Author Topic: Which Shostakovich 11 ("The year 1905")?  (Read 9575 times)

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Kontrapunctus

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Re: Which Shostakovich 11 ("The year 1905")?
« Reply #20 on: July 22, 2011, 08:40:16 AM »
For me, the most brutal one is Oleg Caetani's on the Arts label. It was recorded in concert, so there are some minor imperfections, but he drives the orchestra almost to the breaking point! My only quibble is the bells at the end of the last movement are far too loud--in fact, they are digital bells--probably sampled from some huge cathedral. I have a multi-channel SACD system, and the bells come out of the rear  speakers--they pretty much dominate the sound. Played in stereo they are less overwhelming. Others that I like include Pletnev and Rostropovich, but neither matches Caetani's for searing intensity in my opinion.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2011, 09:26:58 AM by Toccata&Fugue »

snyprrr

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Re: Which Shostakovich 11 ("The year 1905")?
« Reply #21 on: July 23, 2011, 06:24:38 AM »
The Urania release? Oooh, I was too impatient: Ordered that CD as well today from Amazon (a reseller) :)

Listened again to Stokowski/Houston/EMI. They completely failed. The loudness level of the frightening violins after the massacre scene is almost the same as the massacre itself. What complete i***ts that sound engineers were. But anyway, Haitink wins, Concertgebouw rocks, Decca rocks, they did it ;)

I have the EMI in storage,... I've always been thankful for the very 'upfront' recording. So, the recording is good, but the EMI mastering is bad? And, I take it, this new reissue will hopefully sound better? I just don't remember any problems with this. Huh.

Offline techniquest

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Re: Which Shostakovich 11 ("The year 1905")?
« Reply #22 on: July 23, 2011, 11:48:43 AM »
I must second what 'Toccata&Fugue' says above about the Caetani recording on ARTS. A superb reading of the work and very well worth seeking out. As for those bells at the end; they are giant, tolling bells from some enormous Gothic cathedral of doom! It may be a certain amount of artistic licence, but this really does work. It's like the 20th century equivalent of the tolling bells in the 'Symphonie Fantastique' - that always sounds better with bigger, heavier bells in the Dies Irae rather than the rather-too-delicate orchestral tubular bells. The same applies here.
In concert performances of the 11th, conductor Andrew Litton has a set of cast bells which go with him: I've seen a performance with him conducting the Bournemouth Symphony Orchestra and it was really powerful.
BTW, I listened to the Stokowski / Houston recording and for me it really doesn't work beyond an excellent first movement.

snyprrr

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Re: Which Shostakovich 11 ("The year 1905")?
« Reply #23 on: July 23, 2011, 07:35:45 PM »
I must second what 'Toccata&Fugue' says above about the Caetani recording on ARTS. A superb reading of the work and very well worth seeking out. As for those bells at the end; they are giant, tolling bells from some enormous Gothic cathedral of doom! It may be a certain amount of artistic licence, but this really does work. It's like the 20th century equivalent of the tolling bells in the 'Symphonie Fantastique' - that always sounds better with bigger, heavier bells in the Dies Irae rather than the rather-too-delicate orchestral tubular bells. The same applies here.
In concert performances of the 11th, conductor Andrew Litton has a set of cast bells which go with him: I've seen a performance with him conducting the Bournemouth Symphony Orchestra and it was really powerful.
BTW, I listened to the Stokowski / Houston recording and for me it really doesn't work beyond an excellent first movement.

Well,... I'll be honest,... I never make it past the first movements of either 6 or 11!! :-[ ;D Jarvi in 6.

Offline Bogey

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Re: Which Shostakovich 11 ("The year 1905")?
« Reply #24 on: July 23, 2011, 08:31:44 PM »



The one for me....and it has to be this pressing.
There will never be another era like the Golden Age of Hollywood.  We didn't know how to blow up buildings then so we had no choice but to tell great stories with great characters.-Ben Mankiewicz

snyprrr

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Re: Which Shostakovich 11 ("The year 1905")?
« Reply #25 on: July 23, 2011, 08:53:33 PM »
The one for me....and it has to be this pressing.

Haha, Schroeder cracks me up, haha!!

Offline Tapio Dimitriyevich Shostakovich

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Re: Which Shostakovich 11 ("The year 1905")?
« Reply #26 on: July 24, 2011, 07:18:34 AM »
Well,... I'll be honest,... I never make it past the first movements of either 6 or 11!!
Your quiting may be wrong: Are you saying this, snyprrr?
I reply: Woooooooaaaaaat THE F****UUUU******K? It's impossible to listen to #11 without mvmts 2-4!!!! You're wasting your life! A major mistake!

I have the EMI in storage,... I've always been thankful for the very 'upfront' recording. So, the recording is good, but the EMI mastering is bad? And, I take it, this new reissue will hopefully sound better? I just don't remember any problems with this. Huh.
Yes, hopefully the Urania mastering is better. In the EMI release, they've removed the dynamics almost completely.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2011, 07:20:47 AM by Tapio Dmitriyevich Shostakovich »

eyeresist

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Re: Which Shostakovich 11 ("The year 1905")?
« Reply #27 on: July 24, 2011, 03:39:54 PM »
For me, the most brutal one is Oleg Caetani's on the Arts label.

What I've heard of his cycle is terrific, but sadly it's too expensive for me to consider ATM.
 

Offline fuhred

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Re: Which Shostakovich 11 ("The year 1905")?
« Reply #28 on: July 24, 2011, 04:43:31 PM »
Kondrashin's 11th punches harder than any other I've heard.

Kontrapunctus

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Re: Which Shostakovich 11 ("The year 1905")?
« Reply #29 on: July 25, 2011, 10:04:10 AM »
What I've heard of his cycle is terrific, but sadly it's too expensive for me to consider ATM.

Amazon has some at decent prices...the 11th is $13.13, for instance.

Offline fuhred

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Re: Which Shostakovich 11 ("The year 1905")?
« Reply #30 on: July 26, 2011, 02:38:09 PM »
Has anybody heard the Stokowski live recording with the Moscow Radio Symphony Orchestra in 1958?
It's on the Venezia label (see below link). I'd like to know whether it's worth buying.

http://www.hmv.co.jp/en/product/detail/1209621

I too, have never liked the Houston version because of its limited dynamics. I only wish Stokowski had recorded it with Everest instead of Capitol.....


« Last Edit: July 26, 2011, 02:41:49 PM by fuhred »

Offline Dancing Divertimentian

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Re: Which Shostakovich 11 ("The year 1905")?
« Reply #31 on: July 26, 2011, 07:14:00 PM »
Has anybody heard the Stokowski live recording with the Moscow Radio Symphony Orchestra in 1958?
It's on the Venezia label (see below link). I'd like to know whether it's worth buying.

http://www.hmv.co.jp/en/product/detail/1209621

I too, have never liked the Houston version because of its limited dynamics. I only wish Stokowski had recorded it with Everest instead of Capitol.....

I used to have this Stokowski 11th on the Russian Disc label, now defunct. I remember it being a great performance but if the limited dynamics on the EMI (I always thought it sounded pretty good) bothers you you're not going to be happy with the live Moscow recording. It's certainly not better than Houston. But I do remember it having decent sound, which is about all I can hope for from a live Russian recording of this vintage.   

Not that I've heard the Venezia transfer, however.

 
Veit Bach-a baker who found his greatest pleasure in a little cittern which he took with him even into the mill and played while the grinding was going on. In this way he had a chance to have the rhythm drilled into him. And this was the beginning of a musical inclination in his descendants. JS Bach

Offline Tapio Dimitriyevich Shostakovich

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Re: Which Shostakovich 11 ("The year 1905")?
« Reply #32 on: July 29, 2011, 06:46:26 AM »
Received my Urania/Stokowski/Houston today. Not sure if it's the same mastering, but (for the eleventh) it's also completely broken in terms of dynamics like the EMI. I cannot listen to it. I cannot stand it. The part of the massacre feels like someone is permanently twiddling on the volume knob. Probably there is no better recording as it's pretty olf. I think I'll upload some audio files for you his weekend to judge yourself.
Anyway looking forward to the other pieces on that 2 discs.
« Last Edit: July 29, 2011, 06:49:13 AM by Tapio Dmitriyevich Shostakovich »

Offline techniquest

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Re: Which Shostakovich 11 ("The year 1905")?
« Reply #33 on: July 31, 2011, 01:44:21 AM »
Another word or two on the Caetani recording: there's a terrific pounding bass drum during the massacre section in the 2nd movement - turn it up loud and you'll knock the walls down! Also, the adagio 3rd movement is taken very slowly, only speeding up to what I might consider to be 'usual' tempo during the climax, then slowing down again for the reiteration of the first theme. The timpani are particularly loud during part of this climactic section (and possibly just a little sharp until a rest when it seems the timpanist may have done a quick retune - but that may be just me).

Offline Mirror Image

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Re: Which Shostakovich 11 ("The year 1905")?
« Reply #34 on: February 17, 2012, 08:15:57 PM »
Good to see Caetani's 11th get some love on this thread. It is a great performance. Yes, Caetani's set is expensive, but if somebody is already collecting Shostakovich symphony cycles, this is one that's going to be an essential acquisition I think. For one, the orchestra is Italian! I mean WTF? ??? An Italian orchestra playing Shostakovich? Yes and they perform admirably well. I may have pointed out in several other posts about this orchestra's (Orchestra Sinfonica di Milano Giuseppe Verdi) string section. It's really something else and Shostakovich's 11th is a good test drive for this orchestra. The second thing about the Caetani is that Caetani himself has conducting in his blood. He is son of Igor Markevitch. What more could you ask for? Caetani obviously has Shostakovich in his blood as he's been let go from the Melborne Symphony Orchestra for programming too much Shostakovich. :)

P.S. I bought my Caetani set for around $70. Keep your eyes on the set and I'm sure it'll come down in price.
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Kontrapunctus

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Re: Which Shostakovich 11 ("The year 1905")?
« Reply #35 on: February 17, 2012, 11:18:17 PM »
I was very disappointed with Gergiev's--it's surprisingly tame. After attending a live concert by him and the Mariinsky Orch that nearly took off the roof in Berkeley a few years ago, I thought this would "the one"--hardly! It's not nearly as driven as Caetani's, Rostropovich's, or Pletnev's, and the sound is not as good either--the percussion has little impact, which pretty much kills the performance.

Offline Mirror Image

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Re: Which Shostakovich 11 ("The year 1905")?
« Reply #36 on: February 18, 2012, 08:42:11 AM »
I was very disappointed with Gergiev's--it's surprisingly tame. After attending a live concert by him and the Mariinsky Orch that nearly took off the roof in Berkeley a few years ago, I thought this would "the one"--hardly! It's not nearly as driven as Caetani's, Rostropovich's, or Pletnev's, and the sound is not as good either--the percussion has little impact, which pretty much kills the performance.

Yeah, I'm finding that Gergiev's earlier recordings have more energy and life to them whereas most of the recordings I've heard from him recently, like his LSO Live recordings, have been workaday, drab performances.
"The artist who does not feel completely satisfied by elegant lines, by harmonious colors, and by a beautiful succession of chords does not understand the art of music." - Camille Saint-Saëns