Objective review of the US 2012 Presidential and Congressional general campaign

[Karl Henning]

Viz. the next 'new normal'

[Florestan]

Party politics and democratic elections in the last 50 years have fucked up more countries and ruined more lives than all the absolute kings and emperors of the last 500 years put together. 

(Or should I have posted this in ''Unpopular Opinions"?)

[Gurn Blanston]

Party politics and democratic elections in the last 50 years have fucked up more countries and ruined more lives than all the absolute kings and emperors of the last 500 years put together. 

(Or should I have posted this in ''Unpopular Opinions"?)

No, well, what's unpopular about that?   Beyond 'the truth can hurt'? 

[Karl Henning]

The other day, Geo. Will cited a brilliant Menckenism, the gist of which is that Democracy is the theory that the people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard.

[Florestan]

The other day, Geo. Will cited a brilliant Menckenism, the gist of which is that Democracy is the theory that the people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard.

The old cynic got it right once again!

Was it Mencken too who said believing in democracy meant believing in the collective wisdom of the individual ignorance? Sounds like him all right but I'm not sure... 

[Scarpia]

Democracy is the art of running the circus from the monkey cage.  H.L. Mencken

[Florestan]

Democracy is the art of running the circus from the monkey cage.  H.L. Mencken

[Todd]

Party politics and democratic elections in the last 50 years have fucked up more countries and ruined more lives than all the absolute kings and emperors of the last 500 years put together.

It would be interesting to put some numbers to this idea.  Perhaps comparative body counts could be used as a measure of how beneficial competing systems are.  I think the kings and emperors would fare poorly.

What was Churchill's phrase?  "Democracy is the worst form of government except for all those others that have been tried."  Something like that.

El Erian's article rehashes what he has already said and written many times before, along with Bill Gross at Pimco, and a goodly number of other people in the investing world.  There is some sound thinking, but also debatable ideas, too.  Read Krugman to see an alternate take on concerns such as structural unemployment, here included in the phrase "cascading structural impediments to growth and job creation."  While I generally like El Erian and Gross and their directness, it should be noted that Pimco is somewhat vested in this theory, and that they shit the bed last year betting against Treasuries.  Sometimes their predictions prove incorrect.

[Florestan]

It would be interesting to put some numbers to this idea.  Perhaps comparative body counts could be used as a measure of how beneficial competing systems are.  I think the kings and emperors would fare poorly.

I think they would fare quite well. The great democratic nations of US and UK alone are responsible for hundreds of thousands of dead people (Hiroshima, Nagasaki & Dresden). And if you will say that it is the government and not the people that are responsible for that I will retort that it is democratically elected, i.e. people-backed, governments that did that and there is not one single people mass-movement protesting those horrible massacres. I'm really sorry to see such an informed and educated man like you succumb to the democratic propaganda.... 

[Todd]

I think they would fare quite well. The great democratic nations of US and UK alone are responsible for hundreds of thousands of dead people (Hiroshima, Nagasaki & Dresden).

Hang on, there.  You wrote the last 50 years, not the last 70+ years.  Last I checked, the acts you mentioned did not happen after 1962.

[Florestan]

What was Churchill's phrase?  "Democracy is the worst form of government except for all those others that have been tried."  Something like that.

Isn't it the self same Sir Winston who said that democracy meant two wolves and a sheep voting about what's on the plate for dinner? or that the best argument against against democracy is a five-minute talk with an average voter? 

Hang on, there.  You wrote the last 50 years, not the last 70+ years.  Last I checked, the acts you mentioned did not happen after 1962.

If all you have as argument for democracy is a bad timing then I'm afraid it's you who fare poorly. 

[Todd]

If all you have as argument for democracy is a bad timing then I'm afraid it's you who fare poorly.

That is not the only argument, not at all, but I'm not the one arbitrarily selecting one date range and then using another.  Your rejoinder is a cop out.

[Sammy]

I think they would fare quite well. The great democratic nations of US and UK alone are responsible for hundreds of thousands of dead people (Hiroshima, Nagasaki & Dresden). And if you will say that it is the government and not the people that are responsible for that I will retort that it is democratically elected, i.e. people-backed, governments that did that and there is not one single people mass-movement protesting those horrible massacres.

There isn't much protest because of a lack of merit.  War is hell - get used to it.  DEMOCRACY RULES!!

[Florestan]

DEMOCRACY RULES!!

It certainly does, especially over the people... 

[Archaic Torso of Apollo]

Beethoven?

According to Maureen Dowd's column today, Paul Ryan is a fan of "heavy metal and Beethoven." How did this guy get past the Repub Party's anti-intellectual gatekeepers? Or does the heavy metal somehow "cancel out" the Beethoven?

[Ataraxia]

Beethoven?

According to Maureen Dowd's column today, Paul Ryan is a fan of "heavy metal and Beethoven." How did this guy get past the Repub Party's anti-intellectual gatekeepers? Or does the heavy metal somehow "cancel out" the Beethoven?

Ahem.

[ibanezmonster]

Yes, ahem... something like Psyopus, just to name one, is quite a stretch from Metallica or Slayer. Metal can sometimes be more intellectual than Beethoven, all depending on the band.


Though of course, I doubt he listens to bands like that. And I have a feeling he doesn't listen to much other classical than Beethoven. It's hard to imagine political people having any emotions or being able to enjoy music, in general.

[Archaic Torso of Apollo]

Metal can sometimes be more intellectual than Beethoven, all depending on the band.

The point is, it's a matter of perception. Metallists don't have to go out of their way to prove they're "reg'lar guys." Do they?

It's hard to imagine political people having any emotions or being able to enjoy music, in general.

Indeed. As a group, they are the most boring of human beings, at least in democratic countries (right Florestan?). Dictators and absolute monarchs are more colorful.

[Sammy]

Though of course, I doubt he listens to bands like that. And I have a feeling he doesn't listen to much other classical than Beethoven. It's hard to imagine political people having any emotions or being able to enjoy music, in general.

Not hard to imagine at all.  They have just as much capacity to emote and enjoy music as you and I.  Actually, we would all be better off if they dumped politics and became musicians.

[Todd]

Dictators and absolute monarchs are more colorful.

Bunga, Bunga to that, sez Silvio.