The essence of Schumann can be found in THIS work

Started by Lilas Pastia, October 04, 2012, 10:24:47 AM

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Sammy

Quote from: CaughtintheGaze on October 04, 2012, 03:14:24 PM
Well the alter-ego was only part of why I chose the work. I mainly chose it for it being a keyboard work and because of its romantic lyricism, both which I think suit Schumann's character.

I don't understand what you're getting at here.  Schumann wrote a ton of keyboard works and just about all his compositions (keyboard or otherwise) are strong on romantic lyricism.

CaughtintheGaze

Quote from: Sammy on October 04, 2012, 03:27:37 PM
I don't understand what you're getting at here.  Schumann wrote a ton of keyboard works and just about all his compositions (keyboard or otherwise) are strong on romantic lyricism.

Yes, but not all of them were as explicit with the alter ego, which I think is a component I consider necessary. I just meant that statement to say that I didn't choose it solely because of it.

Sammy

Quote from: CaughtintheGaze on October 04, 2012, 03:29:21 PM
Yes, but not all of them were as explicit with the alter ego, which I think is a component I consider necessary. I just meant that statement to say that I didn't choose it solely because of it.

Okay, and I agree about the explicit nature of Davidsbundlertanze and Kreisleriana.

CaughtintheGaze

Quote from: Sammy on October 04, 2012, 03:32:48 PM
Okay, and I agree about the explicit nature of Davidsbundlertanze and Kreisleriana.

That was the other composition that was in the race, for me.

North Star

"Everything has beauty, but not everyone sees it." - Confucius

My photographs on Flickr


Jo498

I like Carnaval, but there is not enough of the "dark side", the Hoffmannian gothic romantic in this piece which may be the most obviously brilliant of his longer pieces. So I'd go with Kreisleriana or Davidsbündlertänze. Of the song cycles I'd nominate the Eichendorff op.39 before Dichterliebe. Dichterliebe is great, of course, but I am not always sure if Schumann is not too serious for the ironic Heine. The Eichendorff-Lieder are all romantic longing (with some dark undertones, like in "Zwielicht")
Tout le malheur des hommes vient d'une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos, dans une chambre.
- Blaise Pascal

EigenUser

Interesting that this thread surfaces today. The day before yesterday I was in the car listening to the quadruple horn concerto (Konzertstuck) and I was thinking that this a particularly Schumann-y work. I have no idea why that piece isn't more well-known. It is absolutely captivating from the emphatic first two notes to the end.

The 4th symphony also is a good example -- perhaps more so since there are more "stormy" sections. Basically, anything with a lot of jumpy dotted rhythms juxtaposed with lyrical, flowing melodies and major/minor transitions that seem like they shouldn't work, but they somehow do. Maybe this doesn't make sense, but that's what Schumann is to me.
Beethoven's Op. 133 -- A fugue so bad that even Beethoven himself called it "Grosse".

amw

Kreisleriana | Fantasy in C

Part of the essence of Schumann is putting seemingly incompatible and disparate elements together to form a kind of unity. Therefore I choose these two as the two halves of Schumann: light and darkness. Two halves of the same work.

Alternately, I guess the Humoreske could do.

vers la flamme


Florestan

Liederkreis op. 39 (Eichendorff)

Schumann himself declared it "the most romantic of all my works".
Every kind of music is good, except the boring kind. — Rossini

(poco) Sforzando

"I don't know what sforzando means, though it clearly means something."

Amfortas

Quote from: Florestan on February 09, 2022, 03:03:19 AM
Liederkreis op. 39 (Eichendorff)

Schumann himself declared it "the most romantic of all my works".

I'd have to agree with this. Op.39 has the longing, solitude, mystery of Romaticism in every measure and word
''Better pass boldly into that other world, in the full glory of some passion, than fade and wither dismally with age.'' - James Joyce (The Dead)

vers la flamme

I do not have that Liederkreis, what's a good recording of it?

Florestan

Quote from: vers la flamme on February 11, 2022, 02:44:15 AM
I do not have that Liederkreis, what's a good recording of it?

I have these



plus the Hyperion Complete Lieder but those are organized in such a messy way that it takes ages to find who sings what.

I never did any A/B comparisons and I never will, it's not my cup of tea. I think you can't go wrong with any of them. Very recently I listened to Bar/Parsons and loved it.
Every kind of music is good, except the boring kind. — Rossini

Jo498

I have an earlier Schreier (with Shetler, I think) that I have had for the longest time and know best. Two with Fischer-Dieskau (usually earlier is better, I got a live one on Orfeo that must have been highly recommended), Gerhaher and two with women (Shirai and Lott, I think, not sure I ever listened to them, it was boxes/compilations not acquired for these recordings).
Dichterliebe is superior as a integrated cycle, i.e. not just a series of lieder (and has that great piano postlude); op.39 is moore loosely organized but I think the actual songs as separate songs in op.39 are unmatched in their highly romantic mood and expression.
Tout le malheur des hommes vient d'une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos, dans une chambre.
- Blaise Pascal

Florestan

Quote from: Jo498 on February 11, 2022, 11:00:27 AM
Dichterliebe is superior as a integrated cycle, i.e. not just a series of lieder (and has that great piano postlude); op.39 is moore loosely organized but I think the actual songs as separate songs in op.39 are unmatched in their highly romantic mood and expression.

I agree.

I listened today to the Schreier / Eschenbach performance of op. 39 and the very first song, In der Fremde brought tears to my eyes instantly when the line

Aber Vater und Mutter sind lange tot

was sung, because today my mother would have turned 81 (she died at 77) and my father died more than a year ago. It was like a punch in the stomach of my soul.
Every kind of music is good, except the boring kind. — Rossini

staxomega

#37
Gesange der Fruhe. Having seen patients on my psych rotation suffering from things like schizophrenia and other mental illness I won't even attempt to imagine how he was feeling in those last years, even more so back then when there were no "modern" (today's drugs are still quite crude) treatment. Gesange der Fruhe paints a haunting image.

Quote from: vers la flamme on February 11, 2022, 02:44:15 AM
I do not have that Liederkreis, what's a good recording of it?

Up there with my favorites:



Someone must have scanned a sun faded copy as the art looks better than that :)

Herman

Isn't this just another "name your fave Schumann work" topic?

I'd say you get closest to Schumann's essence with the early piano solo pieces, like Carnaval, DBT or Kreisleriana. The piano sonatas.
In those works he was least constrained by external demands.

Mandryka

#39
Quote from: vers la flamme on February 11, 2022, 02:44:15 AM
I do not have that Liederkreis, what's a good recording of it?

Schreier made four Schumann solo lieder CDs with Norman Shelter and they were collected together in a box. I just saw the box is going for a tenner on Amazon.co.uk - if they'll ship it to you, I'd snap it up.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Schumann-Lieder-Robert/dp/B000G1TE2S/ref=sr_1_15?crid=RJU9EJ1EY8RA&keywords=Schreier+schumann+cd&qid=1644746030&sprefix=schreier+schumann+cd%2Caps%2C58&sr=8-15

He also made a recording of duets with Varady and FiDi, Christopher Eschenbach on the piano, possibly worth hearing too, even though FiDi barks.

That being said, I haven't kept up with the world of Schumann songs on record for at least 10 years - there are probably new interesting ideas out there.
Wovon man nicht sprechen kann, darüber muss man schweigen