Beethoven in Period Performances

Started by Que, April 07, 2007, 07:34:50 AM

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(poco) Sforzando

Quote from: Rod Corkin on June 26, 2008, 08:22:46 AM
On the other hand if there WERE good period instrument recordings of ALL of Beethoven's works, then why would I need to concern myself with old Brendel and Karajan re-releases for example?  There is no logical reason at all. Can you give me one??

Because of the excellence of the recorded legacy on modern instruments.
"I don't know what sforzando means, though it clearly means something."

Gurn Blanston

Quote from: Rod Corkin on June 26, 2008, 08:22:46 AM
On the other hand if there WERE good period instrument recordings of ALL of Beethoven's works, then why would I need to concern myself with old Brendel and Karajan re-releases for example?  There is no logical reason at all. Can you give me one??

No, my preference is for the sound of period instruments too. However, I would never demean the musicianship of the older artistes, even though some of their performance practices are not to my taste. As an example, I would love to hear a pianist of the calibre of Kempff playing the late sonatas on a Graf... :)

8)
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Haydn: that genius of vulgar music who induces an inordinate thirst for beer - Mily Balakirev (1860)

Bunny

Here are some period instrument Beethoven recordings of violin sonatas and trios:

   

Also look for the Quatuor Mosaïque recordings of the Op. 18 Beethoven string quartets and the recordings of Quatuor Turner (their Op. 18 quartets is sadly oop :()



Anner Bijlsma and Malcolm Bilson have recorded the sonatas for fortepiano and violoncello -- also excellent, but mostly available in the Beethoven box set which might be right up your alley as it also has the recordings of wind music by Mozzafiato.  It's a steal from the partners at about $75 from Amazon.  It's cheaper in Europe than the states, so you can also try to locate it at Amazon.uk.  Their shipping rates are far lower than Amazon.de.  German postal rates for parcels (via DHL) are killer!  Pieter Wispelwey and Paul Komen have also made an excellent period instrument recording (Channel Classics) of the complete piano and cello sonatas and Wispelwey and Lois Shapiro have recorded the variations for the same label, but I don't know how easy it is to find the variations nowadays.


 
 

Rod Corkin

#323
Quote from: Gurn Blanston on June 26, 2008, 09:40:12 AM
As an example, I would love to hear a pianist of the calibre of Kempff playing the late sonatas on a Graf... :)

8)

Some of my very first Beethoven recordings were by Kempff, but I have CDs the late sonatas performed on Grafs in a most satisfactory manner, as has been demonstrated at my site. Hell would freeze over before I abandon those in favour of Kempff.
"If I were but of noble birth..." - Rod Corkin
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/classicalmusicmayhem/

(poco) Sforzando

Quote from: Rod Corkin on June 27, 2008, 01:05:03 AM
Some of my very first Beethoven recordings were by Kempff, but I have CDs the late sonatas performed on Grafs in a most satisfactory manner, as has been demonstrated at my site. Hell would freeze over before I abandon those in favour of Kempff.

Well!

If you read the last few cantos of Dante's Inferno (I assume you've heard of it, even though Handel never wrote an opera on the subject), you'll find that the deepest circles of Hell are characterized by a lake of frozen ice.
"I don't know what sforzando means, though it clearly means something."

Rod Corkin

Quote from: Sforzando on June 27, 2008, 02:47:30 AM
Well!

If you read the last few cantos of Dante's Inferno (I assume you've heard of it, even though Handel never wrote an opera on the subject), you'll find that the deepest circles of Hell are characterized by a lake of frozen ice.

I can only assume you've never heard Kempff..  ::)
"If I were but of noble birth..." - Rod Corkin
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/classicalmusicmayhem/

(poco) Sforzando

Quote from: Rod Corkin on June 27, 2008, 03:20:07 AM
I can only assume you've never heard Kempff..  ::)

Your assumption is incorrect.
"I don't know what sforzando means, though it clearly means something."

FideLeo

#327
Quote from: Bunny on June 26, 2008, 01:39:38 PM

Also look for the Quatuor Mosaïque recordings of the Op. 18 Beethoven string quartets and the recordings of Quatuor Turner (their Op. 18 quartets is sadly oop :()


Here in Taiwan I am surprised to see copies of Turner Op. 18 in record stores.... It may have been back in print!  :)
HIP for all and all for HIP! Harpsichord for Bach, fortepiano for Beethoven and pianoforte for Brahms!

Rod Corkin

Quote from: traverso on June 27, 2008, 03:32:02 AM
Here in Taiwan I am surprised to see copies of Turner Op. 18 in record stores.... It may have been back in print!  :)

That does surprise me too. That recording is ok, not perfect by any means, but ok. The Quator Mosaique's Op18 I can't recommend at all, everything is just so slooooowwww.
"If I were but of noble birth..." - Rod Corkin
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/classicalmusicmayhem/

Bunny

Quote from: traverso on June 27, 2008, 03:32:02 AM
Here in Taiwan I am surprised to see copies of Turner Op. 18 in record stores.... It may have been back in print!  :)

The Q. Turner isn't listed in the artists pages of Harmonia Mundi although if you go through their index of Beethoven recordings you can find their latest recording I cited previously of middle period quartets.  I suspect that you have found a few extra issues for the Asia market which seems to get a higher volume of HIP recordings than the USA.  If it's not oop there, I'd be very surprised.  Is the cover the same as below?




Quote from: Rod Corkin on June 27, 2008, 05:53:04 AM
That does surprise me too. That recording is ok, not perfect by any means, but ok. The Quator Mosaique's Op18 I can't recommend at all, everything is just so slooooowwww.

I like the Quatuor Mosaïques Beethoven!  At first I was put off by the slow tempos, but after a while, I became caught up in the music and it really worked.  It's not an in-your-face piece of speedy virtuousity but more of a leisurely stroll through Beethoven in his most optimistic youth.

FideLeo

Quote from: Bunny on June 27, 2008, 07:11:56 AM
If it's not oop there, I'd be very surprised.  Is the cover the same as below?





Yes.  I bought mine years ago, saw it disappeared for quite a while, and now see it reappear
on shelves.  Who knows?  It may be one of those "pressed on demand" issues from HM.
HIP for all and all for HIP! Harpsichord for Bach, fortepiano for Beethoven and pianoforte for Brahms!

Bunny

Btw, that's a scan of the piece of "cardboard" I got when I purchased the set that was supposedly in Used-very good condition.  You will notice that the staples are completely rusted.  It was the first and only time I gave a seller no stars and a totally negative rating.  Amazon actually took action and refunded my purchase money.  I doubt that seller is still selling at Amazon under the same name.

premont

Quote from: Gurn Blanston on June 26, 2008, 09:40:12 AM
No, my preference is for the sound of period instruments too. However, I would never demean the musicianship of the older artistes, even though some of their performance practices are not to my taste. As an example, I would love to hear a pianist of the calibre of Kempff playing the late sonatas on a Graf... :)

8)

Splendid idea, and I think everyone of us sometimes plays with thoughts like this. But on the other hand: do you think the Graf would suit Kempffs playing style, - would he be able to play the Graf in a convincing way? Nor do I think, he would be interested, - his world of expression originated from the possibilities of the modern concert grand. Not HIP, but still great music-making.
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FideLeo

#333
Another completed cycle of LvB sonatas for pianoforte and violin on period instruments:


HIP for all and all for HIP! Harpsichord for Bach, fortepiano for Beethoven and pianoforte for Brahms!

FideLeo

#334
Given the fact that Ronald Brautigam's much praised recording of Beethoven sonatas were (and are) done on fortepianos, it was surprising for me to learn that he and Andrew Parrott decided to record the concertos with modern instruments.   An interesting option, just like Andrew Manze's "Eroica."

HIP for all and all for HIP! Harpsichord for Bach, fortepiano for Beethoven and pianoforte for Brahms!

Opus106

Beethoven
Violin Concerto, 2 Romances for violin and orchestra
Thomas Zehetmair, Orchestra of the Eighteenth Century, Frans Bruggen


I see this CD almost every time I go to buy CDs. I have been intent on widening my collection in terms of repertoire, that I didn't realise that this was HIP Beethoven. My only performance of the concerto is the one with Menuhin and Furtwangler (EMI GRotC). Is the aforementioned HIP performance good?
Regards,
Navneeth

FideLeo

Quote from: opus67 on July 01, 2008, 06:13:19 AM
Beethoven
Violin Concerto, 2 Romances for violin and orchestra
Thomas Zehetmair, Orchestra of the Eighteenth Century, Frans Bruggen


I see this CD almost every time I go to buy CDs. I have been intent on widening my collection in terms of repertoire, that I didn't realise that this was HIP Beethoven. My only performance of the concerto is the one with Menuhin and Furtwangler (EMI GRotC). Is the aforementioned HIP performance good?

Yes..HIP Beethoven in grand style (but not slow at all)
HIP for all and all for HIP! Harpsichord for Bach, fortepiano for Beethoven and pianoforte for Brahms!

Opus106

Quote from: traverso on July 01, 2008, 06:25:23 AM
Yes..HIP Beethoven in grand style (but not slow at all)

I think I read about that somewhere. The second movement is one of my favourites. I wonder how it sounds sped up...
Regards,
Navneeth

FideLeo

Quote from: opus67 on July 01, 2008, 06:33:15 AM
The second movement is one of my favourites. I wonder how it sounds sped up...

Sounds less like a dream and more like a concert aria sung by the solo violin.   Ditto the two romances. 
HIP for all and all for HIP! Harpsichord for Bach, fortepiano for Beethoven and pianoforte for Brahms!

premont

Quote from: traverso on July 01, 2008, 06:02:07 AM
Given the fact that Ronald Brautigam's much praised recording of Beethoven sonatas were (and are) done on fortepianos, it was surprising for me to learn that he and Andrew Parrott decided to record the concertos with modern instruments.   An interesting option, just like Andrew Manze's "Eroica."

Disappointing. I wonder what kind of expression these HIP pioneers want to put into the music, which can not be made on period instruments.
Is their decision just governed by the wish of making the recordings eatable to non hip listeners, which still are in the majority?
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