Collecting Wagner

[kishnevi]

My collection

Well, I'm gobsmacked.  There's actually a bunch of recordings I own that Sarge doesn't!  I wonder if Hell is experiencing a cold front at the moment....

HOLLANDER:  Bohm/Bayreuth (1971)
TANNHAUSER: Gerdes/DeutschenOper Berlin that's the one in which Nilsson sings both Venus and Elizabeth, Windgassen is Tannhauser and Fischer-Dieskau is Wolfram.
LOHENGRIN: Solti/VPO  (and Domingo in the title role and Jessye Norman as Elsa)
TRISTAN: Pappano/ROH Convent Garden (Domingo again, this time with Nina Stemme)
MEISTERSINGER: Sawallisch/Bavarian State Opera (Weikl, Heppner, Studer)
PARSIFAL: Thielemann/Vienna State Opera (yet again Domingo, with Waltrud Meier as Kundry)

and I perceive you don't have the Solti Meistersinger which I used to have and need to get again in the near future (the first Solti, that is).

[Elgarian]

RING KARAJAN BERLIN PHIL
RING SOLTI VIENNA PHIL
RING KRAUSS BAYREUTH (1953)
RING KNAPPERTSBUSCH BAYREUTH (1956)
RING BÖHM BAYREUTH (1967)
RING BARENBOIM BAYREUTH (1991)
RING MORALT VIENNA SYMPHONY
RING LEVINE MET
RING FURTWÄNGLER RAI ROME
RING THIELEMANN BAYREUTH
RING HAITINK SOBR

DIE WALKÜRE FURTWÄNGLER   VIENNA PHIL
THE VALKYRIE (IN ENGLISH) GOODALL ENGLISH NATIONAL OPERA

One might think that was enough Ring for any man, and yet still there is the mild shock: no Chereau/Boulez Ring, Sarge? And only Valkyrie of the complete Goodall cycle? Are you tempted by the Keilberth one?

(You may have mentioned before why they're missing, but if you have, I've forgotten.)

[Sergeant Rock]

Well, I'm gobsmacked.  There's actually a bunch of recordings I own that Sarge doesn't!  I wonder if Hell is experiencing a cold front at the moment....

HOLLANDER:  Bohm/Bayreuth (1971)
TANNHAUSER: Gerdes/DeutschenOper Berlin that's the one in which Nilsson sings both Venus and Elizabeth, Windgassen is Tannhauser and Fischer-Dieskau is Wolfram.
LOHENGRIN: Solti/VPO  (and Domingo in the title role and Jessye Norman as Elsa)
TRISTAN: Pappano/ROH Convent Garden (Domingo again, this time with Nina Stemme)
MEISTERSINGER: Sawallisch/Bavarian State Opera (Weikl, Heppner, Studer)
PARSIFAL: Thielemann/Vienna State Opera (yet again Domingo, with Waltrud Meier as Kundry)

and I perceive you don't have the Solti Meistersinger which I used to have and need to get again in the near future (the first Solti, that is).

I don't know how old you are but if you're anywhere near my age you remember a time when the choice between Meistersingers was between Solti and Jochum, the new kids on the block. Being able to afford only one, I spent weeks, maybe even months agonizing over it, finally spending my limited bucks on Jochum because I was something of a F-D fan and because the reviews said Jochum was the more sensitive conductor. Thirty-five years later, Solti is still absent, primarily because I'm satisfied with Kubelik. (The other Meistersingers in my collecton came in large boxes: the Bayreuth box, the Karajan EMI vocal box; boxes not bought for their Meistersingers)

Domingo's accent bothers so I've stayed away from most of his Wagner recordings. Sinopoli's Tannhäuser is an exception because I wanted to hear Studer's Elisabeth; I just grit my teeth and bear it when Domingo opens his mouth. I suppose I could overlook his accent for Parsifal. Might even be appropriate; the setting is Spain.

I'm not a Nilsson fan (I admire more than love her) but that Tannhäuser sounds interesting.

Sarge

[Sergeant Rock]

....and yet still there is the mild shock: no Chereau/Boulez Ring, Sarge? And only Valkyrie of the complete Goodall cycle? Are you tempted by the Keilberth one?

The Goodall has always been so damned expensive. I make do with Valkyrie, my favorite of the four Ring dramas. I've seen the Boulez Ring so many times on television, I feel no need to actually own it. I'm tempted, yes, by Keilberth, but there comes a time in every man's life when he finally must say, Enough is enough--and twelve Rings are enough 

Sarge

[Elgarian]

twelve Rings are enough 

I hadn't actually counted them up, but yes: twelve apostles; twelve days of Christmas ... the number speaks for itself.

[Mirror Image]

I personally prefer Karajan's or the Solti's versions, those ones are more passionate and powerful.

Ilaria

Same here. I think Karajan and Solti are the polar opposites of each other, but both approaches are valid and have their merits. Karajan's is actually my favorite Ring cycle.

[Lisztianwagner]

Same here. I think Karajan and Solti are the polar opposites of each other, but both approaches are valid and have their merits. Karajan's is actually my favorite Ring cycle.

Yes, I definitely agree 

What is Levine's Ring like? I listened to it some time ago, and it was amazing 

Ilaria

[kishnevi]

I don't know how old you are but if you're anywhere near my age you remember a time when the choice between Meistersingers was between Solti and Jochum, the new kids on the block. Being able to afford only one, I spent weeks, maybe even months agonizing over it, finally spending my limited bucks on Jochum because I was something of a F-D fan and because the reviews said Jochum was the more sensitive conductor. Thirty-five years later, Solti is still absent, primarily because I'm satisfied with Kubelik. (The other Meistersingers in my collecton came in large boxes: the Bayreuth box, the Karajan EMI vocal box; boxes not bought for their Meistersingers)

Domingo's accent bothers so I've stayed away from most of his Wagner recordings. Sinopoli's Tannhäuser is an exception because I wanted to hear Studer's Elisabeth; I just grit my teeth and bear it when Domingo opens his mouth. I suppose I could overlook his accent for Parsifal. Might even be appropriate; the setting is Spain.

I'm not a Nilsson fan (I admire more than love her) but that Tannhäuser sounds interesting.

Sarge

As far as Domingo goes--I don't mind his accent, aber mein Deutsch ist nicht so stark--and apparently it's less obvious in the later recordings. The only real annoyance in the Parsifal is the stage noise produced by the Grail Knights trooping in during Act I (it's a live recording). And mind you, with Lohengrin you're getting Solti and with Parsifal you're getting Theilemann, not exactly bad conducting.  I might add that I prefer the Solti-Domingo Lohengrin to the Kempe recording (the only other CD version I have) by a wide margin. In part I think it's the sonics--at least, the Kempe sounds rather dull and dreary most of the time, something the Solti never does.
And if you like Studer, remember that she's the Eva in the Sawallisch Meistersinger, although my heart still yearns for Solti in that one.  (But I've never heard the Jochum or the Kubelik or the Karajan.)

And as I write this, I've begun to realize that I don't particularly care for that Tannhauser, other than Fischer Dieskau.  So probably if you've lived this long without it, you can probably continue to do so safely.  It uses, btw, the Dresden version.

[Jaakko Keskinen]

BTW, did Wagner ever wrote anything of worth besides his operas?

Well, he has IMO excellent early symphony in C major from 1832, and arrangement of Wesendock Träume for violin is really awesome. I also love the Albumblatt.

Mozart has KV (or K), Wagner has WWV (Wagner-Werk-Verzeichnis).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_compositions_by_Richard_Wagner Here's the complete list.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQ76jZDnMys

[marvinbrown]

  Wagner fans, figured I'd bump this thread.  I have been looking at getting either Kubelik's Meistersinger or Kubelik's Parsifal or BOTH (if you can convince me that they are as GREAT as reviews say they are):

  [asin]B0000ARNET[/asin]

  AND/OR

  [asin]B00009LW4Y[/asin]

  Any feedback you have would be greatly appreciated.

  marvin

[Dancing Divertimentian]

Wagner fans, figured I'd bump this thread.  I have been looking at getting either Kubelik's Meistersinger or Kubelik's Parsifal or BOTH (if you can convince me that they are as GREAT as reviews say they are):

I have the Meistersinger. It's an extremely enjoyable set. I'm not sure what else to say that hasn't already been said by the other reviewers. We've talked about it before on this board, I know that much, and it's generally been praised. Whether that's enough of an endorsement to convince you to buy it I don't know.

But I've certainly never regretted buying it even though I might still prefer Jochum's on DG overall, if only for the gorgeous orchestral accompaniment. But Kubelik's no slouch, that's for sure.

[listener]

News from the BBC.    You can record these on VHS (or BETA) by patching the headphone/speaker output of your computer to the recorder.  Remember the time zones.
   "One of our major highlights during October is Wagner's Ring Cycle live from Covent
Garden. It is a much awaited production, heralding the 200th anniversary of the
composer's birth next year. The word 'epic' is often used to describe the musical
cycle, and indeed it is an epic undertaking to broadcast it live. Radio 3 is
delighted to be providing access to all comers for this monumental production. It is
an important part of our public service to offer this chance to enjoy the 'best seat
in the house' for this much discussed cycle. It starts on Tuesday, October 16th at
7pm with Das Rheingold, which sets the scene for the operas which follow – the
struggle of love and power echoes through the cycle. We shall be providing lots of
contextual material around the music, going behind the scenes with the artists
themselves. The cast is led by Bryn Terfel, Stig Anderson and Wolfgang Koch, and the
Orchestra and Chorus of the Royal Opera House Covent Garden is conducted by Sir
Antonio !
Pappano. The remainder of the story will unfold on the Thursday 18th, Sunday 21st
and Wednesday 24th, drawing in other great singers, not least the British stars
Susan Bullock, Sarah Connolly and John Tomlinson. Start times will be early, so if
you are unavailable to listen live, then it remains on-demand one week after
transmission."

[marvinbrown]

I have the Meistersinger. It's an extremely enjoyable set. I'm not sure what else to say that hasn't already been said by the other reviewers. We've talked about it before on this board, I know that much, and it's generally been praised. Whether that's enough of an endorsement to convince you to buy it I don't know.

But I've certainly never regretted buying it even though I might still prefer Jochum's on DG overall, if only for the gorgeous orchestral accompaniment. But Kubelik's no slouch, that's for sure.

  Thank you for the feedback. I was hoping you would use the words "lost masterpiece" or "definitive", but since you find other recordings to rival it, and considering its current price of £10/disc......... I'll pass.


marvin

[The new erato]

News from the BBC.    You can record these on VHS (or BETA) by patching the headphone/speaker output of your computer to the recorder.  Remember the time zones.

Why would one want to record a sound track to VHS/Beta???

[listener]

Why would one want to record a sound track to VHS/Beta???

a. For uninterrupted long events the tapes are longer than casettes
b. Because the machines are programmable if you can't be there when the broadcast is on.
c. I don't have TIVO or other digital recording device,

[Dancing Divertimentian]

  Thank you for the feedback. I was hoping you would use the words "lost masterpiece" or "definitive", but since you find other recordings to rival it, and considering its current price of £10/disc......... I'll pass.


marvin

It's definitely a "masterpiece" of a performance, I'd say. But probably one of several for this work. Ultimately it might depend on how many Meistersingers you already have. If you're in the market for another one this makes for a very nice supplement.

For a newcomer it's a definite contender for first choice, no doubt about it, so in that light it's worthy from all angles.

One thing Kubelik brings is a refreshing "naturalness" to his overall concept. Nothing sounds hackneyed or fussed over. Just an organic unfolding of the piece. Singing is delectable, and fits hand-in-glove with the orchestral side of things.

I can't imagine it NOT satisfying even the hardest of hard-bitten Wagernians.

[david johnson]

you guys have much larger collections than i -

my meager holdings:

lohengrin/sawallisch/bayreuth
ring/solti/hvk mix on lp - janowsky on cd
dutchman/konwitschny

a variety of orchestral cds - szell, kubelik, solti, hvk

[marvinbrown]

It's definitely a "masterpiece" of a performance, I'd say. But probably one of several for this work. Ultimately it might depend on how many Meistersingers you already have. If you're in the market for another one this makes for a very nice supplement.

For a newcomer it's a definite contender for first choice, no doubt about it, so in that light it's worthy from all angles.

One thing Kubelik brings is a refreshing "naturalness" to his overall concept. Nothing sounds hackneyed or fussed over. Just an organic unfolding of the piece. Singing is delectable, and fits hand-in-glove with the orchestral side of things.

I can't imagine it NOT satisfying even the hardest of hard-bitten Wagernians.

  You will be pleased to know that the Wagnerian in me couldn't let a good thing pass quite so easily. I kept searching online and found that inandout records in Austria stock both the Kubelik Meistersinger and the Kubelik Parsifal for about £30 each. Delivery charges to the UK are reasonable.  I decided after reading nothing but stellar reviews of both sets that indeed they are worth having. I ordered both sets.


  I only have Karajan's Die Meistersinger CD and Levine 's Meistersinger MET DVD. I really need a different interpretation of the work and from what I have read the Kubelik seems to fit the bill.

  For Parsifal I have Karajan's Parsifal on DG with the BPO, Knappertsbusch's classic 1962 recording from Bayreuth on Phillips and Levine's earlier MET recording on DVD.

  I have also read with some dissatisfaction how both Kubelik recordings have been forsaken, shelved for commercial reasons for other recordings that are not especially superior to them. You know I have recently been listening to the Keilberth Ring '55 and what a stunning performance (Hotter in stereo sound at his peak is to die for!!!) this is proving to be. Why do record companies do that? Shelve classic recordings so that we customers end up paying an arm and a leg to "boutique" labels ready and willing to exploit us. DISGRACEFUL!

[Dancing Divertimentian]

You will be pleased to know that the Wagnerian in me couldn't let a good thing pass quite so easily. I kept searching online and found that inandout records in Austria stock both the Kubelik Meistersinger and the Kubelik Parsifal for about £30 each. Delivery charges to the UK are reasonable.  I decided after reading nothing but stellar reviews of both sets that indeed they are worth having. I ordered both sets.

That's good news. I don't think you'll be sorry. Let us know what you think of them (especially the Meistersinger) when you get the chance.

[techniquest]

I'm a newcomer to Wagner, but that hasn't stopped me having a few enjoyable shopping ventures. Thus far I have:

The Ring Cycle: Solti
                         Neumann

The Ring (excerpts): Solti
                                 Levine
                                 Haitink
                                 Goodall
                                 Karajan (vinyl)
                                 Szell (orchestral excerpts)

Das Rheingold: Karajan (vinyl)

Parsifal: Karajan (vinyl)

Die Fliegende Hollander: Steinberg
                                       Dorati (vinyl)

There's so much more to hear!