Mahler 6 Blind Comparison: Impressions and Votes

[madaboutmahler]

Part 1 - Results!

#24: A5 Bournemouth Symphony Orchestra/Horenstein (BBC Legends/1969)
recieving no votes at all and been described as messy and stolid in parts, this recording released on the 'BBC Legends' comes last place.
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#23: A1 Bavarian Radio Symphony Orchestra/Kubelik (DG/1968)
recieving very very few votes, this recording was described as far too fast.
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#22: C8 London Symphony Orchestra/Gergiev (LSO Live/2008)
The first release in Gergiev's recent, speedily completed Mahler cycle was described as rapid, without shape, with too little power and nothing special.
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#21: B6 The Cleveland Orchestra/Szell (Sony/1967)
Described as a straight-forward, routine performance with poor sound.
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#20: B8 Vienna Philharmonic/Bernstein (DG/1989)
Known as a classic performance of Mahler 6, Bernstein's well-loved DG recording with the VPO comes at only 20th in the survey. Described as rather rushed and superficial.
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[madaboutmahler]

continued....

#19 A2 City of Birmingham Symphony Orchestra/Rattle (EMI/1991)
A recording that recieved a fair amount of praise, but was called too stretched-out.
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#18 C6 Tonhalle Orchestra Zurich/Zinman (RCA/2009)
Recieving mixed responses, this recording was thought by some to be too reserved.
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#17 B3 Czech Philharmonic Orchestra/Neumann (Supraphon/1977)
Those who said anything about this recording said that it was too fast.
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#16 A6 Frankfurt Radio Symphony Orchestra/Inbal (Brilliant/1993)
This recording was criticised for not having enough weight and for sounding thin. It did reach the top 5 of a few of the voters however.
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Part 2 links, with the remaining competitors, shall be sent around very very soon! This part of the comparison will be based around an extract from the scherzo.

[madaboutmahler]

So, what do you think of the results? Surprised?

[fridden]

So, what do you think of the results? Surprised?

I am surprised about the Bernstein actually! I thought I liked it more 
Kubelik is gone as well, hmmm...

But I am also happy to see that there are still a possibility for some of my favorites to be among the finals.

Thanks a lot for all the work you are putting into this!

[DavidW]

I can't believe that the classic Szell recording is already out of the race!  Well at least I had it in my top five.

I'm astonished that I thought that a DG Bernstein recording was too fast!!  Really!?  Am I drunk!?

I don't like Horenstein and I thought that in a blind listen he would be placed dead last (vindication!).  I don't mind his 4th though just because it's so weird.  I would like to see how his famous 3rd does when we tackle that symphony (his third is much more thought out).

I am very glad that Gielen is not on that list.  May he triumph for at least one more round.

[jlaurson]

So, what do you think of the results? Surprised?

Oh, some of this is actually quite gratifying. 

And I'm almost surprised, (even) in retrospect, that I didn't even bother to include Bernstein's DG 6th. (His Sony is fine, his seedy, sloppy Vienna DVD performance I hate...)

You'd think that the one Symphony that should be most suited to Valery Gergiev would be the Sixth: With a stubble, crumpled suit, dark, bloodshot eyes, the smell of liquor from the long night before still lingering, ruthless and wild and with unwashed, unkempt hair. (That's my ideal vision of the Sixth, not a description of Gergiev's appearance.) All the greater my surprise to hear Gergiev's Sixth—part of his Mahler Cycle with the LSO on their own label—to be a tame (if not quite emaciated) performance. Even if Gergiev had gone for Scherzo-Andante and three hammer blows, instead of the (now) standard Andante-Scherzo/Two, this would not qualify for inclusion among the raw, driven Sixths. I prefer it just slightly over Mariss Jansons' all too refined Sixth with the same orchestra from just a few years earlier, but it's far too middle-of-the-run for inclusion among my favorites.

It was with great anticipation that I listened to the brisk live recording (73 minutes; an 18 minute Allegro) of George Szell's with the Cleveland Orchestra (Sony). But the sound is muffled, the interpretation tame, the execution without heft, and everything feels a bit middle-of-the-road. Quick, live, and also on the side of understatement, rather than exaggeration, is Rafael Kubelik—the live performance on Audite showing him at his self-effacing best in Mahler. I'm not quite convinced by an even faster interpretation: that of Kyrill Kondrashin (65 minutes! 16 ½ minutes for the Allegro). In direct comparison, faster is usually more appealing. But in the opening movement Kondrashin doesn't get his feet on the ground to establish the necessary weight and force. That's too bad, as he would have been another conductor I'd have thought capable for the necessary clenching violence that so tickles me here. I'd not want to miss the performance for the mad Scherzo alone, though...

[DavidW]

List of my favorites that have NOT been eliminated: Bertini, Gielen, Zander, Sanderling, Boulez.

[DavidW]

Jens I'm actually really surprised that Kondrashin wasn't outright eliminated, and now I wonder if he is even in the sample.  I've noticed that your impressions were pretty close on the Haydn thread too (well excepting the Auryn Q).

[madaboutmahler]

I am surprised about the Bernstein actually! I thought I liked it more 
Kubelik is gone as well, hmmm...

But I am also happy to see that there are still a possibility for some of my favorites to be among the finals.

Thanks a lot for all the work you are putting into this!

I can't believe that the classic Szell recording is already out of the race!  Well at least I had it in my top five.

I'm astonished that I thought that a DG Bernstein recording was too fast!!  Really!?  Am I drunk!?

I don't like Horenstein and I thought that in a blind listen he would be placed dead last (vindication!).  I don't mind his 4th though just because it's so weird.  I would like to see how his famous 3rd does when we tackle that symphony (his third is much more thought out).

I am very glad that Gielen is not on that list.  May he triumph for at least one more round.

List of my favorites that have NOT been eliminated: Bertini, Gielen, Zander, Sanderling, Boulez.

Yes, I thought that quite a few people would be surprised to see Bernstein DG out...

It's a pleasure! The project of doing a Blind Comparison for all of the Mahler symphonies is great fun and very interesting!

David - I can't reveal any of the contesters remaining, but can apologize that only half of your list of favourites are included... 
Lets hope that your favourites that are included go far!

[Lisztianwagner]

Quite surprised, I can't believe Bernstein's recording has been left out!! It's my absolute favourite one!!

I'm looking forward to the next part then!

[classicalgeek]

Since I only listened to Group B, I'm shocked about B8 as well!  Like many other listeners, Bernstein/DG/Vienna Phil is one of my reference versions.  I didn't think it was bad, per se, but I did find it a bit fast and thought the orchestral playing lacked polish.  No offense to Russian orchestras, but I was sure it was Svetlanov or maybe Fedoseyev! 

I'm less surprised about B3 - it made my cut, but wasn't one of my very top choices.  The rest of what I've heard of Neumann's Mahler has been good, but not great.

It wasn't in my listening group, but I'm also surprised Szell didn't make the cut.  I'm only so-so about it, but it's a classic for some.

Ah well, on to Round Two.  Looking forward to it!

[DavidW]

Since I only listened to Group B, I'm shocked about B8 as well!  Like many other listeners, Bernstein/DG/Vienna Phil is one of my reference versions.  I didn't think it was bad, per se, but I did find it a bit fast and thought the orchestral playing lacked polish.  No offense to Russian orchestras, but I was sure it was Svetlanov or maybe Fedoseyev! 

Me three the DG Bernstein is exceptional.  So surprised.

It wasn't in my listening group, but I'm also surprised Szell didn't make the cut.  I'm only so-so about it, but it's a classic for some.

It was in our group, it was B6.

Daniel I hope that Gielen is in the group!!

[Sergeant Rock]

The results don't surprise me even though two of my favorites failed to make the cut (Bernstein DG, Szell). My love for the Bernstein is based almost entirely on his last movement. And Szell...well, his performance shows its greatness (to me) in its cumulative effect: the way the final tragedy is so unexpected, even startling, given the lightness and "Classical" grace of what's come before. Neither Bernstein's nor Szell's first movements impress me the way their final movements do.

Glad to see my absolute favorite, Solti, is still in the running 

Sarge

[madaboutmahler]

The results don't surprise me even though two of my favorites failed to make the cut (Bernstein DG, Szell). My love for the Bernstein is based almost entirely on his last movement. And Szell...well, his performance shows its greatness (to me) in its cumulative effect: the way the final tragedy is so unexpected, even startling, given the lightness and "Classical" grace of what's come before. Neither Bernstein's nor Szell's first movements impress me the way their final movements do.

Glad to see my absolute favorite, Solti, is still in the running 

Sarge

For me also, the highlight of the Bernstein DG is in the finale. I still need to listen to the Szell properly.
Yes, glad that Solti is still going! Lets hope it stays that way!

[Lisztianwagner]

Glad to see my absolute favorite, Solti, is still in the running 

I agree; the Karajan too.

[classicalgeek]

It was in our group, it was B6.

Ahh, you're right!  Somehow I saw 'C6'... 

Glad to see my absolute favorite, Solti, is still in the running 

Sarge

One of my favorites, too!

[Papy Oli]

hmmm.... I've called the B8 Bernstein DG " bonkers" in my vote and it finished last. Will have to give it a full listen again at some stage 

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

I see to my delight that most of my choices have survived (apart from Rattle and Inbal)... Onwards and upwards!

[madaboutmahler]

Daniel I hope that Gielen is in the group!!

Sorry, David... that was one that I didn't include... 
I hope that there are many more recordings that you will enjoy though!

hmmm.... I've called the B8 Bernstein DG " bonkers" in my vote and it finished last. Will have to give it a full listen again at some stage 

haha

hmmm... there are 4 recordings left in Group A, 5 left in Group B, and 6 left in Group C.
What I have decided to do is create a Group X and a Group Y to share the recordings.
The listings:
Group X: A3, A4, A7, A8, B1, B4, B7, C2.
Group Y: C1, C3, C4, C5, C7, B2, B5.

Shall try and start getting the links out tommorow afternoon! The excerpt from the scherzo shall be roughly 5.5 minutes long.

The voting deadline for Part 2 shall be... erm... Monday 21st May. As always, if you think you will need slightly longer, please let me know.

Glad that you are enjoying the survey!

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

I wonder if three weeks is too long... The (current) contestants are now fully concentrated. Perhaps 14 May?