Who is leading the classical music scene today?

[btpaul674]

In light of the "Abolishment of 'top x' threads" thread,

Which culture, country, school, or group is leading the classical (used loosely) music scene now and today?

Is it the flourishing Finnish music culture? The mighty Danes? The resurgence of Functionalism? The bold sweep of American Wind Music? Discuss! 

[techniquest]

Not sure about country, school and so on, but I would think that the label Naxos has taken a great lead in terms of championing rarely or previously unrecorded modern composers.
By the way, I did not want to abolish the top x threads, just the fake ones. Why don't people read?

[btpaul674]

The fake ones were the target of that comment.

But I agree on what Naxos is doing as far as getting neglected works recorded and organizing existing recordings, as well as helping to get new stuff on CDs available. Fantastic stuff from that label.

In reference to the Finns, Kalevi Aho was discussing in an interview the youth of the Finnish musical culture and how the composers of today in Finland were establishing that culture. Composers such as Aho and Rautavaara are helping to establish Finnish music traditions and carry on the traditions of Sibelius et al.

As for the Danes, just LOOK at the magnitude of works by Per Nørgård and Poul Ruders.

[Novi]

In reference to the Finns, Kalevi Aho was discussing in an interview the youth of the Finnish musical culture and how the composers of today in Finland were establishing that culture. Composers such as Aho and Rautavaara are helping to establish Finnish music traditions and carry on the traditions of Sibelius et al.

I know you're talking of composers, but there also seems to be a strong contingent of Finnish conductors too.

[Hector]

"The bold sweep of American wind music."

Where's that then.

[hornteacher]

"The bold sweep of American wind music."

Where's that then.

Its in every public school system in the country, and there is way too much of it in my opinion.  Thousands of "new" works are being written every year for all levels of concert bands to fullfill the publishers contracts with composers.  Only a small percentage of this music is any good and the constant flood of mediocre compositions takes attention away from the study of established literature and quality new material. 

Too many students have no knowledge of Beethoven, Bach, Dvorak, Copland, or indeed can tell you the difference between a symphony and a concerto, but they can march around a football field playing music from Shriek and call it music education.

</rant>

[techniquest]

The fake ones were the target of that comment.

Fair enough - my misunderstanding
I agree with what you say regarding Finnish composers and I wonder if similar could have been said of Polish composers about 10 years ago, especially with the huge popularity of Goreckis' 3rd symphony at that time. Could it be argued that this created a resurgence of interest in music of the ex-Soviet nations which has in turn been the catalyst by which the European, and in particular the Finnish music scene has been able to flourish? I don't know, but it could have legs...

[BachQ]

Lang Lang

[karlhenning]

Its in every public school system in the country, and there is way too much of it in my opinion.  Thousands of "new" works are being written every year for all levels of concert bands to fullfill the publishers contracts with composers.  Only a small percentage of this music is any good and the constant flood of mediocre compositions takes attention away from the study of established literature and quality new material. 

Too many students have no knowledge of Beethoven, Bach, Dvorak, Copland, or indeed can tell you the difference between a symphony and a concerto, but they can march around a football field playing music from Shriek and call it music education.

</rant>

Oh, 'twas a fine rant.

I had a go at taking it all elsewhere with Out in the Sun . . . .

[Brian]

Not sure about country, school and so on, but I would think that the label Naxos has taken agreat lead in terms of championing arrely or previously unrecorded modern composers.
By the way, I did not want to abolish the top x threads, just the fake ones. Why don't people read?

I agree ~ Klaus Heymann and Naxos have transformed how we listen to music and what music we listen to. And they've probably saved the record industry, too.

[btpaul674]

Fair enough - my misunderstanding
I agree with what you say regarding Finnish composers and I wonder if similar could have been said of Polish composers about 10 years ago, especially with the huge popularity of Goreckis' 3rd symphony at that time. Could it be argued that this created a resurgence of interest in music of the ex-Soviet nations which has in turn been the catalyst by which the European, and in particular the Finnish music scene has been able to flourish? I don't know, but it could have legs...

There might be a chance the Eastern European area and the ex-Soviet nations could have had some influence in the Finnish scene, but I see the rise of Finnish music through trying to escape German traditions (as many people had attempted to do through the 20th century). Sibelius and Madetoja were emergent in the late-romantics periods, and it continues up until Rautavaara, Lindberg, Saariaho, Salenen, etc. Now they have a strong sense of vocal music, opera, and even band music.

I think as far as the ex-Soviet nations are concerned, they used each other as a model to develop their own cultures. The Polish had and still have a strong development in Penderecki and Gorecki, the Estonians with Arvo Part, and the Latvians with Pelecis. Eastern Europe is a great breeding ground for post-avant garde music.

[Maciek]

Anyone call Poles, Latvians, Estonians, or Finns ex-Soviet nations one more time and I'm going to start calling names.

[Bonehelm]

Lang Lang

rofl

I certainly hope not. 

[Siedler]

Anyone call Poles, Latvians, Estonians, or Finns ex-Soviet nations one more time and I'm going to start calling names.

Yeah, especially as Finland has never been a Soviet nation! 

[btpaul674]

Anyone call Poles, Latvians, Estonians, or Finns ex-Soviet nations one more time and I'm going to start calling names.

I dont think anyone ever said the Finns were an ex-Soviet nation, though they did have a friendship treaty with the Soviet Union.

In August 1940, Estonia was annexed by the Soviet Union.

In the same year on August 5th, Latvia was annexed by the Soviet Union.

Poland was under a Communist government since 1948.

What's the problem?

[btpaul674]

Its in every public school system in the country, and there is way too much of it in my opinion.  Thousands of "new" works are being written every year for all levels of concert bands to fullfill the publishers contracts with composers.  Only a small percentage of this music is any good and the constant flood of mediocre compositions takes attention away from the study of established literature and quality new material. 

Too many students have no knowledge of Beethoven, Bach, Dvorak, Copland, or indeed can tell you the difference between a symphony and a concerto, but they can march around a football field playing music from Shriek and call it music education.

</rant>

For the record I hate most wind band music. Especially American wind Band music. Well said.

[Maciek]

I'd expect someone from one of the ex-British nations to be able to understand this but apparently I was wrong...

I dont think anyone ever said the Finns were an ex-Soviet nation, though they did have a friendship treaty with the Soviet Union.

I was being ironic. I was alluding to World War II. Considering what happened to Karelia and taking your criteria seriously, we can safely call Finland a Soviet (not even ex-Soviet) country.

Poland was under a Communist government since 1948.

Actually, during World War II about half of Poland was under German occupation, so I insist you call us an ex-Nazi country. Doing otherwise will be very insulting.

Also, remember to do the same with France and all the others.

[karlhenning]

Yeah, especially as Finland has never been a Soviet nation! 

Psst: nor Poland.

[Maciek]

Very good point, Karl!

Just so it doesn't look as if the immoderate side is all there is, let me try to explain in a more straightforward way...

Why is it not nice to call Poles, Latvians, or Estonians ex-Soviet nations?

Well, first of all, calling any nation an ex-something seems a contradiction in terms because nations are "about" continuity and "exes" are about breaching continuity.

Secondly, the term "ex-Soviet nation" implies that there ever was such a thing as a "Soviet nation" - and that's a debatable point, if there ever was one. A Soviet state, yes. But a nation? It would have to somehow differ from the Russian nation that preceded it, yes? It would then have to be a completely new nation suddenly brought to life on an old territory. How could something like that happen? Well, probably - it couldn't.

These two are minor, strictly "semantic" points. The main point is this: can you define a nation by referring to the alien political influences under which it fell? (Is it proper to call a girl who is known to have been raped at some point in her life "you know, that raped girl"?) And does it make sense? No, it does not make sense. Calling the Estonians or Latvians ex-Soviet nations because they were

annexed by the Soviet Union.

is both insulting and wrong. They were annexed for Pete's sake! They never were Soviet nations! How on earth can you not see how offensive that is? Would you call France an ex-Nazi state because it was occupied by Germany? Would you even call Germany itself an "ex-Nazi country"? Probably not. Yet somehow all that (very laudable) sensibility ends when it comes to the adjective "Soviet"...

As for the case of Poland, I think Karl's succinct remark is enough for an explanation.

[jochanaan]

Its in every public school system in the country, and there is way too much of it in my opinion.  Thousands of "new" works are being written every year for all levels of concert bands to fullfill the publishers contracts with composers...

I don't doubt it, although I've not had much to do with the public school system for a while.  One wonders what happened to the fine composers and arrangers like Alfred Reed, Claude T. Smith (I actually heard him speak once, at the Nebraska All-State Festival of 1974), and especially John Barnes Chance?

For a time I thought that certain women like Joann Falletta and Marin Alsop would be at the top, especially when Ms. Falletta was leading the Women's Philharmonic; but I don't quite see that happening.  Instead, what I see is that, in the words of Russian dissident poet Yevgeny Yevtushenko, "Everyone is a leader, but no one leads."  Record companies and orchestra boards are more concerned about their bottom lines than producing good music, and they are gradually forcing many musicians, even some great ones, to toe their bottom line, or what they think will pad it.

However, there are signs of hope.  The London Symphony, disgusted with record-company politics, has created its own record label, following many non-classical musicians.  James Levine is bringing good modern music back to Symphony Hall in Boston, and Esa-Pekka Salonen has already done the same in L.A.  And I very much like the way Yo-Yo Ma, the Kronos Quartet and others are reaching out to non-Western, non-classical musicians and creating a fascinating synthesis of East and West.  Perhaps this is the way of the future: Artists, rather than depending on uncertain corporate patronage, will begin to network, use the power of the Internet, and take charge of their own careers and world.