Nørgård's Niche

[kentel]

I announced it here above in this thread, and subsequently reviewed it at Amazon. I found it a disappointment, unfortunately.

I don't know if I will agree, but I like the style of your comment : rigorous, well-argued and clear.

"But it pains me to say that this particular recording of "Helle Nacht" is a disappointment. The piece here appears in an arrangement for chamber orchestra, and it lacks the power of the original. Gupta's pacing is sluggish and any sense of forward momentum is lost. "Helle Nacht" is best heard on a Chandos disc in the original version, with a conductor and ensemble who really know what they are doing.

that's actually what I wanted to know. Thanks.

[kentel]

Oh, he wrote something positive? That's a first.

I'm lucky, it's the first time that I read one of his comments 

[Mirror Image]

I'm lucky, it's the first time that I read one of his comments 

You should read many of his Amazon reviews. Some of them, especially his Rautavaara reviews continue to baffle me. Usually someone will state they don't like x composer's music, but the problem with Mr. Culver is he continues to write essentially the same review over and over again about how he doesn't like Rautavaara's music. It's like this: WE GET THE POINT!!! Anyway, I just think he would save himself and everybody a lot time by just sticking to writing reviews about music he actually likes.

[kentel]

You should read many of his Amazon reviews. Some of them, especially his Rautavaara reviews continue to baffle me. Usually someone will state they don't like x composer's music, but the problem with Mr. Culver is he continues to write essentially the same review over and over again about how he doesn't like Rautavaara's music. It's like this: WE GET THE POINT!!! Anyway, I just think he would save himself and everybody a lot time by just sticking to writing reviews about music he actually likes.

I happen to enjoy Rautavaara's music (not everything, but much of it) : I think I'll read these reviews, it's always interesting to read contrary opinions 

[CRCulver]

I've read a lot of your reviews. It takes a lot to make you happy apparently. I don't even understand why you write some of the reviews you did when it's clear that you never liked the music to begin with?

What a strange complaint. The vast majority of my reviews are three stars and above. The review I wrote for the aforementioned Norgard disc said the material was excellent but the performances were inferior to others available elsewhere. That's pretty typical of classical reviewing on Amazon.

[Mirror Image]

I happen to enjoy Rautavaara's music (not everything, but much of it) : I think I'll read these reviews, it's always interesting to read contrary opinions 

It's not that I don't mind Mr. Culver writing negative reviews, it's just that the ones he's written on Rautavaara, which is many of them by the way, seem to be completely jaded by the fact that it's clear that he doesn't like his music and he pretty much let's the reader know from the beginning.

[CRCulver]

It's not that I don't mind Mr. Culver writing negative reviews, it's just that the ones he's written on Rautavaara, which is many of them by the way, seem to be completely jaded by the fact that it's clear that he doesn't like his music and he pretty much let's the reader know from the beginning.

You seem to be ignoring the many positive comments I've made about Rautavaara's music. The negative reviews are generally for post-1980 works that have appalled much of the composer's public here in Finland too. For works before that, I've noted that quite are few are entertaining.

Anyway, I just think he would save himself and everybody a lot time by just sticking to writing reviews about music he actually likes.

If people only wrote reviews about music they actually like, all Amazon reviews would be positive, and then the review system would be useless. Of course, I don't write reviews with much of an aim towards guiding other shoppers (except for a non-existent ideal reader who has exactly the same taste as mine). But over the years my Rautavaara reviews have provoked some e-mails by people who 1) upon pirating the music and hearing it for free, were grateful to my reviews for saving them a purchase, or 2) amassed a collection, eventually came to regret it, and then told me I was right all along and now don't know what to do with so many discs.

[Mirror Image]

You seem to be ignoring the many positive comments I've made about Rautavaara's music.

If people only wrote reviews about music they actually like, all Amazon reviews would be positive, and then the review system would be useless. Of course, I don't write reviews with much of an aim towards guiding other shoppers (except for a non-existent ideal reader who has exactly the same taste as mine). But over the years my Rautavaara reviews have provoked some e-mails by people who 1) upon pirating the music and hearing it for free, were grateful to my reviews for saving them a purchase, or 2) amassed a collection, eventually came to regret it, and then told me I was right all along and now don't know what to do with so many discs.

Blah...blah...blah....yeah you're right and we're all wrong. Your reviews are just one giant ego trip gone haywire.

[CRCulver]

Blah...blah...blah....yeah you're right and we're all wrong. Your reviews are just one giant ego trip gone haywire.

I don't see how saying that some people agree with me equates to a claim that everyone besides me is all wrong. For nearly any of the classical reviewers on Amazon (or any of the other reviews websites or periodicals), they have some sympathetic public and others who don't agree.

[Ataraxia]

I don't see how saying that some people agree with me equates to a claim that everyone besides me is all wrong. For nearly any of the classical reviews on Amazon (or any of the other reviews websites or periodicals), they have some sympathetic public and others who don't agree.

Your reviews look fine to me. Keep up the good work.

[Mirror Image]

I don't see how saying that some people agree with me means that everyone besides me is all wrong. For nearly any of the classical reviews on Amazon, they have some sympathetic public.

Your demeanor on Amazon, which you confirmed today on this thread as well, comes across as pompous and self-righteous. Do you act this way in real life? Who knows.

[CRCulver]

Your demeanor on Amazon, which you confirmed today on this thread as well, comes across as pompous and self-righteous. Do you act this way in real life? Who knows.

I think you have some issues if another poster voicing his opinions on media that he consumes causes you to start ranting about an "ego trip" and "pompous and self-righteous demeanor". Maybe you should lay off this thread for a while and, I don't know, send hate mail to Classics Today or Fanfare for a change of pace.

[Mirror Image]

I think you have some issues if another poster voicing his opinions on media that he consumes causes you to start ranting about an "ego trip" and "pompous and self-righteous demeanor". Maybe you should lay off this thread for a while and, I don't know, send hate mail to Classics Today or Fanfare.

I only have problems with people who beat people over the head with their opinions, which you do on regular basis with your "reviews."

By the way, I have far less problems with Hurwitz's reviews than I do yours. At least with Hurwitz, I know what I'm getting. With your reviews, I don't know half the time whether you like the music or not, unless of course you're reviewing Rautavaara then your opinion is obvious.

[Mirror Image]

Anyway...back to Norgard.

[raduneo]

I love Norgard. One of the best contemporary composers, but not an easy one by any means! I love:

-Symphony 3
-Symphony 4 (the 1st movement an idyll, the 2nd movement hell, but each of the 2 movements has a bit of the other one in it, just like Yin and Yang. I forgot where I read this, but after reading this the symphony all of a sudden clicked for me!
-Symphony 6
-Symphony 7
-The Violin Concertos
-The 2 Harp Concertos
-The Piano Concerto (one of the best contemporary piano concertos hands down)
-Luna, Twilight
-Quartets 4,5 and 8

I am however having trouble with Symphony 5. I can hear how the "orchestra rises to the stratosphere" until the sound dissapears (like a tsunami), but the symphony as a whole doesn't click for me yet. HELP?

Also, I am dying to hear Symphony 8. I wonder how it is compared to his seventh!

[kentel]

I love Norgard. One of the best contemporary composers

YES !

but not an easy one by any means!

It depends : it's easier than Carter or Lutosławski for ex.

I love:

-Symphony 3
-Symphony 4 (the 1st movement an idyll, the 2nd movement hell, but each of the 2 movements has a bit of the other one in it, just like Yin and Yang. I forgot where I read this, but after reading this the symphony all of a sudden clicked for me!
-Symphony 6
-Symphony 7
-The Violin Concertos
-The 2 Harp Concertos
-The Piano Concerto (one of the best contemporary piano concertos hands down)
-Luna, Twilight
-Quartets 4,5 and 8

Very good selection ! I love all these pieces ! Just a little question : which harp concertos are you refering to ?

[lescamil]

Also, I am dying to hear Symphony 8. I wonder how it is compared to his seventh!

Wait, there's an 8th symphony???

[DieNacht]

Wait, there's an 8th symphony???

The 8th is mentioned in reply #115.


These drawings by Nørgård were made when he was 11 years old, for some early musical tales of his:



They can be found on the Nørgård website, which has recently been re-installed. It has a very detailed & interesting biography section, but stops around the year 2000.

http://www.pernoergaard.dk/index.html

[raduneo]

YES !


It depends : it's easier than Carter or Lutosławski for ex.



Very good selection ! I love all these pieces ! Just a little question : which harp concertos are you refering to ?

I am reffering to "Through Thorns" and "King, Queen, and Ace". Two pieces that I do not get are his first two Symphonies, and as I mentionned before his fifth, which for me is more difficult than anything Lutoslawski wrote. (by the way I LOVE both Carter and Lutoslawski)

[kentel]

I am reffering to "Through Thorns" and "King, Queen, and Ace".

That's what I thought, but they are not labelled "Harp Concertos" (actually I whish he wrote a real harp concerto...)

Two pieces that I do not get are his first two Symphonies, and as I mentionned before his fifth, which for me is more difficult than anything Lutoslawski wrote. (by the way I LOVE both Carter and Lutoslawski)

Good taste indeed !

Nørgård's Fifth is not the easiest thing to listen to, even in the context of his own production, but I don't find it excessively difficult. Keep trying !