Havergal Brian.

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

You couldn't have kept that to yourself? Damn it, Johan...you're gonna cost me money.

Truth will out. 





Now listening to Reverie, from English Suite No. 5. It's great to be able to listen to this (again), and in better sound quality than the first time.


End of commercial.

[John Whitmore]

Just compared the opening of No. 10 - the Unicorn Kanchana CD sounds tinny and hoarse, the new restoration dark and warm, like I remember from the LP. Good work!

Glad you like it. The "official" CD never worked did it? Made the orchestra sound dessicated. I use mine as a drinks coaster.

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Who do you think you are, Brian...the Havergal Brian of critics?...this review your Gothic? You need an editor, boy 

Sarge

[Dundonnell]

Good to read Luke's quotations from Mark Morris's Dictionary of Twentieth Century Composers, a quite excellent book which has been a standby for me for many years. Morris's judgments are almost unvaryingly accute and sound with the exceptions, for me, of his damning criticisms of the music of Malcolm Arnold and Robert Simpson

[John Whitmore]

Good to read Luke's quotations from Mark Morris's Dictionary of Twentieth Century Composers, a quite excellent book which has been a standby for me for many years. Morris's judgments are almost unvaryingly accute and sound with the exceptions, for me, of his damning criticisms of the music of Malcolm Arnold and Robert Simpson

Both wonderful composers in their different ways. There's nothing Malcolm didn't know about the orchestra. Nothing. He wrote finished works. not reworked sketches. Truly remarkable. As for Simmo - his 9th is just about beyond criticism. I love his sound world. I would like to hear Mr. Morris's music. Did he write any?

[cilgwyn]

If Mark Morris likes Havergal Brian & you like his book,Dundonnell, he must be worth picking up! I remember you're quote (from his book) about Mathias,and much as I like some of his music & am,even impressed by some of it,I have some sympathy for his viewpoint. Shame about Malcolm Arnold,'the Great Misunderstood!' I recently collected the Naxos cycle,which I hadn't heard. I am now completely won over. A tremendous cycle! Marvellous! In hindsight,Arnolds own,endearing,but self indulgent recordings (particularly the fourth) didn't help!
Anyway,back to Brian!

[Dundonnell]

If Mark Morris likes Havergal Brian & you like his book,Dundonnell, he must be worth picking up! I remember you're quote (from his book) about Mathias,and much as I like some of his music & am,even impressed by some of it,I have some sympathy for his viewpoint. Shame about Malcolm Arnold,'the Great Misunderstood!' I recently collected the Naxos cycle,which I hadn't heard. I am now completely won over. A tremendous cycle! In hindsight,Arnolds own endearing,but self indulgent recordings (particularly the fourth) didn't help!!!
Anyway,back to Brian!

".....back to Brian!"

I was under the impression that this was an all-encompassing stream of consciousness thread which has (and probably will continue to) incorporated discussion of a whole range of barely related topics, including, most recently, the comparative land masses of the county of Rutland and John's garden-the relevance of which to the music of Havergal Brian is so tenuous that it would need an extraordinarily astute detective to establish

[Sergeant Rock]

".....back to Brian!"

I was under the impression that this was an all-encompassing stream of consciousness thread which has (and probably will continue to) incorporated discussion of a whole range of barely related topics, including, most recently, the comparative land masses of the county of Rutland and John's garden-the relevance of which to the music of Havergal Brian is so tenuous that it would need an extraordinarily astute detective to establish

Hey, how about them Knicks? (Just trying to reestablish this thread as an all encompassing stream of consciousness thread  )

Sarge

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Well, Colin, I think this thread is very Brianic - just as Brian's music can veer off in unforeseen directions, so does this thread. But in the end, the music of Brian is always there. Or as the man himself said (about Delius...): plot is always with us.

[Dundonnell]

Well, Colin, I think this thread is very Brianic - just as Brian's music can veer off in unforeseen directions, so does this thread. But in the end, the music of Brian is always there. Or as the man himself said (about Delius...): plot is always with us.

So, if that is the case, am I at liberty to explore the apparent dichotomy between John's oft-expressed aversion to the music of Anton Bruckner-which he claims sends him to sleep-and his evident admiration for Robert Simpson's wonderful Symphony No.9 which is sometimes described as Simpson's most Brucknerian symphony and is certainly a tribute to the great Austrian composer?

[John Whitmore]

".....back to Brian!"

I was under the impression that this was an all-encompassing stream of consciousness thread which has (and probably will continue to) incorporated discussion of a whole range of barely related topics, including, most recently, the comparative land masses of the county of Rutland and John's garden-the relevance of which to the music of Havergal Brian is so tenuous that it would need an extraordinarily astute detective to establish

Rutland inspired Brian to write his Symphonia brevis after a round trip of the county that took him less than 15 minutes to complete. My garden is on a hill and during inclimate weather it brings The Restless Stream into sharp relief as water rushes down the slope onto the road at the bottom. These barely related topics, like much of Brian's writing, are more relevant to this forum than you first think. I've spent 4 whole days trying to get LP restorations launched in the USA. I've done my bit for good old HB. I need a drink. I'm turning Tippett off now. The footie beckons..........

[cilgwyn]

The way Arnold assimilates popular & classical idioms in his symphonies is truly astonishing. I think the only composer who did it as convincingly was Gershwin,who sadly kicked the bucket before he could try his hand at a symphony. The scandalously neglected Grant Still is another example. His Second & third symphonies might not have the 'pop' tunes,but they are arguably more subtle than some of the more populistic war horses that Gershwin wrote,much as I love 'em! (Porgy & Bess is on a different level,altogether!)
The 6th & 7th are astounding. Mahlerian anguish meets 'The Chieftains' in the latter!!!
Of course this isn't an Arnold thread,but like Brian,Arnold was misunderstood.
Brian was allot more philosophical about his 'neglect',though!

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

So, if that is the case, am I at liberty to explore the apparent dichotomy between John's oft-expressed aversion to the music of Anton Bruckner-which he claims sends him to sleep-and his evident admiration for Robert Simpson's wonderful Symphony No.9 which is sometimes described as Simpson's most Brucknerian symphony and is certainly a tribute to the great Austrian composer?

If you want to - yes, but only in a certain way.... Both Bruckner and Simpson have to do with Brian. And I can't understand liking the monumental architecture of Simpson's Ninth and not liking Bruckner neither! So, the different forms monumentality can take in symphonic music is worth a discussion (which John's mysterious dislike will then have sparked off).

[Sergeant Rock]

So, if that is the case, am I at liberty to explore the apparent dichotomy between John's oft-expressed aversion to the music of Anton Bruckner-which he claims sends him to sleep-and his evident admiration for Robert Simpson's wonderful Symphony No.9 which is sometimes described as Simpson's most Brucknerian symphony and is certainly a tribute to the great Austrian composer?

As a fellow Brucknerite, please do! 

And if you are actually taking cilgwyn's comment as some type of criticism, I'm sure he only meant the comment to reflect on his own off-topic jabber...which I appreciate, by the way...as much as I appreciate yours and John's jabber. Makes the thread interesting.

Sarge

[cilgwyn]

It depends how far you go off topic,doesn't it 'Sarge?' I mean if I start droning on about the price of baked beans!
But then of course,there is a possibility that Havergal Brian liked Baked Beans,so there could be a connection!

[Sergeant Rock]

It depends how far you go off topic,doesn't it 'Sarge?'

Well, yes. We don't want to drive it off a cliff. Might get messy.

Sarge

[cilgwyn]

And the consequences of Brian eating allot of baked beans while composing the Gothic symphony are too awful to think about!
Anyway,back to Arnold........I mean,Brian!

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

And the consequences of Brian eating allot of baked beans while composing the Gothic symphony are too awful to think about!

I thought of shouting 'Don't go there!' when you started about baked beans. O my prophetic soul! 

[Brian]

Who do you think you are, Brian...the Havergal Brian of critics?...this review your Gothic? You need an editor, boy 

Sarge

I put little bolded headers at the beginning of each section, and noted in the introduction that readers may skip about as desired. The first is a little statement on the future of the symphony, the second is an outline of what happens (for newcomers), the third discusses the performance, the fourth discusses what Hyperion's done for the release, and the fifth is a strongly worded hint to Chandos that they should call Brisbane and license the Curro Gothic.

[cilgwyn]

Indeed! Blazing Gothic!!! (Saddles)!!!