Roll over, Beethoven? Formal wear, red velvet, and Mozart concerti? Geez louise!

[owlice]

Other than the title of the thread, I am refraining from comment on this article from the Washington Post:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/10/13/AR2009101303565_pf.html

Well, I will say that I heard Time for Three in the Higdon work mentioned; comments about it are on the concert thread.

[Franco]

This isn't some lunatic fringe of experimentalism. The spirit of these groups is permeating, and invigorating, the whole classical music world. Armando Bayolo, who founded the Great Noise Ensemble through the abovementioned Craigslist announcement, knows his model: "I really feel groups like Alarm Will Sound and eighth blackbird represent the future of classical music."

It could, and would not be a bad thing, IMO.  There is nothing wrong with classically trained musicians using available technology to make music in the classical tradition.  This is good, and is a way to avoid the music and musicians being relegated to museum status.  OTOH, it could easily become trite and commercialized if not done with the same high standards as has been applied in the past.

There are two main aspects of the alt-classical idea. On the one hand, it represents an attempt to break down the traditional concert format, which can seem stiff and off-putting to the younger crowd whom all musicians these days would like to attract.

[...]

But the second main point about alt-classical groups is that they are increasingly featured on mainstream, traditional concert series and orchestra programs.

I don't have a problem with any of this - as long as it remains classical music and does not merge with other kinds of "art-pop".  There is nothing intrinsically wrong with fashioning a method to deliver high quality music to people who have grown up with a distorted image of classical music as old-fashioned, stodgy and boring.  But again, the danger is in changing the standards in order to attract a younger crowd.

If the goal is to bring more people to appreciate classical music, you have to deliver real classical music, otherwise you are not attracting people to classical music but away from it and towards just another kind of pop music.

[karlhenning]

Paging Yo Yo Ma . . . .

[Josquin des Prez]

If the goal is to bring more people to appreciate classical music, you have to deliver real classical music, otherwise you are not attracting people to classical music but away from it and towards just another kind of pop music.

Wow, something that actually makes sense, being posted in this forum.

[karlhenning]

No one would suspect that you keep your snide in practice at all; it just flows so naturally from your withered soul.

[snyprrr]

ah yes, the morning paper (the Post) greeted me this morning with that article. I read half before I realized that they're just doing what you all think they're doing... selling out! I've read articles like this before. It's like when they say, "It's for the children." FUCK THE CHILDREN!!!!

Dear Classical Musicians,
        You are allowed to wear something other than a tux, as long as it is black and slinky and sexy. You are also allowed to play somewhere other than the Kennedy Center. However, this is ALL you're allowed to change. Please don't think you're being "hip" or anything, when you play CROSSOVER music, yes, Virginia, it's called crossover, and Yanni is your god.

btw- YoYo Ma is one of the most awful (aggregious?) exponents of this crossover cum classical crap.



yea, this is one of those topics that makes dishes fly across the room! Fuck yer hip shit, you sell outs.

SELL OUTS

[Brian]

That's cool for them.

I don't listen to that kind of music, but whatever.

[karlhenning]

Heck, it's just another clique I don't belong to 

[CD]

Me, Lethe, Brian, Renfield and several others are proof that classical music is attractive to young people.

... young people with taste, that is.  

"Alt-classical" just sounds pandering. I really dislike this sort of thing.  It just seems to attract people intrigued by the image rather than people actually interested in the music — but hey, if a few of those hipsters finally decide to feel the music beyond liking the mere idea of liking the music, good for them.

[owlice]

Ah, maybe I will comment....

I don't have a problem with Time for Three, Bang-on-a-Can, etc. Music benefits from exploration; always has.

What I found problematic was the tone of the article and the stereotypes, about classical music and its listeners, that the author of the article -- a well-known classical reviewer -- is validating! Beethoven doesn't need to roll over; he explored, too.

Sheeeesh. With friends like that......!

[Opus106]

but hey, if a few of those hipsters finally decide to feel the music beyond liking the mere idea of liking the music, good for them.

[I did the bolding thing.]

Ahem... I believe that word has a different meaning in these parts. Although we do prefer the HIP to be written in capitals.

[CD]

[I did the bolding thing.]

Ahem... I believe that word has a different meaning in these parts. Although we do prefer the HIP to be written in capitals.

"toe-may-toe", "toe-mah-toe" 

[Opus106]

To-may-toe!

[ChamberNut]

Me, Lethe, Brian, Renfield and several others are proof that classical music is attractive to young people.

... young people with taste, that is.  

"Alt-classical" just sounds pandering. I really dislike this sort of thing.  It just seems to attract people intrigued by the image rather than people actually interested in the music — but hey, if a few of those hipsters finally decide to feel the music beyond liking the mere idea of liking the music, good for them.

Great comment, Corey!    They really don't give young people credit, do they?!

It's very condescending, actually.  To think that the only way you'll get young people interested in classical is with these 'fusions'.     It's like saying "If you eat your veggies and fruits, we'll give you some french fries, pop and chocolate bar"

At the symphony and chamber music concerts, I am seeing a lot of young people (ie. under 30) attending concerts.  Even more so than just a few years ago.

[ChamberNut]

To-may-toe!

ta-mah-ta

If you're from Boston. 

[Franco]

It's very condescending, actually.  To think that the only way you'll get young people interested in classical is with these 'fusions'.

But I don't think that is what this article is about, or what this scene is about.  There are simply people out there, musicians, composers, who wish to use the latest technology and a blending of styles to create a kind of classical music that is not obviously coming out of the tradition.

There is nothing wrong with this, and it does mean that this is the only approach to trying to interest new audiences in classical music.  It is just one thing that is going on that I find interesting, and other people as well, and sometimes produces some really good music.

[Sorin Eushayson]

This reminds me a bit of Tofurkey.  Hear me out here.  Come Thanksgiving I don't want Tofu, I want a thick, juicy bird!  Tofu is not Turkey and there can be no crossing over!!!  I have compiled this diagram to help:



I have submitted these findings to Scientific American - keep your eyes peeled! 

[DavidW]

Most of you don't get the point, you're clueless and reactionary about this topic.  This is NOT crossover.  This is something new, and it's not to sell albums, you just don't get it.  The entire face of classical music is changing!

The performers want to do something different.  That is not pandering.  It is a return to the baroque era style of playing where the performer is intended to be just as much a part of the compositional process as the composer.  This is also holding true the promise of Cage's philosophy that anything can be music.  It's an application of classical style to any other style of music found out in the world.  It's a great synthesis, and an evolution of classical music performance.

Performing the same canon of works is a decaying art, and there are only so many spots on a symphony orchestra to play the same stuff over and over.  Many musicians of the new generation are going down a different path.  This article is not the first to say it, I've heard it all over the radio.  The writing is on the walls, it's all changing.

That is why I started that other thread on current performance practice, because I feel that in many ways everything is changing now, we are at the cusp of something vastly different from what we had before.  We might be ignoring it for the comfort of our delightful cd collections, and we need to get a finger back on the pulse.

[Josquin des Prez]

Performing the same canon of works is a decaying art

Then produce something new that is equally worthwhile.

[DavidW]

Then produce something new that is equally worthwhile.

Carter does.