Headphones

[71 dB]

No kidding.  That is fake detail.  But there are differences in headphones with detail resolution that have NOTHING to do with treble.  Saying that it is just placebo is straight up BS.  If you can hear specific microdetail (like a creaking chair or someone coughing) in one headphone and not another and they have the same frequency response then one is just more detailed than the other.

What does mean same frequency response? No two headphones, even when the same model and brand has identical frequency responses and one headphone doesn't have the exact same response for both left and right channel. Moving headphones in head changes the frequency response drastically at higher frequencies. So you don't get the exact same frequency response the measurer got measuring a different pair with his/her gear and you get different responses every time you put the cans on your head. Headphones just can't just remove creaking chair sounds without some clear dips on frequency response or some other things. Possible explanation is the way the headphones sits on YOUR head causing some specific pinna reflections with YOUR ears causing hearing some narrow frequency bands boosted or attenuated causing differencies in hearing things you mentioned. Or it can be something as trivial as the headphone model pre-conditioning you to pay more attention to certain things: You believe you hear more "detail" so you pay attention to chair creaks instead of the music thinking that's the detail other headphones "lack." Can you be even sure you have level-matched the headphones when you compare them?

[DavidW]

I yet have to bring my Sennheiser 650 to the repair shop (no signal on the left side). In the past couple of months I've been listening with Grado SR125, cheaper but decent open air headphones. The sound is much different, airier, acoustically less blended. The treble response is quite high. That makes some recordings rather glaring and tiring to listen to. Typically I take the sound level one or two notches down, otherwise it's blasty. I have better hearing on my left ear than the right - always have. That difference seems more noticeable on the Grados than the Sennheisers. These are not subjective impressions.

When I had Sennheiser repair my 580s back in the day it took them the better part of a month before I got them back.  You might want to get those in ASAP.  I like bright headphones but those Grados are known for being (and measuring) high on the treble, borderline sibilant.  So I'm with MI on that.  Don't tell a Grado headphone fan though, they'll go nuts!

[André]

I've had Grados in the past, but a higher end product. Really liked them. I agree w your description (borderline sibilant), although this is more apparent on older recordings like that 1967 Melodiya I was listening to this morning. The Grados do this type of engineering no favour. I picked this one because it was cheapo (200$) and just for a short time. I'll bring the Senns to the shop Friday  .

[Brahmsian]

I know virtually nothing at all about headphones.I am looking for a pair of headphones with the following in order of importance.

1 - Comfort fit is of utmost importance.  I seem to have sensitive ears, whether it is earbuds, larger ear muff phones, ear plugs.  My ears can't seem to handle headphones for lengthy periods of time.  Something that is more clothlike, rather than leather, and not enclosing around the ears (not enveloping around the ears) would be ideal.  Of course, I think I will go into a store to check this out first hand.  Long and McQuade in Winnipeg, likely.

2 - I would say my budget is maximum around $300 CDN.  Ideally, a bit lower price than that, but I can a little bit more flexible on cost.

3 - Quality, of course.

Any recommendations based on my criteria before I go in store browsing are appreciated. 

[DavidW]

Sennheiser 560s fit the bill for comfort and are fairly neutral but a little bit oddly colored.

AKG k612pro are the most neutral akg headphones and they are very comfortable excepting the headband which has bumps on the top.  I can't feel it but some really can.

Audio-Technica ad700x are bright, with exceptional soundstage and imagining but are bass anemic.  Depending on your head these are either the most comfortable headphones you could possibly own or completely unbearable.  It depends on how it sits on your head.  If they slide down and your ears have to take the weight (like they do for me) it is awful, but if it doesn't happen many find them to be AMAZINGLY comfortable.

These are the most comfortable audiophile quality headphones I know of in your price bracket.  Unfortunately either your dollar is weak or electronics are painfully overpriced in Canada because you should be able to get much better than that.

[Brahmsian]

Sennheiser 560s fit the bill for comfort and are fairly neutral but a little bit oddly colored.

AKG k612pro are the most neutral akg headphones and they are very comfortable excepting the headband which has bumps on the top.  I can't feel it but some really can.

Audio-Technica ad700x are bright, with exceptional soundstage and imagining but are bass anemic.  Depending on your head these are either the most comfortable headphones you could possibly own or completely unbearable.  It depends on how it sits on your head.  If they slide down and your ears have to take the weight (like they do for me) it is awful, but if it doesn't happen many find them to be AMAZINGLY comfortable.

These are the most comfortable audiophile quality headphones I know of in your price bracket.  Unfortunately either your dollar is weak or electronics are painfully overpriced in Canada because you should be able to get much better than that.

Thanks David.  Appreciate the feedback! 

[drogulus]

     My now ancient HD 280 Pro phones are falling apart. I bought them in 2009 and I'm a little surprised to see they still show up on best lists for closed back phones.

     This time, though, I went with the Beyerdynamic DT 770 Pro phones (80 ohms). I'm impressed with the detail they deliver.
     

[DavidW]

Ernie I have those headphones, they are great (dt770s)!

[Holden]

     My now ancient HD 280 Pro phones are falling apart. I bought them in 2009 and I'm a little surprised to see they still show up on best lists for closed back phones.

     This time, though, I went with the Beyerdynamic DT 770 Pro phones (80 ohms). I'm impressed with the detail they deliver.
   

When driven properly, the HD280s are a great sounding headphone and almost truly neutral. They are the phones of choice of many recording engineers and DJs. What's more, Sennheiser recently upgraded it making it more comfortable but not altering the sound signature.

One caveat about the increased detail of the DT770s. Quite often, increased detail is the result of boosted treble. Unless you are a treble fan this can result in listening fatigue. I've not heard the Beyers so couldn't say if this was the case or not but reviews suggest that they are quite well balanced.

A couple of questions:
Did you get the 80ohm or 250 ohm model?
Are you running these through a headphone amp?

[drogulus]

When driven properly, the HD280s are a great sounding headphone and almost truly neutral. They are the phones of choice of many recording engineers and DJs. What's more, Sennheiser recently upgraded it making it more comfortable but not altering the sound signature.

One caveat about the increased detail of the DT770s. Quite often, increased detail is the result of boosted treble. Unless you are a treble fan this can result in listening fatigue. I've not heard the Beyers so couldn't say if this was the case or not but reviews suggest that they are quite well balanced.

A couple of questions:
Did you get the 80ohm or 250 ohm model?
Are you running these through a headphone amp?

     These are the 80 ohm cans, which are not supposed to require an amp. I don't have one, so I can't run a test. One of the audio outs on my PC has more drive than the other, but I haven't really explored whether that amounts to a loss of quality or just a volume difference. I may decide to throw some money at a little portable amp to play with.

     AudioQuest - DragonFly Red USB DAC/Headphone Amplifier

     

[DavidW]

I find that all Beyers benefit from an amp due to their low sensitivity.  That DragonFly Red can drive your headphones with authority (I own it) and doesn't take up as much space as a desktop amp.  If you already have a dac and just need the amp, I highly recommend the JDS Atom which can drive anything you can throw at it and is much cheaper.

[drogulus]

I find that all Beyers benefit from an amp due to their low sensitivity.  That DragonFly Red can drive your headphones with authority (I own it) and doesn't take up as much space as a desktop amp.  If you already have a dac and just need the amp, I highly recommend the JDS Atom which can drive anything you can throw at it and is much cheaper.

     All I have is my PC audio out (the strong one) and the out on my cheapo Logitech speakers. So a USB DAC/amp is just the thing. Money is not much of an object. The Dragonfly Red gets good reviews from Wirecutter, not an especially audiophile site but still something I take into account.

[staxomega]

As an owner of hifiman headphones I can attest to planar dynamics resolving more detail at least in the mids and treble than traditional dynamic headphones.  But... what you should know is that planar dynamics can be well... heavy.  I mean physically heavy.  Those Audeze cans don't look that big though so hopefully they will be comfortable.

Dynamic drivers like the Focal Utopia (beryllium, same stuff in their high resolution tweeters) or the one that ring radiator that Sennheiser HD800 use can have really good resolution. My issue with the latter is the frequency response though. Focal had an awful anti-consumer warranty practice when I was still using headphones so I never bothered with them as much as I liked the sound.

[Holden]

     These are the 80 ohm cans, which are not supposed to require an amp. I don't have one, so I can't run a test. One of the audio outs on my PC has more drive than the other, but I haven't really explored whether that amounts to a loss of quality or just a volume difference. I may decide to throw some money at a little portable amp to play with.

     AudioQuest - DragonFly Red USB DAC/Headphone Amplifier

     

To my way of thinking, 80 ohms would benefit from amplification. The HD280s were only 64 ohms and just came alive with a DAC/amp. The beauty of the Dragonfly is it's portability and it gets good reviews.

[DavidW]

Dynamic drivers like the Focal Utopia (beryllium, same stuff in their high resolution tweeters) or the one that ring radiator that Sennheiser HD800 use can have really good resolution. My issue with the latter is the frequency response though. Focal had an awful anti-consumer warranty practice when I was still using headphones so I never bothered with them as much as I liked the sound.

I almost bought some Focals a year ago, now I'm glad that I didn't from what you're saying about their warranty. 

[staxomega]

I almost bought some Focals a year ago, now I'm glad that I didn't from what you're saying about their warranty.

They rectified this after the rather large amount of backlash they received. Basically they weren't repairing sets that were purchased second hand, baffling how they got away with this being a company located in the EU.

[DavidW]

They rectified this after the rather large amount of backlash they received. Basically they weren't repairing sets that were purchased second hand, baffling how they got away with this being a company located in the EU.

Yeah I was going to buy it second hand.  But good to know they walked it back.

[Rinaldo]

I find that all Beyers benefit from an amp due to their low sensitivity.

Just a late +1 to this. I've recently acquired a vintage Toshiba amp, tried plugging in my DT 990 Pros that have been serving me well for eleven years and whoa, it was like buying a new set of cans from a higher price tier. I almost felt guilty for not feeding them properly for so long.

[Holden]

Just a late +1 to this. I've recently acquired a vintage Toshiba amp, tried plugging in my DT 990 Pros that have been serving me well for eleven years and whoa, it was like buying a new set of cans from a higher price tier. I almost felt guilty for not feeding them properly for so long.

You can probably get an even better result by buying a dedicated headphone amp. Nowadays they can be acquired very cheaply.

Glad you're enjoying the upgrade in sound.

[DavidW]

Sennheiser is releasing a new headphone.  The 660s2.  They promise better bass extension.  It also looks like they worked on taming the shouty mids and offering better treble extension as compared to the previous 6 series headphones.

I'm really happy with my dt1990s, but thought I would let everyone know.  I was disappointed with the original 660s, which didn't do enough especially to justify the original price point ($450-500 if I recall).

These new headphones will be priced at $600. Since the original 660s is now priced at $300, if this is an incremental improvement it really makes for a lousy deal.  The massdrop 6xx headphones are still available and are priced at $240.