Mahler's Symphony No. 1 D Major

[DarkAngel]

Can't go wrong with these, $5 each at Amazon USA

[suzyq]

Thanks and the price is right.

[DarkAngel]

Thanks and the price is right.

Be careful, these can be gateways that may lure you into buying the complete sets 

 

[springrite]

Be careful, these can be gateways that may lure you into buying the complete sets 

 

As it should!

[not edward]

Another vote for Kubelik (though I've only heard the DG studio one; so I can't comment on the merits of the oop 1954 recording or the Audite live issue).

[Brian]

Kubelik ... Audite live issue

Totally spectacular first note to last, sounds like it was recorded yesterday. I'm in love with it. I have Lenny/DG too but I don't listen to it. But take my advice with a grain of salt; those are my only Mahler discs, at all.

[Dana]

I very much like Zubin Mehta's account here - and it's availabe for only $1.90 with little to no risk of addiction

[MishaK]

One more vote for Kubelik!

Though if you liked Dudamel - and his is a very idiosyncratic, yet very compelling interpretation, I find - the recording of the LAPO opening night performance is available as a download at the DG webstore.

[Verena]

Can you recommend a cd of Mahler's Symphony No. 1 D Major - I've just seen a DVD Gustavo Dudamel was the conductor at the opening of the new hall in Los Angeles.

Not a CD, but a great interpretation if you don't mind dated sound - and available for free legal (at least in my country) download as an LP transfer is Bruno Walter's first interpretation of this work:
http://themusicparlour.blogspot.com/2010/06/bruno-walter-new-york-mahler-1st-cbs_12.html

It was once available on CD, but is OOP now. Due to its age, it is certainly not the only "one" recording one should own as a Mahlerite, but it nicely complements more recent interpretations. There is a somewhat later recording by Walter which is also very beautiful, but again, not in modern sound.

[Drasko]

Not a CD, but a great interpretation if you don't mind dated sound - and available for free legal (at least in my country) download as an LP transfer is Bruno Walter's first interpretation of this work:
http://themusicparlour.blogspot.com/2010/06/bruno-walter-new-york-mahler-1st-cbs_12.html

It was once available on CD, but is OOP now. Due to its age, it is certainly not the only "one" recording one should own as a Mahlerite, but it nicely complements more recent interpretations. There is a somewhat later recording by Walter which is also very beautiful, but again, not in modern sound.

Thanks very much for this. I've been wanting to hear Walter's 1954 New York recording for some time. I have Walter's live 1947 Concertgebouw recording on Tahra, performance is fantastic but the broadcast sound is somewhat limited, and I have his stereo Columbia recording, again very good performance and in good sound but this time is orchestra somewhat limited in numbers. I'm curious where this one falls interpretatively, it's oft mentioned that Walter slowed down and mellowed in his last years, but even though the live one is more exciting and some Mengelbergian feel in the orchestra is evident, tempos in this instance are pretty much identical in 47 and 60.

[Que]

I have Walter's live 1947 Concertgebouw recording on Tahra, performance is fantastic but the broadcast sound is somewhat limited,

I love that recording! Probably my favourite Mahler-I at the moment. And to my standards the recording is pretty good, for its age of course. But then I also listen to pre-war recordings.

Q

[Drasko]

Probably my favourite Mahler-I at the moment. And to my standards the recording is pretty good, for its age of course.

I agree, on both counts.

Is anyone familiar with Mitropoulos' several live recordings from New York? I have, and like very much his Minneapolis recording, but am unfamiliar with any of the later. How many are there - 1951 on Dynamic, 1955 on Archipel, 1960 on M&A ... and which is best played/recorded?

[Verena]

Thanks very much for this. I've been wanting to hear Walter's 1954 New York recording for some time. I have Walter's live 1947 Concertgebouw recording on Tahra, performance is fantastic but the broadcast sound is somewhat limited, and I have his stereo Columbia recording, again very good performance and in good sound but this time is orchestra somewhat limited in numbers. I'm curious where this one falls interpretatively, it's oft mentioned that Walter slowed down and mellowed in his last years, but even though the live one is more exciting and some Mengelbergian feel in the orchestra is evident, tempos in this instance are pretty much identical in 47 and 60.

You're welcome. I did not know about the Tahra recording, but there are at least two further recordings of Mahler 1 by Walter. One is available on Orfeo. There is also a Walter Mahler 1 available on Testament (LPO, Royal Albert Hall - 6 November 1947). I sometimes feel tempted to buy one of those two recordings.

[mjwal]

Drasko, I have one Mitropoulos #1 with the NYPO, but it's one of those Eurotrash CDs you find at French markets where I live in the summer, and includes Borodin #2 as well. I just put on the last movement to remind myself - it's wild and the sound is vivid if a bit crude, typical of those Mahler performances he did in the later 50s with the NYPO, I would say: I have #3 (on CD, mangled by cuts and sung in English, unfortunately), #5 and #9 (LP). His #5 is still my favourite, I love #9 too. But  I can't tell you if it's '55 or 60 - it sounds more like the latter to my ears.

[Drasko]

Drasko, I have one Mitropoulos #1 with the NYPO, but it's one of those Eurotrash CDs you find at French markets where I live in the summer, and includes Borodin #2 as well. I just put on the last movement to remind myself - it's wild and the sound is vivid if a bit crude, typical of those Mahler performances he did in the later 50s with the NYPO, I would say: I have #3 (on CD, mangled by cuts and sung in English, unfortunately), #5 and #9 (LP). His #5 is still my favourite, I love #9 too. But  I can't tell you if it's '55 or 60 - it sounds more like the latter to my ears.

Of Mitropoulos' Mahler I have Minneapolis 1st, Köln 3rd on Tahra (uncut, sung in German in decent sound, relatively uneventful performance) and Köln 6th on EMI Great Conductors. I was asking about his later 1sts because I noticed there are few around:


1960, New York (M&A oop)


1951, New York (Dynamic)


1955, New York (Archipel)
I couldn't find absolutely no info on this one. On another newsgroup somebody posted that Bruno Walter's live 1954 New York recording (not the studio one mentioned few posts above) used to be misattributed and released on LP as alleged 1955 Mitropoulos recording. So the one above on Archipel could be just that.

[ccar]

I was asking about his later 1sts because I noticed there are few around:

1960, New York (M&A oop)

1951, New York (Dynamic)

1955, New York (Archipel)
I couldn't find absolutely no info on this one. On another newsgroup somebody posted that Bruno Walter's live 1954 New York recording (not the studio one mentioned few posts above) used to be misattributed and released on LP as alleged 1955 Mitropoulos recording. So the one above on Archipel could be just that.

The Bruno Walter 1954 NYP was issued as CD in the CBS/Sony Masterworks Heritage series.

I also have the Archipel 1955 Mitropoulos. The notes indicate "New York Philarmonic Orchestra - Live recording: New York June 15, 1955". I am not certain this is the correct date because the "closing concert" of the NYP 1955 season was on 17 April. But it could be an off-season performance.

Perhaps someone can confirm if this June 1955 concert did happen (maybe a reference in The New York Times ?) and if this is a plausible date for the recording. I will try to take some time to compare it with the 1954 Bruno Walter and with the other Mitropoulos' Mahler 1sts. At least to recognize his hand in the conducting. If others in the Forum are willing to do the same listening exercise we may then compare our impressions.

[Drasko]

Perhaps someone can confirm if this June 1955 concert did happen (maybe a reference in The New York Times ?) and if this is a plausible date for the recording.

I posted question about this on r.m.c.r and the first reply was the following:

According to the Philharmonic repertoire listing in Howard Shanet's
"Philharmonic -- A History of New York's Orchestra" (Doubleday, 1975),
there was no Philharmonic performance of anything on June 15, 1955.
And Mahler's First Symphony wasn't played by the Philharmonic in
either the 1954-5 or 1955-6 seasons.

So the date seems to be definitely fake.

[ccar]

So the date seems to be definitely fake.

Thanks Drasko.

With the NYP records information and a recent rmcr post from Steve Reveyoso (who worked with Eric Ryding - BW's biographer - in the BW discography) I believe we may conclude the Archipel "Mitropoulos 1955" recording is indeed miscredited.  The source of the Mahler 1st "Mitropoulos NYP 1955" (and a "Bruno Walter NYP 1950") is probably Bruno Walter's 24th Jan 1954 NYP broadcast, just the day before the Columbia "official" recording. 

To keep it straight I now tried to relist my BW and DM Mahler First recordings accordingly:
 
    Dimitri Mitropoulos : 1940 – Minneapolis SO – Columbia / 1951 – NYP – live / 1960 – NYP – live

    Bruno Walter : 1939 – NBC – live / 1947 – CGO – live / 1947 – LPO – live / 1950 – BSO – live / 1954 – NYP – live / 1954 – NYP –                 Columbia /1961- CSO - Columbia

[Drasko]

Yes, I believe we may (as far as conclusions without hearing the actual recording go - in my case). Beside the info given by Don Tait and Steve Reveyoso, the timings of that alleged Mitropoulos '55 recording (as given by amazon download service) are much more in line with Walter's than other Mitropoulos' recordings of the piece, especially in 1st movement (as I already posted on rmcr).

You have a typo there in Walter listings - 1954 not 56 for NYP recordings.

I think we've done some fine detective work on this one 

[ccar]

Thanks for the typo correction Drasko - I just edited the post with the right dates.

I have no way of listening to a "certified" recording of the BW 1954 broadcast. But I did some comparative listening. The Archipel "Mitropoulos NYP 1955" = Bruno Walter NYP 1954 broadcast and the Bruno Walter NYP 1954 studio recording obviously have different sound conditions and some  differences in tempo and dynamics. But the A/B listening does suggest the same orchestra, similar instrument solos and interpretation details.

It is much more difficult to compare the "Mitropoulos NYP 1955" with the other BW or DM recordings because there are various orchestras and years of difference between them. But when we try to compare Dimitri Mitropoulos with the 1930-1950's Bruno Walter not only the global timings tend to be different (particularly in the longer DM 1st and 4th movements) but, for me, Mitropoulos has more freedom in the phrasing, colors and dynamics, creating his usual unexpected "expressive moments". Curiously, in the last Bruno Walter recording (CSO stereo 1961) the timings are much closer to Mitropoulos than in his earlier versions.     
   
For those who care to compare them, here are the timings of these recordings (each movement - without spacing intervals or applause):

Bruno Walter NYP 1954 broadcast - 11:50 / 6:00 / 11:06 / 17:53 ("Mitropoulos NYP 1955" )
Bruno Walter NBC 1939 – 11:54 / 6:09 / 11:16 / 18:03
Bruno Walter CGO 1947 - 12:12 / 6:04 / 11:23 / 18:48
Bruno Walter LPO 1947 – 11:28 / 5:51 / 10:36 / 17:21
Bruno Walter BSO 1950 – 12:01 / 6:13 / 11:17 / 18:39   
Bruno Walter NYP 1954 studio – 12:30 / 6:20 / 11:15 / 18:14
Bruno Walter CSO 1961 studio – 13:17 / 6:48 / 11:18 / 20:19
Mitropoulos MSO 1940 studio – 13:30 / 6:11 / 10:24 / 17:17
Mitropoulos NYP 1951 – 14:12 / 6:18 / 11:08 / 19:22 
Mitropoulos NYP 1960 – 14:14 / 6:25 / 10:41 / 19:48