after I realized I was developing tinnitus. Fortunately it seems to have worked and the buzzing has gone back to normal (I do have mild hearing loss and tinnitus from a mishap with fireworks many years ago).

[Bogey]

I actually quit my iPod cold turkey about a month ago after I realized I was developing tinnitus. Fortunately it seems to have worked and the buzzing has gone back to normal (I do have mild hearing loss and tinnitus from a mishap with fireworks many years ago).

Glad that you are recovering.

[Coopmv]

I actually quit my iPod cold turkey about a month ago after I realized I was developing tinnitus. Fortunately it seems to have worked and the buzzing has gone back to normal (I do have mild hearing loss and tinnitus from a mishap with fireworks many years ago).

Assuming Apple will still be around in 20-30 years (hey, you never know with tech company), I wonder if people will be suing it for hearing loss much the same as the tobacco companies have been sued for all the smoking-related ailments.