William Schuman (1910-1992)

[Heck148]

Just realised,there is another recording of the Fourth,coupled with a Piano Concerto,on Albany!

Schwarz/Seattle recorded it as well - on Naxos, with Sym #9. fine disc

[cilgwyn]

Yes,I was aware of that one. I'd rather stick to a cd of his earlier music for the time being,though (Says he,trying to resist!! ) As soon as I buy the First Edition cd of the old Louisville recordings (and the Delos Tribute to William Schuman,'cos it was cheap! ) I find the Albany cd of the Fourth much cheaper! Sods law!! I usually find the old Louisville recordings to be pretty good,though. Not Ormandy,or Bernstein,but they have atmosphere. The mix of mono and stereo recordings on some of the cds,can be a bit of a pain,though!
I'm listening to Schuman's Fourth now. I do like this music. Unfortunately,I've been too busy to listen that attentively. Perhaps now?!

[snyprrr]

Sods law!!

The CDCDCD Thread awaits you!

So, how does the newer recording fare? The slow mvmt. is two minutes quicker (6 vs , but, the sample didn't seem rushed. I can only imagine that the outer movements... wait, the first mvmt. is on YT!! Yes, it sooounds great, but, what do you hear?

Oh- Sarge-

When I said 'Pastoral', I guess I meant it in the "Oklahoma" way- flat, no pat. Schuman reminds me of "the land of unwalled villages" where there are storm clouds brewing, much like I imagine the heartland was tentative when WWII broke out (1941). There is a peaceful, pastoral quality, but, there is something amiss. It's that "tragic" quality we hear in Harris's 3rd.- joy, yet tragedy... mmm???

I'm glad everyone rushed to their Libraries and took a listen!


I WANT A DETAILED COMPARISON BETWEEN VERSIONS!!!!! EXPECT IT AT Oh, eight hundred!!!!

[snyprrr]

Anyone else have massive problems with the 9th? iT JUST BUILDS TOO HYSTERICALLY for me (whoops)... whereas the 8th has many of the same ideas but has a more even keel to it. Yes, I know what the 9th is about, but, meh, - eh....

[cilgwyn]

The third IS generally more contemplative than the third. It has been described as Coplandesque (or something like that?!!) and I can hear that ! No cowpats,but I can see what snyprrr means. He isn't saying it's a US equivalent to VW's third,in other words; Copland isn't rolling over & over in buffalo pats,or whatever they have or do (I don't really want to know!! ) over there! Roy Harris No 5 strikes me as being along similar lines. So yes,I can see what (hear what!) snyprrr means.

[pjme]

Learn more about the 7th symphony.

https://youtu.be/ZRPHGUrHjAo

P.

...nobody likes that "pastoral" viola concerto?

[snyprrr]

Learn more about the 7th symphony.

https://youtu.be/ZRPHGUrHjAo

P.

...nobody likes that "pastoral" viola concerto?

ouch, that's an hour looong...

Wait... what Viola Concerto????huh??


I would also call the 7th "Industrial"... the 6th would be his "Grand Canyon"...

The third IS generally more contemplative than the third. So yes,I can see what (hear what!) snyprrr means.

You know, they'll call you crazy for this! However, I approve that message, lol!!




I'll be taking the 5th with me today ( not "A" fifth!!!)

[Sergeant Rock]

Oh- Sarge-

When I said 'Pastoral', I guess I meant it in the "Oklahoma" way- flat, no pat. Schuman reminds me of "the land of unwalled villages" where there are storm clouds brewing, much like I imagine the heartland was tentative when WWII broke out (1941). There is a peaceful, pastoral quality, but, there is something amiss. It's that "tragic" quality we hear in Harris's 3rd.- joy, yet tragedy... mmm???

I WANT A DETAILED COMPARISON BETWEEN VERSIONS!!!!! EXPECT IT AT Oh, eight hundred!!!!

I originally thought you meant "pastoral" in the Delian sense, or like VW or G. Butterworth. I'll listen again with your new explanation in mind. (Afraid I can't help you with comparisons as I only have Schwarz.)

Sarge

[pjme]

Wait... what Viola Concerto????huh??

It is there, go one page up.... Great work : "On old English rounds"  - solo viola, orchestra and small women's chorus. I never understood why the Bernstein/McInnes recording never made it to cd.

[Karl Henning]

Anyone else have massive problems with the 9th?

No: no problem whatever.

[Karl Henning]

It is there, go one page up.... Great work : "On old English rounds"  - solo viola, orchestra and small women's chorus. I never understood why the Bernstein/McInnes recording never made it to cd.

Is it some other recording which is in the Concertos &c. box?

[pjme]

I know only of one other recording/performance on YT:


https://youtu.be/K41oUHXyEGE

William Schuman Viola Concerto(complete) by Dr.Eun Hwan Bai
1985 December Alice Tully Hall, Lincoln Center, New York,
Juilliard Orchestra, Juilliard Chorus, Conductor; Jorge Mester
William Schuman's 75th Birthday Anniversary Special Concert

P.

[Archaic Torso of Apollo]

A Schuman sighting

Muti/CSO are doing the Symphony No. 9 (Le fosse Ardeatine) on Feb. 21-23.

I've never heard this one myself. I gather it's not a critical favorite, but the CSO is doing war-inspired music this season (100 years since the Armistice), and it fits into that theme. Personally I wish they were doing Prayer in a Time of War instead (a very fine, brooding piece, and not overlong). But it's always good to see Big Bill Schuman get attention from our major ensembles. More please!

[Mirror Image]

A Schuman sighting

Muti/CSO are doing the Symphony No. 9 (Le fosse Ardeatine) on Feb. 21-23.

I've never heard this one myself. I gather it's not a critical favorite, but the CSO is doing war-inspired music this season (100 years since the Armistice), and it fits into that theme. Personally I wish they were doing Prayer in a Time of War instead (a very fine, brooding piece, and not overlong). But it's always good to see Big Bill Schuman get attention from our major ensembles. More please!

This is a symphony I've come to appreciate more and more. It'll be strange to see it conducted by Muti, but I suppose the symphony's Italian origins resonated with him? I really love when there's some kind of a war-related musical theme, because this particular topic in musical terms, in a lot of cases, makes for great listening, but I'd imagine even if you didn't know a piece of music's origins, it would come across sounding rather similarly. I'll have to look into CSO's programs for this season.

[cilgwyn]

I put on Bernstein's classic recordings of William Schuman symphonies,a week,or two,ago. To my surprise,I found myself 'enjoying' (if that's the right word?) his eighth symphony. I have since,bought s/h copies of recordings of his ninth and tenth symphonies. I haven't received them yet,though. They're still in the post;and hopefully,should be here,soon! This follows my finding myself responding more positively to Mennin's eighth and ninth symphonies,than I used to. Particularly,the eighth,with it's apocalyptic imagery. It seems I'm suddenly beginning to like my symphonies a bit tougher,in my mid fifties?!!

[cilgwyn]

Well,okay......maybe,tough for me?!!

[vandermolen]

Well,okay......maybe,tough for me?!!

6 and 3 remain my special favourites.

[Mirror Image]

I put on Bernstein's classic recordings of William Schuman symphonies,a week,or two,ago. To my surprise,I found myself 'enjoying' (if that's the right word?) his eighth symphony. I have since,bought s/h copies of recordings of his ninth and tenth symphonies. I haven't received them yet,though. They're still in the post;and hopefully,should be here,soon! This follows my finding myself responding more positively to Mennin's eighth and ninth symphonies,than I used to. Particularly,the eighth,with it's apocalyptic imagery. It seems I'm suddenly beginning to like my symphonies a bit tougher,in my mid fifties?!!

If you're looking for a 'tough' work, then Schuman's 9th will most definitely fit the bill. I found the music from the first couple of listens to be impenetrable, but then I realized that this work does have a lyricism to it that is deep underneath the gruff exterior of the music. As I said, it took me some time to appreciate it. The 8th was much easier for me to digest as its' language wasn't as hard-boiled as the the 9th's. The 10th is pretty good, but I won't lie and tell you it's a favorite. It has some good moments, but compared to the 9th, it sounds almost like the composer was consciously going for something more jovial in mood, which really sounds like a cop out in a way. I wish he had one more symphony in him before passing away.

[cilgwyn]

I bought the Slatkin recording,of the tenth,incidentally. I already have a recording of the Seventh,which I'm perefectly happy with (Maazel) and I quite,like the Balada work,it's paired with. I also,thought that if I didn't like the symphony,the other pieces would be enjoyable. I also liked the artwork! Slatkin isn't one of my favourite conductors,but I still,wish RCA/BMG, could have done a few more in that series. Some David Diamond,Roy Harris,for instance?!!
Schuman's Ninth sounds very intriguing! Is it tougher than Mennin's eighth or Ninth! I find myself liking those more,recently. Although,'liking',may be the wrong word! (Appreciating!) Particularly,his eighth. Some people feel his earlier symphonies were finer,though. Walter Piston seems to have got a bit tougher later on,too. And David Diamond!
I find it a little shocking that Piston's later symphonies are only available in ancient (albeit,good,or,should I say,serviceable?) recordings! America needs a label like Chandos,to promote their key composers. Also,while here in the Uk,we have complete cycles of British composers;there is no such equivalent in the case of Walter Piston,David Diamond,Roy Harris,or even Paul Creston,for instance? Okay,you might not like,or have reservations,about,one or more,of these composers;but you could say the same for some British composers,who have received the accolade of complete cycles.

[Mirror Image]

I bought the Slatkin recording,of the tenth,incidentally. I already have a recording of the Seventh,which I'm perefectly happy with (Maazel) and I quite,like the Balada work,it's paired with. I also,thought that if I didn't like the symphony,the other pieces would be enjoyable. I also liked the artwork! Slatkin isn't one of my favourite conductors,but I still,wish RCA/BMG, could have done a few more in that series. Some David Diamond,Roy Harris,for instance?!!
Schuman's Ninth sounds very intriguing! Is it tougher than Mennin's eighth or Ninth! I find myself liking those more,recently. Although,'liking',may be the wrong word! (Appreciating!) Particularly,his eighth. Some people feel his earlier symphonies were finer,though. Walter Piston seems to have got a bit tougher later on,too. And David Diamond!
I find it a little shocking that Piston's later symphonies are only available in ancient (albeit,good,or,should I say,serviceable?) recordings! America needs a label like Chandos,to promote their key composers. Also,while here in the Uk,we have complete cycles of British composers;there is no such equivalent in the case of Walter Piston,David Diamond,Roy Harris,or even Paul Creston,for instance? Okay,you might not like,or have reservations,about,one or more,of these composers;but you could say the same for some British composers,who have received the accolade of complete cycles.

I agree that the US needs a label like Chandos to focus on American composers like all of those you mentioned. I'd say only Copland, Barber, and Ives have been given the royal treatment both here and abroad in terms of almost all of their outputs being recorded (some twice or three times over). Fortunately, these composers like Schuman, Harris, Diamond, Piston, Creston, Mennin, among others have had some luck on record, but there's never been a full-blown series where all of their music gets recorded. Naxos, Albany, and Delos certainly tried to record more and more American music, but only Naxos is still really going strong, but their focus seems to have shifted in more recent years to pretty much standard repertoire, but they still record unknown composers, which is a great thing, but I just wished their 'American Classics' series would be a bit more kind to the afore mentioned composers.