Havergal Brian.

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Cilgwyn, I think our friend from Holland may have a link to the Unicorn. If not then I am happy to share.

Well, I have 10 & 21 on standby, so to speak. But if cilgwyn really wants the CD...

[cilgwyn]

No.thank you for the offer,but I think I'll resist for the time being. I think you need it more than me. Anyway,I have the cd-r's & to be honest I have just spent a bit of a packet on some historical recordings. Some very strange people actually prefer listening to a couple of blokes playing into a horn or a 1920's microphone rather than something in state of the art digital sound. (I've got Dan Godfrey's 1920's recordings of VW's 'London Symphony' on at the moment.) But not all the time I hasten to add!
Brian's 'Gothic' could have been recorded in 1928!

NB: Dan Godfrey strikes me as a much better conductor than the jobber he's made out to be by some,judging by these recordings. Very impassioned playing & the swish of the shellac only adds to the evocative atmosphere.
Symposium have done a good job. Recommended!!!

[cilgwyn]

Oskar Fried recorded Mahler's 3rd & Bruckner's Seventh in front of a horn. I reckon a 1928 shellac recording of the 'Gothic' would have been a doddle for him!

[Scarpia]

the swish of the shellac only adds to the evocative atmosphere.

Why not record the shellac swishing at the end of one of your 78s and superimpose it on those newfangled digital recordings.  Then again, why not have shellac swishers in the concert hall!

[cilgwyn]

Ahem,Second!!!!!

[cilgwyn]

I remember the first time I heard Elgar's recordings of his own music. I actually had this thought in my head. How do I KNOW it's really Elgar? It  could be some bloke in a studio mixing in a bit of snap,crackle and hiss. A bit of the old Joyce Hatto!
  Oh,and why not? A bit of shellac ambience. That's what computers are for. God,I could have saved myself a packet!!!

[cilgwyn]

Or I could discover a pile of previously unknown 78's of Oskar Fried conducting an abridged 'Gothic' in my attic. I could be famous!

[cilgwyn]

It just occurred to me that the liveliest performance of 'Dr Merryheart' after the Hull Youth SO one is the one on the Dutton cd of radio broadcasts. The Naxos comes third!

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

It just occurred to me that the liveliest performance of 'Dr Merryheart' after the Hull Youth SO one is the one on the Dutton cd of radio broadcasts. The Naxos comes third!

Hm. That's with Del Mar, isn't it? It has been a few months, but I remember I thought he was a bit too slow in the great lyrical passage, making it sound too romantic = not totally Brianic.

[cilgwyn]

I'll have another listen.

[karlhenning]

One thing I know, I never want to hear the "Gothic."  (I can't fathom chorus and orchestra pieces, generally.)   Which is the "other" disc?

The 17/32/plus Naxos disc that Johan wots of:

You mean with Nos. 17 and 32? Well, the 'Gothic' is the stronger piece. But I like No. 17 in the BBC performance very much, too...

FWIW, Scarps, the first rumor I heard of the Gothic (more than ten years ago), I wasn't at all sure I wanted to hear the piece, either.  The tempered enthusiasm here began to alter that, I was becoming somewhat curious about the piece ityself, and then Luke's advocacy sealed it.

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

The tempered enthusiasm here

Understatement of the day. 

[John Whitmore]

Why not record the shellac swishing at the end of one of your 78s and superimpose it on those newfangled digital recordings.  Then again, why not have shellac swishers in the concert hall!

Reminds me of Charles Ives' famous quote: "What's sound got to do with music?". Perfectly true. I've been revisiting some of Walter Goehr's old mono Concert Hall records and the music making just makes you forget the sound quality. You just sort of listen through it.

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Reminds me of Charles Ives' famous quote: "What's sound got to do with music?". Perfectly true. I've been revisiting some of Walter Goehr's old mono Concert Hall records and the music making just makes you forget the sound quality. You just sort of listen through it.

I recognise this - the vision carries all before it, and the perfection of the recorded sound loses (some of) its importance. I had to use all my aural archeology to listen through muddy Brian recordings the past 25 years, and try to assess the quality of the works in question.

[Scarpia]

Listening the Havergal Brian, Symphony No 8, Groves.  Wow, this is good.  Howcome you guys never told me how good this stuff is?   

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Sorry for having guarded Brian's music jealously for so long, brother Scarpia...


Here, btw, is a review (from 1978) of the Groves recording of symphonies 8 and 9, by David Rudkin. It is by no means uncritical of Havergal Brian, but fair. (I found it on that great resource, JStor, which I can access through the Royal Library in The Hague.)


http://www.mediafire.com/file/fkxd7k2xkrjscnw/David%20Rudkin%20-%20Review%20of%20Brian%27s%208th%20and%209th%20%281978%29.pdf


And here a review by Christopher Norris from 1975, of the Lyrita recording of Symphonies 6 & 16 and the CBS recording with Symphony No. 22, Psalm 23 and the English Suite No. 5 (with the LSSO):


http://www.mediafire.com/file/ttk8pf7h2qcq5y5/Review%20by%20Christopher%20Norris%20of%20the%20Lyrita%20and%20CBS%20Brian%20LPs.pdf

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

A nice photo (by Calotyp46 on Flickr) of a bust of HB by sculptor Richard Thomas, as exhibited at the Potteries Museum & Art Gallery, Hanley, Staffordshire.

[karlhenning]

Really sporting of Aaron Copland to sit as a model for another composer's bust!

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Really sporting of Aaron Copland to sit as a model for another composer's bust!

That's the kind of guy he was. Havergal was off writing another symphony.

[karlhenning]

That's the kind of guy he was. Havergal was off writing another symphony.

He certainly makes Aaron seem . . . lazy by comparison ; )

Havergal Brian Symphony #8 B flat minor, Groves conducting the RLPO



Sarge

You guys! (Aye, Scarps, too.)  As my final music purchase for a month, I went and pulled the trigger on this two-fer.