Female jazz vocalists of the 1920s/30s/40s/50s

[Elgarian]

However, both Sarah and Ella were truly jazz singers, and not just pop singers singing songs some jazz musicians happened to also cover.  I do think that's what sets both of them apart from most of the others of their generation who were sometimes labeled "jazz vocalists" (with a few obvious exceptions, like Anita O'Day and June Christy, of course).

Warning! Warning! Can of Worms opening!

No, not really - but this question of what a true jazz singer is ... can it be defined, actually? If the bottom line hangs on improvisation, then Bob Dylan is a jazz singer supreme, because no two performances are ever alike ... but we know immediately that he isn't. So mere improvisation isn't the magic factor. If it hangs on the question 'does (s)he swing?'then loads of people get included who never improvise at all. Alright then - does (s)he swing and improvise? But what does 'swing' mean anyway?

If I abandon any attempt at definition and follow my gut feeling, I don't seem to have too much trouble. So Helen Ward is a jazz singer for sure (even though she was also a pop singer). So are Annette Hanshaw, Anita O'Day (though she'd describe herself as a 'song stylist'), and Sarah Vaughan, but there's no way I could justify how I know it.

[Ataraxia]

Warning! Warning! Can of Worms opening!

No, not really - but this question of what a true jazz singer is ... can it be defined, actually? If the bottom line hangs on improvisation, then Bob Dylan is a jazz singer supreme, because no two performances are ever alike ... but we know immediately that he isn't. So mere improvisation isn't the magic factor. If it hangs on the question 'does (s)he swing?'then loads of people get included who never improvise at all. Alright then - does (s)he swing and improvise? But what does 'swing' mean anyway?

If I abandon any attempt at definition and follow my gut feeling, I don't seem to have too much trouble. So Helen Ward is a jazz singer for sure (even though she was also a pop singer). So are Annette Hanshaw, Anita O'Day (though she'd describe herself as a 'song stylist'), and Sarah Vaughan, but there's no way I could justify how I know it.

Well, if we know what jazz is, don't we know what a jazz singer is?

[Elgarian]

Though several of these singers had their points of interest, particularly Harris and Morse, Annette Hanshaw really did stand out.

Do you know the incredibly useful book by Scott Yanow, called The Jazz Singers? It's a kind of encyclopedia of over 500 jazz singers - enormously stimulating to dip into. Anyway, he sticks his neck out and compiles a list of those he thinks are the 30 greatest Jazz singers of all time. Just one man's view of course, but it's a very experienced man's view and makes for an interesting list. Much of it is predictable: Ella Fitzgerald, Sarah Vaughan, Billie Holiday, Anita O'Day, Dinah Washington, Peggy Lee, Ethel Waters, Mildred Bailey are all in there, naturally. But guess who else? Yep. Annette Hanshaw.

[Elgarian]

Well, if we know what jazz is ...

[Elgarian sits quietly, waiting to be told....]

[Ataraxia]

"If you have to ask, you'll never know." - Louis Armstrong

Not very helpful he. 

[Ataraxia]

Two of my favorite Boswellian things ever.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MUB3ZR4F8vw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpZZig6ecEo

[Vesteralen]

Warning! Warning! Can of Worms opening!

No, not really - but this question of what a true jazz singer is ... can it be defined, actually? If the bottom line hangs on improvisation, then Bob Dylan is a jazz singer supreme, because no two performances are ever alike ... but we know immediately that he isn't. So mere improvisation isn't the magic factor. If it hangs on the question 'does (s)he swing?'then loads of people get included who never improvise at all. Alright then - does (s)he swing and improvise? But what does 'swing' mean anyway?

If I abandon any attempt at definition and follow my gut feeling, I don't seem to have too much trouble. So Helen Ward is a jazz singer for sure (even though she was also a pop singer). So are Annette Hanshaw, Anita O'Day (though she'd describe herself as a 'song stylist'), and Sarah Vaughan, but there's no way I could justify how I know it.

Yes, I admit my post was a bit controversial.  I wan't trying to downplay standard singers as much as I was trying to show appreciation for the kinds of things people like Ella and Sarah Vaughan could do - improvise melodies, do sudden and unexpected key shifts, and in the case also of the Boswell Sisters, be rhythmically adventurous.

However, there are other singers, who, although known primarily as pop singers, could do a more than creditable job at jazz as well.  Rosemary Clooney comes to mind - particularly her wonderful album with Duke Ellington.  My special favorite on that one is "I'm Checkin' Out, Goombye".

[Vesteralen]

Two of my favorite Boswellian things ever.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MUB3ZR4F8vw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpZZig6ecEo

Hadn't seen the second one before, but "Heebie Jeebies" is favorite of mine.

[eyeresist]

"If you have to ask, you'll never know." - Louis Armstrong

Not very helpful he. 

It don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing.

Get hep.

[Ataraxia]

Jazz singing advice:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2009/may/10/jazz-singing-advice

[Elgarian]

Yes, I admit my post was a bit controversial.  I wan't trying to downplay standard singers as much as I was trying to show appreciation for the kinds of things people like Ella and Sarah Vaughan could do - improvise melodies, do sudden and unexpected key shifts, and in the case also of the Boswell Sisters, be rhythmically adventurous.

Just to clarify: I was just running with the ball you threw for a bit of fun, really. We all know broadly what we're talking about; but still, it's quite amusing that we'd all specify it in different ways. Far simpler to say 'listen to this* - that's jazz singing'. [*this being a recording by Anita O'Day, Billie Holiday, Ella Fitzgerald, etc...) Maybe it's one of those things Wittgenstein maintained could only be shown, not said.

Reading through the guide to jazz singing Dave posted, I haven't done an exhaustive check, but a lot of that would fit Dylan pretty well. No one would call him a jazz singer though.

Enough. There's a bar of soap in the bath that needs catching.

[Elgarian]

When I first started exploring this stuff (not very long ago) I listened to a whole heap of  Benny Goodman with Helen Ward singing, and assumed that everything I was hearing came from the thirties. I remember listening to 'Never say never again' over and over again, amazed by the way she sang just one word: 'I'll never say never again again, cause, here I am alone again...'. I couldn't figure how such a young and inexperienced singer could invest just one syllable with so much musical expression. It made the hair on my neck prickle. I thought of it almost as a definitive example of the best of swing, the joy of singing being caught just for a moment as it flies.

Well later of course I discovered that this particular track was recorded not in the thirties but in the fifties, when she returned from retirement to cut a few songs with BG. So it was, in fact, a much older Helen Ward who could invest that single word with so much. Out of all the musicians from that period, she's the one I'd most like to have a cup of tea and a chat with.

Here's that magic performance (she starts singing her all-too-brief bit at 1:40):

http://www.youtube.com/v/tsTjmgIKfrY

[mc ukrneal]

I like what Duke Ellington had to say on the matter of what is jazz, "It's all music."

You may remember that i posted several versions of I can't give you anything but love, baby a couple days ago. Well, I also wanted to include the original singer of that music, Adelaide Hall. But so far, no luck. Here is something else she sang. Most of what is on youtube seems to be poor quality, but this still gives you an idea of how she sang (another name worth investigating, and she has some interviews on youtube that are pretty interesting):
http://www.youtube.com/v/WujB4_gaGqw

[early grey]

                Well, this thread has certainly blossomed, dearie, while I've been on the road.
                 Vesteralen has stolen my thunder re Keely Smith, who I first caught in the movie "Thunder Road" with Bob Mitchum. I have her LP with Billy May "Politely" which has a superb "Cocktails for Two". According to the invaluable Allmusicguide entry
                                        http://www.allmusic.com/artist/keely-smith-mn0000495784
two more of her early albums are better as well as some very recent ones. Of these I have "I'm in love again" where she is accompanied by some top rank jazz musicians. Trained singers are encouraged to treat the vowel "I" as also in "fly" as a dipthong ah-ee because the ee sound is a closed  tight sound whereas ah is open  and can show off vocal quality better.     "Ah hate to see??"  "Ah loves ya Porgy??" It's a question of degree.
                What surprised me about Ethel Walters version, recorded in 1932, of "I can't give....."  on first hearing, is the fact that her second chorus is a Louis Armstrong take-off and I wondered how early in his career as a Jazz Singer  other artists felt they could imitate/mock his individual vocal style.   
             

[Elgarian]

Of these I have "I'm in love again" where she is accompanied by some top rank jazz musicians. Trained singers are encouraged to treat the vowel "I" as also in "fly" as a dipthong ah-ee because the ee sound is a closed  tight sound whereas ah is open  and can show off vocal quality better.     "Ah hate to see??"  "Ah loves ya Porgy??" It's a question of degree.

By a curious semi-synchronicity, I happened to read this today in my autographed copy of Helen Forrest's autobiography:

"I did a terrible job on it [the recording of 'I have eyes']. ... Without realising it, I had picked up a sort of southern accent. I sounded like I had just come from Alabama. 'Ah only have eyes ...' When I hear it, I get sick. Fortunately, I realised I had picked up an accent and dropped it fast.'

[Vesteralen]

(just in case anyone notices, I'm probably going to be off-line for a week or so starting today.  I wouldn't want anybody to think I've lost interest in this thread.  I've enjoyed it a lot.)

[Elgarian]

(just in case anyone notices, I'm probably going to be off-line for a week or so starting today.  I wouldn't want anybody to think I've lost interest in this thread.  I've enjoyed it a lot.)

We're counting the minutes.

[Elgarian]

When I first stumbled across the music of this period, some of the most inspiring performances I encountered came from Dinah Washington, so I thought I'd plant a few here, for anyone who might be as susceptible as I was (and am).

First, Stormy Weather:

http://www.youtube.com/v/GrqY-JfEzbE

And Smoke gets in your eyes:

http://www.youtube.com/v/hY-bmBSK-u4

The recording I want most of all to post is her version of I Apologize, which is astounding, but I can't find one on you tube.

[mc ukrneal]

When I first stumbled across the music of this period, some of the most inspiring performances I encountered came from Dinah Washington, so I thought I'd plant a few here, for anyone who might be as susceptible as I was (and am).

First, Stormy Weather:

http://www.youtube.com/v/GrqY-JfEzbE

And Smoke gets in your eyes:

http://www.youtube.com/v/hY-bmBSK-u4

The recording I want most of all to post is her version of I Apologize, which is astounding, but I can't find one on you tube.

Yes, wonderful stuff. 

[Elgarian]

Helen Forrest

Thought I'd take a gentle ramble through some Helen Forrest CDs.

Broadly speaking I'm going to consider her career in two phases. Or four, depending on how you count.:
Phase 1
a. The period with Artie Shaw
b. The period with Benny Goodman
c. The period with Harry James

Phase 2
The period of 'going it alone'. Some folks might like to add the duets with Dick Haymes as a subgroup, but I won't consider those.

                                                                                           *******

My personal preference is emphatically for phase 1 (a, b, and c). The Artie Shaw period is well covered in these two CDs:



They're available here:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Sweeter-as-Years-Helen-Forrest/dp/B00000DMHO/ref=sr_1_5?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1343245494&sr=1-5

and here:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Vol-Helen-Forrest-Artie-Orchestra/dp/B000031WE5/ref=sr_1_8?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1343245494&sr=1-8

Although she always thought of herself primarily as a singer of slow ballads, she swings wonderfully on these two CDs regardless of the tempo, and with Artie Shaw providing the clarinet parts everything has a musical lilt. One of the great highlights for me is 'All the things you are' on Sweet and Simple, introduced by a lovely bit of clarinet, and sung with exquisitely swinging delicacy by Helen. The blurb says that these two CDs together include all her recorded studio work with Shaw.


Of the Benny Goodman period I have only this CD:



Available here:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Original-Recordings-1940s-Goodman-Forrest/dp/B000R9U3CO/ref=sr_1_16?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1343246435&sr=1-16

She hated her time with BG (didn't like him at all) but they made some superb music together. I'm pretty sure this CD is only a selection - there seems to have been a box set of HF and BG,  now out of print.


With Harry James we get to her really Big Hit period, but in terms of recordings it was truncated by a musicians' strike that kept her out of the studio for the later part of her time with James. Tragic! She was on fire at this time, no doubt partly because she was in love with James. There is a CD containing all their recordings together but I've yet to find a cheap copy. So for now all I have is a (rather wonderful) compilation of her work with all three big bands:



http://www.amazon.co.uk/Helen-Forrest-Voice-Big-Bands/dp/B0000017ED/ref=sr_1_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1343247190&sr=1-1

The tracks with James are outstanding. Among them is her million-selling and brilliantly swinging 'I've heard that song before' [see below] which alone is enough to explain how at the time she was polling as top of the female jazz/pop singers. James gave her more singing time, instead of confining her just to one chorus, and he must have been thrilled by the results. I could safely say that if you just wanted a flavour of Helen Forrest, this CD would be an outstanding choice.

'I've heard that song before'
http://www.youtube.com/v/MA2hk_CIZeo


Phase 2 is another story. I recently bought this:



http://www.amazon.co.uk/Help-Yourself-Heart-Helen-Forrest/dp/B0000CNXNM/ref=sr_1_6?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1343245494&sr=1-6

In due course James married Betty Grable, discarding Helen, and she left the band, striking out on her own. This CD offers some of the results, recorded in the later forties. My initial response is one of disappointment. Without the ingenuity of a Shaw, Goodman, or James behind her, she seemed to slip into a kind of smooth lifelessness. I listen and ache for the kind of rapport she had with the great bands. This is really just Helen with a pretty uninspired backing, and it all seems a bit dull. I'm not surprised that she never again attained the peak of popularity she'd enjoyed until then. This is still new to me, however, and I might hear more in it on further listening.

There's more, of course. My collection of her stuff isn't anything like complete. But the two Artie Shaw CDs, the Goodman CD, and the compilation of all three periods show her at her very best; and when she's at her best, I get goosebumps.