Chez Stravinsky

Started by karlhenning, April 09, 2007, 08:24:18 AM

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snyprrr

It's a madhouse in this Thread. Every man for themselves!!

Who has made their first impulse buy?





snyprrr

Quote from: Crudblud on March 03, 2017, 03:34:09 PM
Rosbaud and Gielen do wonderful Agons. Both very different, but I would have a difficult time choosing between the two for my personal favourite.

I'll put in another recommendation for the Salonen recording of the Violin Concerto with Mullova. I couldn't really put into words what it is about this one in particular, but it feels like rhythmically, dynamically, in timbre, in overall sound, nothing is a hair out of place, and yet it is not at all mechanical. Total coherence. Where someone earlier said it was fluffy, I would say it is full of wit and invention.

Rosbaud has "characterful" sound whereas Gielen just has "great" sound ;D


You won me over to Mullova.


I'm curious if it's safe to disregard Venerov/Rosty, or not...???...



Stravinsky Listening Days are at fever pitch here. This Thread is HOT!! 8)

ritter

#862
Quote from: snyprrr on March 03, 2017, 03:19:16 PM
Is there a French CD Promo of the Boulez 'Dunbarton & Ebony & 8 Miniatures', that also includes all the random Chamber Music, such as the clarinet and viola pieces, the 'Epitaphium' and 'Double Canon'??? This has the white DG cover of a line drawing of Igor- same as the LP. I also duplicates in the DG Box, but was never released? With Ensemble Intercontemporain

any availability?


AFAIK, this album was only issued on CD (with this cover) in Japan (and I'm not 100% certain of that either to be honest). But the contents is available in the "Stravinsky Complete Edition" and the "Boulez conducts Stravinsky" boxes on DG. Dumbarton Oaks and the Ebony Concerto are avaialbale on an Originals issue along with the Berg Chamber concerto... A pity, because the cover is quite attractive, as was that of the original LP issue of the album with Stravinkys songs:


When transferred to CD, they used a plain cover (as usual with DG's "20th Century Classics" series  :( )

Karl Henning

Quote from: snyprrr on March 03, 2017, 09:01:07 PM
It's a madhouse in this Thread. Every man for themselves!!

Who has made their first impulse buy?

It's an album about which I have been curious forever, but this thread's revivification was the occasion for my fetching the download of the Eötvös recording of the two versions of Свадебка.
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Karl Henning

Quote from: Crudblud on March 03, 2017, 03:34:09 PM
Rosbaud and Gielen do wonderful Agons. Both very different, but I would have a difficult time choosing between the two for my personal favourite.

Quote from: Jeffrey Smith on March 03, 2017, 05:11:30 PM
Having listened the other day to Stravinsky's own recording (1957 LA Festival SO)--perhaps the sonics suffer by comparison, but the musicality itself is hard to beat.

Yes and yes.
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Mirror Image

Quote from: ritter on March 04, 2017, 12:45:00 AM

AFAIK, this album was only issued on CD (with this cover) in Japan (and I'm not 100% certain of that either to be honest). But the contents is available in the "Stravinsky Complete Edition" and the "Boulez conducts Stravinsky" boxes on DG. Dumbarton Oaks and the Ebony Concerto are avaialbale on an Originals issue along with the Berg Chamber concerto... A pity, because the cover is quite attractive, as was that of the original LP issue of the album with Stravinkys songs:


When transferred to CD, the used a plain covers (as usual with DG's "20th Century Classics" series)

Rafael, now I need to listen to Dumbarton Oaks and Ebony Concerto no thanks to you! ;) ;D But, seriously, those are fine Boulez performances. His Dumbarton Oaks may very well be my favorite performance of the work.

ritter

Quote from: Mirror Image on March 04, 2017, 04:53:02 AM
Rafael, now I need to listen to Dumbarton Oaks and Ebony Concerto no thanks to you! ;) ;D But, seriously, those are fine Boulez performances. His Dumbarton Oaks may very well be my favorite performance of the work.
Yep,  a great performance IMHO. The tempi are just right,, and that airiness I miss in the Erato Pulcinella is fully captured here. I couldn't now say which is my favourite performance of this wonderful work,  though. ..

Mirror Image

Quote from: ritter on March 04, 2017, 05:49:55 AM
Yep,  a great performance IMHO. The tempi are just right,, and that airiness I miss in the Erato Pulcinella is fully captured here. I couldn't now say which is my favourite performance of this wonderful work,  though. ..

Craft has a rather excellent Dumbarton Oaks that I'd rank highly along side of Boulez's.

James

My favorite for Agon (other than the composer's closely miked warts-n-all recording, and later featured on a great 3 disc set on Sony, Ballets Vol. II) .. is the Naxos disc, which features a great, great program. From start to finish a really strong 'album'. For chamber-oriented music, excellently performed, recorded, programmed .. the Decca twofer entitled "Chamber Works & Rarities" .. it includes "Dumbarton" and a broad variety of thoughtful & imaginative musical compositions.
Action is the only truth

snyprrr

Quote from: ritter on March 04, 2017, 12:45:00 AM

AFAIK, this album was only issued on CD (with this cover) in Japan (and I'm not 100% certain of that either to be honest). But the contents is available in the "Stravinsky Complete Edition" and the "Boulez conducts Stravinsky" boxes on DG. Dumbarton Oaks and the Ebony Concerto are avaialbale on an Originals issue along with the Berg Chamber concerto... A pity, because the cover is quite attractive, as was that of the original LP issue of the album with Stravinkys songs:


When transferred to CD, the used a plain covers (as usual with DG's "20th Century Classics" series)

I'm trying to avoid those DG Boxes, even though most of either are mandatory. This French/Japanese "Promo" has just those remaining items one desires but can only get in those Boxes. That "Songs" CD is also more expensive than I'd hoped, and I can't tell if only ArkivBurns are available...
Quote from: ritter on March 04, 2017, 05:49:55 AM
Yep,  a great performance IMHO. The tempi are just right,, and that airiness I miss in the Erato Pulcinella is fully captured here. I couldn't now say which is my favourite performance of this wonderful work,  though. ..

I enjoyed Boulez's 'Dumbarton' more than the Orpheus CE. I thought 'Shadow Dances' was going to be mandatory, but I'm not sure I like their glossy style. 'Octet' was the best thing I heard on their album, though the '2 Pieces' for SQ was more unbuttoned than the AlbanBergQ.

Quote from: James on March 04, 2017, 07:50:25 AM
My favorite for Agon (other than the composer's closely miked warts-n-all recording, and later featured on a great 3 disc set on Sony, Ballets Vol. II) .. is the Naxos disc, which features a great, great program. From start to finish a really strong 'album'. For chamber-oriented music, excellently performed, recorded, programmed .. the Decca twofer entitled "Chamber Works & Rarities" .. it includes "Dumbarton" and a broad variety of thoughtful & imaginative musical compositions.

I just did a survey of the Ragtime-Octet-Pastorale-Concertino with the Ashkenazy you mentioned (which I have), the Boston Symphony Chamber Players and the Orpheus. The BSCP trumped them all in charm (though, some reviewers don't like them at all), and the Orpheus really sound too L.A. in comparison- their 'Ragtime' was just awfully non-raggy, just listen to the BSCP in comparison. The Ashkenazy set definitely has a "European" feel to it whilst the BSCP have a much looser, "American jazzy" feel. Props to Chailly also in the 'Octet'.

As per the 2nd disc in that Decca set, I'm really coming around to Dutoit. I thought his Concerto in D is one of the most charming, and "right" (Marriner I liked the best; Karajan not-so-much). But, Dutoit's 'Dumbarton' is just a tweak slow in the 'Vivace' opening, which Boulez rectifies (Igor's "lugano" recording is waaay too fast).

The Dutoit disc with Apollo-Dumbarton-DConcertantes-ConcertoD - I'm am converted to his 'Apollo' now- anyhow, that's about a 1stChoice.


Heady times here, oy vey, my head spinning....



Anyhow- between Decca's 'Chamber Works & Rarities' and the MTT/RCA 'Stravinsky in Hollywood', you can at least get a wide wide sampling of Igor's lesser know works. The MTT especially has such a varied programme that it cancels out a lot of other buying options.



Marriner's LA Chamber LP has never fully been issued on NewMedia. His Concerto in D is the best I've heard so far.



snyprrr

hERE'S WHAT i HAD GOING IN:

1) 3 Symphonies: Igor/CBS

2) Crossley/Salonen Piano+Orchestra/SONY

3) 'Chamber Works & Rarities' Ashkenazy/Decca

4) Apollo+Orpheus    Lubbock/ASV

5) Apollo+Orpheus+Agon    Craft/Naxos

6) string quartets    AlbanBergQ/EMI

7) ;Hommage a Stravinsky      Schleiermacher+Friends/MDG (includes Berio, Carter, Boulez, Denisov...)

8) Concerto in D     Karajan/DG

9) 6 different 'Sacres' (not really for current purposes) but, includes Salonen's 'Symphony in 3 Mvmts', Inbal's '4 Etudes'.
    Colin Davis's 'Petrushka', and minor bits from Mackerras (Dorati/Decca, nIbal/Teldec, Salonen/SONY, Barenboim/Teldec,    Mackerras/CfP, Davis/Philips)

10) Complete Violin+Piano     Mustonen/van Keulen/Philips

11) Sonata+Serenade    Peter Serkin/NewWorld

12) Choral Music    Igor/SONY  (Threni....)

13) 'Stravinsky in Hollywood'    MTT/RCA







Here's the panic buying so far (I think I'm keeping it together pretty good so far)


1) 'The Flood/Variations'     Knussen/DG

2) Pulcinella+Jeu des Cartes       Abbado/DG

3) Piano Music (w/Bartok)      Ranki/Apex-Teldec



Here's what we're considering:

1) 'The Fairy's Kiss'     Knussen/DG

2) 'Le Chant du Rossignol'     either Dutoit or Chailly

3) 'Dumbaron Oaks-Ebony Concerto'       Boulez/DG French/Japanese Promo

4) 'Songs'    Boulez/DG   $$$ $$$

5) 2 Piano Music (w/Bartok)      Kontarsky/DG   $$$ $$$

6)



That pretty much catches me up (minus Operas, Les Noces). Then there's a few duplicates, such as Dutoit's 2 Symphonies (or Karajan), maybe Jarvi's 'Orpheus' (???), or whatnot....

I realized I don't have a 'Firebird', (listening to Rattle now), but I think I'd go for Dutoit first.

And, for current purposes, I was hoping to exclude 'Petrushka' but, all I have is Davis/Philips... maybe Boulez/SONY??...



nickle and dimin' me here.....

Mirror Image

Quote from: Draško on February 27, 2017, 03:48:20 PM


Reuss has been my long time favorite for vibrancy, crispness, precision, clarity, recording quality ...
Eotvos is still I believe the only recording of the 1917 version for full orchestra.
You could also get Rex Lawson on pianola, Stravinsky's transcription.

Of other recordings of standard version that I've heard Stravinsky's own is not that well played nor recorded, Craft's second (Naxos) is ok but not particularly memorable, Ancerl is very good but the recording shows a bit of age, Gergiev is manic, Currentzis I have but haven't listened to yet.

Actually, you forgot that Craft did indeed record BOTH versions of Les noces as found here:


Jo498

Quote from: snyprrr on March 04, 2017, 09:08:05 AM
5) 2 Piano Music (w/Bartok)      Kontarsky/DG   $$$ $$$
This can be had for 12 EUR "used - very good" at amazon.de, but the shipping will probably be expensive if they ship to the US at all...

A lot of this "20th century classics" DG series is worth getting but unfortunately while some can be found cheaply other have been long out of print or are very expensive.
Tout le malheur des hommes vient d'une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos, dans une chambre.
- Blaise Pascal

snyprrr

Quote from: Jo498 on March 05, 2017, 06:33:25 AM
This can be had for 12 EUR "used - very good" at amazon.de, but the shipping will probably be expensive if they ship to the US at all...

A lot of this "20th century classics" DG series is worth getting but unfortunately while some can be found cheaply other have been long out of print or are very expensive.

Well, when I say "expensive" I mean $14.99 :laugh:


snyprrr

Variations

The Knussen arrived... I went straight for the 'Variations', having only know the MTT, with its somewhat recessed acoustic. Well, wow, first off one notices the speed- Knussen takes a minute less than MTT, in a five minute piece!! And Knussen's recording has everything delineated and clean, clearing up what I struggled to hear in the MTT. The music itself seems to make much more sense here- I never quite "got" what was going on in the MTT, being I'd never heard the work before.

As a Serial type Avant piece from a Master, how do the 'Variations' stack up against any other Master's  similar work- who does it remind you of- what's going on here? I'm not sure I got a bead other than "post-Webern"- it just seems like a nice, crystalline Serialtype work, different sections exploited, registers...

anyhow, Knussen certainly clarifies the work,...


Also, the 'Requiem Canticles' ... ahhhh, what to say?...

Haven't made it to 'The Flood' or 'Abraham & Isaac', but,... eh,... can someone pre-warn me or something?... I don't think I'm up for Biblical Igor Hollywood singing... hold my hand 0:)

Knussen's programme really does Igor service! ;)

Karl Henning

Quote from: snyprrr on March 05, 2017, 07:31:48 AM
Variations

The Knussen arrived... I went straight for the 'Variations', having only know the MTT, with its somewhat recessed acoustic. Well, wow, first off one notices the speed- Knussen takes a minute less than MTT, in a five minute piece!! And Knussen's recording has everything delineated and clean, clearing up what I struggled to hear in the MTT. The music itself seems to make much more sense here- I never quite "got" what was going on in the MTT, being I'd never heard the work before.

As a Serial type Avant piece from a Master, how do the 'Variations' stack up against any other Master's  similar work- who does it remind you of- what's going on here? I'm not sure I got a bead other than "post-Webern"- it just seems like a nice, crystalline Serialtype work, different sections exploited, registers...

anyhow, Knussen certainly clarifies the work,...


Also, the 'Requiem Canticles' ... ahhhh, what to say?...

Haven't made it to 'The Flood' or 'Abraham & Isaac', but,... eh,... can someone pre-warn me or something?... I don't think I'm up for Biblical Igor Hollywood singing... hold my hand 0:)

Knussen's programme really does Igor service! ;)

One fabulous disc!
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Drasko

#876
Quote from: Mirror Image on March 05, 2017, 06:22:05 AM
Actually, you forgot that Craft did indeed record BOTH versions of Les noces as found here:



Yes, I tend to forget it because it was never released on CD to best of my knowledge.

But if one has a turntable (it might be available as a download as of recently) it's definitely worth hearing as it includes 1917 full orchestra version and not the standard 1923 but two movements of 1919 version for pianola, two cimbaloms, harmonium and percussions which Stravinsky never finished.

Stravinsky really spent a long time searching for the right orchestration for Les Noces, and I think he did succeed in the end as the final 1923 version is just perfect, I much prefer it to earlier efforts/drafts. 

Mahlerian

Quote from: snyprrr on March 05, 2017, 07:31:48 AMAs a Serial type Avant piece from a Master, how do the 'Variations' stack up against any other Master's  similar work- who does it remind you of- what's going on here? I'm not sure I got a bead other than "post-Webern"- it just seems like a nice, crystalline Serialtype work, different sections exploited, registers...

Stravinsky was certainly aware of and interested in the kind of music being written by his younger colleagues, from Carter to Boulez.  A lot of things in their music seem not to have filtered into his, like Carter's penchant for Varese-like bursts of pure percussion or Boulez's gamelan-like sonorities.  Still, the fragmentation of the row that you hear in the Variations is definitely in line with their aesthetics.

Quote from: snyprrr on March 05, 2017, 07:31:48 AMHaven't made it to 'The Flood' or 'Abraham & Isaac', but,... eh,... can someone pre-warn me or something?... I don't think I'm up for Biblical Igor Hollywood singing... hold my hand 0:)

Abraham and Isaac is about as far from Hollywood as one can get; it's set in Hebrew to a very sparse accompaniment with a heavily ornamented solo singer's line.
"l do not consider my music as atonal, but rather as non-tonal. I feel the unity of all keys. Atonal music by modern composers admits of no key at all, no feeling of any definite center." - Arnold Schoenberg

ritter

#878
Quote from: Draško on March 05, 2017, 09:37:34 AM
Yes, I tend to forget it because it was never released on CD to best of my knowledge.

But if one has a turntable (it might be available as a download as of recently) it's definitely worth hearing as it includes 1917 full orchestra version and not the standard 1923 but two movements of 1919 version for pianola, two cimbaloms, harmonium and percussions which Stravinsky never finished.
...
They've included this disc in the big "Complete Album Collection" box on Sony. Good to have it on CD (I've owned the LP for ages, but don't have a turntable these days)...

Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on March 05, 2017, 09:17:44 AM
One fabulous disc!
A resounding +1...really top-notch!

Drasko

Quote from: ritter on March 05, 2017, 10:02:49 AM
They've included this disc in the big "Complete Album Collection" box on Sony. Good to have it on CD (I've owned the LP for ages, but don't have a turntable these days)...

That's good, finally on CD. For those who might want a single CD rather than 56 CD box, there is a relatively recent French recording of 1923 plus 1919 fragment, a shortish CD which I haven't heard:

[asin]B00699QPNM[/asin]